[OSL]

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Great article by my friend about bootstrapping in Vietnam. Saigon specifically.

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I will probably make this my next long(ish) term spot.

That is.....6-12 months.

Going to be taking stops in Medellin, Brazil, San Francisco along the way.

[Laner]

Good read.

What do you know of people who are working with business development of already finished (hard) product?

Most of these "startup" weekends, destinations, etc seem to be based around digital product. I am in the business (for the moment) of hard product.

Anyone here ever make the transition from hard to digital? I am curious as I could use the break in spending while developing my latest business ventures. Vancouver is very expensive.

[OSL]

(06-17-2013 01:08 PM)Laner Wrote:  

Good read.

What do you know of people who are working with business development of already finished (hard) product?

Most of these "startup" weekends, destinations, etc seem to be based around digital product. I am in the business (for the moment) of hard product.

Anyone here ever make the transition from hard to digital? I am curious as I could use the break in spending while developing my latest business ventures. Vancouver is very expensive.

Guangzhou/Shenzhen/HongKong seems to be the hub for this at the moment.

http://www.theelevatorlife.com

http://blog.michaelmichelini.com/

http://www.originalgrain.com

Places like Saigon/ChiangMai are good because digital products, by nature, allow for mobility to a degree (assuming you don't need VC).

The Pearl River Delta is swimming in "hard products" entrepreneurs.

I think ArturJedi is there now.

A good thing abou the Pearl River Delta is that you are getting three world-class cities within 1-2 hours of each other by rail. Shenzhen/HongKong are literally a 30 minute rail from each other - like going from Grand Central to White Plains.

Guangzhou is about an hour farther.

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[Laner]

What are your thoughts on Taiwan?

I had a family condo in Shenzen that was just sold last week (made a killing) and a cousin still up in Guangdong. I was hoping to be able to use the Shenzen place but he felt the market turning and got out (he is in development). I still have access to a family condo in Taiwan (vacant half the year) and there seems to be a bit of activity there for expats.

I would like to be able to take rent out of the equation for the first 6 months or so that I am there as well as use family connections for business. This limits me to Tokyo, Taipei and a lesser extent in Shanghai and Guangdong.

I would love to make a go of Tokyo, but there are too many barriers there. I have tried, and while fun I could not make enough money to think about it long term.

[artur jedi]

HongKong is more about technology, meantime Sz and Gz are surrounded by factories, thus great for sourcing hard product.
Laner, what are you working with?

Some thoughts about Sz, it is technologically still miles away from HK, mainly due to the chinese censorship and pretty unreliable internet. First one is easy to get rid of, thanks to VPN, but the quality of the connection still sucks... In the office I have a pretty strong internet, but it is not uncommon for the skype to drop calls, mail server to crash, sometimes to load a website takes forever and so on. When at home I often can't even stream a movie in lowest quality. I'm sure with the time mainland China will catch up, but some more water has to flow in Pearl River.

[WanderingSoul]

I have only spent a few nights in Siagon, but I loved it there. If I wasn't tied down to BKK at the moment, I would probably be there.

[OSL]

(06-18-2013 04:49 AM)RioNomad Wrote:  

I have only spent a few nights in Siagon, but I loved it there. If I wasn't tied down to BKK at the moment, I would probably be there.

Rio what did you like about it?

The motorbike traffic seems annoying and harrowing. People who end up in Saigon seem to love the chaos though.

Any report on the chicks there?

[RichieP]

(06-18-2013 01:42 AM)Laner Wrote:  

What are your thoughts on Taiwan?

I had a family condo in Shenzen that was just sold last week (made a killing) and a cousin still up in Guangdong. I was hoping to be able to use the Shenzen place but he felt the market turning and got out (he is in development). I still have access to a family condo in Taiwan (vacant half the year) and there seems to be a bit of activity there for expats.

I would like to be able to take rent out of the equation for the first 6 months or so that I am there as well as use family connections for business. This limits me to Tokyo, Taipei and a lesser extent in Shanghai and Guangdong.

I would love to make a go of Tokyo, but there are too many barriers there. I have tried, and while fun I could not make enough money to think about it long term.

There's three separate things that are important here.

1)Lifestyle factors for someone working location independently - cost of living, visas, safety, internet, etc.

2)Entrepreneurial Buzz - presence of western entpreneurs, freelancers, meetups, networking, etc

3)Actual business opportunities in the country - finding suppliers or locals for joint ventures

I think Taiwan is good for the 1st. Not sure about 2nd two; China and Vietnam probably beat it on those fronts. China obviously wins on 3.

I have a couple of mates in TW who are enjoying it though, cost of living is low, it's modernised, safe, and people are polite and friendly.

[Bad Hussar]

(06-18-2013 03:35 AM)artur jedi Wrote:  

HongKong is more about technology, meantime Sz and Gz are surrounded by factories, thus great for sourcing hard product.
Laner, what are you working with?

Some thoughts about Sz, it is technologically still miles away from HK, mainly due to the chinese censorship and pretty unreliable internet. First one is easy to get rid of, thanks to VPN, but the quality of the connection still sucks... In the office I have a pretty strong internet, but it is not uncommon for the skype to drop calls, mail server to crash, sometimes to load a website takes forever and so on. When at home I often can't even stream a movie in lowest quality. I'm sure with the time mainland China will catch up, but some more water has to flow in Pearl River.

Thanks for the on the ground info on Shenzen. Is it an interesting place to live for a few months? Or is it an "industrial wasteland" Also, how expensive is it to rent a small furnished apartment? Easy and fast for daytrips to Hong Kong (as a foreign Westerner with no visa requirement for Hong Kong) or does it take forever?

I'm in a similar situation to Laner. Only a few places want to deal with physical products. Everyone thinks they are going to make millions off the web somehow...

[Laner]

Quote:

HongKong is more about technology, meantime Sz and Gz are surrounded by factories, thus great for sourcing hard product.
Laner, what are you working with?

High end interior design products sourced/designed/manufactured in Canada.

[Brosemite]

(06-18-2013 05:34 AM)youngmobileglobal Wrote:  

(06-18-2013 04:49 AM)RioNomad Wrote:  

I have only spent a few nights in Siagon, but I loved it there. If I wasn't tied down to BKK at the moment, I would probably be there.

Rio what did you like about it?

The motorbike traffic seems annoying and harrowing. People who end up in Saigon seem to love the chaos though.

Any report on the chicks there?

I wouldn't know anything about the chicks...but I've spent some time working HCM. Get ready to take a motorbike or cab taxi everywhere because public transport via bus is in horrible condition. Cheap, but those costs add up for maneuvering around the city. Outside of district 1 being the main area, the place isn't very walkable either.

I'm currently in the Home & Textiles industry (leaving soon for a new career/grad school) where everything seems to be switching from China to Vietnam where work conditions & quality control are much better. However, VN people still have a much harder time grasping everyday deadlines & a true business mentality like their counterparts in say Thailand or China though.

It's been ages since I've been to Hanoi, but I remember that place being much more walkable than HCM. Will answer your PM in a moment later on too YMG.