[RichieP]

**Spoilers within, read at your peril if you havent watched it yet**

Personally I thought it was pretty mediocre. And I was surprised! The reviews were glowing... 94% on Rotten Tomatoes. Why!?!

My thoughts:

-Did not even feel like a Bond film. Felt like one big buildup, with some second-rate Jason Bourne action thrown in. Actually felt like a similar kind of let-down like Dark Knight Rises.
-Some scenes were so cardboard and cliched they were laughable... the whole Macau thing, it wasnt Bond, it was a cliche of Bond. I was thinking "huh, how can this be so cheesy"...
-The computer hacking was predictable and boring. There was no cleverness in general. A couple of times I thought "cool, here it comes..." and then, nope.
-Ralph Fiennes character and hipster Q were almost unnecessary and seemed to exist only to further the plot at 1-2 points, despite devoting chunks of the film to them
-Bardems villain had the beginnings of something interesting but ended up just seeming comical and pathetic. I never once thought "damn this guy is FUCKING COOL/SCARY/GENIUS"
-All the London action scenes seemed like a second-rate Bourne ripoff


And the whole last half an hour in Scotland was atrocious. This is James Bond! He's supposed to have some climactic problem solving / complex action / infiltration/ sabotage/ rescue / save the girl climax of awesomeness... not one boring last stand shootout in a barn in Scotland.

And if you're going to reveal Bonds past, and strip away the mysteriousness around him, at least make it have a payoff - some trial by fire, or touching something deep in his soul that develops the character. Obviously he has trauma and a dark past - but to actually take the audience back to his house, meet the old gamekeeper... why? Just so they can have a boring shootout with the badguys? You're destroying Bond's mysteriousness for nothing.


Casino Royale was AWESOME. Understated. Subtle. Intellectual. Pure Bond Awesomeness - stubborn determination, smooth social engineering, mysteriousness, razor-sharp masterful handling of conflicts. International jet-setting. Subterfuge, levels peeled back to reveal more complexity, deceit and intricacy underneath. An amazing twist. Bond being Bond.

Where was that in Skyfall? what happened?

There were only a couple of moments where I thought "YES, this is Bond". The 10 minutes when he'd returned from his 'death' and was going through the tests at Mi6, failing and getting stubborn, defiant and deliciously British. The other was the pistol shoot & helicopter scene at Silva's hideout where he owned it and pulled off the operation with sick Bond-ness.

Other than that though... man. Such a let down! I read that it's a "transition" movie... from what?! From having Judi Dench as a supporting character?!?! Casino Royale made the transition to the new Bond... this should have been pure awesomeness in the same vein. IMO it fell flat.

If you enjoyed it, what did you like? I obviously was expecting something and got something very different. Help me see why it was good...

[christpuncher]

The sex is getting worse and worse in Bond. There was hardly any sexual tension in Skyfall. And he's even banging some super fucking ugly woman who looks like she's 40 at the beginning of the film.

I long for the ass-slapping, "man talk"ing, lesbian-converting bond of yesteryear....and I'm only 25!

[WanderingSoul]

I've actually never watched a James Bond film. Am I missing out?

[Drazen]

** spoilers below as well***







I really enjoyed the old-school-ness of the final scene. I thought it wasn't as good as people made it out to be. I'm not sure how I feel about Moneypenny. Finnes and Q are pretty solid for the future though.

Yeah, Scotland was terribly boring of a scene to me, I hated that part. They really never gave any reason why Bond was "off" his game, why he would fail the test. I thought those issues resolved itself in Quantum of Solace.

The Shanghai building scene kind of reminded me of The Dark Knight where he goes there as well and a little bit of the assassination attempt in License to Kill.

I liked Bardem's character, but honestly, he wasn't that intimidating as a foe. I mean when Severeine was talking about how he "knows no fear", I expected something more sinister..but it never really materialized.

I did like the line about wasting the perfectly good scotch though.

Hopefully the next bond is more traditional in the sense where he's on a case and its related to Quantum somehow. Something where he is more calm and collected as an international playboy spy. Tuxes, Casinos, high living and women.

[RichieP]

Rio, the good old ones with Sean Connery and a couple with Roger Moore are great - you have to look past some of the dated action and spy cliches (which at the time werent cliches, but actual original spy awesomeness). If you can get past that they tap into some pure awesomeness that every man should see... the James Bond character = epitome of classiness, womanizer, hyper-competent, resourceful, smooth, stealthy, socially elite, international jet-setter.

Beyond the Connery classics I'd say check out Casino Royale. Craig is a great Bond. I also liked Quantum of Solace alot but reviews were mixed on that. I hope he gets another chance with a better script and director.

[RichieP]

(11-12-2012 03:07 PM)PartyonBro Wrote:  

** spoilers below as well***

I liked Bardem's character, but honestly, he wasn't that intimidating as a foe. I mean when Severeine was talking about how he "knows no fear", I expected something more sinister..but it never really materialized.

I did like the line about wasting the perfectly good scotch though.

Totally agree! Silva was set up well... that girl was so fuckin scared of him. And she's like "can you kill him??" with such glimmer of hope. Cool set up. and then.. he's a gay blonde computer hacker with mommy issues? uhhhh...?

Yes the scotch line was awesome. Part of one of the only real Bond scene I thought.

Quote:

Hopefully the next bond is more traditional in the sense where he's on a case and its related to Quantum somehow. Something where he is more calm and collected as an international playboy spy. Tuxes, Casinos, high living and women.

Yeah man. Throw in stealthy complex social manipulation, and super-sharp quick-witted improvised combat action too. Hope DCs got another Bond in him...

[Drazen]

I also really enjoyed Quantum of Solace as well. I don't know why so many people were down on it and its "complex plot". To me it was pretty straightforward. Dominic Greene was a pretty awesome villan for being such a wimpy guy.

In fact, Tosca is playing here in LA next year and I want to catch it now.

[iop890]

(11-12-2012 02:53 PM)christpuncher Wrote:  

The sex is getting worse and worse in Bond. There was hardly any sexual tension in Skyfall. And he's even banging some super fucking ugly woman who looks like she's 40 at the beginning of the film.

I long for the ass-slapping, "man talk"ing, lesbian-converting bond of yesteryear....and I'm only 25!

Found this after reading that comment.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/201...n_now.html

Quote:

But in Casino Royale, after experiencing poisoning and torture, Craig’s bond tells Vesper: "I have no armor left. You've stripped it from me. Whatever is left of me—whatever I am—I'm yours." And in Skyfall, Bond doesn't even have sex with the Bond Woman! Eve (Naomie Harris) can drive a Jeep like a maniac, handle a sniper rifle, and rock a casino in a gold gown. When Bond starts unbuttoning her blouse, she shuts him down—old-fashioned straight razor to his throat, a sharp turn toward a beautiful friendship.

[Wreckingball]

(11-12-2012 02:58 PM)RioNomad Wrote:  

I've actually never watched a James Bond film. Am I missing out?

Check Sean Connery, Timothy Dalton, and Pierce Brosnan movies. they're all quite good with the rare exception

[Drazen]

Brosnan movies were absolutely horrible. He fit the part but they were so poorly written and executed to the point of ridiculousness.

Go watch "Diamonds are Forever". more people need to see the dynamic between Bond and M...there is great underrated moments when he's being briefed in the office and the banter back and forth.

[Rick91]

I actually thought goldeneye was awesome.

[_GQ_]

(11-12-2012 02:58 PM)RioNomad Wrote:  

I've actually never watched a James Bond film. Am I missing out?

Not really IMO, Bond films are overrated for me. Watch Casino Royale though, Daniel Craig is the most alpha Bond in my opinion.

[elabayarde]

It was awesome to me also

[Drazen]

to me, goldeneye was more of an action movie than a bond film.

[tommygun]

I think it's overrated as well too. Basically MSM hyping it up to grab the $. Beginning was decent but then got really slow and cheesy. If you read the production notes. Mendes was influenced a lot by Nolan's batman so the 2/3 of the movie felt like the Dark Knight rehash.

Shanghai = Hong Kong Skyscraper Scene
Bond standing on top overview of City
Henchman getting caught on purpose to escape. Same jail pose sitting down.
etc, etc.

Lowest budgeted film w/ Craig.
Produced during a turmoil with MGM
= Below Average film.

There was some cool nostalgic parts and simplicity to it but overall poor story.
Casino Royale and Quantom seem feasible in today's world.

This story as half assed. No way a NOC-List would be sitting on a harddrive. And 1 mans 20 year odyssey to kill his old boss - mommy's issues? Weak sauce.

Conclusion: Wait for the Bluray release.

[christpuncher]

Just a reminder of what a bond sex scene used to be like. Sigh...

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

I loved Skyfall. I've had many doubts about the Bond franchise being dead and buried after the awful, awful Quantum of Shit ( this explains my opinion too: http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/...of_phallus ) movie, but I was pleasantly surprised. This movie also made me like Daniel Craig, about whom I've been skeptical no matter his solid role in Casino Royale.

- The story is personal and up-close, and in a good way (not pathetic and tear-jerking like the last movie). The style is like a cross between Bond and Hitchcock. No stupid "save the world from nuclear missiles #425252 stolen by generic villain #5336337" plot.
- Action scenes are shot wonderfully, with just the right balance of chaos.
- Awesome music, not just Adele's intro
- Javier Bardem as Silva is incredible and brings life to what would otherwise be quite a boring villain. The "what makes you think I haven't done it before?" scene was great. He's very stylish, yet dangerous and haunting. His way of tossing grenades is great.
- I like the new Q because he's cocky but not annoyingly cocky. I also like them making fun of high-tech gadgets. I particularly love the "new" car.
- There's a Komodo Dragon (can't tell in what context so not to give it away)! How many movies do you see featuring these awesome reptiles? That's right. None. Bravo, Skyfall.

All of this by far compensates for some weaknesses of the movie, such as weak chemistry between Bond and Moneypenny, some unrealistic feats (but those are to be expected in Bond movies), the "stretched plot" concerning Silva's lover, and a few unnecessary interludes by Ralph Fiennes's character.

I'd give it 4.5 out of 5. Certainly one of the best 3 Bond movies ever, IMO.

[Stitch]

It's worth noting that Casino Royale was a reboot in the best sense of the word--it is probably the closest to the source material from Fleming as any of the movies (excepting possibly Dr. No, and updating for the modern age) and it was the first book in the series as well. I recommend the Bond books, by the way; they're a lot less cheesy than the movies.

Quantum of Solace (the movie; the title derives from a completely unrelated short story) tried to branch out from Casino Royale by creating a sort of old-fashioned-Bond-movie master villain network, but it just didn't work so well. I liked Judi Dench as M, but it was a different dynamic than the earlier Bond movies.

With Skyfall as the "50 years of Bond" movie, the producers had a quandary--they wanted to continue the reboot, but also pay homage--thus the old Aston Martin DB5, the recreation of Moneypenny, and the establishment of Fiennes as M (in the books and movies, M is almost a father figure to Bond). So it was a transition movie, and I think it succeeded very well there; I'm curious where they go from here, to be honest. Sure, some of the Macau scenes were a little silly, but some bits were tribute (the "jumping off the komodo dragon" touched on the "running across alligators" scene from an earlier movie, etc)

(having said all that, I find the new Q deplorable, though I see why they went that route. And yes, the "hacking" scenes were absolutely atrocious, and no idiot would hook up a known cybercriminal's laptop to an organization's network. But I still enjoyed it; being in London, I even liked the London scenes quite a bit).

[RichieP]

(11-12-2012 03:57 PM)tommygun Wrote:  

I think it's overrated as well too. Basically MSM hyping it up to grab the $. Beginning was decent but then got really slow and cheesy. If you read the production notes. Mendes was influenced a lot by Nolan's batman so the 2/3 of the movie felt like the Dark Knight rehash.

Shanghai = Hong Kong Skyscraper Scene
Bond standing on top overview of City
Henchman getting caught on purpose to escape. Same jail pose sitting down.
etc, etc.

Lowest budgeted film w/ Craig.
Produced during a turmoil with MGM
= Below Average film.

There was some cool nostalgic parts and simplicity to it but overall poor story.
Casino Royale and Quantom seem feasible in today's world.

This story as half assed. No way a NOC-List would be sitting on a harddrive. And 1 mans 20 year odyssey to kill his old boss - mommy's issues? Weak sauce.

Conclusion: Wait for the Bluray release.

Wow you're right. No wonder it felt like Batman. Knowing that has lowered my opinion of it even further... so he basically copied Dark Knight but actually failed to hit any of the elements that made that so great.

One thing I'd love to know, why the hell are there so many good reviews? are these people even watching the same film?

[Hades]

I saw it in German so I think I only got a rough idea of how the whole thing went, but I sure enjoyed the interplay between the villain and Bond about being gay. Might have been something lost in translation though.

[Nomad77]

I agree completely with the OP. I have no idea what those reviewers are talking about. 3 Stars at the most!

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

That said, I do believe that the current common plot of superhero movies where the main hero is shot, defeated and almost killed before recovering and coming back are inspired by the current recession. There seems to be some sub-conscious psychological influence at work. I'd still say that Bond was a lot more realistic with it than Batman, given that a broken spine shouldn't be that easy to recover from compared to just a bullet wound.

[Roustabout]

Agree with the OP. The movie I saw last night was nowhere near as good as that depicted in the reviews. The opening 10 minutes were good, and I liked the Adele song and the scenes during which this played. But, the plot was poor and predictable. I liked the scenery, Scotland, Macau, Hong Kong, but as far as action, spy movies go, it was vastly inferior to the Bourne movies. Daniel Craig is a great Bond; I think Casino Royale and Quatum of Solace were great, and better than average, respectively. Skyfall is the poorest of the three.

[chyamor]

This was Craig last bond movie probably. Killing of M, Him going back to his childhood house. He is completing the circle when the character goes back to his beginnings.

[rudebwoy]

The OP makes some great points.
Let's be honest, Bond took a beating from Bourne. Alot of the scenes in this movie (Turkey beginning) seem to be a rip-off from that, although I loved the beginning and Bond getting shot was awesome.
I like Ralph Fiennes, I was getting tired of seeing wrinkly Dench.
I liked the interaction with Q, only wish he introduced more gadgets and a real Aston Martin. That old car was great in the 60's but I am not a fan of it now. What is with Bond driving a Merc in Shanghai, just those details annoys me.
Bardem was awesome but needed more build up and time for his character to develop, what about if he escaped for once while killing M. I actually thought he might be part of that "organization" from the last two bonds.
The Scotland bit was weak, I liked the nostalgia but it was a horrible ending.