[Laska]

^^Shakespeare wrote extremely entertaining works; I was periodically laughing for two weeks after finishing The Taming of the Shrew. I was nine years old then, and enjoyed Shakespeare as much as I do now. You would too, but you have to put in the effort to understand the language. Shakespeare informs not just the thoughts in my head, but persuades my actions. He convinces me to understand people, and judge them by what they do and say; he convinces me that the quality of mercy is not strained, that religion is important to peoples thinking, and helped convince me of the need for women to be submissive. He is one of those authors, like Victor Hugo who gives a perception of life as a whole. He convinced me that eloquence could be important, that it's a part of joy, and especially that joy itself is important (as I'm temperamentally inclined to stoicism). Lastly, the memorizing of Shakespeare's verse lines have improved my memory noticeably.

People can write for a class, or for their posterity. They can write for art, or entertainment. And yes, people can write for profit, but also for political persuasion. I'm certain even your copywriting would improve from reading Shakespeare.

[Laska]

(11-04-2017 01:13 AM)redbeard Wrote:  

Tell me....WHY do you write?

I write to convince. More accurately, I write to push people to action, most often, a sale.

One of my mentors told me to write everyday. He said,

"Don't just write a diary entry about how Sally from 3rd period let you touch her boob. Write with the intention to change someone's mind about something. Get them to buy whatever you're selling."

What does Shakespeare convince you to do?

Here's a sample.

"Think upon patience. Pray you, gentlemen,
I have felt so many quirks of joy and grief,
That the first face of neither, on the start,
Can woman me unto't: where is my son, I pray you?"

The fuck?

If you want to write a novel, go ahead, read Shakespeare.

If you want to tell great stories (and make money along the way), learn copywriting.

John Carlton said that you need to make your sales letter the MOST INTERESTING thing your reader reads all day. Can't say the same for Shakespeare's work.

Tell me if this isn't extremely persuasive:

[Vasily Zaytsev]

IMO, the thing that is most important in terms of developing good writing skills is simply reading a lot. Also, whenever I need to improve the quality of anything that I've written, I focus on strengthening the verbs in my work and deleting all unnecessary adverbs. Btw, there is a great Cristopher Hitchens essay that I recently read and would highly recommend to the other guys on this forum if they want to improve their writing.
Supposedly, he wrote this right before he died...

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2011/06/...ths-201106

[Laska]

(11-04-2017 11:45 PM)Vasily Zaytsev Wrote:  

IMO, the thing that is most important in terms of developing good writing skills is simply reading a lot. Also, whenever I need to improve the quality of anything that I've written, I focus on strengthening the verbs in my work and deleting all unnecessary adverbs. Btw, there is a great Cristopher Hitchens essay that I recently read and would highly recommend to the other guys on this forum if they want to improve their writing.
Supposedly, he wrote this right before he died...

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2011/06/...ths-201106

Reading is extremely important. Of course, there many other ways to improve writing, somewhat depending on what kind someone's doing. RedBeard mentioned copywriting. Training is perhaps the biggest way of getting better at that, but I don't know.

[the1element]

"This sentence has five words. Here are five more words. Five-word sentences are fine. But several together become monotonous. Listen to what is happening. The writing is getting boring. The sound of it drones. It’s like a stuck record. The ear demands some variety. Now listen. I vary the sentence length, and I create music. Music. The writing sings. It has a pleasant rhythm, a lilt, a harmony. I use short sentences. And I use sentences of medium length. And sometimes, when I am certain the reader is rested, I will engage him with a sentence of considerable length, a sentence that burns with energy and builds with all the impetus of a crescendo, the roll of the drums, the crash of the cymbals–sounds that say listen to this, it is important."

I can't remember where I found this or who originally said it, but it's a quote in my writing resource file that I find immensely inspiring and useful.

[TooFineAPoint]

^ pacing!

Pacing induces pleasure. Pleasure leads to persuasion.

I disagree with Redbeard's disparaging comments about Shakespeare. And I LOVE John Carlton.

Billy S. has influenced/persuaded more people (and will continue to do so) than all of the copywriters alive today.

It's foolish and shortsighted for the best commercial/non-fiction writers to dismiss fiction as fluff, and for the fiction writers to dismiss commercial/non-fiction writers as dry or shallow. The top of their craft do the same thing -- illuminate human nature.

Read Balzac and Shakespeare and Dostoevsky -- make more sales. Read Carlton and Halbert and Bencivenga -- connect with your emotions and transcend your physical experiences.

We've a lot to learn from the indecisive man, the over-ambitious man, the man who is driven to despair by his woman.

"I am but mad north-north-west. When the wind is southerly, I know a hawk from a handsaw."