[gang]

Up until about 4 months ago I was a night game savage. I could pull one night stands from night game fairly easy inside and outside of the United States. It's been my sole source of vagina most of my life and I became very good at it.

Recently however I began to experience fairly serious health issues that are suspected to be from drinking too much over the years while hunting girls during the night (wrote about it in another thread). I will most likely not be able to drink anymore without risk to my health.

When these problems first hit me I stopped going out at night for 3.5 months and have just recently started to poke around with nightlife again while sober.

I've been finding it extremely difficult to get to that same mental state where it is fairly easy for me to pull girls from clubs/bars. When sober I feel stiff, bored, awkward and a bad dj bothers me way more. This however is not the case when I do day game sober, I am actually pretty good at day game (never had a same day lay) when I rarely decide to do some and do not feel any sort of awkwardness.

Tonight I tried to force myself to make something happen at the club/bar I generally have lots of success at. I opened a girl and was dancing with her for about 45 minutes before she eventually disappeared on a trip to the bathroom. The whole time I felt like I was not connecting with her. I felt super self conscious and awkward of every move I was making even my facial expressions. It was not like me at all and usually while drinking everything flows super natural and I'm able to connect on that level with girls in the bar. I feel like alcohol is mainly responsible for creating that savage mentality and sex drive that gets me laid the same night from clubs and bars and without it I am an awkward little bitch with no sex drive.

My friend even told me multiple times that he sees a dramatic difference in me in the club and in my desire to go out at all. It's a struggle for me to even get myself to go out on the weekends now to a club or bar, I'm simply not even interested in doing it because I can't drink. Another crazy thing is while I'm talking to girls in a bar or club while sober I feel less interested in a one night stand. I begin to feel nervous about the thought of even bringing them home at all.

Basically all of this shit is really fucking me up because nightlife and night game was a huge part of my life and until recently it was nothing for me to bring home a girl same night and bang her brains out.

I want to know if anyone goes out on the regular while sober and successfully pulls one night stands? I'm not talking about getting numbers and following up another day but about sober one night stands from the bar or club. Is this your preferred method of getting laid? Is this just a mental hump I need to get over? Or should I just dump night game and focus on day game from now on?

Any advice, strategies or insight is welcomed. Please don't advise if you don't actually have any experience trying to get laid same night sober from a bar or club. If you drink regularly when you go out it's easy to speculate what you can do sober but until you've tried it you don't really know what it's like.

Thanks

[Adrenaline]

Sounds like you have always used alcohol as a crutch for social anxiety, and finally need to push through those issues and re-learn the game sober.

How old are you, and what is the health issue preventing you from consuming alcohol?

[BoricuaKing]

Sucks this happened to you, but your health is numero uno. I know it's not easy, because personally a few drinks helps me loosen up my inhabitations. But I've also been very successful at clubs sober. My mind frame and confidence is what works with no drinks. I go to a borderline cocky place with it, I view myself as the prize in the setting and act accordingly. If my intention is to get laid that night, I find my target and escalate with touching and body language..very few words

[WestIndianArchie]

Sober night game is my preferred method, and for most of my game career my only method.

For most lushes, alcohol loosens the tongue. Gets a guy outside of his head and more in tune with the hunger.

But the other side is that you don't react to a lot of the bs that chicks will try and sideline you with. Being non-reactive is a huge key in the game.

Your game will suffer a bit, but you'll get a lot better. You have to unlock for yourself what specifically is going on with your drunk game and how it works.

Running day game will make your sober night game better as well.

WIA

[Moma]

Archie, I had a lizard at mine earlier this year. African American lizard, fairly hood but putting on her best behaviour because of my exotic accent. She was either a former drunk or current because she was drinking through my strongest Jamaican AND Dominican rum and it was only loosening her tongue to talk mad shyt. I made my second play to try and extract those big jugs, having ignored her first caution. This one was more stern than the first and she said that I told her i wanted her to come and watch movies not to fcuk. I smiled lazily and told her thar my hand had slipped.
Her response was: How yo muthafcukin hand gon slip behind my back?

Bear in mind that swearing is normal for this lizard so it's not a sign of exasperation per se.
Keeping in mind that she's hood, how would you suggest one to have spun that around? I prefer to rebuttal it and continue the sexual intent if possible without having her tear my head off.

[WestIndianArchie]

The true chick came out when she was drinking. Blame it in the alcohol is actually the reverse of the truth.

Questions

1) had you made out with her prior to this
2) how skeptical was she during the initial setup

3) how did you set the scene? Blanket, cold room, love seat ( A two seat sofa) or a couch (a three seat sofa)

4) when did the alcohol come out?

5) were you touching each other
6) flirting was two way?

My first read is that she put you in the LTR box, and was coming to you like that. But when you switched up, she was caught off guard.

Women want different things from lovers than long terms.

The solution to the particular problem of a hostile but isolated chick is
- de-escalate
- change topic
- change activity
- change mood
- withdraw enough emotionally, so that she metaphorically reaches for your touch.

That's when you start getting compliance.

Now me personally, I would have broken out the 151. Gotten her good and drunk and then put her out the crib.

She put herself in a bad position and is depending on you to take care of her. Fuck that bitch.

WIA

[Moma]

It was pure 151 all night with Wray and Nephew from Mobay Proper; she could drink like a sailor. We sat in my living room where my seating arrangement is based on a lazy boy two seater. I didn't touch her prior, I'm not that way inclined. There was no flirting that I was aware of, I think hood lizards operate differently. I pulled a cat and mouse on a previous one in which I told her I was concerned she would be too rough in sex. This resulted in the lay.

I still go from 'indifferent' to HERE IS MY WOOD/INTENT which may surprise many lizards. My British veneer still baffles a lot of reptiles out here and I think they stay guessing. So you are saying it's more of a mood thing right now than particular words? I was wondering if there were any clever lines you could suggest to optimise the situation.

[WestIndianArchie]

(04-27-2016 10:19 AM)Moma Wrote:  

It was pure 151 all night with Wray and Nephew from Mobay Proper; she could drink like a sailor.

Lol at Wray and Nephew.

(04-27-2016 10:19 AM)Moma Wrote:  

We sat in my living room where my seating arrangement is based on a lazy boy two seater. I didn't touch her prior, I'm not that way inclined. There was no flirting that I was aware of, I think hood lizards operate differently.

So you basically went from chill guy to hop on my dick.
London style takes no prisoners!

You have to get her wet before you ram it in!
I'm not saying you need to be tender and Mr. Loverman/Marvin Gaye.

But she even a hood chick has to be eased into the situation.

(04-27-2016 10:19 AM)Moma Wrote:  

I pulled a cat and mouse on a previous one in which I told her I was concerned she would be too rough in sex. This resulted in the lay.

That's smart thinking, because your baiting her into it.

(04-27-2016 10:19 AM)Moma Wrote:  

I still go from 'indifferent' to HERE IS MY WOOD/INTENT which may surprise many lizards. My British veneer still baffles a lot of reptiles out here and I think they stay guessing.

But not in a good way. Even if you're getting numbers, you're potentially missing on better conversion and long term 'tings'.

(04-27-2016 10:19 AM)Moma Wrote:  

So you are saying it's more of a mood thing right now than particular words? I was wondering if there were any clever lines you could suggest to optimise the situation.

Mood isn't the right word, she was thinking one thing, and then you change. She was going to convince you that she was a good girl by playing hard to get, but she'd let you get it..On her timetable.

When you came with the wood, all of her plans were ruined.
So now she's in a hostile state.

You can't let her dwell on that. It's your job to manage her emotions in that situation, and move her past that.

She's dealt with guys that have her over in order to fuck her. You're not like them, until you were.

So now you have to climb the other side of the mountain.
You have to become that dude she's used to fucking.

The overarching stuff here is bigger than what you're asking. But it links up with some stuff in other threads about what to do when the chick wants you to play a role.

WIA

[WestIndianArchie]

In any scenario where a girl gets angry, you defuse the situation by changing the subject, and then comeback to the issue when she's giggly and compliant.

A clever line?

Do the same thing again, with a half smile on your face. You actually want to push it blatantly, because you want to poke fun at her being so serious.

Then you turn the situation back on her, like she's the one to blame.

It's just dicey,, because she can go left on you, and put you in a place that forces a tough decision. She's perfectly happy not fucking you. Bitches look for reasons to not fuck. And if they're aren't into it, they'll invent something.

That's what you're trying to avoid.

[spygoat]

(04-27-2016 11:08 AM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

In any scenario where a girl gets angry, you defuse the situation by changing the subject, and then comeback to the issue when she's giggly and compliant.

A clever line?

Do the same thing again, with a half smile on your face. You actually want to push it blatantly, because you want to poke fun at her being so serious.

Then you turn the situation back on her, like she's the one to blame.

It's just dicey,, because she can go left on you, and put you in a place that forces a tough decision. She's perfectly happy not fucking you. Bitches look for reasons to not fuck. And if they're aren't into it, they'll invent something.

That's what you're trying to avoid.

Isn't this kind of like agree and amplify - ie. she isn't happy or shit tests you over something. You brush it off or agree, move on to another subject, circle around and drop the bomb and hiroshima that shit test?

Not disagreeing with you fella - just trying to understand better.

[WestIndianArchie]

The mechanics are the same, but the intention is different.

A&A is for the initial pull, like when you first pull a chick. It's part of what makes you attractive to her, you don't take her bullshit seriously.

After you bang her, gotten the prize so to speak, then you A&A to keep her in check.

But Moma hasn't fucked her yet and he's already attracted her. When a chick acts up after attraction, it's a judgement call on how to proceed.

When he goes from Steve Urkle to Lexington Steel she's now in a vulnerable position.

The way I read the situation is she's actually and legitimately mad, egged on by the alcohol.

So he can A&A to change the mood, but then turn the situation. It's a two piece because most girls are never on the receiving end of that kind of game.

If you just think agree and amplify without understanding the context, you don't know what to do next.

In my opinion, when I read cats doling out advice all willy nilly, I know they haven't thought enough about it, and haven't been in enough real situations where internet advice or "common sense" has blown up in their faces.

Context matters

WIA

[gang]

(04-27-2016 08:16 AM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

Sober night game is my preferred method, and for most of my game career my only method.

For most lushes, alcohol loosens the tongue. Gets a guy outside of his head and more in tune with the hunger.

But the other side is that you don't react to a lot of the bs that chicks will try and sideline you with. Being non-reactive is a huge key in the game.

Your game will suffer a bit, but you'll get a lot better. You have to unlock for yourself what specifically is going on with your drunk game and how it works.

Running day game will make your sober night game better as well.

WIA

But are you pulling one night stands or just getting numbers while sober?

[WestIndianArchie]

One night stands are considerably easier sober.
I know what I'm doing and I can head drama off before it comes.

That's pretty much the case through out guys who do this the "old school" way

WIA

[gang]

(04-27-2016 03:48 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

One night stands are considerably easier sober.
I know what I'm doing and I can head drama off before it comes.

That's pretty much the case through out guys who do this the "old school" way

WIA

Not really sure what you mean by drama. When I'm drinking I can turn the fuck up and usually that helps in getting laid from clubs and bars in my experience. When I'm sober I feel too serious and I'm talking to these bitches like I would in a coffee shop or some shit. My body language is weak because I don't feel the music as much and I know that used to be a strong point because one time a girl told me every girl in the bar was watching me dance because of how sexy it was. I'm sure my lack of enthusiasm shows through on my face too. I believe the girls feel this vibe from me and feel a disconnect. I'm not sure how to shift my mind to where it would be if I were buzzed like they are.

I'm not saying its not possible but the transition will be hard for me if I don't get super bored and give up before I'm able to make it work for me.

[jake1720]

Yup. Used to. Game got stale because I stopped going out.

It's actually easier. For me I have enough game to where most girls like me. hard part now is the comfort.

it takes time but after a while you can get good at it.

[gang]

(04-27-2016 07:45 PM)jake1720 Wrote:  

Yup. Used to. Game got stale because I stopped going out.

It's actually easier. For me I have enough game to where most girls like me. hard part now is the comfort.

it takes time but after a while you can get good at it.

why did you stop going out? and what do you mean the comfort?

[thecrazy]

I had the opposite problem, i quitted drinking when doing night game cause with alcohol i used to enjoy more the night, but sober i pulled much more. I am quite good looking, so i either get approached and run the "i am the prize" game and when you're drunk it's much easier to fuck it up, or run caveman game on the dancefloor and when sober i am more dominant and girls feel it. Then when sober is easier to screen girls, easier to spot the sluts, i handle rejections better and i get pissed off much less, while drunk every rejection can be an excuse to get pissed off and ruin my state/get aggressive. The only cases when i drink is if i am with a girl and her group of friends is drinking and invites me drinking with them/offers me to drink, in that case i don't mind even getting drunk, i think it's better to be accepted and not cockblocked by her friends and it makes you emotionally closer to her, i drink with the girl, not to get the girl.

[Player_1337]

I've executed all of my ONS night game pulls while sober. When I hit the clubs/bars, I typically only have 1-2 drinks max. A surplus of drinks (especially in NYC venues) is a waste of $, calories and ultimately becomes a crutch.

You sober + her tipsy/drunk = a huge advantage in steering the interaction.

[thecrazy]

(04-28-2016 10:02 AM)Player_1337 Wrote:  

You sober + her tipsy/drunk = a huge advantage in steering the interaction.

Exactly

[XXL]

(04-28-2016 04:26 AM)thecrazy Wrote:  

I had the opposite problem, i quitted drinking when doing night game cause with alcohol i used to enjoy more the night, but sober i pulled much more. I am quite good looking, so i either get approached and run the "i am the prize" game and when you're drunk it's much easier to fuck it up, or run caveman game on the dancefloor and when sober i am more dominant and girls feel it. Then when sober is easier to screen girls, easier to spot the sluts, i handle rejections better and i get pissed off much less, while drunk every rejection can be an excuse to get pissed off and ruin my state/get aggressive. The only cases when i drink is if i am with a girl and her group of friends is drinking and invites me drinking with them/offers me to drink, in that case i don't mind even getting drunk, i think it's better to be accepted and not cockblocked by her friends and it makes you emotionally closer to her, i drink with the girl, not to get the girl.

That's my experience too. Once I tried old school sober way and saw all the benefits I couldn't go back.

(04-27-2016 07:41 PM)gang Wrote:  

(04-27-2016 03:48 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

One night stands are considerably easier sober.
I know what I'm doing and I can head drama off before it comes.

That's pretty much the case through out guys who do this the "old school" way

WIA

Not really sure what you mean by drama. When I'm drinking I can turn the fuck up and usually that helps in getting laid from clubs and bars in my experience. When I'm sober I feel too serious and I'm talking to these bitches like I would in a coffee shop or some shit. My body language is weak because I don't feel the music as much and I know that used to be a strong point because one time a girl told me every girl in the bar was watching me dance because of how sexy it was. I'm sure my lack of enthusiasm shows through on my face too. I believe the girls feel this vibe from me and feel a disconnect. I'm not sure how to shift my mind to where it would be if I were buzzed like they are.

I'm not saying its not possible but the transition will be hard for me if I don't get super bored and give up before I'm able to make it work for me.

So it seems that all your charisma/game/etc is run by the booze itself, not you.

If you're bored that's actually good. It makes you to want to entertain yourself by doing/saying shit you find fun, instead of, drinking to get numb and act up like another upbeat dude with faggy smile. It's a complete different process. The former one is run by you and your actions, the latter is run by liquid.

I know that booze helps a lot to be more fun, carefree and in tune with the club but believe me, talking to girls has the same effect on your body/mind. Countless times I felt "drunk" in very low key places like quiet coffee shop or even on lunch break at work just because I had interesting/vivid conversation with bunch of girls there. Add some music, some dancing, some typical club nonsense on top of that and you feel and look the same drunk/loose/carefree/confident.

[Nascimento]

Not drinking is the best thing a man can do for his night game.

thread-25236.html

[gang]

(04-28-2016 10:02 AM)Player_1337 Wrote:  

I've executed all of my ONS night game pulls while sober. When I hit the clubs/bars, I typically only have 1-2 drinks max. A surplus of drinks (especially in NYC venues) is a waste of $, calories and ultimately becomes a crutch.

You sober + her tipsy/drunk = a huge advantage in steering the interaction.

All of my ONS were "sober" too if you put it that way, just steady beer drinking. When I say sober I mean 0 drinking. 1-2 drinks does a lot to your mental state in a club/bar.

I think I just need to practice and get used to the new sober state that I am forced to have at night. It's ridiculous to think I have to rely on a substance to pull ONS from a club/bar.

Another "problem" I forgot to post in the original post is my pickiness skyrockets to another level while I'm sober. I might see only 2-3 girls the whole night that I would even bother approaching versus when drinking I have a wider selection because I'm hornier and just want some fast, exciting, alcohol induced sex. But I guess this pickiness can be a good thing also.

I also believe it is essential to lie and say you are drinking if you are directly asked by a girl you are trying to game. Even though its OK in your mind it might kill the connection in her mind like I feel it has for me in the past when honest about it.

[WestIndianArchie]

Sounds like you need to revamp your "game"

WIA

[WalkingMan]

(04-30-2016 04:22 PM)gang Wrote:  

I also believe it is essential to lie and say you are drinking if you are directly asked by a girl you are trying to game. Even though its OK in your mind it might kill the connection in her mind like I feel it has for me in the past when honest about it.

Anybody else just carry around a glass of water?

[The_e_man]

Currently sitting at a notch count of 80 (age: 22 years old). Majority, probably over 90%, of those notches were from SNL solo sober night game.
I used to rely on alcohol or the presence of my friends being with me to be able to actually approach / escalate.
My first time rolling solo and sober was TERRIFYING. My adrenal glands were pumped into overdrive. I was so in my head that I may as well have been on some sort of drug.
But it gets better with time. And soon you will LAUGH at how you used to trip about approaching girls at the club while alone/sober.