[joecolombia]

I`ve been struggling with being tired during the entire day and can`t do anything about it. Most of the time I have to wake up early (5 am or so) but when I try to fall asleep early, I am not able to. I shut down everything and just wait for sleep to come, but it usually takes up to an hour and a half. That makes me stay roughly till 1 am everyday, leaving me with just a few hours of sleep.

I drink coffee (a lot)
I workout in the afternoon
I am unable to take naps during the day

I`ve seen some people get used to sleeping 4 or 5 hours and be just fine during the day.

How do you do that, and if not, how to fall asleep easily.

[Jack Of All Trades]

being physically active during the day helps a lot, I do the same especially since I work long days sometimes. Instead of sitting, stand and walk around to keep your blood flowing.

[roid]

Do bloodwork. Check your thyroid and testosterone levels

[Bushido]

Cut down on the coffee and drink it early in the day.

[Clockwerk]

Go for a walk at 8pm, take a hot bath and get in bed before 10pm at the latest. The hours between 10pm and 2am you get double rest IF you're asleep by 10.

[Requiem]

- Make sure your entire room is completely dark. No stand-by lights, no lantern shining through a crack in the roller blind.
- Make sure to let in fresh air before going to bed
- Make sure your room temperature feels somewhat cool.
- Avoid coffee after 1 or 2 PM
- Avoid unnatural lights for at least an hour before going to bed. This includes computer and smartphone screens. f.lux (https://justgetflux.com/) can help with this.
- Do your workout as early as possible; meaning very soon after work. The more time between the gym and bedtime, the more your body can calm down.
- Also calm down mentally, which means no exciting movies before bed.
- Going to bed hungry won't help but some people can't sleep well if they eat late. Thus try to have your last bit to eat 1 or 2 hours before bed.
- Not being able to take naps should help you sleep at night, so not a big problem really. To make your body understand better when it's time to be active and when it's time to fall asleep, consider using a bright light. You can read the important info about it in this thread: thread-39799.html

Based on your statement I assume you go to bed around 11 PM. You said you were tired throughout the day but I'm sure there are highs and lows. Is there a time in the evening where you feel your tiredness increases a little? Maybe you just realize it after you start paying heed to it. If there is such a time and you can afford it, try to go to bed immediately. This can be anywhere between 7 and 10 PM. Maybe you just think "it's too early yet" but if you wake up at 5 AM, then 10 PM should already be considered "late for bed".

If you can't fall asleep, don't stress yourself out over it. The more you try, the harder it is.

[TestosteroneMan]

Make the post-lunch coffee/tea your last caffeinated beverage of the day, it will make a difference. If not, do as suggested and check your blood. You should check your blood 3 times a year or so anyhow, so it's never a bad idea.

[WalkingMan]

To me it's obviously the coffee. Caffeine lasts for almost 8-12 hours after you drink it.

I'll second what Requiem said about dark rooms. It took me a while to realize that my curtains sucked and that I should invest a bit more cash in blackout curtains. Awesome investment. I need to get some for my new place as well.

[thoughtgypsy]

I wouldn't even have the after lunch coffee. As other's have already mentioned, it has a long half life and stays in your system for up to 12 hours. If you go to bed at 11pm, that means 10am is your last coffee. Have one or two in the morning and no more. Have an afternoon green tea or two if you're having a hard time staying awake.

Get some magnesium citrate and take it 30min before bed.

I also feel like this topic has been covered here before. Do a forum search for "sleep" and see what pops up. I think TLOZ has covered bright light theraphy in great detail, which might be worth checking out.

[Brodiaga]

^If you avoid coffee, what do you drink instead? Let's say you have a habit of sitting in a coffee shop in the afternoon and working What do you get instead? Tea? Decaf?

[thoughtgypsy]

(04-12-2016 10:31 AM)Brodiaga Wrote:  

^If you avoid coffee, what do you drink instead? Let's say you have a habit of sitting in a coffee shop in the afternoon and working What do you get instead? Tea? Decaf?

I used to drink coffee in the afternoon up to maybe 4PM. Eventually I switched to green tea in the afternoon and now I do chamomile tea. Green tea has 1/8-1/4 the caffeine of coffee. Looks like Decaf is even better at 1/10-1/20. Chamomile is caffeine free.
http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifest...t-20049372

Chamomile also has the effect of calming the stomach and there's some evidence that it can be used to help treat insomnia.
http://www.europeanneuropsychopharmacolo...X/abstract

Speaking of Chamomile, I make my own "power tea" and megadose probiotics as soon as I start feeling the first hint of sickness coming on. The tea consists of chopped and boiled ginger root, turmeric (optional). After its warm I add a couple capfuls of apple cider vinegar, lemon or lime juice, and honey to mask the bitter taste, then stir. I'll add a bag of chamomile tea and let it soak, then sip it as it gets warm. It does a pretty good job of completely clearing out any mucus, opening the sinuses, and delivering some vitamin C.

[Ski pro]

I just quit booze 6 months + now and stopped coffee/caffeine 3 weeks ago.

Sleeping so well now and have lots more energy.

[hydrogonian]

Eat dinner by 6 p.m.

No computer or television within at most one hour before bed.

Read a book or magazine during that hour. The more you have to think about what you are reading, the better. But the act itself should mostly be enough as long as you are actually doing it. What you are doing is depleting your frontal cortex of energy/sugar.

Doing this should wear out your frontal cortex enough, and stop artificially stimulating it with light/flicker from the screen, to allow you to fall into a healthier sleep pattern within one week or so.

Also, scale back your bedtime by 30-60 minutes each night until you are going to bed around 9:00-9:30. Earlier sleep is more restful sleep.

[Jaysive]

Try staying hydrated throughout the day and limiting caffine consumption to 1-2 cups daily preferably for morning use only. 1 quart of water upon waking, 1 quart with every meal (assuming they are big meals) and 1 quart a few hours before bed.

Urine should be fairly clear and not smell. If urine is yellow or smells you are not hydrated enough. Give this a try and should help with fatigue.

[Phoenix]

I really wish they still sold caffeine free coca cola. I love coke, but if I have it with dinner then my sleep is fucked.

[storm]

Work hard, especially physically, and set an alarm.

When you wake up, use a ringtone that you have trained yourself to become alert when listening to.

Having the correct lighting also helps.

Ultimately any vaguely reasonable sleep schedule can be adopted, even something like 3-4 hrs, and give you about 80-90% efficiency. But you must let your body adapt. This will typically take four to six weeks. Expect one or two episodes during that time when your body rebels. Fight them naturally if you can, or with sleeping pills and stimulants if you cannot. Building a consistent habit is key, do what it takes.

Enjoy having 50-100% more time than anyone else you know.

EDIT: ever since I began TRT it has been 100x easier to sleep less. I naturally wake up in <5hrs full of energy and can work 20hrs+. Fall asleep immediately when I hit the bed. You don't need any of the above tricks, but if you try them they work like some sort of magic trick, so well that it is almost frightening. Probably your biggest problem is T.

[WalkingMan]

(04-15-2016 12:16 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  

I really wish they still sold caffeine free coca cola. I love coke, but if I have it with dinner then my sleep is fucked.

I'm sure you already know that soda is the worst thing you can drink out of all the choices you have. I can go months without drinking any kind of soda and not even notice. There's so much other better stuff out there, man.

Try downgrading to sparkling flavored water at first. One week I bought a bunch of bottles for like 75 cents per bottle at Kmart. Cheaper than a bottle of Coke, bigger bottle, AND tastier! I felt like I was robbing the place.

[birthday cat]

joecolombia - How much and what kind of coffee do you drink? You wrote that you work out in the afternoons. Is it more difficult for you to sleep on days that you workout?

[WalkingMan]

(04-15-2016 10:41 AM)WalkingMan Wrote:  

(04-15-2016 12:16 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  

I really wish they still sold caffeine free coca cola. I love coke, but if I have it with dinner then my sleep is fucked.

I'm sure you already know that soda is the worst thing you can drink out of all the choices you have. I can go months without drinking any kind of soda and not even notice. There's so much other better stuff out there, man.

Try downgrading to sparkling flavored water at first. One week I bought a bunch of bottles for like 75 cents per bottle at Kmart. Cheaper than a bottle of Coke, bigger bottle, AND tastier! I felt like I was robbing the place.

I wanted to share another option on what kinds of drinks you can replace soda with.

I just bought some berries, spinach, bananas, carrots, and pineapple juice on Sunday. Chop them bitches up (or not), ~5 minutes in the blender, and now you have a delicious smoothie that doesn't need any more sugar, doesn't make you feel guilty about drinking, and no caffeine so you can drink it at 1AM on a Monday night if you felt like it.

Throw in some milk and you're more likely to feel sleepier. Bananas and milk have an amino acid called tryptophin which induces serotonin, which can assist in helping you fall asleep.

[Malo]

Another thing you can try is to sleep lighter - this is achieved by sleeping on your back. Your sleep is not as deep, but still satisfying, and it makes it much easier to wake up and start the day. And it does not make you tired during the day. It's also better for your back.

Takes some getting used to (not turning around in your sleep takes some work, getting used to a slightly different type of sleep takes a bit), but can be achieved and definitely worth trying.

[Hannibal]

Stop drinking coffee. Coffee has a fairly long half life, so if you're drinking a shit ton of it, it makes sense that it would disturb your ability to go to sleep.

About three or four years ago I was living overseas in Germany. I have always been a coffee drinker and I'd have a few cups every day, but the coffee was so good there at the university that I drank six, maybe eight cups of it a day.

After a week or two of this, I noticed that I could not get to bed until 1 or 2 in the morning and I'd wake up every 45 minutes or so until 6. I still had a decent amount of energy. At first I thought it was some bad jet lag. After some googling I discovered that drinking that much coffee in a day will mess with your sleep cycle.

It would be a good idea to cut down on the coffee.

[WalkingMan]

I'm quitting night game for the next few months so I can get my day skills handled.

After staying up all night on Sunday, I went to bed at 10:30 Monday night and woke up at 6:30 today. Feeling good. I'll feel even better tomorrow.

More sleep = more energy for afternoon day game = less excuses

[WalkingMan]

(04-16-2016 09:50 AM)birthday cat Wrote:  

joecolombia - How much and what kind of coffee do you drink? You wrote that you work out in the afternoons. Is it more difficult for you to sleep on days that you workout?

In my case, it's harder for me to sleep if I work out a few hours before I'm meant to sleep.

On the contrary, my sleep is easier and more restful if I work out earlier in the morning. Cardio makes me sleep better than just lifting on it's own.

[WalkingMan]

(04-12-2016 10:31 AM)Brodiaga Wrote:  

^If you avoid coffee, what do you drink instead? Let's say you have a habit of sitting in a coffee shop in the afternoon and working What do you get instead? Tea? Decaf?

Water? Fruit juice? Smoothies? or even nothing at all. Getting a full night of sleep every night and riding my bicycle to and from work provides all the energy I need. No need to rely on any crutches.

If I stay out late even once it messes with me for the rest of the week. I came home at 11:30PM this Sunday night when all of last week I was sleeping at 9:30-10PM. It's Friday and I'm still not back to normal.

[Leonard D Neubache]

I know of people who've gotten good results with Valerian tablets (natural remedy, non prescription) but pills should only be a stop-gap measure.