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11-01-2013, 08:29 PM
Not trying to disappoint anyone here, but entry into reputable finance institutions is incredibly competitve. Often, those money management firms hire straight out of top B-Schools or people who have made themselves a name at bulge bracket firms like Goldman Sachs - again, those top rated I-banks have ultra high hiring standards. No such thing as "bro'ing" your way in, lol.
I remember speaking with an american here in my native Munich, he told me that with state university degree, he would not even try to apply as Wall Street would not hire him anyhow.
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11-01-2013, 09:05 PM
I don't understand the point of this thread.
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11-01-2013, 09:29 PM
what is the point of this thread pls.
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11-01-2013, 11:19 PM
Quote: (11-01-2013 09:29 PM)Que enspastic Wrote:
what is the point of this thread pls.
I'd say a member named "Steve9" is relatively clueless about the caliber of people that gets this kind of jobs. He probably believes it's like working in the oilsands or the like, another words an industry that is drowning in work and hires everyone who has work experience and at least "some college" on his resume.
Another words, Steve :
![[Image: youtheman.gif]](https://rooshvforum.network/images/smilies/youtheman.gif)
Joking aside, I believe (and don't mean this downgrading as I myself am struggling to make ends meet) that most Rooshers simply aren't Ivy Leaguers with Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan and the like on their resume. Most of us won't ever get this kind of job, even if we are CPAs or have an undergraduate degree in finance from Penn State.
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11-02-2013, 01:14 AM
Meh. You're talking about like .01% of the job market that have entry-level salaries over $300k. If an average man wanted any hope of making that kind of money the best route to take is start your own business.
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11-02-2013, 01:34 AM
This is funny. A friend's wife lives in Manhattan, is a Hedgy since dad was in the buiz, she makes literally exactly $350k yearly doing this. He is Mr. Mom, watches their two kids, while she makes mad bank for them. Set for life..
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11-02-2013, 02:04 AM
The firm I used to work for hired from target schools in the Southeast such as...UGA, Florida, Florida State, Clemson, UNC, USC, Auburn, Emory.
Starting total comp over $100k...not $353k but not a bad start either.
Jobs are out there, but expect to sacrifice most all of your time (life) for a few years.
"...it's the quiet cool...it's for someone who's been through the struggle and come out on the other side smelling like money and pussy."
"put her in the taxi, put her number in the trash can"
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11-02-2013, 02:32 AM
A good rule of thumb is that the higher the starting salary and the perspectives you have in a firm (average compensation at Goldman Sachs was around 700k US$ / year in 2007!), the more competitive "getting in there" is.
Read this interview with Anton Kreil if you have the time ... Quote " I have heard that it is apparently easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than to
get a job as a trader at Goldman Sachs. Is this true and, if so, is there even any point even trying unless you have an incredible personal charisma, an IQ of
150 plus, nerves of steel to do the job and a better sense of humour than all the Marx Brothers put together?"
http://www.spreadbetmagazine.com/storage...tion-1.pdf
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11-05-2013, 03:30 PM
Better have an in or be a Senators son or something to land one of those jobs. Those jobs are taken or better said given before they are ever even posted.
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11-05-2013, 03:42 PM
That's where good headhunters come in handy.
More proof that to get in the door, it's who you know.
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11-05-2013, 03:46 PM
^ seriously if you think head hunters will get you a good job on Wall Street you're tripping. It's always about getting the managing directors and heads of the group to recommend you.
When you get a call to go work for a "top bank" or "top hedge fund" immediately ask "what is the compensation range".
They will do anything in their power to make you do the lateral jump with no change in pay or responsibility simply because it is more "prestigious" this is career suicide on Wall Street. Do not do this.
Prestige = bull shit.
Fuck prestige Get money.
I almost made this mistake 3 years ago when I was going to jump firms, said group got shut down 9 months later. Missed a landmine.
Finally fucking LOL at that entry level number. Hey the entry level at the top long only's is prob near 500K.
Please ignore he fact that capital group is in that list which skews your number up by probably $1M a head <<<< underestimate.
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11-05-2013, 03:48 PM
When the headhunters you're working with focus on filling CIO, MD, and other top positions at HF, PE, IB, and other asset management firms, it helps.
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11-05-2013, 03:50 PM
^ yeah I disagree. If I get a job via a head hunter I just fucked my career 99/100. They suck and are in it for the $$$. Great hustle though.
If you mean it's good for CEO's/Cfo's I entirely agree. I am not a C level exec
As soon as a lower or middle level guy says he landed a job via a head hunter I know he didn't get ranked well by his previous firm. Back in 2002-2006 head hunters had your back because there was too much demand. In 2013? Not so much.
If you really want to go the head hunter route. DO NOT go with major ones like glocap. Go find a niche firm focusing on a segment and industry. Such as "long short only: medical" or "event driven only: NYC" or "merger arbitration: consumer"
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11-05-2013, 03:52 PM
I was talking upper level/C level management. No point for a hh to focus on low level positions unless you're related to a C level exec.
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11-05-2013, 03:57 PM
^ then yes that is true.
Until you start making $500K on Wall Street head hunters are just fucking up your career.
At the high revenue generation level you are usually getting someone fired. That's why headhunters help because you can't just call a firm and say your consumer banker sucks fire him and bring me in for 90% of his cost structure and a 2 yr guarantee with xyz deals on the docket.
I always had a great idea for a headhunter scam to put glocaps out of business. You basically linked in all the hb1 visa guys who have to have disclosed ranges and then you stagger the slots and constantly sell the $20K pay bump to the idiots who will take it and scrape the $5K fee.
Have wasted more time on Head hunter calls that I have on angry calls from ex-girlfriends.
I am not even nice at all anymore within 4 seconds it's "what's the pay range and responsibilities of the position" I don't care about your "highly accredited long-short fund" tag line. Pander to the idiots don't call me.
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11-06-2013, 03:58 AM
WestCoast, would you be willing to share how you got into high finance ? What schools and so forth ?
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11-06-2013, 07:10 AM
What does this hypothetical person do that makes them worth so much? They'd have to produce at least a million $s of profit for it to be worth it for the company to hire them at that salary. And to produce a million $s of profit from trading stock options, the amount of money invested, traded and spun around is just mind-boggling. Probably tens of millions even at such a "basic" level.
"Imagine" by HCE | Hitler reacts to Battle of Montreal | An alternative use for
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11-06-2013, 09:03 AM
@munich I went to a reputable university in the usa, worked in 6 finance internships before graduating (started from the bottom at financial advisory then worked up by jumping internships every 6 months). Then started in investment banking.
Getting a job is simply this: 1) 3.5+ GPA from a top school, 2) finance internships working up to front office roles. That really is it. If you went to a no-name school you have a next to zero percent chance of ever getting in. So make sure to take mental notes when people think they are smarter than the people to get in and ask yourself "if this guy is bright why didn't he get in". Wall Street is a very competitive field so be prepared to be laughed at if you try to break in with a low SAT score and no-name school with a humanities major. The one major issue is you have a whole bunch of type A aspenger people in your office as well so when you do break in make sure you remember everyone believes they are important.
The people who keep talking about average salary and why they get paid have never worked in the industry before.
Want to know why average salary doesn't mean shit? Here's a basic hedge fund team.
1) PM
2) 3 analysts
3) 2 associates for each analyst
PM is going to make $10M in a good year, Analyst about a million, associates $100-400K
Why do they make a lot... If you manage $1B dollars and charge a 2 percent fee that's already $20M. Most of the things Steve9 is posting is what you'll see from guys on yahoo finance and other mainstream sources that make no sense. They cite "averages" they don't explain how spread the pay gets, they don't talk about how you'll be fired in a single bad year, they don't talk about relationships, they don't talk about anything that drives be business model.
Mainstream media's job is to make you hate Wall Street and think that people who work in the industry are dumb. Throw out a couple of insider trading cases like SAC and others and of course average joe will label them all as crooks.
Anyway I have dropped more than my fair share of posts on why they get paid, why average joe has no business talking about high finance and why people hate on it.
Here is how you filter out people who know and don't know anything about finance.
1. Are they impressed by Goldman Sachs? Dude is an idiot.
2. Do they think the highest paid people are good at math? Dude is an idiot.
3. Does the guy think the buyside is "always the best side"? Dude is an idiot.
4. Can the guy even build a financial model? Dude is an idiot.
5. Can the guy read a filing? Dude is an idiot.
If they fail any of the five above you just dollar cost average into ETF's and ignore the guys opinion on finance. Even smart guys who have no experience seem to chime in on "how to manage cash". Really? Unless you've done it there is no point in listening.
If the guy is brilliant then simply ask him basic questions "what finance items do you recommend" any book/source he recommends is a dead tell to how far along the learning curve he is.
Anyway, ignore all the "averages" that shit is for the peons.
To give you an idea, the best guy I ever worked for made $10M in profit per year for the firm 5 years running. How many people were on his team?
3.
Him and 2 low life's like myself. So tell me the average pay was like $3M I'll tell you I didn't touch anywhere near that number.
The hardest jump in finance is the final one.
Going from the $100-400K a year range to that $500-1M range. Once you get there you drop off the radar.
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11-06-2013, 10:51 AM
The "pay" some of the PMs take home is often obviously not so much the salary they get or pay themselves, but simply the increase in net worth they enjoyed thanks to managing a large chunk, maybe all of their very own net worth. If they happen to have a stellar year (John Paulson comes to mind, his Credit Opportunities funds skyrocketed thanks to him and his small team of financial analysts anticipating the subprime debacle), it means their net worth skyrockets, too.
"Dude is an idiot" by answering "No" (aka "fail" in your terms) ... would not say so as I don't think the track record of George Soros speaks against him, however he admits he was not good at math. Steve Cohen was a decent, but not outstanding student at Wharton, again according to his own words.
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11-06-2013, 10:55 AM
Fascinating piece, though a bit older, on "the firm"
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/f...06/380330/
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