[Saweeep]

I love France. I love the French; their "fuck you" attitude to just about everything has always appealed to me as a child of nanny-state Britain.

However, this is just ridiculous.

I am no poster boy for super-waif-like models, but this is exactly the kind of shit a government should not be wasting its time getting involved in (especially in a fiscally bankrupt country with race wars going on in its cities):

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...walks.html

Quote:

France considers ban on ultra-skinny models from catwalks

Socialist MP tables amendment introducing six-month prison term and €75,000 fine on agencies using models below a certain Body Mass Index

The French government on Monday backed parliamentary plans to introduce fines and prison sentences on anyone employing skinny, undernourished fashion models or who "glorify anorexia".

Olivier Véran, a Socialist MP, tabled two amendments to recent health reforms to punish those who promote the painfully thin as fashionable.

The first amendment would ban modelling agencies from using any "extremely thin young women whose weight could put them in danger".

It would oblige models to provide medical certificates showing their Body Mass Index, or BMI. Any agency that took on someone whose BMI was below an as yet unspecified minimum would face a maximum six-month prison term and a €75,000 (£54,000) fine.

"It's intolerable to promote malnutrition and to commercially exploit people who are endangering their own health," Mr Véran, a neurologist at the University Hospital of Grenoble, told Le Parisien newspaper.

The second amendment would make it a criminal offence to "glorify excessive skinniness" and create powers to shut down websites that "promote anorexia", such as "pro-ana" sites that encourage young women to be as thin as possible.

A host of websites claim to offer beauty tips to girls as young as 12, including starving themselves to create a 15cm "thigh gap".

Marisol Touraine, the health minister, on Monday said she backed the amendments. "When you are a model, you must eat and take care of your health. This is an important message to young girls, girls who see in these models an aesthetic ideal. This is a good way to proceed."

Mr Véran said that up to 40,000 people in France are suffering from anorexia, around 90 per cent of whom are adolescents.

France's burgeoning fashion industry has often been criticised for promoting wafer-thin models.

The issue came to the fore in 2013 when star Chanel designer Karl Lagerfeld wrote a book in which he lauded thinness after losing 42 kilos (eight and a half stone) himself.

"No one wants to see curvy women on the catwalk", he wrote in The World According to Karl.

He also said France's health care system was struggling partly because of "all the illnesses contracted by people who are too fat".

"It's the fat women sitting in front of televisions with their pack of crisps who say slim models are hideous", he is quoted as saying.



Pretty, Curvy, Sexy and Fine With It, a French association that fights for the rights of curvy women, sued him for "defamatory and discriminatory comments".

I see no mention of an upper BMI limit for models?


Now, on the subject of Karl Lagerfeld; he may be gay, but to me, he's one cool dude.

Some Karl quotes:

Quote:

No one wants to see curvy women

Quote:

Yes, some people say to me you're too skinny, but never a skinny person says that to me, only people who could lose a few pounds say that.

Quote:

The brain is a muscle, and I'm a kind of body-builder.

Quote:

What I hate is nasty, ugly people

Quote:

I think tattoos are horrible. It's like living in a Pucci dress full-time.

Quote:

I don't care if people I admire criticize me because their opinion is valuable to me.

Quote:

I am never satisfied with myself and that is what keeps me going - I have no post-satisfaction.

Quote:

Work is making a living out of being bored

Quote:

It would have been difficult to have an ugly daughter.

Quote:

I can do whatever I want.

Quote:

I am like a TV antenna. I catch everything that is in the air, and then I do it my way

Quote:

There are less than 1 per cent of anorexic girls, but there more than 30 per cent of girls in France - I don't know about England - that are much, much overweight. And it is much more dangerous and very bad for the health.

Quote:

I'm always relaxed.

Quote:

I like the discipline of well-cut, impeccable clothes. I think it's a very healthy discipline.

[philosophical_recovery]

(03-17-2015 07:48 AM)CrashBangWallop Wrote:  

WB. She can even leave the running shoes on.

This guy has got the old man peacocking thing down.

[Lizard King]

I agree with you about KL. For a gay, he is OK.

Regarding the article: What absolute madness. High fashion is a big part of French culture and their economy, those involved should be allowed to use any model they want. No one wants to see ungraceful lumps of lard on the catwalk.

[philosophical_recovery]

(03-17-2015 07:57 AM)Lizard King Wrote:  

I agree with you about KL. For a gay, he is OK.

Regarding the article: What absolute madness. High fashion is a big part of French culture and their economy, those involved should be allowed to use any model they want. No one wants to see ungraceful lumps of lard on the catwalk.

Let's just call fat acceptance what it is, in context of the greater movement: Willful Mediocrity

[The Beast1]

I read somewhere that the ultra skinny models in fashion were chosen because of their similarities to young boys (eg for the older gay men running the shows).

[Libertas]

(03-17-2015 08:38 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

I read somewhere that the ultra skinny models in fashion were chosen because of their similarities to young boys (eg for the older gay men running the shows).

Yeah, I'd heard the same. I actually do think a lot of the models are way too thin and could stand to gain a few pounds. Let's be honest, a lot of them are too thin to have a feminine figure.

I have a feeling the fashion industry in France will ultimately defeat this, but the fact that government wants to get involved in something like this shows how dystopian the times we're living now really are.

[turkishcandy]

Quote:

It would oblige models to provide medical certificates showing their Body Mass Index, or BMI. Any agency that took on someone whose BMI was below an as yet unspecified minimum would face a maximum six-month prison term and a €75,000 (£54,000) fine.

I'm also tired of seeing skeletons with flat chests and and bony legs, but this law is gonna end up as a disaster. BMI is such a bullshit. WHO's definition of healthy BMI is close to the feminist definition of curvy real woman.



If the bill passes, we will see nothing but plus-size whales on runway, like this one:



Any law that prohibits the use of skinny models is a fascist and despotic law anyway, but if you had to pass such law, you should determine it by body fat percentage (fat ratio), not BMI. Fat ratio is a more objective way to determine who is unhealthily underweight, who is healthy, who is too muscular for her own sake and who is a gross landwhale.

[Phoenix]

Believe it or not, runway models are not hired to be hot. They're not even hired to be healthy. They're hired to be 'pretty coat hangers'. The clothes are supposed to be the main attraction, otherwise the women and their clothes would look more like that in a porn video.

They are at complete liberty to sign up for this profession, and people are at complete liberty to go to the shows.

That said, I've had women suggest to me that victoria's secret models are hot. They seemed surprised that they do zero for me. I think people need to separate 'hot' and 'looks like a model'. They aren't the same at all.

Also does someone have a pic of the MP? I'm expecting to see short dyed hair, wrinkles, and rotundity.

[sixsix]

Like I said before: Gay men are not our enemy. Masculine gay men are often very alpha and red pill because they are not clouded by thirst and don't need to ingratiate themselves for female approval.

The enemy is the cultural marxist attack on heterosexuality and the nuclear family that uses gay acceptance (as well as anti-racism and anti-sexism) as a front. Emasculating little boys into androgynous losers is horrible, but no way Karl Lagerfeld would have been straight in a more conservative environment.

And look at what he says loud, clear and unashamed: "I hate fat and ugly women."

Good luck finding many 'superior' straight men saying that. This man is, and should be recognized as being, on our side.

About the law. I can imagine wholeheartedly agreeing with banning the glorification of eating disorders. Anorexia is not good. But being very slim is fucking perfect. It's called an aesthetic idea for a reason: people should strive for certain standards while knowing they will likely never reach them completely. They are not average representations, just like we don't watch mediocre, middle-aged men running the 100 meters. We watch the very best and can be inspired by that.

But we should acknowledge the biggest and most dangerous eating disorder and that is over-eating, not under-eating. Very few girls actually die from anorexia and many die from obesity.

If banning anorexic models would also mean banning chubby girls from the catwalk and the television, I would love it. But obesity can be praised and glorified while hot girls are shamed. They don't want to protect girls and promote health. They want to change what normal men find attractive and increase their own sexual competitiveness.

Similarly, banning those booth babes is not empowering women. You are firing women and destroy lucrative careers. They hate the power that young and attractive girls hold and their resentment drives their actions. Having the option to have a normal career plus being able to cash in on their looks give these girls options beyond what men have. But also beyond what the bitter feminists have, so they want to get rid of that.

Politics have become intelligently-disguised biological strategizing, and truth and beauty is losing.

[The Lizard of Oz]

(03-17-2015 08:38 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

I read somewhere that the ultra skinny models in fashion were chosen because of their similarities to young boys (eg for the older gay men running the shows).

Nope. Runway models have to be tall and thin because that is the body type that shows the best hang, drape and movement on the clothing they model. In addition, their height makes it easier for spectators in the shows to see them. Print models who don't do runway shows don't have to be as tall and slim, and generally aren't.

[eradicator]

medical certificates showing body mass index?!? would make the whole process cost more, more expensive clothes, more expensive events, wtf? That is just madness, having to provide something like this, the french fashion industry had better defeat this.

[vinman]

There's a lot to learn here, just from the pics alone. He's an old gay man, but he's projecting strength, and confidence. Like he could maintain frame in a hurricane.

[UroboricForms]

Karl Lagerfeldt is officially awesome, I had no idea

[Esus]

The bill got rejected yesterday but they want to try to pass it again.

[Saweeep]

(03-19-2015 01:37 PM)Esus Wrote:  

The bill got rejected yesterday but they want to try to pass it again.

Just like the Irish Eurovote, European politicians care little for democracy.

They will keep resubmitting again and again till they get their way.

[Medic42]

France has this backwards, they should be fining and jailing promoters of fashion shows that use fat bitches... It encourages women in our society to continue to live an unhealthy lifestyle that strains the medical system as well as my back when I have to pick their fat asses up off the floor.

I do agree that we need to increase public awareness of eating disorders in our country. There are a lot of 4's and 5's that could go up one or two points by simply becoming anorexic. I'm not a fan of bulimia though, vomit breath sounds gross... One of the articles that brought me into the sphere, http://www.returnofkings.com/21313/5-rea...g-disorder

[Horus]

(03-17-2015 09:19 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  

Also does someone have a pic of the MP? I'm expecting to see short dyed hair, wrinkles, and rotundity.

We shouldn't be at all surprised that it's actually a dude who proposed the law changes! Meet Monsieur Olivier Véran.

Perhaps you'd be more satisfied by seeing a picture of the current French health minister, Madame Marisol Touraine, who backed the proposal.

[General Mayhem]

(03-17-2015 09:42 AM)sixsix Wrote:  

But we should acknowledge the biggest and most dangerous eating disorder and that is over-eating, not under-eating. Very few girls actually die from anorexia and many die from obesity.

I have started using this is my primary argument against fatties.

How many people do you know who have died from being too skinny?

Now how many people do you know who have died from heart disease or become diabetics because they eat like shit?

I haven't fully fleshed this out yet, but it could be a potent answer.

[Ocelot]

(03-19-2015 02:30 PM)Horus Wrote:  

Perhaps you'd be more satisfied by seeing a picture of the current French health minister, Madame Marisol Touraine, who backed the proposal.

Christ, she looks like she found the One Ring:

[germanico]

(03-17-2015 08:53 AM)turkishcandy Wrote:  

BMI is percentage of fat in the body right?

so if a 100 pound woman has 17 BMI, thats a whole 7 kilos of pure lard in her body.

How is more than that "unhealthy"?

Why do they consider a full 1/5 of your body made out of Crisco Shortening "healthy"? Under whose standards?

[turkishcandy]

(03-19-2015 05:23 PM)germanico Wrote:  

(03-17-2015 08:53 AM)turkishcandy Wrote:  

BMI is percentage of fat in the body right?

so if a 100 pound woman has 17 BMI, thats a whole 7 kilos of pure lard in her body.

How is more than that "unhealthy"?

Why do they consider a full 1/5 of your body made out of Crisco Shortening "healthy"? Under whose standards?

BMI is not percentage of fat. Body Mass Index is your weight divided by your height.

It's problematic because it doesn't take into account whether you have muscles or fat, heavy bones or light bones. 2 girls with the same BMI can look the opposite if one of them works out every day and the other one never works out. Therefore, a fit girl and a chubby girl can have the same BMI and that's why the acceptable BMI levels are too high for our eyes' sake. Plus, according to World Health Organization every girl who isn't chubby is ''unhealthy'' as shown in the picture above. I don't know what exactly they mean by ''healthy'', but it's probably something about how well equipped a girl is to wrestle with you.

Fat percentage, on the other hand, defines how stiff or wiggly your body is (can't find the right word for that). Girls who work out and girls who are just naturally thin can have different BMIs but same fat percentage, which makes sense because they all look attractive and healthy. But fatties can't cheat on fat percentage. That's why I believe body fat percentage can be an objective marker of how attractive a girl's body is. If it's too low, she is either ripped like a man or bony like a skeleton, which are both unattractive. If it's between 15 and 25, she's at healthy weight. If it's more than that, she needs to either lose weight or work out to burn that fat.

[turkishcandy]

So the law passed and the minimum acceptable BMI level, the one they chose to hide for all this time, is 18. Just so we are clear, below are photos of girls with BMI lower than 18 and therefore are ILLEGAL to hire now in France.
(Adrianna Lima [BMI of 17.6], Candice Swanepoel [BMI of 17.7] and Alessandro Ambrosio [BMI of 16.3])
17.9
17.1

[Kieran]

Despicable. Fucking with some of these young girl's livelihoods just to protect fat girls feelings.

I wonder if this will result in many labels no longer showing in Paris. It's hard to imagine some designers working with models with BMI over 18.

[Libertas]

Didn't they say just the lower house of parliament passed it? I'm a bit confused. How does the legislative process work in France? Pretty frightening how fast it went through though, and telling that they didn't put a cap on an upper BMI limit. But that might anger fatties.

I do think the French fashion industry will somehow defeat this (fashion is BIG business over there, one of France's most important industries), but still, this is a wake up call.

[PhDre]

Accidentally, I found a similar chart with the Boner Movement Index on my computer: