[Demitrios]

What has really confused the hell outta me is the fact that some guys i know just ask a girl if she wants to make out, do stuff, and even have sex is that wrong or too direct? Or does it just depend on the person personally I think it should just happen but to tell you the truth it isnt really working for me lmao

[broken]

Don't ask her, just do it.
Kiss, neck, wiggle to the Bra....et cetera

If she doesn't want it, she'll stop you.

[Prodigy]

If you ask her to have sex etc. it takes all your power away. There is now sexual tension and are far less likely to get any.

[mlucasone]

(12-05-2008 11:12 AM)broken Wrote:  

Don't ask her, just do it.

Word.

[Demitrios]

for real? thats how like its happened with other girls I've been with but it seems like usually I hear alotta girls just being asked to have sex and stuff and that just doesnt seem right ya know

[mlucasone]

"Would you like to engage in doggy-style sex with me tonight? Please circle Yes or no."

You may be on to something lol

But seriously though you shouldn't ask. Get her to where she wants it, then give it to her. Easier said than done, but that basically should be the formula for making sex. Just trying to help, I'm still learning too.

[speakeasy]

David DeAngelo's two steps forward, one step back technique works pretty good with overcoming a girl's last minute resistance. Google it.

[Trotter]

I strongly believe you never ask for permission for a great many things when it comes to the pickup. There are some things that perhaps you should ask permission for, but I don't really see those things ever occuring during the process of seduction. Quite frankly if you're at a bar just seat yourself. I used to think that it was proper to ask "Is anyone sitting here" but I learned that causes women to put up their force field because they feel the inevitable pickup attempt coming. Of course, if it's another guy yeah ask if anyone is sitting in your target seat.

So you can sit yourself next to your mark and if someone is actually sitting there before you she will let you know and I think that has its advantages. If I sit down next to a woman at a bar and she says "that seat is taken" it can mean a lot of things such as her boyfriend/husband's seat, her friend's seat, or maybe she just doesn't want you sitting next to her. You can also use that as an opportunity to gather information. She says "this seat is taken" I could say "oh, we can just get another one for your friend. I want to sit here because <tv, ordering drinks, insert your excuse here>."

[Demitrios]

(12-07-2008 07:14 PM)mlucasone Wrote:  

"Would you like to engage in doggy-style sex with me tonight? Please circle Yes or no."

You may be on to something lol

But seriously though you shouldn't ask. Get her to where she wants it, then give it to her. Easier said than done, but that basically should be the formula for making sex. Just trying to help, I'm still learning too.

Well how do I go about doing that I already droppped hints that i like her and we plan to hang out ya know but i wanna know for sure that Im not wasteing time and just close hardcore

[Roosh]

Never ask.

[Trotter]

(12-07-2008 06:11 PM)Demitrios Wrote:  

for real? thats how like its happened with other girls I've been with but it seems like usually I hear alotta girls just being asked to have sex and stuff and that just doesnt seem right ya know

Why not? You never just said to a woman "Let's have sex"?

Demitrios Wrote:

Well how do I go about doing that I already droppped hints that i like her and we plan to hang out ya know but i wanna know for sure that Im not wasteing time and just close hardcore

Okay, back up. Dropping hints? That's like feeding a stray dog that only follows you because you feed it. Attention whores are the same way you feed them attention and they'll keep coming back for it. But that's all it is and will never escalate beyond that point. And honestly only women drop hints men shouldn't (a semantic different from suggestion).

It's clear you don't even have an understanding for the basic art of seduction and without that it's like trying to learn to fly before learning to walk. The first thing you need to do is review 'Bang'. Then you need to put some of its principles into practice. Signup on Roosh's blog and mailing list and read about some techniques and hints.

If you're wondering if you're wasting your time without question the answer is automatically 'yes'. Not because the girl isn't interested but because you don't know what you're doing and can quickly ruin an opportunity. You need to take charge of the situation.

[Demitrios]

(12-10-2008 12:55 PM)Trotter Wrote:  

(12-07-2008 06:11 PM)Demitrios Wrote:  

for real? thats how like its happened with other girls I've been with but it seems like usually I hear alotta girls just being asked to have sex and stuff and that just doesnt seem right ya know

Why not? You never just said to a woman "Let's have sex"?

Demitrios Wrote:

Well how do I go about doing that I already droppped hints that i like her and we plan to hang out ya know but i wanna know for sure that Im not wasteing time and just close hardcore

Okay, back up. Dropping hints? That's like feeding a stray dog that only follows you because you feed it. Attention whores are the same way you feed them attention and they'll keep coming back for it. But that's all it is and will never escalate beyond that point. And honestly only women drop hints men shouldn't (a semantic different from suggestion).

It's clear you don't even have an understanding for the basic art of seduction and without that it's like trying to learn to fly before learning to walk. The first thing you need to do is review 'Bang'. Then you need to put some of its principles into practice. Signup on Roosh's blog and mailing list and read about some techniques and hints.

If you're wondering if you're wasting your time without question the answer is automatically 'yes'. Not because the girl isn't interested but because you don't know what you're doing and can quickly ruin an opportunity. You need to take charge of the situation.

I like this girl and she knows that and she likes me as well, I just wanna have sex with her soon lol and no I've never just asked a woman outright if she wants to have sex. Thats not my style bud. That was the whole topic to begin with but now Im just getting mixed answers,some of the people that replied said it alright to ask and others said no. so Idk

[Trotter]

There's no mixed messages we all said the same thing if you look back through the posts. You don't ask. If you want to borrow her car yeah sure that's something to ask for, but regarding seduction you don't ask permission.

Yeah, there are some there are some guys that can walk up to a girl and ask. But there are two things you need to consider: what other assets do they have, and how are they approaching. I almost bet you that it'll either be one of two things.

1. Guy is some kind of Adonnis that women can't say no to, or he has a reputation saying he's the big man on campus or some other type of status symbol. The kind of traits that makes him desirable to women for some reason hence he doesn't have to work at trying to get laid. I don't think that's you.

2. Guy that can walk up to a woman and say "Let's go back to my room" which generally suggests sex. Yep, he asked but then he DIDN'T ask. He suggested it and that's definitely a far better way of approaching that with a woman. Women will find something like "Will you have sex with me?" as weak on any guy's part and a sign of insecurity. Women likes to be directed in a seductive manner and it turns them on.

In your case, you've empowered this girl by telling her that you 'like her'. Now she knows she has you and can deny you every step of the way because she knows she can have it at any time. That's not the point of the pickup or seduction. Even in real relationships this is a strong dynamic. To be able to seduce your woman without words is more powerful than simply going "wanna have sex with me?"

Showing her that you have a pair will excite her and make her more willing to follow your lead. Yeah, there comes a point where you can just say wanna have sex. But that's way after you've been seeing this girl for a long period of time as in LTR or marriage. I'm being harsh here because it kills me to see guys empower women and then get walked on later. You sound like a candy and flowers kind of guy and If that's your bag then go with it. In all honesty, you're looking for a magic wand that will get you laid but the magic doesn't work if you're not willing to make an investment into yourself and an investment into studying game. Try as much as you like but it doesn't generally work that way.

I'm almost willing to bet that you'll be far more effective if you release the Alpha and will benefit more from it. You can man up and get what you want, or you can let her dictate how things go because you're too afraid to take that step.

[Demitrios]

(12-11-2008 01:10 PM)Trotter Wrote:  

There's no mixed messages we all said the same thing if you look back through the posts. You don't ask. If you want to borrow her car yeah sure that's something to ask for, but regarding seduction you don't ask permission.

Yeah, there are some there are some guys that can walk up to a girl and ask. But there are two things you need to consider: what other assets do they have, and how are they approaching. I almost bet you that it'll either be one of two things.

1. Guy is some kind of Adonnis that women can't say no to, or he has a reputation saying he's the big man on campus or some other type of status symbol. The kind of traits that makes him desirable to women for some reason hence he doesn't have to work at trying to get laid. I don't think that's you.

2. Guy that can walk up to a woman and say "Let's go back to my room" which generally suggests sex. Yep, he asked but then he DIDN'T ask. He suggested it and that's definitely a far better way of approaching that with a woman. Women will find something like "Will you have sex with me?" as weak on any guy's part and a sign of insecurity. Women likes to be directed in a seductive manner and it turns them on.

In your case, you've empowered this girl by telling her that you 'like her'. Now she knows she has you and can deny you every step of the way because she knows she can have it at any time. That's not the point of the pickup or seduction. Even in real relationships this is a strong dynamic. To be able to seduce your woman without words is more powerful than simply going "wanna have sex with me?"

Showing her that you have a pair will excite her and make her more willing to follow your lead. Yeah, there comes a point where you can just say wanna have sex. But that's way after you've been seeing this girl for a long period of time as in LTR or marriage. I'm being harsh here because it kills me to see guys empower women and then get walked on later. You sound like a candy and flowers kind of guy and If that's your bag then go with it. In all honesty, you're looking for a magic wand that will get you laid but the magic doesn't work if you're not willing to make an investment into yourself and an investment into studying game. Try as much as you like but it doesn't generally work that way.

I'm almost willing to bet that you'll be far more effective if you release the Alpha and will benefit more from it. You can man up and get what you want, or you can let her dictate how things go because you're too afraid to take that step.

okay that makes sense and Im kinda of a pussy when it comes to plaseing people especially girls, Im the kind of guy that is eager to please to a point. trust me I want to make the change but I dont know how???? I've been reading alot of material on the internet and alotta stuff by Roosh. I just dont really know how "I" can apply it,if that makes sense. And how do I relase the Alpha in me? Im a popular guy and all and I know alot o people but I just dont know how to do what your suggesting,btw its cool I rather you be forward with me and Im the laid back type of dude not candy and flowers but I also think that screws me over. Btw thanks man I appreciate it.

[Trotter]

And that's the tough part because the hardest lesson to learn is to simply not give a damn. It simply boils down to either you get it or don't. It's not something that can be taught but it can be learned. At some point you have to find something deep inside that'll bring out an awakening where it's like having an epiphany.

Somewhere along the line you have to realize that you don't need to validate yourself to women, but rather women should automatically see the value in you. Being eager to please is a very Beta personality and usually causes women to classify those kinds of men as 'friends'. But don't mistake being Alpha as meaning to be an asshole. Though we all know that the asshole is a mysterious force that attracts women like flies on crap but it's not the asshole that really attracts them, but the Alpha male that is present when they are with a man. Your eagerness to please is related to your fear of rejection and it's not until you can accept rejection is when you'll finally get it.

You ask any successful man, Roosh, anyone that has studied game and they will all tell you that rejection is simply a part of the process and you cannot fear it. Rejection is a positive thing and that's how you should view it. When we first started we would talk to 100 women before 1 one give us what we wanted. But when you get that one a little light bulb will go off in your head and things will being to make sense. Next thing you know it'll be 2 out of 100, 3, 4, and so on.

The other thing is you can't be so focused on one girl. You'll lose perspective and ultimately your game will fall apart especially if you have no game. Make your move and let rejection slide off your back like it was nothing. And think of it more along the lines of they're not rejecting you but more like you're disqualifying them. Yeah, it sounds like an asshole approach but soon you'll learn that it isn't and you can mix a good, wholesome, personality with game and you ultimately still come out being a great guy.

[InternationPlayboy]

(12-10-2008 02:28 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Never ask.

Espesially with South American girls. It makes you seem really week if you ask. Just go for it.

[Demitrios]

(12-12-2008 03:39 AM)Trotter Wrote:  

And that's the tough part because the hardest lesson to learn is to simply not give a damn. It simply boils down to either you get it or don't. It's not something that can be taught but it can be learned. At some point you have to find something deep inside that'll bring out an awakening where it's like having an epiphany.

Somewhere along the line you have to realize that you don't need to validate yourself to women, but rather women should automatically see the value in you. Being eager to please is a very Beta personality and usually causes women to classify those kinds of men as 'friends'. But don't mistake being Alpha as meaning to be an asshole. Though we all know that the asshole is a mysterious force that attracts women like flies on crap but it's not the asshole that really attracts them, but the Alpha male that is present when they are with a man. Your eagerness to please is related to your fear of rejection and it's not until you can accept rejection is when you'll finally get it.

You ask any successful man, Roosh, anyone that has studied game and they will all tell you that rejection is simply a part of the process and you cannot fear it. Rejection is a positive thing and that's how you should view it. When we first started we would talk to 100 women before 1 one give us what we wanted. But when you get that one a little light bulb will go off in your head and things will being to make sense. Next thing you know it'll be 2 out of 100, 3, 4, and so on.

The other thing is you can't be so focused on one girl. You'll lose perspective and ultimately your game will fall apart especially if you have no game. Make your move and let rejection slide off your back like it was nothing. And think of it more along the lines of they're not rejecting you but more like you're disqualifying them. Yeah, it sounds like an asshole approach but soon you'll learn that it isn't and you can mix a good, wholesome, personality with game and you ultimately still come out being a great guy.

I've noticed if I focus on one girl I do lose sight of alot of things going on around me,although I think my problem is that Ive just become comfortable with just letting oppurtunities pass me by and I've being trying to not give a damn and your right it does work. I think I just needed a little coaching and one more thing because you've helped me alot more than I expected,no offense, an ex of mine just started talking to me because Ive been talking to a girl alot hotter than she. and I think this is funny but I wanna try and have sex with her again but thats it I've let it be known that Im in control of the situation is that all I can really do? And do I just proceed from there?

[Trotter]

There are a ton of threads in this forum about guys asking what to do with their ex's. Some of them have some pretty good advice so check those out.

[Demitrios]

(12-12-2008 12:00 PM)Trotter Wrote:  

There are a ton of threads in this forum about guys asking what to do with their ex's. Some of them have some pretty good advice so check those out.

How did you become alpha like what were some of the things you did? You seem to know alot of what your saying is true,so I think advice froom you is solid and I appreciate the rest of advice man.

[X-Factor]

Just got back on the forums after a month and caught this thread. My two cents...

Trotter has done a good job at attempting to communicate ideas that are often not suited to communication. OP, you must have epiphanies and other flashes of insight, coupled with a desire to become a better man. That is the foundation you must seek. Put it this way: there are two roads you can take.

1) Become a vapid pua (a la Mystery in The Game), devoid of any real value and screwed in the head, or...

2) Become a REAL pua, who does not fake/feign confidence. He does not fake this because true confidence comes from the man who has set goals for himself and has achieved those goals. It comes from taking risks and stepping way outside your comfort zone. True confidence also comes from the knowledge that your life is freaking awesome, and any woman would be THRILLED to experience just a portion of your life. But you can't have an awesome life without setting goals to achieve.

Do you see what I'm getting at?

This is the perspective, mindset, and philosophy you must adopt in order to become the "alpha male." Being alpha is an attitude, not an action. And that attitude stems from your real life experiences, sacrifices, failures, and successes. It is the essence of who you are, and CANNOT be faked.

Re: the OP's original question, the answer is simple.

If you've done it correctly, there will be no question. It will just...be.

Respect.

[Hellbound]

X Factor and Trotter have really given me a boost, and at a time when I thought I didn't need one. Nice one!

I thought I was an Alpha but clearly I'm not there yet...

[Demitrios]

(12-15-2008 08:02 AM)X-Factor Wrote:  

Just got back on the forums after a month and caught this thread. My two cents...

Trotter has done a good job at attempting to communicate ideas that are often not suited to communication. OP, you must have epiphanies and other flashes of insight, coupled with a desire to become a better man. That is the foundation you must seek. Put it this way: there are two roads you can take.

1) Become a vapid pua (a la Mystery in The Game), devoid of any real value and screwed in the head, or...

2) Become a REAL pua, who does not fake/feign confidence. He does not fake this because true confidence comes from the man who has set goals for himself and has achieved those goals. It comes from taking risks and stepping way outside your comfort zone. True confidence also comes from the knowledge that your life is freaking awesome, and any woman would be THRILLED to experience just a portion of your life. But you can't have an awesome life without setting goals to achieve.

Do you see what I'm getting at?

This is the perspective, mindset, and philosophy you must adopt in order to become the "alpha male." Being alpha is an attitude, not an action. And that attitude stems from your real life experiences, sacrifices, failures, and successes. It is the essence of who you are, and CANNOT be faked.

Re: the OP's original question, the answer is simple.

If you've done it correctly, there will be no question. It will just...be.

Respect.

That makes alot of sense, Ive come across the conclusion when Im posative,good things happen and I attract people and attitudes that are also posative and vice versa being negative, and if Im not mistaken your saying that it all has to deal with how I portray myself mentally and project that outward? Hence how I would like to be at one point and then acting upon that?

[X-Factor]

(12-16-2008 12:14 AM)Demitrios Wrote:  

That makes alot of sense, Ive come across the conclusion when Im posative,good things happen and I attract people and attitudes that are also posative and vice versa being negative, and if Im not mistaken your saying that it all has to deal with how I portray myself mentally and project that outward? Hence how I would like to be at one point and then acting upon that?

That's EXACTLY what I'm saying. I knew you'd pick up what I was trying to lay out. Each individual person is in control of their destiny; nobody else can do this for them. It is up to the individual to drop the "victim mentality" and start achieving goals in life. THAT is being alpha.

[Trotter]

(12-12-2008 04:55 PM)Demitrios Wrote:  

(12-12-2008 12:00 PM)Trotter Wrote:  

There are a ton of threads in this forum about guys asking what to do with their ex's. Some of them have some pretty good advice so check those out.

How did you become alpha like what were some of the things you did? You seem to know alot of what your saying is true,so I think advice froom you is solid and I appreciate the rest of advice man.

I spent a lot of years bowing down to the beckon of women. I used to be that guy that thought I had to be super nice to girls and do things that would appease them or just make them happy in general. My legs would turn to jello whenever I tried to talk to a girl. I was the flower and balloons guy for the longest time and it was getting me nowhere. Ultimately, in the end a lot of women just saw me as a good 'friend'. And it was especially infuriating to me seeing these same girls walking out in the arms of some guy I thought was a big a-hole.

I was fortunate enough to be able to learn from other guys that knew how to handle themselves around women. I had two roommates years ago that gave me some tips I was able to use to finally get to the point of where I am today. I have also studied online material at various PUA sites along the way. But no matter what I read or what my friends tried to teach me the one thing they couldn't teach was to release my alpha and to stop fearing rejection.

The day I had my epiphany was the day after I had spent the night with a woman that I had only known hours previous to it happening. I woke up the next morning realizing that I had put my fears aside and reflected on my attitude and how it worked for me. I showed this chick that I was very much secure with myself and that I wasn't trying to get her to like me. In fact, I wasn't even trying to pick her up because I wasn't attracted to her at all. And it was that understanding that opened a new horizon for me. I more or less just stopped caring all together and decided it was a far more effective approach to stop fearing rejection, and to stop placing women on a pedastal.

[X-Factor]

^^^^ A-freaking-men brother.