[OGNorCal707]

Haha this thread is funny, I like what the Thai guy has to say, but I think both sides are right here, he does have some wisdom, but he is also part snake-oil salesman.

When I say that what I mean is that he way over simplifies things and acts like it's all "so easy", while planting a garden may not be as challenging as becoming an Engineering professor, he's leaving a lot of stuff out of the presentation, and glossing over a lot of facts.

The info that was dug up about the guy is pretty telling, he married a white woman from Colorado whom we can presume most likely comes from a somewhat affluent background. How much did his wife invest in his land, building homes, etc.? That US dollar she may be throwing behind things will go a long way, versus a local Thai man who never married a rich white American lady. Also the guy is charging rich white kids to come and stay and work on his farms, that brings in a lot of money and makes it easy for the Thai guy to chill out and let others help do a lot of the work.

Really though this guy is smart and there are people doing this kind of stuff all over the world, I've never done it, but there's an organization called WOOF, world organic organization of farmers or something like that, where people who own organic farms host volunteers who work the land in exchange for a free place to stay. Well there are guys with organic farms that have cute hippies chicks staying with them doing all the work, so they can just kick back and run game.

Anyway the wisdom I took away from the Thai guy's talk is sometimes we get caught up in the rat race, we're trying to obtain a whole lot of money, status, and material things, but sometimes it comes at a steep price. Perhaps there is virtue in a more simple life, one where we have more free time, and a greater connection to the land, growing our own food, and living more sustainably, compared to the constant grit and grind of city life.

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2015 06:33 PM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  

(10-18-2015 06:21 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

This is forum. We like discussion here. If you don't like it you don't need to be here.

Thanks for informing me of these facts, worldwidetraveler.

My pleasure, it looked like you needed a reminder. Now let's get back to Jandai, shall we?

[The Lizard of Oz]

Jandai LOL

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2015 06:34 PM)OGNorCal707 Wrote:  

Anyway the wisdom I took away from the Thai guy's talk is sometimes we get caught up in the rat race, we're trying to obtain a whole lot of money, status, and material things, but sometimes it comes at a steep price. Perhaps there is virtue in a more simple life, one where we have more free time, and a greater connection to the land, growing our own food, and living more sustainably, compared to the constant grit and grind of city life.

I don't think a simple life needs to entail going off grid ,building mud huts and growing your own food. Doing those things may be more satisfying to some.

You can still keep it simple living a decent life.

I bet most people don't realize how much money they are putting into their cars, homes, phones, etc...

I would rather use that money for experiences. I have seen first hand people who are broke yet make good money. They have no money to do anything but have some mighty nice shit sitting around their nice houses keeping them company.

It really doesn't cost that much money to have a good life.

[LEMONed IScream]

I'd rephrase it somewhat. Life is easy. Only if there wasn't so much good looking pussy to chase. I know this might sound extremely stupid to people here, but one of the things that makes me consider a LTR is that there are so many hot girls I'll never bang, it makes me want to scale back a bit. I don't mean a LTR for now or something like that. But the thing is, hot girls are abundant, relationship and eventually mother material ones are the proverbial unicorn...

[Quintus Curtius]

I love this thread.



@Deathtofatties:

Interesting video. It looks like Mr. Vikernes has found a way to do his own thing, and good for him. He at least comes across as sincere. He's not going to be invited to the celebrity parties in Beverly Hills or hosting conferences in UCLA about Buddhism.

But personally for me, his choice of lifestyle is not what I would want. It would be step backward for me, not forward. Country living may be fine for short periods of time, or as a temporary retreat, but I would go bloody crazy with that life.

We can't go back. We can't go back in time. We can't go back to the primitive "state of nature." If that ever did exist, which I doubt.

There is no "idealism" for me in the soil, in the mud, in the backbreaking work of agriculture. The hoe and the plow will not be glorified. They cannot be. Cannot.

No.

You can try. And you can almost succeed, like Mr. Thailand. But Nature will consume and destroy all those who try to sentimentalize her. Who try to glorify here. She will have none of it. She will eat such men alive.

Because you can't really idealize brute labor. Nature, for all its wonder, carries the seeds of just as much Evil as it carries Good. There is no Noble Savage. Nothing noble about him, really. Only savage.

No brotherhood between man and wild beast, either. Look into the eyes of a wild animal. And then you will know.

And this is what Thoreau, Rousseau, and our snake Mr. Thailand can never really comprehend.

I don't want to go back to "Nature." Because "Nature" never really left me.

There is no idealism in Nature. There is, under that placid surface of chirping birds and worms oozing their way through the soil, only a relentless struggle for existence.

And the only redeeming sentiment in this struggle is the knowledge that we--all of us--are part of that eternal One, that all-embracing One-ness, that is the pantheistic whole of the Universe. Nature, Soul, Intellect, and finally the One: the fount of all life.

It is this knowledge--the idea of the unity of all things--is what we should strive for.

I refuse to idealize Nature and the soil because I can't turn my back on civilization. When I'm here, I wish I was there. And when I'm there, I wish I was here. But there you have it. This is the way men are.

.

[RoastBeefCurtains4Me]

Quintus, I don't think there is a man on this forum that doesn't respect you, but I see you coming out on this issue with guns blazing in a way that surprises me a little. I didn't watch the video of the Thai guy, but I've read much of this thread.

I would say this: To everything, there is a season.

I think the real issue in this thread is not about the virtues of the simple life, based on subsistence agriculture and minimalism. I think the question is whether we should seek a life of ease, or if we should always embrace the struggle and push forward from where we are.

There is a strong thread in the manosphere to party poolside and enjoy the decline. Some men say that we must not do this, and advocate trying to find a worthy woman, then lead her and shape her into a good wife and mother, so they can be a proper patriarch in a declining age. You have spoken strongly about how the available women make this a foolish proposition.

I sense that you are arguing that although we cannot expect to find a worthy wife, we should take on the reality that we face, and carve out the best that we can from it.

I would say this is true for young men, and men with a lot of energy. However, everybody has their ups and downs. I am 51. I have made mistakes in my life, and am not in the place I'd like to be. I have also had successes. I have a six figure income, and the respect of a circle of high quality people around me.

At 51, I am somewhat tired. I still have battles to fight, and I will fight them, but at this point, I want a life of ease, and I see some level of minimalization as part of my strategy. I'm trying to motivate myself to take on the battles I still need to fight, to set myself up financially for my old age, and to finalize a set of achievements I can be proud of, but I'm looking for the life of ease as the reward at the end of this final burst of effort. I don't want to be scrambling for my daily bread in my 60's. I want to be able to dabble in some activities I enjoy, and bang much younger women, and not worry about paying the bills.

Whether the man in the video is the exact role model, or agricultural minimalism is the exact means, I think a life of ease is a legitimate thing for a man to aspire to in the long term.

Edit: I just noticed my signature quote is somewhat ironic given my stance. I do think that a man should take on life to a considerable extent, but personally, I look forward to a time when I feel that I've made it, and can settle back, relax, and enjoy the fruits of my labor. Living a simpler life will be part of my strategy to be able to ease back and enjoy my 60's and beyond, and I'd like to get there by 55.

[iop890]

(10-10-2015 08:00 AM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  

Nah, this Thai dude is just a smart lazy hustler, for which I give him full credit.

His "wisdom" consists of the fact that he figured out that working hard can be very tedious, and studying and trying to master a field of knowledge is even more so. Some people who come into possession of this wisdom become criminals, but those who have a scammer's talent and a distaste for violence realize that they can have a relatively easy life by hustling people out of their money in more peaceful ways. What better way to do it than by founding an "organic farm" based on "holistic principles" and being feted by goofy and/or nihilistic SWPL folk whose hatred for the world as it is leads them to worship an imagined farmer sage and his Oriental "wisdom".

The truth is that life is only ever "easy" because someone -- generations upon generations of men -- have worked and are working extremely hard to make it so. The material world is obdurate and unforgiving and human sentience is always imperiled and must struggle to sustain itself and its difference in kind against the dead materials that surround it and of which it is made. Because of the relentless slaving ingenuity of generations of men, we have increasingly prevailed in this struggle, and have built a world in which precious human sentience can be housed with relative ease and comfort. But none of it is ever easy, and no false wisdom of sleazy con men and hustling "sages" can make it so.

Lizard, what books/drugs do I need to read/take to be able to write like you?

[The Lizard of Oz]

RBC4M, of course there is nothing wrong with a man wanting to have a life of ease -- in fact one would be a fool not to want it, and especially as you get a little older. Ease, comfort, and convenience are great goods and however you manage to achieve them -- even by doing a little hustling like sly old JANDAI lol -- you should enjoy them, indeed revel in them, for as much of your life as you possibly can.

The point is that all that comfort and ease did not just magically come about -- it all had to be created by someone, that someone being generations of men who have slaved to invent, produce, and refine the wondrous devices that, increasingly, have freed us from a far worse slavery, the slavery to mere materials, to mere inanimate nature and its brute whims. Even if you were born rich or won the lottery, and had the easiest and most blissful life from cradle to grave, someone -- thousands and millions of someones, in fact -- have had to do intricate, various, and continuing physical and mental work to pave every step of your way. That is simply a fact of life -- one of its most fundamental facts, and quite obvious unless one simply forgets about it.

To say that life is not "easy" is not (at least for me) a moral judgment, or some sort of exhortation to make it difficult -- far from it. It's simply an expression of a truth about life; but it is a truth that sleazy sages and snake oil salesmen like JANDAI always conveniently forget about, even as they enjoy all the sumptuous fruits of other men's painstaking and inspired labors.

The only moral point I have to make (and even then the point is really more a cognitive than a moral one) is this: don't be an ingrate. If you can make your life easy, do so -- in fact enjoy that ease, relish it, and prolong it. But don't commit the infamy of slandering the wondrous (though still very fragile -- because our work as a species is far from done) comfort that you are able to enjoy, don't be a fool who thinks it's "empty" or "meaningless" and that the specter of "meaning" lies in an imagined simple life that renounces all the hard won achievements that made your thinking at leisure possible in the first place. Don't be an ingrate, and enjoy your life for all it's worth; that's all.

[The Lizard of Oz]

(10-18-2015 08:31 PM)iop890 Wrote:  

Lizard, what books/drugs do I need to read/take to be able to write like you?

Boswell's Life of Johnson and coke, respectively. But skip the coke.

Seriously, if you ever want to spend a long season reading the best and most enjoyable book of prose ever written in the English language, you should buy this edition of the Life of Johnson, and give yourself a real treat.

[el mechanico]

(10-18-2015 08:31 PM)iop890 Wrote:  

(10-10-2015 08:00 AM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  

Nah, this Thai dude is just a smart lazy hustler, for which I give him full credit.

His "wisdom" consists of the fact that he figured out that working hard can be very tedious, and studying and trying to master a field of knowledge is even more so. Some people who come into possession of this wisdom become criminals, but those who have a scammer's talent and a distaste for violence realize that they can have a relatively easy life by hustling people out of their money in more peaceful ways. What better way to do it than by founding an "organic farm" based on "holistic principles" and being feted by goofy and/or nihilistic SWPL folk whose hatred for the world as it is leads them to worship an imagined farmer sage and his Oriental "wisdom".

The truth is that life is only ever "easy" because someone -- generations upon generations of men -- have worked and are working extremely hard to make it so. The material world is obdurate and unforgiving and human sentience is always imperiled and must struggle to sustain itself and its difference in kind against the dead materials that surround it and of which it is made. Because of the relentless slaving ingenuity of generations of men, we have increasingly prevailed in this struggle, and have built a world in which precious human sentience can be housed with relative ease and comfort. But none of it is ever easy, and no false wisdom of sleazy con men and hustling "sages" can make it so.

Lizard, what books/drugs do I need to read/take to be able to write like you?

He's amazing. I would like to Know myself how these guys tick.. And Zelcorpion..

It would take me all day to make a post like that.

I can't concentrate like that but have people in my face all the time

[The Lizard of Oz]

Thank you Mech. There are some things you've written on this forum that have given me more pleasure and better laughs than just about anything ever. I could even explain exactly why I like them so much but it would take a lot of words...

[RoastBeefCurtains4Me]

LoOZ, I agree with your point. Not everybody can live a life of ease. Anyone peddling a scheme that makes it seem otherwise is a fraud. Some are able to lead a life of ease because they were born rich, or were just lucky, like the middle class child who walks into the right college program and then the right corporate career track just by being reasonably hard working and intelligent, and having natural likeability. Other than those blessed by fortune, the rest of us have to work very hard, and generally endure some hard blows, before we achieve any measure of success. Anyone that arrives on Easy Street should appreciate their good fortune, and appreciate those who have worked hard, and still work hard to sustain civilization.

Most of humanity will never enjoy a live of ease. The men on this forum are generally above average, and are likely to excel. In general, they will excel because of hard work. Any advice on how to get ahead must be based on a plan for working hard.

However, I see Quintus advocating struggle to the end, for it's own sake. This is what I find surprising. I would say this has an important place in a man's life. There should be a period in our lives when we run towards the sound of gunfire. However, I don't think that this is something to seek life long. Perhaps I am misunderstanding, but I see Quintus saying he wants to struggle as long as he's able to draw a breath, and that the desire for a life of ease is illegitimate.

Perhaps the urge for a life of ease will take care of itself, so all the encouragement should be for men to struggle, fight, and win. However, what does it mean to win? To me it means being able to finally take my ease.

[deathtofatties]

(10-18-2015 07:03 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  

I love this thread.



@Deathtofatties:

Interesting video. It looks like Mr. Vikernes has found a way to do his own thing, and good for him. He at least comes across as sincere. He's not going to be invited to the celebrity parties in Beverly Hills or hosting conferences in UCLA about Buddhism.

But personally for me, his choice of lifestyle is not what I would want. It would be step backward for me, not forward. Country living may be fine for short periods of time, or as a temporary retreat, but I would go bloody crazy with that life.

We can't go back. We can't go back in time. We can't go back to the primitive "state of nature." If that ever did exist, which I doubt.

There is no "idealism" for me in the soil, in the mud, in the backbreaking work of agriculture. The hoe and the plow will not be glorified. They cannot be. Cannot.

No.

You can try. And you can almost succeed, like Mr. Thailand. But Nature will consume and destroy all those who try to sentimentalize her. Who try to glorify here. She will have none of it. She will eat such men alive.

Because you can't really idealize brute labor. Nature, for all its wonder, carries the seeds of just as much Evil as it carries Good. There is no Noble Savage. Nothing noble about him, really. Only savage.

No brotherhood between man and wild beast, either. Look into the eyes of a wild animal. And then you will know.

And this is what Thoreau, Rousseau, and our snake Mr. Thailand can never really comprehend.

I don't want to go back to "Nature." Because "Nature" never really left me.

There is no idealism in Nature. There is, under that placid surface of chirping birds and worms oozing their way through the soil, only a relentless struggle for existence.

And the only redeeming sentiment in this struggle is the knowledge that we--all of us--are part of that eternal One, that all-embracing One-ness, that is the pantheistic whole of the Universe. Nature, Soul, Intellect, and finally the One: the fount of all life.

It is this knowledge--the idea of the unity of all things--is what we should strive for.

I refuse to idealize Nature and the soil because I can't turn my back on civilization. When I'm here, I wish I was there. And when I'm there, I wish I was here. But there you have it. This is the way men are.

.

@QuintusCurtius

Very interesting take on this Quintus Curtius, but I respectfully disagree with you on some things.

Equally misguided is the blind march toward "progress" and so called civilization and capitalism.

Has it made us stronger? No.

Has it made us happier? No.

Is life easier? No.

Are we reproducing, passing on our genetic heritage? Not so much.

Are we healthier? Not really. We live a decade or two longer, but more of us are obese and very dependent on modern medicine.

Modern civilization has made us weaker and dysgenic, because it will support all forms of life. Modern medicine is a form of welfare for bad genes. Meanwhile, our immune systems get weaker and weaker.

I'm not a Luddite, but we are definitely headed toward the world of Wall-E at lightening speed.



We have traded a natural environment for an unnatural one. The byproduct of the latter is responsible for feminism, social alienation, welfare for the weak and dysgenic, less freedom, more bureaucracy, and the total domestication of our species.

What good is civilization without balance? What we have now perhaps shouldn't even be thought of as civilization, it's just slavery and stupidity. And it's not even sustainable.

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2015 09:16 PM)RoastBeefCurtains4Me Wrote:  

LoOZ, I agree with your point. Not everybody can live a life of ease. Anyone peddling a scheme that makes it seem otherwise is a fraud. Some are able to lead a life of ease because they were born rich, or were just lucky, like the middle class child who walks into the right college program and then the right corporate career track just by being reasonably hard working and intelligent, and having natural likeability. Other than those blessed by fortune, the rest of us have to work very hard, and generally endure some hard blows, before we achieve any measure of success. Anyone that arrives on Easy Street should appreciate their good fortune, and appreciate those who have worked hard, and still work hard to sustain civilization.

Most of humanity will never enjoy a live of ease. The men on this forum are generally above average, and are likely to excel. In general, they will excel because of hard work. Any advice on how to get ahead must be based on a plan for working hard.

However, I see Quintus advocating struggle to the end, for it's own sake. This is what I find surprising. I would say this has an important place in a man's life. There should be a period in our lives when we run towards the sound of gunfire. However, I don't think that this is something to seek life long. Perhaps I am misunderstanding, but I see Quintus saying he wants to struggle as long as he's able to draw a breath, and that the desire for a life of ease is illegitimate.

Perhaps the urge for a life of ease will take care of itself, so all the encouragement should be for men to struggle, fight, and win. However, what does it mean to win? To me it means being able to finally take my ease.

What is your definition of a easy life?

I think the idea turns a lot of people on. After some time of easy living, the magic wears off and you may find there isn't really anything to get you fired up to get out of bed.

I can't imagine not struggling at something.

I enjoy it, I learn from it, I am somewhat addicted to it. I sometimes wish a simpler life would make me more content. Maybe it's because I have seen what can happen to men who have nothing to look forward. No fire. It's sad to be honest and it isn't something I would want.

[Onto]

(10-18-2015 09:39 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

What is your definition of a easy life?

I think the idea turns a lot of people on. After some time of easy living, the magic wears off and you may find there isn't really anything to get you fired up to get out of bed.

I can't imagine not struggling at something.

I enjoy it, I learn from it, I am somewhat addicted to it. I sometimes wish a simpler life would make me more content. Maybe it's because I have seen what can happen to men who have nothing to look forward. No fire. It's sad to be honest and it isn't something I would want.

If that's how you feel, I'm surprised you don't understand how some of us think the JANDAI mantra of, "Life should and can be a bowl of cherries", to not only be misleading, but actually a false way to be.

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2015 10:00 PM)Onto Wrote:  

If that's how you feel, I'm surprised you don't understand how some of us think the JANDAI mantra of, "Life should and can be a bowl of cherries", to not only be misleading, but a false way to be.

I don't expect most to be like me.

For most people in the western world, life can be as hard or as easy as we want.

I choose my lifestyle. I left mid 6 figure contracts because I wasn't happy. These were really easy gigs as well. Instead, I left and started a business that I struggled with for some time.

I am a builder by nature. I need to build stuff. In can be anything from art to software to rehabbing properties. I enjoy the process of taking something and making it better. It's hard to explain. I can find a sort of elegance in many of those types of things. That is what makes me happy even though many of my interests leads to it's own struggles.

For most western people, they need very little to survive in the western world. People just make themselves believe they need more and with that comes stress. Once you cut out all of that crap and truly understand what makes you happy then life becomes much easier. Easy, for me, doesn't mean the struggles disappear.

[RoastBeefCurtains4Me]

I've had to put in 90 or 100 hour weeks on my job, because that's what it took to do the job, and the economy was too poor to find a better job, and I needed the money. I want a situation where I can work somewhere between zero and thirty hours a week to cover my cost of living comfortably, doing things I enjoy, with the rest of the time free for me to enjoy.

If I'm trying to get 500 hp out of my supercharged V8, and only get 475, then I'm struggling, and the battle is not won. However, that's not the same as trying to keep an underwater business venture from folding with devastating financial consequences for me. I want pleasantly challenging goals that I have chosen, with no real existential consequences for failure.

(10-18-2015 09:39 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

(10-18-2015 09:16 PM)RoastBeefCurtains4Me Wrote:  

LoOZ, I agree with your point. Not everybody can live a life of ease. Anyone peddling a scheme that makes it seem otherwise is a fraud. Some are able to lead a life of ease because they were born rich, or were just lucky, like the middle class child who walks into the right college program and then the right corporate career track just by being reasonably hard working and intelligent, and having natural likeability. Other than those blessed by fortune, the rest of us have to work very hard, and generally endure some hard blows, before we achieve any measure of success. Anyone that arrives on Easy Street should appreciate their good fortune, and appreciate those who have worked hard, and still work hard to sustain civilization.

Most of humanity will never enjoy a live of ease. The men on this forum are generally above average, and are likely to excel. In general, they will excel because of hard work. Any advice on how to get ahead must be based on a plan for working hard.

However, I see Quintus advocating struggle to the end, for it's own sake. This is what I find surprising. I would say this has an important place in a man's life. There should be a period in our lives when we run towards the sound of gunfire. However, I don't think that this is something to seek life long. Perhaps I am misunderstanding, but I see Quintus saying he wants to struggle as long as he's able to draw a breath, and that the desire for a life of ease is illegitimate.

Perhaps the urge for a life of ease will take care of itself, so all the encouragement should be for men to struggle, fight, and win. However, what does it mean to win? To me it means being able to finally take my ease.

What is your definition of a easy life?

I think the idea turns a lot of people on. After some time of easy living, the magic wears off and you may find there isn't really anything to get you fired up to get out of bed.

I can't imagine not struggling at something.

I enjoy it, I learn from it, I am somewhat addicted to it. I sometimes wish a simpler life would make me more content. Maybe it's because I have seen what can happen to men who have nothing to look forward. No fire. It's sad to be honest and it isn't something I would want.

[worldwidetraveler]

(10-18-2015 10:25 PM)RoastBeefCurtains4Me Wrote:  

However, that's not the same as trying to keep an underwater business venture from folding with devastating financial consequences for me. I want pleasantly challenging goals that I have chosen, with no real existential consequences for failure.

First, sorry to hear you're going through some rough times.

If you don't mind, what do you imagine would happen if you lost your business?

Would this bankrupt you? Lose a house or a car? Hurt your credit? What do you imagine would be the worst?

[Quintus Curtius]

(10-18-2015 09:16 PM)RoastBeefCurtains4Me Wrote:  

However, I see Quintus advocating struggle to the end, for it's own sake. This is what I find surprising. I would say this has an important place in a man's life. There should be a period in our lives when we run towards the sound of gunfire. However, I don't think that this is something to seek life long. Perhaps I am misunderstanding, but I see Quintus saying he wants to struggle as long as he's able to draw a breath, and that the desire for a life of ease is illegitimate.

Perhaps the urge for a life of ease will take care of itself, so all the encouragement should be for men to struggle, fight, and win. However, what does it mean to win? To me it means being able to finally take my ease.

Let me clarify.

There is struggle to the end, I am sorry to say. There is no point in our lives where we will reach the end-zone, slam the ball down, and rest on our laurels forever after.

You will be struggling in kindergarten.

You will be struggling in school. In college. In the workplace. With you friends. With your lovers. With your wives. With your children.

This is the law of life.

And on your deathbed, in your eighties or nineties (we hope), you will be struggling with the nurses and the others lying in beds beside you.

(Do not go gentle into that dark night, comrades. Rage, rage against the dying of the light.)

But this does not mean that life is an endless sequence of gloom and doom, of conflict on top of conflict, signifying nothing.

No, far from it.

It only means that life is for the living. Life is for the stout of heart. For the coeurs-de-leon.

Life involves agony, pain, and conflict, but it also elevates us to the pinnacles of ecstasy, joy, satisfaction, and above all Love. Love, which is the eternal binder of all souls.

We should not, and cannot, shrink from the responsibilities of life, in all of its ups and downs, its highs and lows, its agonies and its ecstasies.

We must never allow ourselves to feel broken, defeated, debilitated, or beaten by life. I will not allow this. I will not permit this disease of defeatism in my life. Will not. Ever. You fight till the last rag is left on your old bones.

So, no, I am not advocating pointless conflict for its own sake. I am not doing this at all. My language is strident, but this is for a reason.

I am only reminding us all--myself included--that we must buoy our spirits up, and collect our fortitude, and remember that we should welcome the opportunity for challenges in life.

Ease and relaxation are wonderful. But they are not goals. They are conditions of the spirit.

We have a responsibility to train our brethren to expect hardships, and equip them with the tools needed for survival and happiness in life.

I will quote Cicero here, from a passage I translated today from "On Moral Duties," (I.19) which sums up some of what I am talking about:


A strong and great soul is altogether distinguished by two features. One is the contempt for the external things of this world; the great soul is persuaded that no man ought to wonder at, hope for, or seek after anything except those things related to goodness and virtue, and that he should succumb to neither another man, nor a disturbance of the spirit, nor a trial of Fortune.

The second feature is that, when you have molded your soul with this sort of attitude, as I said above, you perform great achievements of the highest utility which are extremely arduous, laborious, and full of danger to life, and to many other things connected to one’s livelihood.


.

[RoastBeefCurtains4Me]

The situation I was speaking of was several years ago, and my situation is much better now. I did go bankrupt from a business failure in the 90's. It's not the end of the world. I regret not paying my bills, but life goes on. The job I had with the super long hours was a position of responsibility in a small tech company, where my own capital wasn't at stake, but the success of the project I was working on required that level of dedication. We ultimately completed the project successfully, but didn't hit the big time the way we wanted. There are still possibilities that that effort will pay off big, but it's a long shot.

One of the themes that comes up in this thread is that people who are overly content in life are living in stasis, with no fire in the belly, no passion. It's like they aren't really living. I think that there is some truth to that. However, when pursuing all out guts and glory, it's easy to get into a situation that's not enjoyable in any way whatsoever. Not at the time it's happening, and not in hindsight. I've been there.

I'd like a situation with combination of passive income and location independent income that leaves me financially independent with minimal stress. I'd still want some challenges in life, but I'd want the stakes to be more about bragging rights than about keeping a roof over my head.

[Veloce]

I've been on both sides of the argument.

There's detaching yourself from earthly pleasures. Yeah that can bring happiness.

There's also being knee deep in the hustle. Working a lot. Girls on rotation. Making money. Spending money on frivolous bullshit. That's fun.

Ultimately I don't think there is such thing as a "prescription for a happy life."

Learn to listen to the voice which compels you. If that voice tells you to build a log cabin in the middle of nowhere, well, go do it.

If that voice tells you to be a hedge-fund manager, go do that too.

Working yourself to the bone is a joyous experience that every man should experience at least once, I think. Some of my favorite memories in my career are the nights after a 14 hour shift, my hands blistered, cut, burnt, a layer of grease all over my body and face, having an ice cold cheap shit beer in a blazing hot shower at 3am, feeling the hot water on my burns and cuts, working for shit money. The best part about working for almost no money? You know you're not doing it for the money. You're doing it just to fucking do it.

That in itself is one of the great masculine joys on Earth. To do something just to do it. That's pure activity. Zero pacifism.

But that shit can burn you out too, and at some point it's important to move on. And find the next thing that compels you.

[AnonymousBosch]

I don't know where people get the idea farming is an easy life from. Life for every Farmer I've ever known is a constant battle against nature and the banks. One bad season, and you lose everything.

This was the undoing of the 1840's version of this style of Utopian Agrarian Commune, 'Fruitlands': one harsh winter with a resulting shortage of food and it collapsed.

From my own experience, it doesn't matter if you desire an easy life. Life has its own plans for you. Comfort is transitory and largely-illusionary. As brutal as that sounds: so is hardship.

(10-18-2015 11:11 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  

Let me clarify...

Holy hell, that was incredible. It's like you're inside my mind and summing up years of brutal conflict, yet recognise my battle scars are worn proudly - not as attention-seeking totems of victimhood, but because they're evidence of hardships that didn't defeat me and need no further explanation. Not only that, but I conquered them and made them submit to my will.

Sit, dog.

If it's possible for my consciousness to exist in another body, it's in QC's. I need to send you more of my songs, brother. You'll see the common focus.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

I finally got the time to catch up and watch the video and read the entire thread. I think that Jandai is right only in a superficial way. In addition, the way he goes about it totally discredits him as a mentor of any sort.

As Quintus explains, nothing in life is easy. You might temporarily make some aspects of life easy and totally carefree, but then it will degrade your body and soul to the point that things will become hard for you again. However, it doesn't mean that life is not a joyful occasion and that struggling prevents one from being happy. Quite the opposite, in fact!

In the short run, be carefree and relaxed. In the long run, be critical and merciless.

That way you won't just feel happy, but your happiness will also be sustainable.

[el mechanico]

(10-18-2015 09:14 PM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  

Thank you Mech. There are some things you've written on this forum that have given me more pleasure and better laughs than just about anything ever. I could even explain exactly why I like them so much but it would take a lot of words...

This is my first choice

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glyfada

Edit: I crossed threads again. I read then think. My posts sometimes don't end up where they should be. I'm the guy that should not be on the internet but like the cave-folks one made it across.