[VincentVinturi]

I'm about to turn 30.

I feel better now than I ever have in my adult life.

I attribute this to the fact that I have my own digital business, live in a sunny paradise, crush young poony on the regular, train hard, rest well, and get out into nature often.

None of that was true in my 20s.

You can age well if you take care of yourself.

And when you really start to feel your age, TRT is readily available.

I wouldn't even call it "the wall" - that's for women.

If you have your shit together you can keep leveling up into your 60s.

And then you can spend your 70s, 80s+ doing cool shit using the money you have saved up and playing with grandkids.

That's what it's all about.

[SlickyBoy]

(03-29-2016 01:23 PM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  

And then you can spend your 70s, 80s+ doing cool shit using the money you have saved up and playing with grandkids.

That's what it's all about.

By that time, I'd better have a slush fund. Till then, I'm afraid to go back to Asia and have my potential kids & grandkids find & bankrupt me.....

[PhDre]

(03-26-2016 06:50 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Trust me, no amount of TRT will get me boners comparable to when I was a teenager.

I am talking boners that hit my stomach and that I could place a wet towel on.

T is not the biggest player when it comes to achieving rock hard erections.

You could try PT-141 or melanotan 2, these are synthetic analogues of MSH which is apparently the strongest erection inducing hormone in the human body.

Plenty of stories online from people who use these to get better boners than they've ever had in their lives.

[thoughtgypsy]

Apologies ahead of time for the long post, but I wanted to include as much detail as possible, as I think a lot of guys on the forum might be able to relate to this, given my demographic (late 20s, early 30s).

I was apathetic about health for most of my life, though I got in the habit of consistently lifting when I around 20 years old. I've stuck with it to the present day with the occasional one month off maximum. Looking back on it, it was probably one of the best decisions I've made, and has afforded me relatively good health even with the occasional lapse of other healthy habits.

Had a minor health scare around 25 which couldn't be explained by conventional medical science. After being misdiagnosed a couple times, I researched unconventional treatments and became very interested in health and disciplined in my diet. I cured the condition, and despite being unrelated to diet, I retained my newfound health habits.

After college I lived in the DC area, where most socializing takes place only if massive amounts of alcohol are involved. The habit stuck with me and years after college I was still binge drinking regularly, even drinking moderately on weekdays (few beers after work). I was able to delay the effects of it for a while through good (non-inflammatory, vitamin-dense) diet, consistently working out, and consciously reducing the negative side effects through hydration and antioxidant supplementation. My liver and kidney function is in the optimal range. However, it still caught up with me and after a while I noticed my skin was starting to get rougher and I was prematurely aging. Despite having a receding hairline, my recessive features and soft angularity generally had me mistaken for a few years younger, though now people were putting me a few years older than I was. Too much beer consistently caused bloating, indigestion, and sleep disruption.

Since I've recently returned to the US, I've realized how anti-social the culture is. At least from what I can tell, it's extremely rare for adults to socialize unless alcohol is involved in some form. In many of the other places I've been, people often get together over food at least once a week, whereas here it seems to occur a only few times a year. I think the majority of my drinking was just a way to make passing time easier. My excuse in the past was that I want to prioritize happiness over longevity, but there is a difference between using alcohol for celebrations, and using it as a tranquilizer. I could stop for weeks or months without issue, but the boredom is what always brought me back. As friends marry off and the culture gets increasingly radical, I've felt increasingly isolated socially. I am not complaining- this has actually pushed me to travel the world and seek connections elsewhere.

I'm late 20s and certainly haven't hit the wall yet. Last month I had the opportunity to travel to a place I've grown fond of over the years. After the first week I looked and felt younger than I had in years. I had a constant desire to socialize (despite being naturally introverted), and enjoyed the rush of exploring new food, new environments, interacting with new people, and practicing a language. I rarely if ever had the desire to drink and I met a lot of guys of similar mindset, interacted with warm women, and I never got bored of any of it. To the guys who think they've hit the wall in their 20s, I'd highly recommend putting yourself in a rewarding environment (if you haven't already tried it) before giving up prematurely. I'm carrying that mindset forward and hope to build a healthy lifestyle in a new environment after a period of further reflection.

I'm not at the same work volume as I was before, though that's out of preference. I used to do the work capacity of the sealfit WODs in my mid 20s, and while I enjoyed it at the time, it's no longer worth it for me. I think the work volume is a bit excessive and the increased cortisol would negate some of the positives. I've developed a lifting routine that doesn't bore me and has the biggest pay off in terms of time spent and results given. My goal isn't to break records (even personal), but maintain my current level while gaining the health (and mental) benefits at minimal time input. My body won't make it in magazines or win awards by any means, but I'm proud of it and that's enough for me. Perhaps the bar is set so low that it's easy to stand out. I am continually improving and consistently getting compliments on my physique despite the extremely low time investment (maybe 1.5 hours/week). My energy and stress levels are also on the way up.

So despite years of neglect, punishment, and bouts of laziness, my body is still able to repair and reach new heights. It is a testament to the resilience of the human body more than anything.

Other factors that may have helped to slow the damage of aging:

• A near obsessive avoidance of environmental estrogens and phthalates, documented here: thread-51922.html
• Avoidance of topical metals. Some studies suggest excessive Iron is correlated with premature aging. Other metals seem to have a correlation with incidince of parkinsons or alzheimers. I make my own metal-free deodorant and take a metal chelator (curcumin)
• Intermittent Fasting (IF) to mimic caloric restriction, induce autophagy. I will skip breakfast at least every other day.

[thoughtgypsy]

A phenomenal resource on anti-aging for men is Rogue Health and Fitness: http://roguehealthandfitness.com/

Has a lot of high level information on autophagy, life extension studies, effects of metals on aging, etc etc. He's blazing a lot of uncharted trails on the subject.

The guy is 60+ and looks better than most guys in their 20s:

[NASA Test Pilot]

I should have mentioned before that Somatotropin, the fancy term for hGH, is controlled by two hormones released from the hypothalamus, called somatocrinin or Growth-hormone-releasing hormone (GHRH), and somatostatin or Growth-hormone-inhibiting hormone (GHIH). If you want to boost hGH, you need to boost GHRH and suppress GHIH. There are several things that boost GHRH, including the hormone Grehlin, the sex hormones, deep sleep, (where over 50% of your hGH is released), hypoglycemia, vitamin B3, hard exercise.

The types of things that increase GHIH (which you do not want) are hyperglycemia (high blood sugar), glucocorticoids (stress hormones), hGH itself (through negative feedback), and high body fat.

If others have more examples of these, it would be appreciated. Also, if anyone can explain what or if there is a relationship between GHIH and DHT I would like to know. Post it or send me a PM.

The sleep part reminded me about a sign around my 33-34 year mark. Before I was 18 years old I would sleep significantly more than from 18-34. During this time I only needed 4 hours of sleep.

At about the 33-34 year mark this went up to about 6 hours per night (11-5). So I think this may have been a curve. Then again at about 47-48 it went up to 8 hours per night (10-6 or 8-4 in training), which may have been a curve that was a precursor to decreasing training performance. I will look for the next sleep increase to see if it is a precursor to a performance decrease.

The suggestion about fasting got me thinking. This makes sense if hGH is increased during fasting because it would help to preserve your muscle tissue and glycogen stores while using your fat stores instead. This breakdown of fat, which is called lipolysis, releases free fatty acids and glycerol, which are then metabolized to produce energy. Also, Grehlin (relates to the hunger response) boosts GHRH. My issue would then be with all of the physical activity and needing the caloric intake to sustain basic performance. A thought might be in the off season and on a resting day or 12-16 hour intermittent fasts. Lack of caloric intake also temporarily lowers testosterone, but maybe the detoxification (especially from estrogenic compounds) part outweighs this for shorter periods.

Perhaps the hGH would make you relatively more lean as a percentage, and I am focusing more on the recovery side of the equation as it is energetically less expensive to repair a cell than it is to divide and create new cells.

From a dated study in sports medicine they examined (younger) elite athletes and found that male swimmers in the 100M, 200M, and 400M Freestyle events had a mean body fat level of 6.5% plus or minus 1.2 percent while at peak training. I found a less dated study (1993) that related swim performance, body composition and somatotypes (in collegiate athletes at the beginning of the season (not at peak training) indicating 11% body fat. Current information seems to be showing 9-10 % for swimmers and 6-10 % for tri-athletes but I am looking for something more oriented toward science to confirm. Some of the strength development guys indicate that this percentage is generally low. If I am not training two a days for swimming; I combine/rotate 5 activities (surfing, swimming, 2-man sand volleyball, weight training, and dryland training).

I had my body fat measured again (double checked anthropometrically) today by the national team coaching staff and it averaged 8.6%. He believes that his consistency is plus or minus 1-2% and less experienced sports medicine guys maybe 2-3%. In the future I will have it double checked by an experienced person for greater accuracy. The winter surf swell is fading and I may begin another major swim training cycle in mid-April if I do not go back out to sea (sailing).

I am going to put on more lean muscle mass in the first two (three) meso-cycles (a meso-cycle is normally 4-6 weeks) and then work to maintain those strength gains during peak training. I will then measure my swim performance in sets during the early (meso) cycles, mid cycles and late cycles to include taper and compare them to the previous season(s); a season is usually a macro-cycle. I will measure my overall weight and percentage of body fat vs. swimming performance output (in 6 types of intensity/interval/set length categories) during training. It will only be few data points, but I can keep adding to them. What I will be looking for is how the change (increase in this case) in body fat and muscle mass (from previous sessions) affects my performance. As a side note, I eat 6+ times per day during heavy training and by increasing fat intake I will also see if my Testosterone levels increase when my body fat is measured.

Here is a list of actions I have to naturally increase hGH: Others can add to it or chop it down. Input is desired

1.Eat low glycemic carbohydrates (pastas, oatmeal, etc.) before training.
2.Training in shorter, more intense workouts 2-3 times a day.
3.Training using powerful lifts for example squats, dead lifts and power cleans.
4.Eating a balanced diet. Carbs/protein/fat.
5.Eating 5-7 times per day.
6.Using certain aminos throughout the day. Ornithine, arginine.
7.Take naps.
8.Go to bed on a carbohydrate empty stomach as carbohydrates produce insulin, which can help store fat. The body will only produce one at a time (hGH or insulin).
9.Getting enough deep sleep.
10.Intermittent Fasting.

[Livingthedream123]

Get on a plant based diet. There is lots of doctors on youtube that talk about it, such as- Dr John Mcdougall, and Dr Michael Greger.

[The Beast1]

(03-30-2016 07:05 AM)Livingthedream123 Wrote:  

Get on a plant based diet. There is lots of doctors on youtube that talk about it, such as- Dr John Mcdougall, and Dr Michael Greger.

[Livingthedream123]

I am not advocating religious fundamentalism veganism. Plant based diet is a scientific diet to reverse chronic disease, and prolong life. I think the doctors specifically chose a different name for it than veganism to get away from the religious side of it (animal worship).

[thoughtgypsy]

(03-30-2016 02:06 AM)NASA Test Pilot Wrote:  

The suggestion about fasting got me thinking. This makes sense if hGH is increased during fasting because it would help to preserve your muscle tissue and glycogen stores while using your fat stores instead. This breakdown of fat, which is called lipolysis, releases free fatty acids and glycerol, which are then metabolized to produce energy. Also, Grehlin (relates to the hunger response) boosts GHRH. My issue would then be with all of the physical activity and needing the caloric intake to sustain basic performance. A thought might be in the off season and on a resting day or 12-16 hour intermittent fasts. Lack of caloric intake also temporarily lowers testosterone, but maybe the detoxification (especially from estrogenic compounds) part outweighs this for shorter periods.

Fasting also mimics the effects of Calorie Restriction (CR) through the process of autophagy by the mTOR (cell growth) and AMPK (cell energy) pathways. Most of the research being done on this topic is conducted on simple organisms like C. elegans or mice, though what has been thus far is promising. Primate studies are suggesting clinical significance in humans.

The mitochondrial theory of aging suggests that free radicals (reactive oxygen species) can attach to molecules in the body and introduce cell replication errors over time. By reducing the mTOR activity (cell replication rate), the accumulation of errors is slowed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanisti...ycin#Aging

Lipolysis (through the AMPK pathway) may extend life by slowing the generation of reactive oxygen species, which are a by-product of cellular energy (ATP) production. This may make the clearance of reactive oxygen species from the body easier. Increased AMPK activity is associated with longer life span in other species.
http://roguehealthandfitness.com/activat...extension/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMP-activa..._life_span
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hormesis#Mitohormesis

Intermittent fasting stimulates the same lifespan-increasing activity as CR, but is much more convenient. By restricting the feeding window to 8 hours or less in a day, someone can still get meet their caloric needs while gaining the same benefits of CR.

A discussion on the timing of IF for those who remain active: http://roguehealthandfitness.com/an-inte...-schedule/
Further discussion on anti-aging strategies: http://roguehealthandfitness.com/the-opt...-strategy/

Perhaps I am wrong, but I'm of the belief that peak performance and longevity are not directly correlated. Our bodies are machines, and when pushed beyond the point of exhaustion, damage can be incurred. Endurance athletes have more efficient hearts (lower resting heartrates) due to the necessity to deliver large volumes of oxygen in short amounts of time. But there is a point where stress is excessive and damage occurs. It is difficult to know where this upper bound is, but there are some studies out there that may give a better idea.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3538475/

Weightlifting seems to be the most efficient method for the body to perform work without inducing cardiovascular damage. It stimulates testosterone production and prevents muscle loss (a reliable indicator of premature death) through the inhibition of myostatin. Exercise activity is a very reliable indicator of longevity: http://roguehealthandfitness.com/exercis...-survival/

(03-30-2016 02:06 AM)NASA Test Pilot Wrote:  

Here is a list of actions I have to naturally increase hGH: Others can add to it or chop it down. Input is desired

1.Eat low glycemic carbohydrates (pastas, oatmeal, etc.) before training.
2.Training in shorter, more intense workouts 2-3 times a day.
3.Training using powerful lifts for example squats, dead lifts and power cleans.
4.Eating a balanced diet. Carbs/protein/fat.
5.Eating 5-7 times per day.
6.Using certain aminos throughout the day. Ornithine, arginine.
7.Take naps.
8.Go to bed on a carbohydrate empty stomach as carbohydrates produce insulin, which can help store fat. The body will only produce one at a time (hGH or insulin).
9.Getting enough deep sleep.
10.Intermittent Fasting.

Not sure if these would be directly related to hGH production, but these are other things I practice:

- Eating carbohydrates following intense workouts (to replace muscle glycogen expended during training)
- Eating probiotics (sauerkraut, kimchi, yogurt, or pills) to extract maximum calories from digested food (less fat deposition).
- Eating/drinking polyphenols (green tea or EGCG, coffee, blueberries, grapes[red wine]) to help clear reactive oxygen species. Controversial: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17327526
- Restricting fat content during carbohydrate-laden meals (fat is calorically dense, carbs are glycemically "fast"; combining them raises the volume of fat deposition)
- Sauteing veggies or combining them with fatty food (some vitamins are fat soluble)
- Avoiding dairy, even from grass fed cows (rBGH and BGH are given to dairy cows to produce excessive milk production; but they also exist naturally in high levels in cow's milk even before human intervention)
- Getting a source of omega-3 fatty acids (eggs, fish or fish oil, avocados, flaxseed, walnuts) to reduce inflammation

[VincentVinturi]

(03-30-2016 02:06 AM)NASA Test Pilot Wrote:  

The types of things that increase GHIH (which you do not want) are hyperglycemia (high blood sugar), glucocorticoids (stress hormones), hGH itself (through negative feedback), and high body fat.

If others have more examples of these, it would be appreciated.

Mercola et al advocate an HGH-maximizing routine through a combination of high intensity sprinting exercises (peak 8) and avoiding carbs immediately after the routine as eating carbs releases somatostatin which interferes with HGH release.

Instead, he recommends drinking a grass fed whey protein concentrate + water after within 30 minutes of finishing the Peak 8.

More info:

http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness...scles.aspx

I used to do a lot of sprinting but haven't done it for years, preferring heavy low rep powerlifting.

In my experience trying a bunch of shit, powerlifting has the highest ROI in terms of overall well being.

Jiu jitsu -- or anything that tends to inflict overtraining and "chronic cardio" -- are the worst.

Nothing like a week of full-on BJJ training to totally wreck your body.

[eatthishomie]

I watched some docs on Netflix recently about the merits of plant based diets.

I will never be fully vegetarian again and will certainly not go vegan.

But I do see the merits of making plants a substantial foundation of your diet. Aside from whey protein, fish, eggs, and a bit of yogurt and cheese, this is largely what I will be doing once off RFL.

It also can't hurt to diversify your protein sources a bit either (pea/hemp/other plant-based protein powders in addition to whey protein).

[NASA Test Pilot]

Thanks for the input Gents!

@thoughtgypsy
¨but I'm of the belief that peak performance and longevity are not directly correlated. Our bodies are machines, and when pushed beyond the point of exhaustion, damage can be incurred.¨

This is the point, I want to ride the edge at the limits of my performance (degradation or approaching the wall without overtraining or getting injured), go figure, me doing that….

With peak performance and longevity I am looking at it from the perspective of maintaining or extending a relative peak in performance as time (age) marches on. This can be done through maximizing training (which I am pretty good at doing since I have been doing it for a half a century now) and changing inputs to maximize genetic potential as well as minimize environmental drag (insults).

For example, I know my times from swimming a 400 M Freestyle and in general they are decreasing 2-3% every five years from my best time when I was younger, however, there have been periods when it may be 3-4% decrease. If I can reach repeat or decrease a time from X(5) years ago, then I need to change something in order to alter performance relative to a (my) norm (or max). My technique is solid (with the exception of surfing having a negative impact and I still work on it after all of these decades) as well as other things that I have mentioned before. What I have changed that seems to slow the degradation is more rest. It may be also how I rest. I am also trying to work things out at chemical and hormonal level (increase body fat slightly to boost testosterone and increase muscle mass), maximize hGH naturally and then considering artificial things to see if there is a difference in performance degradation/enhancement.

The links that people offer are helpful as I am increasing my knowledge and the probability of more success. I am also learning more and that is its own reward on multiple levels.

[churros]

(03-30-2016 10:44 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  

+ water after within 30 minutes of finishing the Peak 8.
Jiu jitsu -- or anything that tends to inflict overtraining and "chronic cardio" -- are the worst.

Nothing like a week of full-on BJJ training to totally wreck your body.

You don't think training combat sports is sustainable into old age? Now that you mention it, I never felt that great after intense sparring. But I used to box with a 60 year old dude, and it seemed to keep him lively.

[IDrinkYourMilkShake]

(04-09-2016 10:36 AM)churros Wrote:  

(03-30-2016 10:44 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  

+ water after within 30 minutes of finishing the Peak 8.
Jiu jitsu -- or anything that tends to inflict overtraining and "chronic cardio" -- are the worst.

Nothing like a week of full-on BJJ training to totally wreck your body.

You don't think training combat sports is sustainable into old age? Now that you mention it, I never felt that great after intense sparring. But I used to box with a 60 year old dude, and it seemed to keep him lively.

I have been thinking about that. Basicly without giving such a datailed onfo on the bio-mechanics like other posters, I think consistency is the key if anything. Like with training in general that if you stop doing something you wont be good at it anymore. Or like Einstein put it: "One does not stop playing because of aging, but he ages because he stops playing", something like that.

Here some inspiration of what consistency will do for you

[themilkman]

Gypsy, where is this magical place you speak of?

[Cobra]

Isn't the male persona built up of confidence? If you can have that until you're physically unable, I'm not sure you can hit a wall the same way as a woman can hit the wall "physically." If the physicality is an issue for men, it can be worked on, whereas for women, physicality is beauty rather than strength for men.

For women, working on the beauty aspect of their physicality is much harder. On the contrary, even if your face is busted a bit, a man can hit the gym and still have that empowered grizzled look and attract women at an older age.

I just think the term "hitting the wall," should be kept exclusive to women.

[Ski pro]

Maybe not so much hitting the wall but a declining in one abilities might be a better way to put it.

In skiing, we have to find a balance between agility and strength. Whilst at this season I'm starting to make all sorts of connections I've never made before and unlocking different levels within my movements, this year I felt like soemthing had changed. Like I'd hit some sort of wall.

Obviously I plan to find a way over or round it but it's interesting to hear this sort of awareness of our bodies from other people's perspective and to know that it's just not me alone noticing it.

Making lifestyle changes drinking less and no Caffine has sure helped and no doubt will continue to in the future. I start planning for next seasons goals in June and I'll need to find a way to balance this agility and strength requirement, as well as sharpening my mental skills and getting my diet back on track.

[Chaos]

Relevant:

Check out this 96 year old man's mindset about hitting the male wall and how to have a "beachbody" at 90+ years age.

I think I haven't seen anyone before writing about "sexy 70 year old girls".

http://http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/ch...-on-planet

[RoastBeefCurtains4Me]

I think the wall is completely different for men than women. Women's wall is related to their fertility. As fertility begins to decline in their 30's and ends in their 40's, women start looking like a wilting flower, then become like dried up dead flowers as far as their sexual appeal. The exceptions are very few and far between.

In comparison, men remain fertile for life, and remain potentially valuable for protection and provision well into old age. So, I don't think men have a wall. At most men have a hill, hence the term over the hill.

I've recently had an insight about being in the game or out of the game. So many 30 and 40 year old women are completely unfuckable, because of the way they let themselves go. A fat young woman is a shame, but she can get thirsty, fit guys to fuck her, and they'll honestly like it. However, these women are a final and total wreck by their early 30's. Men are the same way. They let themselves go, until their simply not able to get new pussy. When I see a fat guy with dumpy style, I think he's basically checked out of the game, and is not competing for pussy.

Unfortunately, I started out skinny fat, then started developing a dad bod after I got married, then eventually was just plain fat. Since I was married, I didn't see myself as being in the game, and I wasn't trying. Back then, I thought looks didn't matter for men anyway. Of course now I know that fitness is very important to be desired for sex, as opposed to being desired for provisioning.

When I started dealing with my failing marriage, I started working out and lost weight, but I've never gotten all the way down to being slim. My recent insight on being in the game tells me that if I really want to be a player, and have the opportunity to get with attractive young women, then I have to actually lose the weight, and put on some serious muscles.

I will say that age makes a difference. Even chubby younger guys often have decent looking girlfriends. So, they're in the game simply by virtue of being younger, and not being a total wreck. As an older guy, I feel like I need to be truly fit if I want to be in the game. I've made significant progress from my low point, but I never truly put in the effort it takes to get into the game at my age.

So, that's what I'm working on now. I'm going to get truly fit, and truly get in the game as far as competing for the sexual attention of young, attractive women. The thing is, I'm convinced that at 51, if I get in shape, and have an upper middle class persona, with a moderately decent level of job prestige, then I will have young women with daddy issues wanting me to fuck them. So, from this point of view, I let myself go for most of my life, and was never truly in the game. Now I'm making a big play to get into the game, and I believe this is doable. Therefore, I haven't hit the wall at all.

As for NTP, with your excellent fitness and attractive lifestyle, you can probably bang attractive girls under 30 up to age 65 or so, and after that point can probably still bang good looking women in their 30's until age 75 or so. You'll have to stay highly fit, and rock some "Most Interesting Man in the World" style, but it appears to me that you've got that all locked down. In fact, these numbers are for hot western women. You can probably do even better in the various poosey paradise locations. Based on this, I'd say a man's wall can potentially be near 80. The one proviso is that a man has to make a higher and higher effort to stay in the game as he ages. For a guy in his 70's, you really need one in 10,000 fitness and style. Fortunately, I think this is actually doable, and that's my long term strategy.

[TheOllam]

Just realized this was an NTP thread!

Serious post. My Dad is turning 60 this year, and the wall is beginning to Punish him.

The bigger issue is actually emotional. Dude is done, and it's really sad for me to see him this way. He's holding down a crappy job at a mechanical contractor, but it's the end of the road for him. He has no plan for anything, he's just existing and turning nihilist.

He just does not listen, and takes no action to improve himself. Zero self care, no regular doctor/dentist visits, foolish diet, poor time management. He was blessed with amazing youthfulness his whole life, remaining healthy and disease free. But this blessing is now a curse because he does not really understand what's entailed in diet and thoughtful physical maintenance. He's still lean, but his energy levels are shot and he's coughing/hacking a lot.

I also realize how few friends he has these days. Just seems like there's nothing left. Not here to make a sob story, but does anyone have ideas on dealing with health issues for a parent that has lost drive? What if I told you what I say to him does not seem to matter anymore and he's tuned me out?

Thanks, making the best out of this NTP thread!

[SteezeySteve]

I have a question for some of the older guys here.

Those of you who reached high levels of athleticism,agility,strength,flexibility,and movement ability in your younger days how much of a struggle has it been to maintain this combination of traits as you've gotten older?

Strength and body composition seems 100% realistic to keep up for a while (to a certain point),but you dont hear a lot of guys discussing performance beyond strength and body composition.

[Dantes]

I'm 40 and my strength hasn't decreased at all. In fact, I lift about the same as when I was 19. Athleticism and agility has definitely decreased but I don't care. My days of competitive sports are long gone. I just want to look and feel good at this point. One thing I have noticed, is it takes longer to shed a few pounds as It did even 5 years ago.

[weambulance]

(05-18-2016 05:06 PM)TheOllam Wrote:  

Just realized this was an NTP thread!

Serious post. My Dad is turning 60 this year, and the wall is beginning to Punish him.

The bigger issue is actually emotional. Dude is done, and it's really sad for me to see him this way. He's holding down a crappy job at a mechanical contractor, but it's the end of the road for him. He has no plan for anything, he's just existing and turning nihilist.

He just does not listen, and takes no action to improve himself. Zero self care, no regular doctor/dentist visits, foolish diet, poor time management. He was blessed with amazing youthfulness his whole life, remaining healthy and disease free. But this blessing is now a curse because he does not really understand what's entailed in diet and thoughtful physical maintenance. He's still lean, but his energy levels are shot and he's coughing/hacking a lot.

I also realize how few friends he has these days. Just seems like there's nothing left. Not here to make a sob story, but does anyone have ideas on dealing with health issues for a parent that has lost drive? What if I told you what I say to him does not seem to matter anymore and he's tuned me out?

Thanks, making the best out of this NTP thread!

I wish I had good advice for you. But all I can say is, speaking as someone who has fought depression for the last several years, it sounds to me like your father might be depressed.

That doesn't mean sad, or suicidal, despite what people generally think. Often it's just extreme apathy, a lack of caring about oneself and what will happen in the future.

I don't have good advice because I've found that the only effective way for me to fight depression is to recognize what is happening, when I'm falling into depression, and do certain things that help claw my way back to giving a shit. Other people are not helpful. I didn't even realize I was depressed for several years, so I have no idea how to make someone else realize they have internal issues they need to fix.

Maybe some other guys here have better insights. Start a new thread asking for advice, and you'll get a lot more eyes on it than you will here.

[SlickyBoy]

(05-18-2016 05:06 PM)TheOllam Wrote:  

Just realized this was an NTP thread!

Serious post. My Dad is turning 60 this year, and the wall is beginning to Punish him.

The bigger issue is actually emotional. Dude is done, and it's really sad for me to see him this way. He's holding down a crappy job at a mechanical contractor, but it's the end of the road for him. He has no plan for anything, he's just existing and turning nihilist.

He just does not listen, and takes no action to improve himself. Zero self care, no regular doctor/dentist visits, foolish diet, poor time management. He was blessed with amazing youthfulness his whole life, remaining healthy and disease free. But this blessing is now a curse because he does not really understand what's entailed in diet and thoughtful physical maintenance. He's still lean, but his energy levels are shot and he's coughing/hacking a lot.

I also realize how few friends he has these days. Just seems like there's nothing left. Not here to make a sob story, but does anyone have ideas on dealing with health issues for a parent that has lost drive? What if I told you what I say to him does not seem to matter anymore and he's tuned me out?

Thanks, making the best out of this NTP thread!

There might be a lot more going on there, but at first blush I would recommend he talk to an endocrinologist who knows about hormone replacement therapy. A lot of doctors blow this off, but if he find the right guy he may get some solid advice and a program that can take care of a lot of what you are describing. We all get old, but it does not have to be a total downward spiral. Something to think about.