[sterling_archer]

Maybe you are right, not excusing myself, I am 99% to blame for being virgin.

[Basil II]

(10-23-2016 03:20 PM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:  

I do wonder if the purpose of this thread is to talk about the shift from a clan-oriented culture where virginity and arranged marriage are valued,
towards an individualistic culture where out-of-wedlock sex is more common...

...or if it's to excuse some of the poster's failures to get laid.

I'm leaning towards the latter, really.

Exactly, same as a slut who hates being called a slut will try diminish the term.

[nomadbrah]

If being a virgin bothers anyone then pay a hot escort for sex and tell her to teach you a bit in the process.

Pedestalizing of the first time for men is also an example of an inverted world.

[rpg]

(10-23-2016 03:58 PM)nomadbrah Wrote:  

If being a virgin bothers anyone then pay a hot escort for sex and tell her to teach you a bit in the process.

Pedestalizing of the first time for men is also an example of an inverted world.

Exactly.
The whole enchilada is nailing down all the variables so a guy can get laid when he wants to. Who the hell wants to get laid once? That is worse than not getting laid ever.

[Rob Banks]

(10-22-2016 07:32 PM)Darius2times Wrote:  

I was actually just talking about this. There is no such thing as a male virginity. The hymen makes a woman a virgin or not, obviously men have no hymen. I have broken a hymen or two and in one of those instances I was also a "virgin", but nothing changed about me other than I had now had sex. She on the other hand bled all over my NFL comforter. In short no such thing as male virginity it's just "Locker room talk"...Shout out to Donald Trump.

Exactly. I am the OP and this is what I meant.

I don't know what the hell everyone else is talking about. I was talking about the word virgin and how it historically applied only to women.

To "lose one's virginity" technically means to be penetrated by a dick for the first time. That's why it makes me cringe when a man is said to "lose his virginity."

If you guys want to keep making comments like "OP is a virgin and just needs to get laid," knock yourselves out. I am done with this thread.

[ivansirko]

OP and related all have a point. Virgin, the original definition referred to feminine purity. There is no such thing as a male virgin unless the male wants to be a female.

Maybe we can refer to "male virginity" as "First time getting some".....

[Enoch]

(10-23-2016 05:30 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

(10-22-2016 07:32 PM)Darius2times Wrote:  

I was actually just talking about this. There is no such thing as a male virginity. The hymen makes a woman a virgin or not, obviously men have no hymen. I have broken a hymen or two and in one of those instances I was also a "virgin", but nothing changed about me other than I had now had sex. She on the other hand bled all over my NFL comforter. In short no such thing as male virginity it's just "Locker room talk"...Shout out to Donald Trump.

Exactly. I am the OP and this is what I meant.

I don't know what the hell everyone else is talking about. I was talking about the word virgin and how it historically applied only to women.

To "lose one's virginity" technically means to be penetrated by a dick for the first time. That's why it makes me cringe when a man is said to "lose his virginity."

If you guys want to keep making comments like "OP is a virgin and just needs to get laid," knock yourselves out. I am done with this thread.

This was a good topic and prompted some good conversation. Don't be turned off by the just get laid bro types.

Personal anecdote - The first time I had sex the girl I was with was a virgin. (you never forget that much blood, or the pain the girl endures) Since then haven't had such a profound physical relationship with a woman. Only cherry I ever popped. I wonder if there something biological that happens in a man's brain when he does this....perhaps multiple cherry poppers could chime in...

[MKDAWUSS]

I noticed that some time back while reading the Bible (where it seemed to be defined as an unmarried woman), but didn't place too much thought into it beyond "that's interesting"

[rpg]

In the Old Testament a bloody bed sheet would be produced to prove a woman was pure at marriage. I think this is kind of messed up. Women have all kinds of hymens. Some have none. Animals seem to show no value for virginity and get down to fucking right away when everything is in order. So in the natural world, ability to reproduce is more important that not ever having the chance. Males battle it out to get dibs on pussy and the winners ensure strong offspring. Male virginity cant exist in the natural world as a positive attribute.

[FireStarter]

(10-23-2016 05:30 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

I am done with this thread.

Thread not going the direction you hoped?

If you go by the historical meaning, it shouldn't be used to describe men. But you're not going to change the way the world uses it now.

I don't believe that virgin being an insult to males is necessarily going to mean that females also see it as an insult. The same way that slut is never going to be a genuine insult against a male.

For all the political correctness in the world, I believe that the majority of people understand the difference between masculinity and femininity. They might not admit it, even to themselves but they feel it.

Or maybe I'm just telling myself that because I don't want to believe that there are so many delusional people...

[Rob Banks]

(10-24-2016 06:58 AM)FireStarter Wrote:  

Thread not going the direction you hoped?

If you go by the historical meaning, it shouldn't be used to describe men. But you're not going to change the way the world uses it now.

I don't believe that virgin being an insult to males is necessarily going to mean that females also see it as an insult. The same way that slut is never going to be a genuine insult against a male.

For all the political correctness in the world, I believe that the majority of people understand the difference between masculinity and femininity. They might not admit it, even to themselves but they feel it.

Or maybe I'm just telling myself that because I don't want to believe that there are so many delusional people...

Thanks for the serious response.

I know I won't change the way people use the term. I just thought I would bring attention to the fact that it has changed from its original meaning due to leftist manipulation of language.

The "slut" comparison is not a good comparison. Nobody except feminists uses the word "slut" to refer to men. Men don't go around referring to other men as "sluts." However, men do refer to other men as "virgins" even here at RVF.

Also, men are not as easily manipulated as women. If a boy in high school gets laid a lot and his peers call him a "slut," that is not likely to have a huge effect on him. On the other hand, if a girl in high school decides to save herself and her peers call her a "virgin prude," that is likely to to have an effect on her.

In fact, I have personal experience with a female family member years ago who was made fun of in high school for being a virgin and never having kissed a guy. Over the next few years, she did some things that she now thoroughly regrets. She told me the reason she did it is because she thought it was "not normal" for her to never have kissed a guy and that sex was what she was "supposed" to do at that age. I have also met other girls who told me similar stories.

Among high school-age kids, there seems to be a culture where "virginity" is something you want to lose as quickly as possible. This obviously stems from the fact that teenage boys want to get laid, but ends up spreading to the girls as well. This happens for many different reasons, but the fact that the term "virgin" applies to both sexes certainly doesn't help.

[GlobalMan]

(10-24-2016 01:20 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

Among high school-age kids, there seems to be a culture where "virginity" is something you want to lose as quickly as possible. This obviously stems from the fact that teenage boys want to get laid, but ends up spreading to the girls as well.

It doesn't "spread" to the girls- they are at home rubbing their pussies wanting to bang too, all on their own. This isn't some "deviant" disease that is getting transmitted from boys and infecting girls. These are desires that have been with them through all time.

[Rob Banks]

(10-24-2016 02:16 PM)GlobalMan Wrote:  

(10-24-2016 01:20 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

Among high school-age kids, there seems to be a culture where "virginity" is something you want to lose as quickly as possible. This obviously stems from the fact that teenage boys want to get laid, but ends up spreading to the girls as well.

It doesn't "spread" to the girls- they are at home rubbing their pussies wanting to bang too, all on their own. This isn't some "deviant" disease that is getting transmitted from boys and infecting girls. These are desires that have been with them through all time.

Are you saying that women in the past did not value their virginity more than women today do?

[McCarthy]

(10-24-2016 09:43 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

(10-24-2016 02:16 PM)GlobalMan Wrote:  

(10-24-2016 01:20 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

Among high school-age kids, there seems to be a culture where "virginity" is something you want to lose as quickly as possible. This obviously stems from the fact that teenage boys want to get laid, but ends up spreading to the girls as well.

It doesn't "spread" to the girls- they are at home rubbing their pussies wanting to bang too, all on their own. This isn't some "deviant" disease that is getting transmitted from boys and infecting girls. These are desires that have been with them through all time.

Are you saying that women in the past did not value their virginity more than women today do?

I would say yes. I remember in high school girls bragging about who had lost the virginity the earliest. In my mother’s generation that would be unthinkable.

I would go even further and say that female sexuality in attitude is masculinizing very, very fast.

[billbudsocket]

There is one reference in the Bible to males as virgins, it is the only one that I know of.

Quote:

Revelations 14:4 - These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

[cascadecombo]

(10-22-2016 01:08 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

I see the term "virgin" being used a lot to refer to guys. It kind of makes me cringe.

The term "virgin" traditionally only referred to women. Up until relatively recently, it was not used (or very rarely used) to refer to men. It makes sense that it would, because women are really the ones who lose something valuable when they have sex for the first time.

What do you guys think?

I don't generally spend my free time trying to debate whether a word should or shouldn't be used by people. Reminds me too much of how the politically correct crowd try to control the vernacular that we use.

[Rob Banks]

(12-10-2016 12:25 PM)cascadecombo Wrote:  

I don't generally spend my free time trying to debate whether a word should or shouldn't be used by people. Reminds me too much of how the politically correct crowd try to control the vernacular that we use.

Which is precisely why it bothers me so much when we use the leftists' gender-neutral language.

There are many common terms that we use in our everyday speech that have had their meaning changed by leftists. "Virgin" is one of those terms. "Adultery" is another (it used to only refer to a cheating woman and her lover, not a cheating man or his lover).

Another example of this -- although not a verbal one -- is the fact that modern men are expected to wear wedding rings. Wedding rings were traditionally only worn by women, in order to let other people know that she was taken (i.e. owned by a man). Men only started wearing them around the 1960s.

I could give many more examples of words and phrases that have been changed in order to make them "gender neutral," which I try to avoid using as much as possible.

I refuse to refer to an MTF transsexual as "she" or "trans-woman" (and vice-versa for FTMs). I try to avoid using the phrase "she fucked him" (the correct phrase would be "she got fucked by him" or "she had sex with him"). I try to avoid using masculine terms like "actor" and "author" to refer to women (the correct feminine terms are "actress" and "authoress").

I realize some people may think I am splitting hairs and being silly. However, I think that these small changes in language affect us more than we think. The way we see the world is affected by the language we use, from the time we are very young. The leftists would not have pushed so hard for "gender-neutral" language over the last 50-100 years if it wasn't such a useful way to manipulate society.

[Jim Johnson]

Depends on the circles you run around with. I go to church, and it does put a bad mark on your reputation. Not so much the act itself, but the fact that you are breaking a baptismal covenant.

For others, a guy being a virgin itself is a negative thing.

[Rush87]

When I was in high school in the early 2000's, guys always used to call dudes a 'virgin' or a 'pussy' when we were talking smack. I don't see anything wrong with it.

[Sidney Crosby]

People are too sensitive these days, for example in the first Fast in the Furious movie that was released in 2001, Vince says to Brian "Yo,Try Fat Burger from now on you can get yourself a double cheese with fries for $2.95 faggot"

Now a days they wouldn't use the word "Faggot" for a movie geared towards teens.

[Lordless]

(12-15-2016 04:22 AM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

Which is precisely why it bothers me so much when we use the leftists' gender-neutral language.

I realize some people may think I am splitting hairs and being silly. However, I think that these small changes in language affect us more than we think. The way we see the world is affected by the language we use, from the time we are very young.

Rediscovering and preserving the proper terms in our language puts the enemy at a disadvantage. Replacing, adding or exempting words from your speech can assist you in more ways than one. I took this advice from Jordan B. Peterson, who in either the first or second JRE Podcast, said:

"If it makes you feel weaker, stop saying it. Try to reformulate your speech until you can feel the ground under your feet solidifying. Then practice only saying things that make you strong."

This meant the elimination of words such as "just", "think", "feel" or "like"(in replacement of pauses). They're all utterly feminine idiosyncrasies which have grown far too snug on the tongues of young men. Sitting in a modern classroom is insufferable; far too many people rely on these words to get their opinions across, perhaps to ease its submission, to circumvent disapproval.

Most recently, I've learned the origin of "gender" and have refrained using it, as the word allows for retarded arguments to be made to justify dozens of genders. Absolutely refusing the word strips it of credibility, more so when its origin is thoroughly explained. Was never aware of 'virgin's' definition, and from a biology standpoint, it makes sense for the term to refer to females. I wonder if we can get a list going of terms beyond these few that have suffered the same fate.

[Aurini]

I surprised that OP is getting so much flack; I think he's bang on, twiting words and equivocating are one of the Left's main tactics of subversion.

I've written before about the medieval trivium; people used to study:

Grammar (facts and history)
Logic (application of facts upon one another)
Rhetoric (taking a new idea, and putting it on the road).

These days we spend twelve years learning rhetoric (X Boo, Y Yay!), 4 years learning Logic in University to back up the rhetoric, and if you bother to get a PhD you just might learn a little bit of grammar, about an extremely specialized field.

Applying the feminine term 'virgin' to men is yet another form of destruction of grammar, the very basis of language.

[DarkTriad]

(10-22-2016 03:25 PM)Mage Wrote:  

Heck even things like having a big dick were not always seen as a good thing for men. In ancient Rome and Greece men with big dicks were made fun of or so I have heard. Political caricatures made fun of politicians by drawing them with bigger then average dicks (or big noses implying big dicks).

Monty Python covered this in their Biggus Dickus documentery.

[Blaster]

(07-17-2017 06:28 PM)Rush87 Wrote:  

When I was in high school in the early 2000's, guys always used to call dudes a 'virgin' or a 'pussy' when we were talking smack. I don't see anything wrong with it.

As I understand, OP isn't specifically objecting to the use of the term in this context. It's a more general complaint that the term "virgin" really means "unspoiled woman," but people use it to mean "unspoiled man" which is stupid because men aren't spoiled by sex the way women are.

[Blaster]

(12-10-2016 12:25 PM)cascadecombo Wrote:  

(10-22-2016 01:08 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:  

I see the term "virgin" being used a lot to refer to guys. It kind of makes me cringe.

The term "virgin" traditionally only referred to women. Up until relatively recently, it was not used (or very rarely used) to refer to men. It makes sense that it would, because women are really the ones who lose something valuable when they have sex for the first time.

What do you guys think?

I don't generally spend my free time trying to debate whether a word should or shouldn't be used by people. Reminds me too much of how the politically correct crowd try to control the vernacular that we use.

Nevertheless, words have meanings and it's helpful to understand what is meant by them. I think the confusion here is that most people on this forum probably don't use the word in the way that Rob Banks objects to. Not understanding the real objection, they just criticize the perceived language policing, which really isn't the point.

Would you ever tell the forum a story about the woman who took your virginity? I'm bet that you wouldn't. You'd tell the story of the first time you got laid, or your first bang, or the first girl you fucked, or the first time you got your dick wet.