[Renberg]

I went on a Tinder date with a gorgeous girl. We had a great time, walked around the city, went to a bar, she laughed at all my jokes. I only got good signs from her.

We're sitting down a bit later on a bench, when, after 4 hours hanging out total, I go in for the kiss. She turns her head and tells me that she doesn't date often. It's her first time using Tinder, and she wasn't looking for hook-ups. It seemed much more harsh than a shit test. She then talked about how she realized it's just a hook-up app but she was looking to make friends. She also said that tonight was a date, so she was very contradictory. I could tell she'd turn away because every time I put my head near hers she would.

However, I told her, "If this isn't a date, why did you let me pay for your beers?"

After walking towards her place in silence for ten minutes, she said, "Good luck hooking up on your next Tinder date." I called her out for being judgmental and she apologized a lot. I eventually got her laughing, intermittently telling her that what she said was rude. She laughed every now and then. Ever have that passive aggressive girl that couldn't help but laugh at you when she was trying to convince herself not to? She acted like her.

I told her I'd walk her back to her place to make sure she got home safe, and our convo ended with, "Thanks for walking me home." She offered me cash for the beer. And I said, "Was it a date?" She replied, "If you have to ask, take the cash." I gave it back, played the nice guy card.

It's weird that the thought of kissing on the first date was so crazy to this girl. But I do think she's cute; she's a cool girl and would really like to get further than holding hands. Should I eject because it's a failed Tinder date? Should I pursue/wait a certain amount of time to text her? If so, what would be a good restart message?

Thanks,
Renberg

[polymath]

Should have taken the cash, she would respect you more.

If you want to send a restart text, the one I would probably use is, "hey, a few friends and I are going to X place tonight. join us." I would even hope that she doesn't come, but the message is enough to soften the harshness of what happened a little bit. No harm in trying to get her to actually act chill with you. The thing about being friends with a girl, like ACTUAL friends not the friend zone where you want her to suck your dick and she just uses you for attention and as an emotional tampon, is that a real friend is usually happy to introduce you to her other friends who are more attractive than she is.

Send a text, but simultaneously forget about dating her and go out with some other girls. Think about how you felt when she turned her head. The girl doesn't deserve your romantic attention, and there are plenty of other beautiful girls (some even more attractive) who would not react that way.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

I think it was just some sort of Anti Slut Defense with this girl, since you got to know her over Tinder.

She was attracted, you made your move, she refused your kiss - that alone does not mean that she is not attracted to you or that this hasn't been a date. You may have become accustomed to slutty girls only, but there are plenty of girls out there who do not even kiss on a first kiss despite having wet panties.

It was basically a bit of a shit-test and I am sorry to say that you failed it and ruined the mood via "If this isn't a date, why did you let me pay for your beers?"

But you came back a bit. Getting your money back would be stupid. Even mentioning it is ridiculous. You paid for it, you stick by your decision.

I have personally met even model-type girls who avoided kisses even on second dates, but fucked furiously on the third. Important is that you made your move - she knows what you want from her. You meet many more of these kind of girls in Eastern Europe and the FSU - in the old times that was NORMAL behavior even in the US!

I would contact her and go for date two - if she accepts then you know that she is into you and you just failed some shit-tests. She might be actually one of the few good girls out there, but you never know and will find out in due time.

[lowside]

I too vote for following up on this. It seems to me she dropped a shit test which is to be expected.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

Quote:

"If this isn't a date, why did you let me pay for your beers?"

Not a good idea, man. Don't negotiate with woman. No amount of logic or rational arguments has ever caused a woman to like someone.

Quote:

She turns her head and tells me that she doesn't date often. It's her first time using Tinder, and she wasn't looking for hook-ups. It seemed much more harsh than a shit test. She then talked about how she realized it's just a hook-up app but she was looking to make friends.

This is actually pretty standard shit for a woman to pull off. Memorize this phrase, because it is going to bring you lots of sex in the future:

"Let's not negotiate like a contract."

Be amused. Be in control. And be understanding, but not negotiating. You know you'll be fucking her later no matter what she says; she is just saying it because no woman wants to feel like a slut, even if she is doing something slutty.

If, after dropping the sentence I wrote above, she still returns to this topic, you can always take it further. There are no limits as long as you keep your dominant frame. For example, hug her and tell her "Awwww, it's like we're in high school again."

Don't feel bad for failing this shit test, it's devious and quite common. But now you should be ready for next time.

[Coldfire]

If the thought of ejecting is already on your mind you need to pull that rip cord buddy.

[Renberg]

Thank you for the solid advice, guys. I appreciate it. What would be your time frame for contacting her?

Also, in terms of the interaction, if she phrased things better, the date would have gone much better. If she had been, "Let's take it slower" I still would have messed with her. But the initial and accidental "I don't date" thing threw me the hell off. That's what caused me to question what I'm even doing here. And I thought that if my fellow RVFers knew they were wasting their time, they would leave. So I might have screwed things up. But it's interesting that she qualified the night as indeed a date twenty minutes later. I tried to argue logic, which, as mentioned, was a bad choice.

-R

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(06-18-2014 06:36 AM)Renberg Wrote:  

Thank you for the solid advice, guys. I appreciate it. What would be your time frame for contacting her?

Also, in terms of the interaction, if she phrased things better, the date would have gone much better. If she had been, "Let's take it slower" I still would have messed with her. But the initial and accidental "I don't date" thing threw me the hell off. That's what caused me to question what I'm even doing here. And I thought that if my fellow RVFers knew they were wasting their time, they would leave. So I might have screwed things up. But it's interesting that she qualified the night as indeed a date twenty minutes later. I tried to argue logic, which, as mentioned, was a bad choice.

-R

3 days is usually the right time, though even that seems to change in current hook-up-culture time.

Some of the very young ones in the US and also already in the UK are becoming date-averse. Even mentioning a Date is too much commitment for them.

Experienced Players have pursued a target sometimes for 2 months or even with long-term play for 2 years! Of course that was while travelling and online-Game etc., but still - for a high-level girl basically you decide what's worth your effort. Just make a move every time - if you realize that she is just playing you then next immediatelly of course.

There are still some girls out there who take 4-6 dates for sex to happen. If it's worth your time - why not?

[Renberg]

Thank you for putting things in perspective, Zelcorpion. I'm not sure if she's interested in seeing me again, but there's only one way to find out. I'm worried that, attempting to kiss on even the date after this would be difficult to pull off. But I live a no-regrets lifestyle, and I'll let her know it.

I told her, "If I see something I want, I attempt to take it." She seemed baffled that I would go for the kiss for a reason NO OTHER than the fact that it was a Tinder date...like she'd rather go on dates with many different men but not hook up. I thought it was mistreatment that women looked down upon. Now it's hard to get a goddam kiss!

[Vaun]

(06-18-2014 02:34 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

You may have become accustomed to slutty girls only

Great observation. Could the state of sexual affairs in the US actually affect how you react to and treat normal women, and how often you keep these women in your life?

(06-18-2014 02:34 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

You meet many more of these kind of girls in Eastern Europe and the FSU - in the old times that was NORMAL behavior even in the US!

Dealing with this now with a Hungarian girl. I thought she was uninterested after a few dates and barely a kiss, but she seemed to be very comfortable with me and we had really nice times together. Was about to let it go but reopened and she's been texting me for the last two days. I think she is interested.

[Renberg]

I agree that modern dating in the US, specifically through Tinder, is slut-expected. However, there should be no mistreatment for attempting to kiss. It's a compliment to the chick

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(06-18-2014 11:28 AM)Renberg Wrote:  

I agree that modern dating in the US, specifically through Tinder, is slut-expected. However, there should be no mistreatment for attempting to kiss. It's a compliment to the chick

Again - you are the one on the ground and should be the best person to assess the situation. It looks more like a shit-test to me.
But who knows - you will find out soon enough. Either way - reacting to those things is always better via teasing her & amused mastery. it can be learnt

@Vaun Could the state of sexual affairs in the US actually affect how you react to and treat normal women, and how often you keep these women in your life?

Yes - some Players have tuned their radars to easy slutty girls which is great if you are looking for a SDL or quick fuck. After some time it affects their reasoning regarding girls who are indeed different.

I also met Players who predominantly prefer sweet feminine girls who could become their girlfriends. That usually complicates things for various reasons - those girls are more difficult to game and they also expect way more commitment from you.

Either way - you decide ultimately how much time you would like to invest in a girl of that caliber - going on 7 dates for a 8-9 might be fine with you, while for that slutty 5 you will not even go on date 2.

[Renberg]

I feel you. Definitely adding great perspective to this convo, like I mentioned. She's a solid 8, so I figure I'll hit her up Friday to make plans for early next week. Think that's a good plan. I'll text her a joke and move forward from there

[Renberg]

UPDATE:

I was really interested in seeing this girl again. But this is what she told me:

"It's true I don't actually know what I want and I'd rather not waste anyone's time. I deleted Tinder since I didn't really have a goal with it. I wish you the best of luck with everything, and your career "

Do I even respond to this?

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(06-19-2014 05:18 PM)Renberg Wrote:  

UPDATE:

I was really interested in seeing this girl again. But this is what she told me:

"It's true I don't actually know what I want and I'd rather not waste anyone's time. I deleted Tinder since I didn't really have a goal with it. I wish you the best of luck with everything, and your career "

Do I even respond to this?

Ouch. Done. Response: "Ok."

Or "Ok. Bye."

[jessup25]

"Unsubscribe"

That ones done for. But Law of Abundance, better luck next time.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

"..."

[Renberg]

Handsome Creepy Eel, will that elicit a response from her? Honestly, so far, I have said nothing because I am disappointed in what she said. I don't want to come off as desperate and attempt to use logic to get her to go out with me. Think about it: She met me on Tinder, liked me but hated Tinder. Therefore, she axes me. Fuck that. I said nothing --> law of abundance. Is it necessary to even respond?

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(06-20-2014 09:22 AM)Renberg Wrote:  

Handsome Creepy Eel, will that elicit a response from her? Honestly, so far, I have said nothing because I am disappointed in what she said. I don't want to come off as desperate and attempt to use logic to get her to go out with me. Think about it: She met me on Tinder, liked me but hated Tinder. Therefore, she axes me. Fuck that. I said nothing --> law of abundance. Is it necessary to even respond?

No.

Learn more about Game. Read some good books by Roosh, Krauser etc.

There are more fish in the water.

[YoungBlood]

After I finished reading your original post Renberg, I knew it wasn't going to end in your favor.

After a certain point, the date seemed transactional and this is confirmed by her offering to give you back your money. You didn't arouse her primal hind-brain so she not only didn't want to kiss you, but she also wanted to essentially kill off any feelings of owing you anything, hence her offering to give you your money back. You should have taken back the money and used it for another date, I know I would. You have to be cold as ice when you deal with any women, but especially so for tinder girls. I always say be playful, fun and exciting, but make no mistake about it, there's always an icy cold calculating scheme I have going on. I always pretend to have the perspective of an outsider viewing my dates. I must create an objective appraisal of the date to seek out my goal.

Here's a good post by Rollo that you must read also: The Medium Is The Message

Quote:

The average guy tends to ‘get’ exactly what a woman has implied with her words, but it takes practice to read her behavior and then more practice in self-control to apply it to his own interpretation. When a woman goes from hot to cold and back again, THIS IS the message – she’s got buyers remorse, you’re not her first priority, she’s deliberating between you and what she perceives is a better prospect, you were better looking when she was drunk, etc. – the message isn’t the ‘what ifs’, the message IS her own hesitation and how her behavior manifests it. 10 dates before sex? This IS the message. Canceling dates? Flaking? strong interest to weak interest? This IS the message.

What Rollo is saying is true, to the letter.