[cmrocks]

Hi guys,

I need some workout advice. I know there are a lot of threads out there but I have some specific questions. I'll start with a bit of background.

I'm 27, 5'9 tall and until recently, I was around 170 lbs.

I've worked out off and on for a while. I say off and on because I used to work at a gold mine which didn't have a gym. I worked a 4 weeks in, 2 weeks out schedule so I'd hit the gym on my weeks off and do push ups and pull ups and such while on site. It was okay. I didn't pay much attention to my diet besides "eat healthy". I stayed around 165 lbs and was reasonably fit.

Last September, I started grad school and used it as an opportunity to start working out more seriously. I ate a lot and followed Starting Strength for a while then some variations of that. I went from 165 lbs to 177 lbs and I got my squat up to 295 lbs, deadlift to 385 lbs and bench to 215 lbs.

I was happy with my strength numbers but I wasn't happy with my body. I definitely got bigger but I also got chubby. At 177 lbs, I only had 1 pair of pants left that fit me properly.

In April, I bought a mountain bike and started riding for fun 3 times a week. I also cleaned up my diet. I dropped down to 170 lbs fairly quickly and my strength numbers also suffered a bit.

A month ago, I had a pretty bad crash on my mountain bike which resulted in a 3rd grade AC shoulder separation. I haven't lifted or done much of anything active for the last month. I decided to really clean up my diet because I didn't want to gain weight again while not working out. I started doing intermittent fasting and I cut my carbs back quite significantly.

Yesterday, I went to the gym for the first time in a month and was shocked when I jumped on the scale. I'm down to 158 lbs! In the mirror, I actually look better than I have in a while. I've definitely dropped a lot of body fat. At this point, I definitely don't want to get any smaller, muscle-wise, though.

I need advice on what to do from here. I want to gain weight again but I don't want to get chubby like I did last time. I sit on my ass in front of a computer all day so I can't follow the standard bodybuilding diet of moderate carbs, eat 5-6x a day. I just balloon up and get really bloated.

So far, I really like this IF and lowish carb thing. I feel great and I like eating less frequently. I'd like to stick with this template but modify it to start gaining some quality weight.

How do I go about this? When should I eat carbs and when should I avoid them?

[Laurifer]

Im doing intermittent fasting as well. I find it works best for me since I dont really have to abstain from certain kinds of food, just lower my daily caloric in take by skipping meals. Yesterday I ate like a pig so today I havent had anything yet.

For me, I make sure to eat carbs post workout. This will put glycogen back into your muscles and keep them rounded and energized (thanks MikeCF/D&P).

Also, consider popping a Yohimbine HCL capsule while fasting. Take it with coffee and do some light cardio if you feel up to it. Cycling is perfect. This will help blood to flow to areas that retain fat that is hard to get rid of. (Again thanks MikeCF/D&P)

I can only reach the gym once a week usually, rest of the time im usually on my ass driving. So i dont need the calories that come from three meals a day. Ive done keto before but I prefer just fasting so I can still eat carbs.

[Remington]

When you lift, you need to go through lifting cycles. I usually do something along the lines of 6-8 weeks of heavy lifting with many sets and low reps. Then, go to a little lighter weight with many reps and fewer sets. The heavy lifts I do help me build that muscle, the lighter sets help me cut. Plus it increases your strength tremendously. You just need to find that happy medium.

[Nascimento]

http://www.dangerandplay.com/category/the-weight-room/

Several articles that I found very helpful.

For training specific advice, there's a podcast in there somewhere that's excellent.

[Bushido]

First of all, what you need is diet advice, not workout advice.

Second, you should shoot for ONE goal at a time.

1. Gain strength
2. Gain mass
3. Lose fat

Choose ONE of the above and commit 1,000%. Too many people try to do everything at once and stay in the same place.

Assuming your goal is to GAIN MASS, you need carbs. You aren't going to bulk on a low carb diet. Period. It's hard not to lose weight on keto unless you are stuffing your face 24/7.

So, add the carbs back in, get yourself in a calorific surplus and add mass until you want to change your goal.

Once you want to lose some fat, you can switch back to low carb to cut down. Keep protein high during the cut phase and you will keep your strength and mass gains while you burn off the fat.

Then, when you are happy with your bodyfat level, you can switch to hitting strength gains while maintaining. And so on. One goal at a time.

[Griprip08]

(07-29-2014 07:58 PM)Remington Wrote:  

When you lift, you need to go through lifting cycles. I usually do something along the lines of 6-8 weeks of heavy lifting with many sets and low reps. Then, go to a little lighter weight with many reps and fewer sets. The heavy lifts I do help me build that muscle, the lighter sets help me cut. Plus it increases your strength tremendously. You just need to find that happy medium.

I agree. I actually just got off a "cutting bulk(?)" routine myself, (and said fuck it and just started bulking again), but I was instructed by a trainer of mine (Was a bit lost myself on how to reach my specific goals), this guy didn't come cheap. I had always got the bulking thing down, but being 6'6" 250, the idea of eating 1200 calories less than my bulking seemed crazy. Anyway, me and him worked out a heavy week/light week schedule. A bit different than Rem's plan but the same concept, periodization/cycling.

It was mainly at least 3 days a week, 4 if we planned it right and got good lifts/progress in, but doing 4 days for a full, lifting (light/heavy) cycle/period. So back/bis, chest/tris, legs, and shoulders, then we would repeat the next week except do them "heavy" (less reps/more sets/heavier weight). In between cycles (so after a full body work-week) we would do an "anerobic day" (these were fucking killer). These were the ones that really pushed you over the edge mentally and sometimes physically (had to <strike>sit</strike> lay down between sets of burpees super-set with prisoner squats, at the beginning).

One of the things I liked about this type of split, is that it gave me the flexibility to go when I could. I tried sticking to not missing more than 2 days without going, and no more than 2 days in a row.

Like he said, the heavy weeks will help you gain muscle while the light weeks will keep your heart rate up and your nervous system/ligaments/muscles active and strong. This combination is deadly if you eat the right foods.

If you want to be lean as fuck but still slowly gain, diet is gonna impact you more. Keep eating protein until your liver begs you to stop(not really), and stay away from anything that's processed, or has a shit load of starch/fat in it. Stick to "cleaner" carbs (fruits/veggies/brown rice/sweet potato/oatmeal).The only reason I say stay away from fat is because if you're taking the right vitamins (i.e. fish oil/flaxseed oil) you wont' need a shit load to make up for calories. I tried to stay under 50g of fat a day, around 270g protein and 220 for carbs(*starting out*) (I don't remember exact numbers, and these are obviously based on my weight). Of course you want to remember the first law of thermodynamics and eat below your caloric intake, for something like this I would recommend only around 300-400 under.

As the weeks go by, you want to start to reduce the amount of carbs, (I struggled with this). Go at whatever rate you want, but after a full light/heavy week, you should reduce the carbs by at least 10%. I got down to eating just over 120g of carbs and still staying conscious during my workouts. It didn't last long, but there was a point where I was (what I consider) lean.

If you're looking to gain a litter fast weight at the expense of shredding some fat, increase the calories with slightly more carbs/fat. The reason I saw fat is because no matter what, you should always be getting minimum 1-1.5g protein/1 lb. of bodyweight.

Overall, if you have the discipline to go on the weekends, and not flake for out for 4 days on multiple occasions, you should be able to get a really good rhythm going.

Again, this is all from my personal experience, and in no way am I certified nutritionist/trainer. Hell, I've only been (educated)lifting for 3 years.

But, you might find some of this useful, as it worked for me. Let me know if you decide to do something like this. I gained a lot of resources during this period, some of which I still have access to, not to mention my target numbers, workouts I did, reps/sets all that good jazz, so I can hook you up with whatever you might think will help.

Cheers

[Giovonny]

Great post and great question.

Gaining muscle AND losing fat SIMULTANEOUSLY is possible

It's tricky, but with hard work and dedication, it can be done.

Nutrition/Diet is the biggest factor.

Of course, lifting weights with high intensity is the other factor.

Quality sleep, lots of water, and lots of vegetables are other factors.

(07-29-2014 09:49 AM)cmrocks Wrote:  

How do I go about this?

Lift weights like a mad man.

And, when you get hungry, eat a bunch of CLEAN food.

If you lift hard and don't eat garbage, you can not get fat.

(07-29-2014 09:49 AM)cmrocks Wrote:  

When should I eat carbs?

You should eat carbs when you are going to be using a lot energy.

- pre workout
- post workout (to recover the used energy)
etc.

(07-29-2014 09:49 AM)cmrocks Wrote:  

when should I avoid them

You should avoid them when you will not use them.

-night time
-when you have enough fuel from protein, vegetables, fats
etc.

Your greatest guide is your own body.

When you need carbs, your body will crave them.

You need some carbs for fuel, just try and eat the highest quality carbs as possible.

And, don't over indulge on carbs.

In time, with lots of trial and error, you will learn whats types of carbs and how many carbs are right for you.

I agree with you, there is no reason to get fat and bloated just to gain muscle. That might work for bodybuilders but I think there are other options that can work just as good if not better.

Right now, my carbs come from:

- oatmeal
- nuts
- brown rice
- vegetables/fruit

Early in the day, I load up on carbs.

Later in the day, I pretty much only eat protein and vegetables.

If you are getting fat, you are doing something wrong, in my opinion.

[Switch]

I've been thinking a good way to gain muscle mass while losing fat is to do alternating bulk and cut cycles. But really short cycles, like 1.5 weeks bulk then 4-7 days of cut. It's a lot easier to gain muscle when you have a calorie overload. It's also significantly easier to lose fat compared to gaining muscle. So just eat a normal bulking diet for like 1.5-2 weeks, then cut for a week. This way you'll maximize gains without gaining too much chub, perhaps even losing some fat.

[Frater]

I agree with dreambig, you need nutrition advice ; for the workouts, Rippetoe's book is fine.

It's not IF but Scooby has a great post about loosing fat and building muscle at the same time : you'll find it here : http://scoobysworkshop.com/gain-muscle-lose-fat/
In a few words, you need to reduce a little bit your calories (10 % of your total daily expenditure) and to follow a very clean diet : some complex carbs (low GI), lots of proteins and vegetables. I find Giovonny's advice very wise too.

If I had to choose, I'd rather be cutting than bulking ; in my opinion, it's better to be ripped than big ; but who said we couldn't have both ?