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Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad
#1

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Someone said in the how-many-men-did-your-mom-sleep-with thread that I should write about my dad.

(Mercenary, thanks for the lightning bolt of inspiration!)

I’d explained that before my mom met my dad (both born in Lebanon), she had an alpha boyfriend for whom she stole food and loaded ammunition into semi-auto AK-47 rifles during the onset of the Lebanese civil war in the early 70s. She was only 17 at the time.

Yet, when my mom met my dad, she forever devoted herself to him, and remains so even past my dad’s death 8 years ago. They had a marriage that both men and women could dream of having. My mother still wears her wedding ring to this day. I keep wondering if she’ll start dating again, but I don’t think she’s even tried doing that.

My dad had mad game. He was a people’s person with street smarts. He didn't teach me game, but I still learned a few things from him by watching him.

I’m not sure if his game would be fully effective in today’s world, but if I could ever become half the man he was, I’d consider that a damned good accomplishment. He had very strong frame control. You could simply not break his frame. I’ve never seen my dad get rattled by anyone.

He might not have collected tons of notches through sport fucking like some of the veterans here. Even I think I have more notches than he had at his age. But I don’t think that was what he wanted. He also lived in a VASTLY different time and culture than the present. No PC feminist horse shit.

He was no James Bond either, didn’t have any extraordinary looks. He stood at 5’6, looked more like a darker skinned William Shatner with brown eyes, and sported a pot belly.

If he were my age today and he wanted notches, then he’d probably kill it. But I don’t think he would be happy. Not remotely. He would be a mismatch with today’s world. He was born at the right time, and he died at the right time - for him.

Without further ado, here are some things I learned from him.

1. Ask Three Times. If You Get Three No’s, The Answer Will Always Be No.

Most people ask only once. One "no", they give up. A much smaller percentage would even ask a second time. After a second "no", it’s a very rare person who would ask a third time.

My dad made it a point to ask three times before moving on. Whether it was trying to make a sale, have someone hire him for a job, asking me to go get an ice cream with him for some father-son time, and even asking my mom to marry him!

At age 39, he met my mother, who was 19 at the time. Within only three weeks*** he’d asked her to marry him. He actually asked her THREE times! The first time, my mother laughed and said, "no, I barely know you."

The second time, only a week later, she didn’t laugh. She stared at him, "are you serious? no, I can’t do that."

Another week later, my dad asked her yet again to marry him. She finally said yes. As my parents relayed this story to me, I kept asking my mom what made her change her mind. She said she couldn’t explain it. She said she thought if a man were brave enough to ask her to marry him after getting rejected twice, then he must be really serious about getting - and staying - married. All my mom really wanted was a man who would stay with her, and once she’d found that, she would give him everything she had. And she did.

Thank goodness he had the cajones to get rejected twice and try again a third time! If he were like anybody else, I wouldn’t even be here.

*** Special note: my dad already knew my mother’s parents long before he actually met my mother herself. Members of their respective families had done business together before, and Dad became friends with some of my mom’s family members. He’d gotten to know my mother’s parents very well years prior to meeting my mom. It was not like he just swooped into my mom’s life out of nowhere and suddenly blurted out the big question.

In a less extreme example when I was a kid, I was playing video games when Dad asked me if I wanted to go out for an ice cream with him. I said, "no thanks, I’m playing."

Ten minutes later, he said "it’s a beautiful day out! I’d pay ten dollars for a day like this! You sure you don’t want to come outside, take a walk with me, have some ice cream?"

I said, "sorry Dad, I’m playing video games. I’m about to level up right here."

Another ten minutes, Dad comes by and says "How about that ice cream? I want to get this rocky road ice cream, and you can eat however many scoops you want. I know you like chocolate chip…" licking his lips and raising his eyebrows with a mischievous look.

"Alright, I’ll go."

2. Use the Phrase "Yes, And…" to Agree-and-Pivot

Those two simple words may have possibly saved his life and my mom’s as well. From the stories they told me just before I went to college, they’d gotten themselves into a dangerous hostage situation and my dad talked their way out of it.

Here’s the story. At the time my parents got married, war was breaking out in Lebanon.

Let me back up a bit. My dad had gone to college in the US and worked as a professor through the late 50s and 60s, visiting Lebanon frequently and staying over the summers when school was out. He even married an American woman, had two kids (half brothers), and then divorced because he and his ex-wife couldn’t get along.

In the 60s, life in Lebanon was quite good. Great, in fact. Beirut was the Paris of the Middle East. Then the war began. It started out slowly, though. Pockets of guerilla street warfare. Skirmishes. Faction infighting. Raids. Looting. That was around the time my mother got involved with the alpha boyfriend and loading ammo for semi-automatics.

The Lebanese currency cratered with hyperinflation. Before the war, one dollar USD was equivalent to about 2-3 Lebanese pounds. Today 1 USD gives you 1500 Lebanese pounds. Everyone became poor. Stealing food became common.

My father’s family also became poor so he took all his money from the US to Lebanon to help them.

It wasn’t yet an all out war with daily bombs going off when my parents got married, but both of their families were telling them they needed to get out, and fast. So they gathered their things and tried to get to Syria by car, but they didn’t make it. They got car jacked, lost all their things, their money stolen, and both were pushed into a building where other hostages were held for several hours.

When dad kept trying to talk to the captors, they beat him up and threatened to shoot him if he didn’t shut up. Their building got shot at twice in separate gunfights. One of their captors got killed.

Now, I really don’t know how exactly he did it, but my dad eventually talked down the hostage takers and into letting them all go. ALL the hostages. While he was telling me this story, he could not remember everything he said, but he was constantly using the phrase "yes, and…"

Imagine, when you’re arguing with someone, you’re always saying "no, that’s wrong!", "no, but…", "yes, but…", and so on. Instead, my dad agrees and pivots. This is a little different from our agree-and-amplify tactic for disarming resistance from women.

Here’s how it works:

When you make a counterpoint in disagreement with what your opponent is saying, you say "yes, and…" then make your counterpoint. And. Not but.

Saying the word "but" would have the effect of closing their ears and raising their guard. The word "but" alerts them that you’re going to disagree.

Hearing "yes, and" in response to your point keeps your guard down and you’re not prepared for a disagreement. Then, when you hear him saying something diametrically opposed to the point you just made, you’re suddenly confused… "wait a minute, is he agreeing with me? what he just said was different than… but did I hear him correctly?"

As a result, his hostage takers were reduced to a state of confusion, and they agreed to let them go.

He continued to use this agree-and-pivot tactic throughout his career and even on my mother. It’s incredible how it works when I use this.

3. Nip The First Sign of Disrespect Right In The Bud

If I could name one fault my father had, I’d say he had a hot temper. Even the smallest things could set him off. But not just any small thing. Only when it involves disrespect. My dad is firmly old school when it came to respect. He did not tolerate an ounce of disrespect from anyone, not from his wife, not from me, not from his boss, and certainly not from some budding feminist. No one.

Whenever my father even sniffed the smallest sign of disrespect, he’d smack you right down with his sharp biting words. Not with verbal abuse, though. He has never called anyone names.

Try to talk right back at him, he’d cut you off mid sentence. If I could pick a movie scene to best describe it, I would go with The Negotiator scene where Samuel Jackson smacks down an amateur negotiator: "You can't talk me down! You can't make me change the deadline. Now get me Sabian!" The negotiator could barely get a few meek words out as Samuel Jackson kept cutting him off.

I’d watch him slice and dice customer service on the phone a-la Samuel Jackson and get the cable company to do whatever he wanted. Then he’d smile and say “thank you very much, have a good evening,” and hang up the phone.

Whenever I interrupted him while he was talking, he’d look me in the eye and sternly say "shut up and listen." He’d say that to my mother when she interrupted him, too. How many husbands out there today would dare say anything like that to their wives??

We’d go out to family dinners at restaurants, and Dad would insist on picking up the check. It was more than wanting to "provide" for his family, it was fundamentally about respect for him. I don’t quite understand it myself, but that’s how Dad felt. When someone would dare reach for the check, my dad would shoot a withering stare until the other person timidly drew his hand back. He even made a huge scene once, at a big family dinner in the restaurant because someone took the check before he did.

Once people got to know my father a little, they would not dare disrespect him. He’s one of those people whom you’d meet, and you’d know right away he’s not one of those who can be fucked with.

In his marriage with my mother, he never once showed weakness. Not once did he allow my mom to disrespect him without a verbal smackdown putting her in her place. I’ll say he could have accomplished the same more effectively with a slightly cooler temper, though.

4. Master the Art of Sweet Talking Without Being Ingratiating

He had a knack for sweet talking without being obviously brown-nosy. I can’t say too much about it, but he was a master at this and at getting anyone to do anything he wanted. This is one of those times where I wish I weren’t deaf so I could hear everything he was saying.

But he did not go around buttering up everyone. Instead, he’d get them curious first. He’d ramble, talk around the compliment he intends to give, and only when the person is expectantly listening for the next word out of his mouth, that’s when he’d lay it on thick.

He did tell me one story, in detail, that is a great example. I remember it very well.

He was driving on the way home when he got pulled over for speeding. When he handed over his license and registration, he asked the cop "sir, may I ask you a question? If you don’t mind my asking, where are you from?"

Cop: "Why do you ask?"
Dad: "Well, I was just wondering because…"
Cop: "Because what?"
Dad: "Oh, it’s nothing really… you just remind me of…"
Cop: "Of what?"
Dad: "Well…you do look a little like my son. You see, he’s an athlete, a swimmer, and he has a big race tomorrow..."
Cop: "Is that so?"

Cop goes back to his car, sits there for a few minutes, and comes back to my dad: "Alright, I’ll leave you off with a warning. Slow down, alright?"

I thought it was interesting that he didn’t come right out and say the cop looked like me, not from the outset. I think my father believed that if he said it right off the bat, the cop would think he’s trying to get out of a speeding ticket. Cop would have strengthened his resolve to not fall for it. Instead, he got the cop hooked, increased his curiosity, and then complimented him after much hesitation.

When he told me this (when he got home, right after the incident), I asked him "you said that to get out of that speeding ticket, didn’t you?"

He played innocent, "oh, he was a nice guy" and smiled. Right. Clever sneaky fella.

5. Do Talk to Strangers

Almost everyone in my childhood told me "don’t talk to strangers!"

Except my dad. Whenever I’d go with him to do errands, pick up the mail from the US Post Office, or pick up his diabetic medication, he’d chat up complete strangers anytime, anywhere. Completely random. He wasn’t trying to get women’s phone numbers or anything like that. He just enjoyed talking to people.

I don’t know what he says or what topics he’d bring up, but he’d crack a joke and make people laugh. He made it look so easy. I’m sure he was using most of the day game principles that are discussed in this forum, but he wasn’t even aware of "game" or anything like that. He was just randomly talking to whoever crossed his path.

Sure, some people did not want to be talked to, and were rude to him. After walking away, he’d look at me, make a face, say "such a sourpuss", and we’d have a good laugh about it. Classic DGAF attitude. I’ve seen him talk to beautiful women, and some even flirted with him. Mind you, he was in his 50s and 60s, and hot chicks MY age were flirting with him! It was incredible.

I fondly remember one time Dad was visiting my university, and he took myself and my friends out to dinner. We went to Hooters, got a table, and my father started talking to the waitresses. He was making them laugh. They were standing there next to him, with their tits prominently showing, and they were playing with their hair. I could see he was asking them where they were from, what they were studying at school, and then going off on random tangents from there. My friends were completely nonplussed, watching in bemused silence. I will NEVER forget that evening.

One evening, I asked my dad how he did it. He said you have to enjoy talking to people, getting to know them a little, and try to make them smile before you go separate ways. I asked him what he talked about with them. He didn’t really give me a concrete answer, but he did say he never talked about himself unless they asked.

He said, "people love to talk about themselves. So I ask questions about them, and they talk and talk!"

My father never really talked about himself. I didn’t really know him all that well until I was in my 20s. Only when I started asking him specific questions about his past, who his parents were, his war stories, and how he talked to all those strangers, did I learn much more about the man himself.

...

So in sum, these were the things I learned from my father. Not sure if this is anything new or groundbreaking for you guys here, but he was one of the true naturals I know. He understood people. Part of me wishes that he’d explained more to me, but I don’t think he truly knew how to put it in words. If, as a young man, he wanted to go after notches, he would absolutely kill it.

I’ve tried mimicking him when talking to strangers, but it didn’t work quite as well as it did for him. Plus the gimmicky PUA stuff led me astray for a long time.

As for today’s era vs my father’s era, they are very different, yes. I don’t think my dad would enjoy today’s era as much as he did in his own. He is very old school. He’s against gays and lesbians. Said they are “unnatural” with a tone of disgust. If he saw how big the LGBTQ movement is along with unfettered feminazism today, he would be appalled and very distressed.

I enjoyed writing about him in this post. Trips down the memory lane. 8 years since his passing, and not a day passes without a thought of my old man.
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#2

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Excellent write-up CleanSlate and it was my pleasure to help inspire it.

I'm really pleased you took the time to write all this.
It truly deserved its own thread.

This isn't just about the ways of a man from a previous generation and how we can follow his example in relation to game, but also about how to have a fulfilling life, a strong marriage, run a healthy family, and be a role model for your children....especially your sons. I think most of us here who don't have such positive images of our fathers, wish we had a dad like yours. His role in talking the captors into releasing all the hostages is the stuff of legends.

And the part about respect is something I can really relate to. If anyone, especially a girl I'm dating (or am already together with) disrespects me, I make it clear it's unacceptable to act like that with me. If you let those things pass, they just get worse and worse and people walk all over you. Women always have a greater admiration for a guy who won't tolerate their shitty behaviour and puts them back in line when they misbehave.

Quote: (11-07-2015 07:50 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

Yet, when my mom met my dad, she forever devoted herself to him, and remains so even past my dad’s death 8 years ago. They had a marriage that both men and women could dream of having. My mother still wears her wedding ring to this day. I keep wondering if she’ll start dating again, but I don’t think she’s even tried doing that.

We all dream of having a girl (wife) who is this devoted to us even beyond our deaths.
Can you imagine a girl like this today ?
It's become the stuff of science fiction.

Quote: (11-07-2015 07:50 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

At age 39, he met my mother, who was 19 at the time.

Nice [Image: thumb.gif]

And I’m assuming no one in either family made the 20 year age difference into a problem. In fact, they probably all knew it was much better arrangement than her marrying someone her own age. An older man/young (usually virgin) bride arrangement was the norm for hundreds of years in Europe as well until the early 20th century. These marriages were usually rock solid.



Quote: (11-07-2015 07:50 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

I don’t think my dad would enjoy today’s era as much as he did in his own. He is very old school. He’s against gays and lesbians.
Said they are “unnatural” with a tone of disgust.

[Image: agree2.gif]
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#3

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Thank you for this loving and beautiful post.

same old shit, sixes and sevens Shaft...
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#4

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Fantastic read, thank you.
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#5

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Almost got the chills reading this, thanks for sharing !
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#6

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Solid. My brother in law is Lebanese, fled the country during the war in the early 80s, covered up in watermelons in the back of a truck to cross the border, and came to the US. Learned English, got an international business degree and now is a successful international business man.

I once asked him:"How'd you learn English so well?" He said besides studying:"I watched daytime soap operas.." Haha. Coincidentally, he's pretty good with women.

There are many similarities between your description of your father and my brother in law, who I soon hope to be going into a manufacturing business with.
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#7

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Thanks CleanSlate, that was really great to read and I learned a lot from it.
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#8

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

A fantastic post indeed, thanks for sharing this with us, CleanSlate! These kind of contributions make this forum amazing.
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#9

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Thanks all for the kind words!

Quote: (11-07-2015 08:53 PM)Mercenary Wrote:  

And I’m assuming no one in either family made the 20 year age difference into a problem. In fact, they probably all knew it was much better arrangement than her marrying someone her own age. An older man/young (usually virgin) bride arrangement was the norm for hundreds of years in Europe as well until the early 20th century. These marriages were usually rock solid.

I think part of it was that my Dad had already just gotten his US citizenship, and my mother's family wanted my mom to get the hell out before things got really bad in Lebanon.

But no one had any issues with the 19-20 year age difference. From what they've told me, no one stopped to think twice about it, as far as I am aware.

Quote: (11-08-2015 12:02 PM)Ingocnito Wrote:  

Solid. My brother in law is Lebanese, fled the country during the war in the early 80s, covered up in watermelons in the back of a truck to cross the border, and came to the US. Learned English, got an international business degree and now is a successful international business man.

I once asked him:"How'd you learn English so well?" He said besides studying:"I watched daytime soap operas.." Haha. Coincidentally, he's pretty good with women.

There are many similarities between your description of your father and my brother in law, who I soon hope to be going into a manufacturing business with.

It's so funny you should bring this up. Your brother in law pulled the same stunt that my dad, with my mom, tried to pull. Only my dad got caught!

They were detained for 6 days, and the only reason they did not throw them in a cell that would never see sunlight again was that he was a US citizen, and the border guards didn't want to have an international incident.

When they finally were let go, a storm had dumped several feet of snow. Roads were impassable. The guard just opened the door and said with a knowing smirk, "you're free to go" as the snow was up to the height of their eyeballs blocking the doorway.

And you know what Dad did? He talked the asshole guard into giving them two apples before they climbed out into the snow and waited for a vehicle to come by.
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#10

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Excellent write up, thank you. All five points are helpful, but especially 5 - that point alone will help assuage the hesitations we feel talking to women.
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#11

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Great read and write-up.

A bit of sadness when reading that, you hardly meet men like that today. Your Dad sounds like my Dad, who has similar characteristics in terms of personality and charm.

I don't run across many men that have real passion for women, its all about getting laid and that is it.

Our New Blog:

http://www.repstylez.com
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#12

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

I would rep you again if i could.

WIA
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#13

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Good men raise good sons.
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#14

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Solid post C-Slate. I'm going to remember these things while I'm out and second guessing approaching and being social. Thanks for sharing man. Tried to rep but realized I repped you a while ago, ha.
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#15

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

+1 with my dad, but he had a soft heart so hes been divorced 3 times!

other than that very similar, the detail you go into are great! cheers mate
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#16

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

I'm going through an extremely rough patch right now Cleanslate. Sometimes I log in to the forum, these days almost rarely.

I'm glad, however, that I read this post. It is one of the most inspiring things I have read. When you write something like this, you don't know whose souls you will touch. I will say this: it made my day. It may even make more of my days better.
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#17

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Girls love talking about themselves. Some things will never change!
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#18

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Quote: (11-07-2015 07:50 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

At age 39, he met my mother, who was 19 at the time.

[Image: gamerecognized.gif]

[Image: clap2.gif]

“There is no global anthem, no global currency, no certificate of global citizenship. We pledge allegiance to one flag, and that flag is the American flag!” -DJT
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#19

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Can he fly too?
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#20

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

My dad is like peter pan .. never grows up .. very much a womaniser .. Some of his favourite lines :

He'll spot a cute girls at the bar , walk up to her :
Dad: I spotted you from over there and I just wanted to say you look really nice ....
Girl : awwww thanks:
Dad : ... from a distance ..

He'll take a girl on a date - drop her off in his car . Just as she's about to leave :
Dad: I just wanted to say I had a really really average night ..

Really gets the old hamster spinning .
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#21

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

I only found this just now and I'm glad I did.

This was a really beautiful post and really practical post and I want more people to see it.
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#22

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

I'm gonna bump this thread, it's gold.....

Clean Slate, man.. this was one of the best posts I've read on this entire site.

Props to ya!!!
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#23

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Glad Breeze bumped this. Great post. I started (re)reading Nasim Taleb's Black Swan today and CleanSlate's dad embodies a lot of Taleb's values (they're also both from Lebanon and survived the civil war - seems like a special country).
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#24

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Quote: (02-19-2017 09:48 PM)Alpone Wrote:  

Glad Breeze bumped this. Great post. I started (re)reading Nasim Taleb's Black Swan today and CleanSlate's dad embodies a lot of Taleb's values (they're also both from Lebanon and survived the civil war - seems like a special country).

Thanks guys. I haven't read much of Nassim Taleb's story or Black Swan, but I've been reading his other book Antifragile.

It's a great read, and a fascinating concept -- antifragility. The way I understand it is it's mostly a mindset and positioning your life in a way that things beyond your control won't affect your life in a significant way (recession proof businesses that aren't "fragile" economically, for example).

I really should read his other book Black Swan, though.
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#25

Five Game Tips I Learned From My Dad

Great bump.

Number 5 really resonated with me. These last few years I've made a real effort to learn how to speak with strangers. Young and old. Male and female. Rich and poor. Smart and dumb.

Having said that, for some reason I never correlated it to my increased ability to speak to women. Go figure.

A well earned rep-point for you.

The public will judge a man by what he lifts, but those close to him will judge him by what he carries.
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