[GetRichOrdie]

Thanks for the useful post, some great points. My modest addition is that if you are going to check out a strip club, go to Harem club near Arena lol. I dont agree with some posters that the 9s and 10s arent on the street, i saw quite a few 9s and at least a few 10's out when i was shopping, supermodel looks that i haven't seen anywhere else in the world even. You can make assumptions that local guys will have a better chance bla bla bla, but why not reinforce the local frame that they don't have the resources and will sleep around, and then create a positive frame of your position or background, which is pretty close to the truth. Bad boy archetypes are a powerful tool anywhere you go, and im working to bring more of that into my style, and field tests in the hard testing ground of perth western australia have proved their efficacy. Personally i only dabble in night game and far prefer day game and the adventures you can go on which are better for my health long term.

Ive been in Kiev now for about 3/4 days, and if i could add to this signing up to ABNB is better than staying at a hotel for the money. It would be good to have seen resources which you used to find accommodation like this, but the locals get really cheap rates for the places they stay at. With the markup there might even be a nice little cash-flow business if you long term rent a place, and stick it on ABNB etc and make a profit markup, and based on availability I think a few people are doing that across the world

As for the girls, Im amazed at how many stunners there are. I wonder if it would be useful to have some pretext to talking to them, that you are in film/a modelling agency/talent scout/adult film to capitalize on the economic hardships, and I like how Kyle Trouble talks about using the indirect approach which Ive used with success in the past and is just so much more lower pressure. I wonder if the girls use this holding out approach because of the apparent excessive player tactics and "cheating" that the local men get up to, with a local girl telling me that they are spoiled with choice and can have many women on the side. I couldn't believe how hot some of these girls were, on par with supermodel quality from other parts but without the anorexia. I got caught out on a scam date with a girl ordering $120 worth of wine but i used a credit card so ill dispute that when i get back.

I really love the cleanliness and greenery of the city in comparison to the urban pollution of places like Manila, and while its still early days, I can certainly sense the great opportunity here in terms of having a world class sex life, as well as potential business opportunities with real estate prices being at record lows due to the negative view regarding the conflict in the east. It seems like it can be cheaper than living in the Philippines, with better internet speeds, culture, amenities and so on. Im certain the smart money is buying up a lot of this property in view of increases down the track. Its funny the landlady at the place I was staying at was describing how when the soviet union fell, Jewish people were buying up all the apartments, and nearly everyone's landlord in the area is Jewish, and nowadays many live overseas or are retired from all the cash-flow income. I found this amusing, considering ive never seen so many Jews in an airport anywhere else, and I wonder if they know something we don't know about, with their people being a close knit community, and having their people in politics, media, and so on, or maybe its just they come for the girls as well.

So far my more 'natural' style indirect openers as i've been going sightseeing and shopping seems to have been working great as an opener, using the language barrier, directions, or needing to recharge my phone as a good pretext to open girls and then go on mini-dates elsewhere. I'm going to keep it fun and keep my vibe really positive and high by doing interesting sightseeing and staying active, rather than getting absorbed in excessive internet dating which has happened in the past.

[Henny]

Ukraine doesn't have many stunners in my opinion, not girls that will make your jaw drop or turn around, but it does have a lot of 7's and 8's

[Cambodian Creamsicle]

And people wonder why places are getting played out..,

[Tony_Flame]

Hello guys,

I was in Kiev recently and wanted to share my experience.
Prior my journey Ive met a couple ukrainian girls (also from Kiev) which were pretty nice, so I thought it would be a good idea to go to the capitol of ukraina.

But it turned out to be a bad experience for me... if not to say a desaster!

- The overall atmosphere in the town is kind of strange, weird and also somewhat threatening.
- Lots of ugly and dark undergrounds and you cant cross the street easily when you spot a girl on the other side
- Many dirty, shabby places
- You will see a lot of confused and primitive looking people and soldiers on every corner there. Also uncultivated loud and
agressive people.
- I've found that there aren't even that many beautiful girls! Lots of mediocre or even 'unattractive' girls, but they are all slim though.
In nearly every european town you will find at least the same amount of beautifull girls E.g. Krakow.

I was there for a couple days and was doing daygame all the time, in an indirect-direct rather 'nice guy' manner. In downtown area (Krechatnyk, shevshenko boulevard main station and the parks).

- It was very hard to stop a moving girl at all. Many girls will give you instant blowouts the moment you open your mouth. Oftentimes in a very unfriendly and disrespectfull manner!
Me. Excuse me... I hope you speak english?
She: Of course I speak english, do you speak ukrainian (in a humilating angry voice, tone turning away)!?

Many say that these girls just dont speak english at all and get confused when getting approached in english, but I dont believe it.
I've tested it by opening random guys on the street for small talk and they responded nice. Oftentimes we ended up drinking beer, even though their english was really poor. So if there is interest the language barrier shouldnt be a problem.
- At many Daygame streets you have many people sitting on the benches and observing your approaches, this can add additional pressure

- When I realized that approaching moving girls dont work I focused on seated sets. Positive thing is Kiev has very nice parks and lots of girls sitting alone on benches . But it didn't work at all. Bad responses usually... including things like eyes rolling or angry "can you please leave me alone!?".

- After doing about 30 approaches I had little to no results.
- 1 instant date with a young HB7
- 3 number closes. 2 resulted in dates. The other ine flaked.
- A couple of nice chats, where the girl had a boyfriend and it was impossible to escalate (and I didnt want it)

A desaster to summ it up!

But I dont want to demotivate guys because I also saw confusing and suprising things happen around me:

- I've met another ukranian guy doing daygame, with tremendous success. He used some kind of "clown game", mixed with masculine energy. You could see this guy from a big distance how he was obviously PERFORMING, entertaining. Hitting the primal buttons worked fine. I've done this type of game some years ago, but now it just looks embarassing for me. Howeever it worked for him getting bunch of number closes but its possible that he gets lot of flakes.

- You will see a lot of couples, where the girl is really hot but the guy just an averagy plain guy (nice guys, betas). I remember seing
one couple where the hot girl was literally 'eating out' the guy, who didn't know how to behave and was just standing stiff lol.
When it gets dark you will see couples on about every park bench making out... wouldn't surprise me if they also have sex in the darker park corners!
- Flirting, romance and intimacy seems to be on everybodys mind. You will see a lot of romance there, which is nice.

Maybe my game is just not good enough for Kiev, or they simply dislike a guy with black hair... who speaks english.

A game diagnose could make sense and then try it again... with some russian skills. But momentarily I feel bad thinking about that mess, as I've experienced citys in europe where you get recieved much warmer. Example: Bratislava... you will get recieved so much warmer and girls are even hotter imo! They will be thankfull for allmost every approach.

Another idea:
I would encourage to try approaches DURING THE EVENING, although this is usually against my daygame ethic. Many girls just hang out in the evening in park benches. Clubs don't seem to be that popular for the average people there, too expensive.

I also wanted to point out that kiev girls know how to play games, and how to tool men! So keep your eyes open!
- Guy grabs a girls hand (probably it was a date). She didn't like it but covers it up by removing her hand in order to 'make up her hair'. CLEVER move with plausible deniability!
This is true for the strippers as well!
- Guy pays to sit with a stripper girl and than grabs her hand. She acts totally indignant as if he tries to bang a princess in the middle of the day LOL!

I had the impression that the price of pussy seems to be tremendous there, and women on everybodys mind.

Dont want to discourage anybody to try it for yourself though. But I couldnt believe what happened there. Later Ive met some hot ukranian girls in Prague and they were nice... But in Kiev no chance!

[freeloader]

Supermodel looks on the streets / shopping malls of Kiev? I wonder which malls GetRichOrDie is going to. I didn't see any. Maybe I have different standards, I don't know. I saw some quality on the high-end restaurants, especially the waitresses, but not on the street.

I was in Sofia beginning of September. You see a super 10+ in high heels walking by every 5 minutes on a weekend afternoon in the center. Compared to Kiev, Sofia was plastered with 10s. The quality on the streets there is outrageous. Also in the clubs the quality was better. But the clubs are a disgrace, withouth a table you can't get in and the girls are mostly hookers. Sofia is the world capital of prostitution anyway. At night, EVERY taxi driver wants to take you to a brothel or strip club.
Generally, Sofia girls are arrogant bitches and much less open to foreigners, in my experience. No pay no play.
Overall, bulgarian people were pretty cold and unfriendly, especially in Sofia. Like they don't give a shit about you and are not interested in you at all. I really disliked the vibe of that place.

[Apollo21]

I can see that Kiev is many things to many people... I was there for a month in August and had a blast with other forum members.

There are few places like Kiev...you will experience so many emotions it's not funny...from hope and excitement to frustration, exhaustion and complete surprise...

One of the common complaints is that there are not a lot of 9's and 10's which is complete nonsense...

If you just walk around the city, then depending on the time of day and where you are going then naturally you're going to see a mix of people...some girls will be amazing while others will be average.

It's not until you sit down on Kreschatyk with a beer with the guys at happy hour for an hour do you really start to see a parade of stunning women walk past you. If you're constantly jumping around here and there then of course you're going to get mixed results.

The flipside to all of this is that if you go, be ready to pound the pavement or you might waste a lot if time and get burnt out with night game.

Kiev is one of the best places to push your limits though and understand the traditional role of guys which has been diluted in western culture.

[Cambodian Creamsicle]

You're not going to see supermodels on the streets or malls in any city in the world with any frequency. Of course there might that once in a blue moon scenario, but that's why they're supermodels - they have extremely rare beauty.

As for Sofia, that's where I'm at right now, and have been for 3 weeks. It is most certainly not plastered with 10s. There are hotties for sure, like any other EE city, but I wouldn't place it above any of the other big ones. You'll see a lot of nice asses, similar to Romania. I haven't been gaming too hard but this place is tough, the toughest place in EE I've been (Poland, Belarus, Ukraine, Croatia, Romania, Moldova, Czech). The daygame has been pretty good as far as good responses go, but as for notches not good at all. I met this hot 19 year old on the street the other day and she said men never talk to her in the street, so I guess this might one EE city not overrun by daygamers. Tinder has been shit for me whereas in Ukraine and Belarus it was very good. Thought I had a couple sure things from a couple young hotties only for it to go to shit. After so many flakes a guy starts to lose motivation.

Totally agree with Bulgarian girls being a bit arrogant and the country as a whole having a negative vibe. You really notice it in the restaurants. They're just dicks for no reason. I only fucked one girl here and it was a daygame SDL from a Taiwanese tourist.

(09-29-2016 03:13 PM)freeloader Wrote:  

Supermodel looks on the streets / shopping malls of Kiev? I wonder which malls GetRichOrDie is going to. I didn't see any. Maybe I have different standards, I don't know. I saw some quality on the high-end restaurants, especially the waitresses, but not on the street.

I was in Sofia beginning of September. You see a super 10+ in high heels walking by every 5 minutes on a weekend afternoon in the center. Compared to Kiev, Sofia was plastered with 10s. The quality on the streets there is outrageous. Also in the clubs the quality was better. But the clubs are a disgrace, withouth a table you can't get in and the girls are mostly hookers. Sofia is the world capital of prostitution anyway. At night, EVERY taxi driver wants to take you to a brothel or strip club.
Generally, Sofia girls are arrogant bitches and much less open to foreigners, in my experience. No pay no play.
Overall, bulgarian people were pretty cold and unfriendly, especially in Sofia. Like they don't give a shit about you and are not interested in you at all. I really disliked the vibe of that place.

[scrambled]

Quote:

The overall atmosphere in the town is kind of strange, weird and also somewhat threatening.

I understand a bit of what you mean, but perhaps you are a bit too pejorative in your expression. Kiev, especially Kreshchatik, was mostly destroyed during WWII by the retreating Soviet Army, and then rebuilt under Soviet lines, which mandates wide boulevards and large concrete, rough looking but strong buildings. That it is 'strange' I do not see; it's just Soviet-era architecture. America itself, in its glorious capital, has plenty of hideous concrete "threatening" brutalist buildings still quite operational.

It is important for the 'player' to choose the environment best suited for his game. Kiev is a large, sprawling capital city due to so many people from the countryside moving there to work. I recommend you go to Lvov instead, it's smaller, more middle-European, and tourist-friendly. Stay away from the east of Ukraine, it is more Soviet than Kiev.

Quote:

Lots of ugly and dark undergrounds and you cant cross the street easily when you spot a girl on the other side

I think you are exaggerating in your reasons to justify something else you feel, yet leave unsaid; really there is no need to cross the street when there are so many eligible girls on both sides; that the streets are wide does not affect anyone's game who is reasonably flexible.

The underground (metro stations?) weren't "dark" at all when I saw them, the major ones are well-lit and contain many convenience shops such as clothing, florists, snacks. The actual stations are much better lit than Washington DC's, by comparison, and contain infinitely more eligible ladies.

Quote:

Many dirty, shabby places

Ukraine ain't Switzerland, but what of it? There isn't the same shiny-newness and everything must work perfectly that the US or maybe "Blonde" countries in western Europe have, but you have to go far from the tourist track to see such rough areas. No need to go there; nothing is perfect, and it is not relevant to our overall success.

Quote:

You will see a lot of confused and primitive looking people and soldiers on every corner there. Also uncultivated loud and
agressive people.

Confused and primitive? Didn't see any lost cavemen when I was there, I must have missed them, or with my luck, they were out hunting Sabre-Tooth cats during my visit.

There are soldiers there due to it being the Capital and having military offices, but it is nothing out of the ordinary, and I believe that on the streets of America they would say that you are, I think, Trippin'--what you mention has little actual effect on the visitor's enjoyment. I did not see any "Uncultivated loud and agressive" people, rather, compared to America, I saw lots of couples and young families. Your description of Kiev seems to portray it, contrary to all of my sensory experience, as some kind of Latin American violent slum without the Salsa music and good dancing.

Quote:

I've found that there aren't even that many beautiful girls! Lots of mediocre or even 'unattractive' girls, but they are all slim though.
In nearly every european town you will find at least the same amount of beautifull girls E.g. Krakow.

Why do you put 'unattractive' in scare quotes? Do you think they are unattractive or not? Even if your report were objectively true, Kiev is so target-rich that man who has prepared himself and has a mature adult amount of courage can succeed there, beyond anything possible in the west, (considering the effort and results).

Quote:

I had the impression that the price of pussy seems to be tremendous there, and women on everybodys mind.

Forgive me for thinking that you perhaps you project a bit. I think it is the opposite, fit fair girls are more like a dime a dozen there, though they are not 'easy'. You need patience to win them over and prove yourself as a man.

Girls I saw in Kiev that there attract no notice at all, so common are they, even with long hair, fit bodies in form-fitting dresses and high-heels, would cause jaws to drop in any US venue.

But the Don't go, Ukraine is one big Chernobyl!!! posts continue.

[TripleG]

(09-29-2016 03:25 PM)Apollo21 Wrote:  

I can see that Kiev is many things to many people... I was there for a month in August and had a blast with other forum members.

There are few places like Kiev...you will experience so many emotions it's not funny...from hope and excitement to frustration, exhaustion and complete surprise...

One of the common complaints is that there are not a lot of 9's and 10's which is complete nonsense...

If you just walk around the city, then depending on the time of day and where you are going then naturally you're going to see a mix of people...some girls will be amazing while others will be average.

It's not until you sit down on Kreschatyk with a beer with the guys at happy hour for an hour do you really start to see a parade of stunning women walk past you. If you're constantly jumping around here and there then of course you're going to get mixed results.

The flipside to all of this is that if you go, be ready to pound the pavement or you might waste a lot if time and get burnt out with night game.

Kiev is one of the best places to push your limits though and understand the traditional role of guys which has been diluted in western culture.

Apollo is right on, Kiev still requires good game and night game becomes harder the older one gets. Some of us are not cut out for day-game with cold-approaching that's why I am a big advocate of evening game....just pass by a happening restaurant/bar/cafe, grab a table next to a couple girls and just ask them what's a good drink/meal at that place or better yet ask them what the "wifi password is?" as that rarely results in a rejection...with these approaches my number close rate is around 50%

[Vancity29]

I am in Kiev now. Anyone saying that there are no hot girls here are crazy. I have a major bias for Latinas and even I think this place is full of stunners. These girls are not easy to get but they are here in abundance.

I think a big problem is that guys are reading the forum and learning of others successes and thinking that Ukraine is gonna be the Philippines for white girls. The girls here are not thirsty. I have found it to be very similar to any other place. Guys with good looks or good game are getting girls fairly easy. If you don't regularly meet and pickup women where you live, you probably won't here either. If you do pickup where you live then Ukraine will give you a higher quality of girls to pick up.

[Cad and Bounder]

I, too, have been in kiev and sofia this summer and I concur with what Cambodian creamsicle is saying on both cities rather than what freeloader wrote. We can all disagree on how tough a city is, but men rarely have fundamental differences on how attractive the woman are. Frankly, I've never met anyone that ranks the quality in sofia higher than kiev or anywhere else in the Balkans, aside from say, macedonia. You definitely do not see 10s walking around every 5 minutes in sofia. That idea is complete bullshit.

Sofia isn't overrun with daygamers, but there is a reason for that. Guys have gone and found it really tough, and not gone back, whereas guys go to kiev and it's much easier, so they go back. I'm afraid Sofia is more in the Italy/Spain/Greece you-need-social-circle club than, say the Romania or Ukraine open-minded to foreigners club.

As for Kiev, it's a city where men are men and girls are girls. No need for indirect approaches--they know what you are doing and are likely to see you as a guy ready to be tooled due to making a weak indirect approach. Just go direct, you guys will do okay.

[Vancity29]

something I find funny is when guys are complaining that there are not enough 10s in a city. Are you a male 10? Do you have attributes that would make you attractive to a 10 like wealth or incredible social status? If not than 10s are out of your league and the closest you will get to them is passing them by in public anyways. Be realistic.

[Cad and Bounder]

A distribution curve shifted to the right will usually make it easier to get a better quality of girl, so more abundance of 10s in a city does tend to make a difference.

[Schlep]

@ Vancity29

Yes, I have to agree with your last two posts. I'm also currently in Kiev. The quality here is just unmatched. I can sit in a cafe on Khreschatyk street and just spend all day in amazement. People on here talk about the 9's and 10's. I personally prefer the 7.5 - 8.5 with natural beauty, not alot of makeup and dressed more conservative. They are my preference and in abundance here in Kiev.

My last two trips abroad have been to the phils and it's been a big learning experience to say the least. I've struggled badly since the day I arrived. Getting dates for me is easy but, converting them into second and third dates not so much. And, I will admit I'm not killing it in my own country. Overall, I absolutely love this city. I can walk around all hours of the city and have never felt unsafe. Everything is cheap. The food is delicious and inexpensive. The women have been difficult and frustrating but, realize that the problem is with myself. At first I was being hard on myself but, now I realize that you can't expect to completely understand the women on your first trip to Europe in only three weeks.

Edit: If your looking to find a location to live and find a quality wife. This would be a great choice in my opinion. You can live on 1,500$ easily if you cook most of your own meals, rely on public transportation and avoid nightclubs. My current apartment is a little far from city center but, very nice. I could rent for 500$ a month if I wanted.

[freeloader]

(09-29-2016 03:59 PM)Cambodian Creamsicle Wrote:  

You're not going to see supermodels on the streets or malls in any city in the world with any frequency. Of course there might that once in a blue moon scenario, but that's why they're supermodels - they have extremely rare beauty.

As for Sofia, that's where I'm at right now, and have been for 3 weeks. It is most certainly not plastered with 10s. There are hotties for sure, like any other EE city, but I wouldn't place it above any of the other big ones. You'll see a lot of nice asses, similar to Romania. I haven't been gaming too hard but this place is tough, the toughest place in EE I've been (Poland, Belarus, Ukraine, Croatia, Romania, Moldova, Czech). The daygame has been pretty good as far as good responses go, but as for notches not good at all. I met this hot 19 year old on the street the other day and she said men never talk to her in the street, so I guess this might one EE city not overrun by daygamers. Tinder has been shit for me whereas in Ukraine and Belarus it was very good. Thought I had a couple sure things from a couple young hotties only for it to go to shit. After so many flakes a guy starts to lose motivation.

Totally agree with Bulgarian girls being a bit arrogant and the country as a whole having a negative vibe. You really notice it in the restaurants. They're just dicks for no reason. I only fucked one girl here and it was a daygame SDL from a Taiwanese tourist.

(09-29-2016 03:13 PM)freeloader Wrote:  

Well for my eyes Sofia was plastered with 9s and some 10s. But at the end of the day, it's also a matter of taste, right? I love them real skinny, and long legged, with small and firm tits, and for this Bulgaria is paradise.

Have you been to Plowdiw? Quality is outstanding there, too, and the girls are much more open. They almost never brush you off. Also the place is gorgeous, with all the roman monuments and stuff. People are way more friendly than in Kiev. It's a student city. For me it's the nicest city in Bulgaria. Small and cosy. Nightlife is also small, though. And girls flake like hell. 10 numbers, 1 notch. But the vibe of the place is great, I really enjoyed my stay.

I agree that tinder in Bulgaria is pointless. My only tinder date was with a girl from moscow.

This one girl from Plowdiw I went to the mountains with for 2 days, a little older, but still a solid 8, with a tight 9 skinny body and a 10 snatch. But she was crying all the time about how she normally doesn't do that, also she was annoying in general, having huge expectations just because we were having some fun, always complaining about this and that - boy was I happy when we split.

[Kendrick]

Can anyone recommend a website for apartments in Kiev (two month stay) that's cheaper than airbnb (I've heard airbnb is significantly more expensive than market rate). My friend can read Russian.

[Bobkins]

https://www.olx.ua/i2/nedvizhimost/arend...ew=gallery

[TripleG]

(09-30-2016 03:45 PM)Bobkins Wrote:  

https://www.olx.ua/i2/nedvizhimost/arend...ew=gallery

Thanks for that link but searching it is an exercise in frustration. I can read Russian well but that is just one slow, disorganized site. For a bit more money nothing can beat airbnb. Nevertheless, isn't there something a little more organized in UA, similar to Craigslist in USA?

[rishboy77]

(09-30-2016 08:02 PM)TripleG Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 03:45 PM)Bobkins Wrote:  

https://www.olx.ua/i2/nedvizhimost/arend...ew=gallery

Thanks for that link but searching it is an exercise in frustration. I can read Russian well but that is just one slow, disorganized site. For a bit more money nothing can beat airbnb. Nevertheless, isn't there something a little more organized in UA, similar to Craigslist in USA?

There is 1 major advantage of AirBNB is that you have some recourse with the head office in case of some issue other wise your on your own.

In fact I used olx.ua on my recent visit a few weeks ago and found I did not save that much. First of all you have to send 1 night's deposit and pay a West Union fee.

Although the place was fine it had a "open" wifi which required no pass code for entry and although it worked fine but I did not do any banking or other password sensitive work as I feel it's too risky on a open network.

[jasond]

I had a friend who used http://www.dobovo.com with good results.

[iron93]

You could always use the local websites as a comparison for prices then rely that to airbnb hosts to see if they could at least price match it. At least then it goes thru airbnb.

[freeloader]

(09-29-2016 07:08 PM)Vancity29 Wrote:  

something I find funny is when guys are complaining that there are not enough 10s in a city. Are you a male 10? Do you have attributes that would make you attractive to a 10 like wealth or incredible social status? If not than 10s are out of your league and the closest you will get to them is passing them by in public anyways. Be realistic.

Excuse me, but what are you talking about my friend? Of course I'm not a 10, but what do you think game is for, what the heck do you think this forum is for? For 10s who wanna get access to other 10s? Ever heard of GAME? It's for make her believe that YOU are a 10 and she will regret for the rest of her life if she passed on you. It is about upping your scale for at least 3 notches.

Using game I have given more 10s the pleasure of sharing the bed with me than you probably have ever even caught a sight of. Rest assured, they are not out of my league. And believe me, after you have been with a 9 or 10 any 6 or 7 is nothing more than a diversion that you consume with as much pleasure as watching a soccer game of the third league. It's like skiing in an indoor hall after having skied the deep powder snow of remote canadian mountains.

And if specifically notice the lack of 10s in Kyiv in this moment of time on the street I have good reason to do so, and I have the knowledge and experience to assess that, because I have been there in earlier times when it was different. Every real expert on this forum can confirm that fact. They either left the city or don't show themselves any more. Anyone who disputes that fact has either no concept about what a 10 is, or is in denial of it because he does not want to acknowledge that he spent all this effort and money to come here in vain.

Anyway, your attitude doesn't help. What we need is to find out where they have gone, or even better, what other places there are on this planet outside of North Korea where we can still hunt and bag this kind of prey.

[jabba]

Has anyone flown with Ukraine Intl Air?

I want to visit some West UA cities and don't want to take the train.

[Vancity29]

(10-02-2016 05:16 AM)freeloader Wrote:  

Excuse me, but what are you talking about my friend? Of course I'm not a 10, but what do you think game is for, what the heck do you think this forum is for? For 10s who wanna get access to other 10s? Ever heard of GAME? It's for make her believe that YOU are a 10 and she will regret for the rest of her life if she passed on you. It is about upping your scale for at least 3 notches.

Using game I have given more 10s the pleasure of sharing the bed with me than you probably have ever even caught a sight of. Rest assured, they are not out of my league. And believe me, after you have been with a 9 or 10 any 6 or 7 is nothing more than a diversion that you consume with as much pleasure as watching a soccer game of the third league. It's like skiing in an indoor hall after having skied the deep powder snow of remote canadian mountains.

well I don't know who you are. I don't know your looks and don't know your level of game. All I know of you Is your latest Kiev trip reports where you came across a little butt hurt and it sounded like you didn't do so good. To say Kiev has low talent is absurd. Most of the roosh guys here thought you were just trolling.

My concept of a 10 is supermodel level. Victoria secret. Now of course with GAME you can bang up. But If your game was that tight that you have banged as many 10s as you say, I find it hard to believe you would even come to the roosh forum to search advice and vent your frustrations on your kiev trip.

But what do I know.... I don't know you and maybe you are legit. Not trying to start an argument with you. Wish you all the best man and if you find that spot with all the 10s walking on the street, Don't ruin it by posting about it. Just send me a PM

[jasond]

For those guys on the ground in Kiev...do you sense that the girls right now in 2016 are actively looking to leave the country? Are they looking at Western European/USA guys as a kind of passport out? Or do they mostly want to stay in Kiev?