[pialox]

I've found recently that the more I've involved and subscribed myself in Red Pill thinking and issues the more my conversations and vibing with women starts heading into those types of topics.

I'm of the age now (34) that putting up with a womans shit is something I will not do and adding notches to my bed post is really of not much interest to me. But for example just yesterday I went on a date with a fit 24 year old girl, ticks a lot of my boxes in interests. But I found that the conversation after awhile turned to SJW's, feminism, Male to female dynamics. As I suppose these are subjects of interest for me.

Granted, this was a good way of screening her as to her background and turns out she is a feminist (although describes herself more 2nd wave), comes from a traditional Christian family where her parents are still together and is aware and embraces the differences/dynamics between man and woman.

I came away thinking that she did tick a lot of things of my list and was someone I would definitely want to see again (she has stated she would also like to do the same). So in a way yeh I guess I was screening her for suitability.

BUT....

As with all that type of conversation its a sure fire way to dry some women up like the Sahara. As a result it was impossible to steer the conversation where I had the ability in which to escalate physically. Which of course runs the danger of pushing things into friendzone territory

I suppose I was lucky in this case as her texts regarding the date after the fact were enthusiastic and said "Thanks for the fun night". But I know i need to shake this thinking as it is or will effect my game in future if i keep it up.

So I ask brothers, those of you who have found yourself going down this path of screening or subject matter.
How do you break the cycle?
Am I alone in this?
How can I disperse or steer conversation into a sexual way from these topics?
Should I have a red pill detox?

[Onto]

Same thing happened to me when I was your age.

There are a few options I see:

1) You still stick to your red-pill guns but to it in very light-hearted, teasing way.

2) Stick to dating FOB's (Fresh off the Boat)

3) Stop dating American and travel/date

You can do all three if you want and see what you like more.

[pialox]

I suppose it isnt so much of who I'm dating its more that i feel my perhaps over consumption of red pill news and current affairs is causing me to go to that subject matter quickly.

[Onto]

(04-20-2016 09:14 PM)pialox Wrote:  

I suppose it isnt so much of who I'm dating its more that i feel my perhaps over consumption of red pill news and current affairs is causing me to go to that subject matter quickly.

Ahh...I see. If you are the one starting that kind of topic it may be because it's still relatively new to you.

Those kind of conversations are best suited for men, unless you have an LTR who's traditional and subscribes to the same beliefs as you. That's a nice experience.

If you want to see where a woman stands you can point something out (movie, current event, social circle drama) and ask her what she thinks about it.

It's better for her to offer up an opinion first. This way it gives you some insight into her mind-set along with an edge on any follow-up question you want to ask. You can also decide to drop it and let her follow up with a question. Then you still have the advantage of already knowing her position along with time to think of how you want to express it.

[pialox]

(04-20-2016 09:29 PM)Onto Wrote:  

Ahh...I see. If you are the one starting that kind of topic it may be because it's still relatively new to you.

Those kind of conversations are best suited for men, unless you have an LTR who's traditional and subscribes to the same beliefs as you. That's a nice experience.

If you want to see where a woman stands you can point something out (movie, current event, social circle drama) and ask her what she thinks about it.

I wouldnt say its relatively new to me. I guess maybe things from a cultural point of view holistically are slotting together.

I don't really force the point, the subject comes up through kind of natural osmosis. Last night the conversation got on to some hippy free thinking kind of stuff and it evolved from there. She certainly didnt disagree with any of the Red Pill stuff i was dropping on her. (Probably due to her upbringing and parents)

But turning the conversation to a sexual nature was difficult and I feel as this is going to cause issues in the future.

I'm starting to think maybe my consumption of things prior to dates is incorrect and i should thrash out on guitar for an hour rather than watch an interview on the current state of cultural marxism.
On the plus side, she got screened pretty thoroughly and passed the femicunt and boner test.

[XPQ22]

I sometimes feel myself running up against the same issues, as I am somewhat new at this myself.

I try to remember the saying attributed to George Bernard Shaw: "Never wrestle with a pig. You just get dirty. And besides, the pig kinda likes it."

Never argue with feminists or SJWs. Don't try to enlighten them, change them, or "get them to see things your way." Because you can't. The conclusions of those philosophies were drawn way ahead of time. They never will see things your way - the best you will ever get is "Well, I disagree."

Because it was never really about "social justice", or equality. It was and is about control of the sexual marketplace...to consolidate the power and freeze out as many men as possible. You can't debate the issues when the issues are not the real issues.

When you hear these things, I think one must simply observe, not enagage.

"There once was an old owl, who lived in an oak. The more he heard, the less he spoke. The less he spoke, the more he heard. Why can't we all be more, like that wise old bird?"

The great irony of it is this. Imagine that for some reason one had a strident feminist girlfriend. If you were to send her some list of "red pill fundamentals of game" all at once, she would try to destroy you.

Now imagine you had the same list. And perhaps every week, every two weeks, you casually inserted an item into conversation in a quiet, thoughtful voice.

"Well, I just don't think women really like men in the same way that men like women."

"Yes, I could see that."

"I think women like men who aren't needy and clingy."

"Of course!"

And each time she agreed, you crossed an item off the list. Expected result? After a few months, just about every item in the list would be crossed off. And there she would be...slow boiled like the proverbial frog in a pot of red-pill/game juices.

I do not know if such an experiment has ever been attempted.

[pialox]

The funny thing is, I dont really get much resistance or disagreement. I suppose I feel things out with pre-questioning and work out how far down the red pill path i can take it.

I usually frame it in a hippy, free speech, feminists are always agree kinda vibe that I think because of the emotional aspect of framing it in that fashion girls can kind of relate and agree with it.

But like i said, sexual escalation after talking about say the effect of false rape accusations on men is a bit of a jump lol.

[XPQ22]

Didn't feminists tell you the reason they hate the "patriarchy"? The real reasons?

They hate the patriarchy because...the patriarchy is a bunch of white knights, who interfere with their ability to do as they wish in regards to the sexual marketplace. The patriarchy believes that women are delicate flowers who must be saved from themselves...at any cost. The patriarchy wants to control their ability to fuck all the "alphas" they want, while abort the children of unsuitable men with impunity.

The patriarchy believes in fair and equitable distribution of women's sexual resources in exchange for men doing the grunt work of running society. "Fuck that", says women. "Stop cockblocking the alphas."

And I have no reason to believe that if I were a woman that I'd feel any differently.

Aside from Bumble, most online dating sites were designed by crack teams of white knights, who would do anything to appease their female base and keep the money flowing in. They love them for it. They hate them.

[pialox]

(04-20-2016 10:18 PM)XPQ22 Wrote:  

And each time she agreed, you crossed an item off the list. Expected result? After a few months, just about every item in the list would be crossed off. And there she would be...slow boiled like the proverbial frog in a pot of red-pill/game juices.

I do not know if such an experiment has ever been attempted.

Hrrmm interesting.

Being presenting with logic over a long period of time and being able to perhaps reference experiences you have both shared over that time would have to result in some red-pill realizations on her behalf.

I guess when I saw compliance in a lot of red-pill knowledge i was dropping on her it was only natural for me to put the foot down in a calculated fashion. I guess sometimes you can just read your target audience before you even open your mouth.

She acknowledged there are definitely difference between the sexes, and that difference is what she finds attractive in guys. Also talked about how when she talks to her father when she has a problem that she prefaces the conversation with "I'm not looking for how to fix this issue dad. I'm just want to emotionally vent". So she knows that guys are natural problem solvers.

I suppose if anything regardless of my lack of sexual escalation, with the topics I brought up I've put myself in position in her mind of guy who is different, logically grounded with some element polarizing her femininity.

[XXL]

Quick question What's the point of touching upon red pill topics with a woman at all?

[pialox]

(04-21-2016 12:27 AM)XXL Wrote:  

Quick question What's the point of touching upon red pill topics with a woman at all?

There wasnt a point. The conversation just seems to go that way.

[Leonard D Neubache]

Not to put too fine a point on it, but your OP seems to indicate that you want an LTR or possibly marriage but you haven't consciously accepted that fact yet.

If you don't want an LTR then you don't need to give a single shit about her politics. The very fact that you're bringing up politics (even subconsciously) would seem to indicate that you're in a "settling down" phase.

The very first thing you need to do is to get absolutely 100% clear on that. Are you seriously intending on getting married? I say married because LTRs without the specific intention of marriage are a recipe for epic fucking disaster, so be straight with yourself.

[Walker]

(04-21-2016 01:30 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

Not to put too fine a point on it, but your OP seems to indicate that you want an LTR or possibly marriage but you haven't consciously accepted that fact yet.

If you don't want an LTR then you don't need to give a single shit about her politics. The very fact that you're bringing up politics (even subconsciously) would seem to indicate that you're in a "settling down" phase.

The very first thing you need to do is to get absolutely 100% clear on that. Are you seriously intending on getting married? I say married because LTRs without the specific intention of marriage are a recipe for epic fucking disaster, so be straight with yourself.

IDK social context matters a lot to me.

1 on 1 I never talk politics with a girl. In front of a group I sometimes do it. If the girl is saying something that's bothersome I'm likely to start talking RP so I can look smart and principled in front of the group.

I'm a medium term relationship kind of guy. 6-12 months of NRE followed by an amicable breakup is what I'm always going for.

[pialox]

(04-21-2016 01:30 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

Not to put too fine a point on it, but your OP seems to indicate that you want an LTR or possibly marriage but you haven't consciously accepted that fact yet.

If you don't want an LTR then you don't need to give a single shit about her politics. The very fact that you're bringing up politics (even subconsciously) would seem to indicate that you're in a "settling down" phase.

The very first thing you need to do is to get absolutely 100% clear on that. Are you seriously intending on getting married? I say married because LTRs without the specific intention of marriage are a recipe for epic fucking disaster, so be straight with yourself.

You raise an interesting point. I will put some thought into that i suppose.

[AntiMediocrity]

(04-21-2016 01:36 AM)Walker Wrote:  

.I'm a medium term relationship kind of guy. 6-12 months of NRE followed by an amicable breakup is what I'm always going for.

A slight thread derail, because I'm curious:

Have you ever revealed to a woman that you're a "medium-term relationship guy"? I don't think such a concept exists for a woman, either a guy is a new horse on the carousel or potential marriage (Read: LTR) material, often moving from the former to the latter after she's slept with you enough times. So in that respect you must be hiding your intentions from the beginning, unless the girl in question is clearly going to be a ONS and you both implicitly agree on that.
_______________

To the OP, I too get the impression you're looking for a LTR, and if that's the case you shouldn't avoid this kind of discussion because it'll come up eventually, whether it's the first night or 6 months in. Better sooner than later, you don't want to invest too much time in a woman who has a dissenting opinion on what essentially shapes the culture we reside in.

As someone said in an earlier post, it's good for filtering-just don't throw everything in at once. Let the woman ask the questions, otherwise drop your opinion on her and then try to move onto something else. Deep stuff is left for the second date or even better, after the lay.

(04-21-2016 12:27 AM)XXL Wrote:  

Quick question What's the point of touching upon red pill topics with a woman at all?

Why not? Unless you're solely looking for plates, it's important to have your partner on the same intellectual level as you. Who wants to spend the rest of their life disagreeing with someone or avoiding delicate topics?

[Leonard D Neubache]

(04-21-2016 01:36 AM)Walker Wrote:  

IDK social context matters a lot to me.

1 on 1 I never talk politics with a girl. In front of a group I sometimes do it. If the girl is saying something that's bothersome I'm likely to start talking RP so I can look smart and principled in front of the group.

I'm a medium term relationship kind of guy. 6-12 months of NRE followed by an amicable breakup is what I'm always going for.

Are we talking six to twelve months of monogamy? And an amicable breakup after that?

If you can manage that on a regular basis then I seriously tip my hat to you, friend.

Of course a non monogamous relationship of 6 to 12 months would be better described as "friends with benefits" IMO.

[262]

OP, did you even read Roosh's book, Bang?

In short, friendly chat is fine for the first venue on your first dates.

But, at the second venue on your first dates, you essentially find reasons to touch her, slowly escalating from innocent, to more sexual.

[The Black Knight]

Whether it is a fuckbuddy or a potential LTR, I don't really like associating with anti-red pill women anymore. A SJW/feminist twat is a serious liability for a ONS these days anyway and I rather associate with people I actually get along with as oppose to people who's personalities I find repulsive.

Generally, I don't need to drop any real hard line red pill statements; I just know the women I go out with are somewhat on the same page as me on some things and just roll with it.

But I do troll sometimes if a woman gets a little out there with the "you go girl"/feminist bullshit (which almost every woman in the US will do at some point since it's blasted constantly in their faces all the time) and I'll just straight up say:

"I don't believe men and women are equal"

....which will lead to a shit-test which I pass because I don't back down and can back up my statement. Unless they are a hardcore feminist twat, they will respect you more since:

1. You stood your ground and
2. They know deep down men and women are not equal.

So in a sea of politically correct effeminate "men", you can stand out in a VERY positive manner if you can embrace and be direct about your red pill beliefs (as long as you don't come off as bitter, whiny or angry). I suppose if you only strictly care about getting a bang, you should moderate yourself accordingly. But I'm definitely a "big picture" guy these days when it comes to investing my time and energy into hanging out with a woman; whether they are a potential fuckbuddy or potential LTR.

[Walker]

(04-21-2016 02:32 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

(04-21-2016 01:36 AM)Walker Wrote:  

IDK social context matters a lot to me.

1 on 1 I never talk politics with a girl. In front of a group I sometimes do it. If the girl is saying something that's bothersome I'm likely to start talking RP so I can look smart and principled in front of the group.

I'm a medium term relationship kind of guy. 6-12 months of NRE followed by an amicable breakup is what I'm always going for.

Are we talking six to twelve months of monogamy? And an amicable breakup after that?

If you can manage that on a regular basis then I seriously tip my hat to you, friend.

Of course a non monogamous relationship of 6 to 12 months would be better described as "friends with benefits" IMO.

Sometimes it works out, sometimes it fails. I've had bitter breakups and I've had premature ones.

I've had MTRs that I consider perfect. A few months of submission where she adjusts to my kinks, has great sex with me, buys me stuff, then when she's clearly starting to get tired of me, I tell her it's time to move on and we do it without trying to burn each other's life down.

I don't try to spin plates or cheat. I don't know if I've ever been cheated on. I don't rule out the possibility that my more toxic girlfriends did it.

(04-21-2016 02:15 AM)AntiMediocrity Wrote:  

A slight thread derail, because I'm curious:

Have you ever revealed to a woman that you're a "medium-term relationship guy"? I don't think such a concept exists for a woman, either a guy is a new horse on the carousel or potential marriage (Read: LTR) material, often moving from the former to the latter after she's slept with you enough times. So in that respect you must be hiding your intentions from the beginning, unless the girl in question is clearly going to be a ONS and you both implicitly agree on that.

I reveal it if they ask.

"Ummm... what are you looking for out of this?"
"A girlfriend for the next few months."

I lie about the details of my life. I don't say what I do for a living. Sometimes I imply that I'm planning to move soon when really I'm not. But I've never tried to string a girlfriend into thinking I want marriage and kids and I never will, unless I go baby crazy myself and really do plan to find a wife.

[WestIndianArchie]

I still can't understand why red pill guys are anti game.
It makes no sense to me.

WIA

[birthday cat]

(04-21-2016 12:27 AM)XXL Wrote:  

Quick question What's the point of touching upon red pill topics with a woman at all?

Maybe you are less interested in banging and more interested in telling other guys how alpha you are for not tolerating how her group's groupthink doesn't agree with your group's groupthink.

[XXL]

(04-21-2016 12:28 AM)pialox Wrote:  

(04-21-2016 12:27 AM)XXL Wrote:  

Quick question What's the point of touching upon red pill topics with a woman at all?

There wasnt a point. The conversation just seems to go that way.

If it just happen to go that way then who's leading?

AntiMediocrity Wrote:

(04-21-2016 12:27 AM)XXL Wrote:  

Quick question What's the point of touching upon red pill topics with a woman at all?

Why not? Unless you're solely looking for plates, it's important to have your partner on the same intellectual level as you. Who wants to spend the rest of their life disagreeing with someone or avoiding delicate topics?

I've learned that there are some things that are better left unsaid. Not because of fear of bringing them up or anything like that, rather for my own comfort and peace.

Take gender roles. Everybody knows that there have been clear gender roles at play since the beginning of time, that's how we are wired by default and no feminist driven revolution can change our nature and what we are innately built to do as human beings. However I know that when I bring it up I'll probably get into stupid debate and will have to hear out a lot of idiotic counter arguments how the world is changing etc.

No thank you. To me the best way to talk about "the truths" is to be very vague and brief. For example, when someone asks me what I think about being stay at home dad I say that I can't imagine doing it, that I find it weird and that I being out there makes me feel like a man and allows me to provide for my family. That's it. I don't start giving lectures about harsh truths of life and how things are suppose to work.

(04-21-2016 09:35 AM)birthday cat Wrote:  

(04-21-2016 12:27 AM)XXL Wrote:  

Quick question What's the point of touching upon red pill topics with a woman at all?

Maybe you are less interested in banging and more interested in telling other guys how alpha you are for not tolerating how her group's groupthink doesn't agree with your group's groupthink.

Telling other guys how alpha I am for not tolerating how her group's groupthink doesn't agree with my group's groupthink would imply that I care about what those guys think so much that I feel inside the need to confront them and show how better I am. Which is by and of itself a clear signal of low status.

If you like to debate a bit then here's what I know... So called alpha guy that you're referring to does not give a flying fuck about what regular people think, do, say, unless it directly affects his well being. He's not the loudest in the room, doesn't care about being viewed as right and he actually prefers when others stay confused, wrong, mislead cause that means they're behind and he's ahead. He walks his own path, tolerate everyday bullshit people do/say, chuckle inside out of pity and does what he wants.

(04-21-2016 09:07 AM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

I still can't understand why red pill guys are anti game.
It makes no sense to me.

WIA

Because there are 2 different camps in this sphere. Camp "red pill fans / game philosophers" and camp "game players". None of them are wrong or right, they just have different focus.

[XPQ22]

For my part I try to stay firmly in the camp of "game player" as much as I can. It's why I prefer reading Roosh's material to the ponderous, humorless sophistry of Roissy.

Red pill pop evo-psych navel gazing is sort of like pondering the fall of the Roman Empire - it can be fun to think about, but at the end of the day I think it does very little to get one laid. Perhaps it's because I come from an engineering background - the "whys" of things don't matter so much to me. I like "practical problems."

[WestIndianArchie]

@XXL

OP has a problem that game solves, but red pill does not.

WIA

[Travesty]

(04-21-2016 01:18 PM)XXL Wrote:  

-- Great answers --

Bravo. #1 should be why are you wasting precious life trying to convert people through argument or diatribes.

The right people you care about will come to you for advice in private or ask casually.

Women will follow when you lead and they know they can't do better.

No need to go parading the flag around. Live life well.