[ghostdog]

Are they worth the money? I'm hoping to find one that has some foundation in philosophy and evolutionary psychology, no luck so far though...

[plague]

what problem are you trying to solve?

[Bad Hussar]

(10-15-2012 04:43 PM)ghostdog Wrote:  

Are they worth the money? I'm hoping to find one that has some foundation in philosophy and evolutionary psychology, no luck so far though...

Lot's of academics have things to say on evolutionary psychology, but I've never heard of any practicing psychologist actually making it a central part of their practice. That's actually a good market niche to look into.

You probably have read many books on the subject, but i can recomend books by Richard Dawkins for a very broad overview of evolution, not specifically as it relates to human psychology, and Susan Blackmore's "Meme Machine" as one of the better books on memetic theory. For writers who write about Evolutionary Psychology more directly you could look at books by Desmond Morris and a Dutch writer, Frans de Waal, who writes a lot on primate behaviour and how it relates to human behavior.

[ghostdog]

(10-16-2012 12:08 AM)plague Wrote:  

what problem are you trying to solve?

I can't seem to get over the reality of death and think about it too extensively and more often than I'd like to leading to severe depressive periods. I don't know if there is a solution to this except to distract the brain and get it refocused on simple tasks and primal goals so that it forgets about death long enough to make it to the next day.
I don't want to hear any new age/existentialist/seize your destiny kind of crap or be told to just cheer up.
The psychologists goal would be to get me back into competing with all the other dna vehicles hopefully leading to success. Isn't that the simplicity of life?

[ghostdog]

(10-16-2012 10:19 AM)Bad Hussar Wrote:  

(10-15-2012 04:43 PM)ghostdog Wrote:  

Are they worth the money? I'm hoping to find one that has some foundation in philosophy and evolutionary psychology, no luck so far though...

Lot's of academics have things to say on evolutionary psychology, but I've never heard of any practicing psychologist actually making it a central part of their practice. That's actually a good market niche to look into.

You probably have read many books on the subject, but i can recomend books by Richard Dawkins for a very broad overview of evolution, not specifically as it relates to human psychology, and Susan Blackmore's "Meme Machine" as one of the better books on memetic theory. For writers who write about Evolutionary Psychology more directly you could look at books by Desmond Morris and a Dutch writer, Frans de Waal, who writes a lot on primate behaviour and how it relates to human behavior.

I'll look into your recommendations. The big question that perplexes me is if a human is essentially just a machine with a central goal of reproduction, with a brain that feeds it delusions of grandeur, and a very simple window into life, what does that say about the "altered" perceptions of a schizophrenic, or someone on drugs, etc.?

[RichieP]

Alot of psychology/psychotherapy is fairly useless - either circles around talking about your mother for years (psychoanalysis) or puts a band-aid over the gaping wound (CBT), or oftentimes even worse, chemically subdues the problem along with your personality (psychiatry).

BUT. They are all outdated, and have been surpassed by some of the cutting edge stuff.

Some of the new stuff is very good - getting real results with depression, anxiety, trauma, etc. Like, really helping people heal their issue and get to places of lasting well-being.

For emotional issues I would look into:-

Internal Family Systems
Coherence Therapy

The above are the real deal; extensively trained professionals, using the latest effective methods.

I would also AVOID any of the new-age "energy therapies" - EFT, TFT, etc. They do have promise (even though the therapists wrongly think they work via energy meridans or thought-fields or other such crap) - BUT the therapists are unqualified, unreliable and unequipped to deal with some kinds of problems.

Hope that helps.

[RichieP]

(10-16-2012 08:34 PM)ghostdog Wrote:  

(10-16-2012 10:19 AM)Bad Hussar Wrote:  

(10-15-2012 04:43 PM)ghostdog Wrote:  

Are they worth the money? I'm hoping to find one that has some foundation in philosophy and evolutionary psychology, no luck so far though...

Lot's of academics have things to say on evolutionary psychology, but I've never heard of any practicing psychologist actually making it a central part of their practice. That's actually a good market niche to look into.

You probably have read many books on the subject, but i can recomend books by Richard Dawkins for a very broad overview of evolution, not specifically as it relates to human psychology, and Susan Blackmore's "Meme Machine" as one of the better books on memetic theory. For writers who write about Evolutionary Psychology more directly you could look at books by Desmond Morris and a Dutch writer, Frans de Waal, who writes a lot on primate behaviour and how it relates to human behavior.

I'll look into your recommendations. The big question that perplexes me is if a human is essentially just a machine with a central goal of reproduction, with a brain that feeds it delusions of grandeur, and a very simple window into life, what does that say about the "altered" perceptions of a schizophrenic, or someone on drugs, etc.?

I dont think we have a "central goal" as humans, certainly not one that's determined by our biology. People read too much Evo-Psych and start thinking their sole purpose in life is to procreate, lol.

To me. it's like this:

Our biological wiring evolved to give us happiness/fulfilment from survival and replication behaviours.

Now in modern times alot of our survival is taken care of, but we still get happiness/fulfilment from the types of behaviour that would have ensured tribal survival and replication in the past - e.g. building something, hunting, exploring, working in teams, contributing, connecting with new people, sex, etc. Or anything that is the modern equivalent of those things.

Re: Altered states, they are just that, altered states - put certain stuff into a biological machine and it will start doing/feeling unusual things.

Re: Schizophrenics, most studies show that the main factor is abuse or trauma. One can have a predisposition to develop it, but what makes people Schizophrenic is usually abuse or some sort of extreme dysfunctional parenting when they were very young. Their condition is an understandable reaction to conditions in their childhood.

Also if you're depressed, then something has "gone wrong" at some point, and it wasn't your fault - usually abuse or neglect in your past. You can heal this with the cutting edge therapies I mentioned man. It's worth doing!

Also, for depression, there are some quick fixes that help mitigate it. Vigorous exercise 3x a week is an easy one. Here's some more:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Management_of_depression
(I would avoid medication though. Too many horror stories, and studies show it's not better than vigorous exercise anyway.)

[Bad Hussar]

(10-16-2012 08:34 PM)ghostdog Wrote:  

I'll look into your recommendations. The big question that perplexes me is if a human is essentially just a machine with a central goal of reproduction, with a brain that feeds it delusions of grandeur, and a very simple window into life, what does that say about the "altered" perceptions of a schizophrenic, or someone on drugs, etc.?

OK. In that case I'd concentrate on the interplay between the only two real replicators, genes and memes. I think considering both simultaneously will help with the sort of existential depression you are talking about. The way I think about the two is that if life is a building then one's genes are the foundation, and maybe the ground floor, and memes are the rest of the structure. The foundation(genes) is critical, and you cannot build, say, a skyscraper on a foundation designed for a house, but you can build a lot of interesting and different buildings (memes) nonetheless.

Considering what you said above I'd repeat my recommendation of Susan Blackmore's "Meme Machine". She comes across as a little less depressing than Dawkins with his "DNA Machine" metaphors, though give Dawkins the credit for actually coming up with the term "Memes". It's a pity he hasn't really written too much more about this since coining the term in his 1970's book, "The Selfish Gene".

[dirtman]

Talk therapy can be very beneficial. There are many different approaches that a psychologist can take so you might read about them on psychology today or call and ask them whatt heir approach is to find one that 'fits'. For example some may use mindfulness based techniques, and some may be more traditional. It can take more than one attempt to find one that you can have productive sessions with.

The big question for most people is whether or not they're willing to put in the work and face things that bother them. Many just go in and expect the person to tell them what to do. It doesn't really work like that.

[malc]

For me, it was the confidential sounding board aspect of it that helped me realize new things about life or myself. You can tell these people basically anything (outside of a few small legal things), you don't have to impress them, you don't have to keep them as friends, and it's never going to go anywhere else so you can feel free to say whatever the fuck you want or feel. It doesn't matter if it's violent, super beta or just weird. By verbalizing these things out loud, it helps you think about whatever is on your mind in a way you never think about it before and it can make you realize things about them or just let them go. They can also help point things out to you that you didn't realize.

It's like the story about a guy who brought a rubber ducky when he did his problem sets. Whenever he got really stuck on a problem, he would start talking about it to the rubber ducky he brought about it. Often enough just talking out loud about it was able to get him through the problem.

[Mage]

IMHO psychology is useless. All it does is try to make you feel better about your shitty self. That never gives long term benefits because your self remains just as shitty as it was and only creates an addiction for psychotherapy or if you are woman then also for psychotherapist.

The real cure is self improvement of whatever kind. Pick an area or multiple areas and try to improve yourself in them. Hard work helps. That's why hard working people never need psychotherapy only lazy rich soft handed people do. That is also why psychology is more popular among women then among men. A man is almost forced to work and improve himself if he wants to achieve anything in this life and society while women are sheltered form any harm and thus grow easily irritable from too easy a life.

This is why Game is 1000 times superior to common psychology - while both can have common theoretical backgrounds in evolutionary psychology - game teaches you to go out and sharpen your skills in real life for real success, while psychotherapy will make you sit and wallow about your feeeeeelings (the most important and sacred thing in any losers life), will talk and talk about accepting yourself and all those idiot people for who you and they are, and other PC nonsense.

[Mage]

Now if your problem is existencial questions like purpose of life and the question of mortality - then psychology won't help either. They have no answers here and whatever they cannot answer they will deny. This is the field of philosophy and spirituality. I suggest that you try some spiritual practice that could help you feel oneness and integrity with universe and would help you to feel the immortality of consciousness. If you are absolutely new to this field then yoga can help, but I mean yoga that also teaches something not mere body exercise.

But whatever you do do not get stuck in any religion. Do not become a devotee of any Guru/God/religion/politician/philospher or whatever. Remain an independent seeker of truth. All religion and spirituality in the world has only two root sources - the Vedas (root of all eastern religions) and Kaballah (root of Judaism,Christianity and Islam and any western philosophical school). Study the roots with an open mind and you will find answers for the big questions in life.

[RichieP]

Honestly guys. Check out Internal Family Systems. It's new, effective and credible. It just works.
http://www.personal-growth-programs.com/...ms-therapy

[Hades]

I don't know if I posted in this thread yet, but one of the biggest things I have learned about living with a mental illness is that you can't trust your own moods and feelings. You're always second guessing a good mood as possible stages of mania and shitty moods as being some kind of depressive episode. Or however you personally conclude your own mental state. It's not a very good way to live. So if you have to see a psychologist or a therapist or something to make sense of your own internal/mental environment, then by all means go and figure it out. You probably won't rest until you get a confidential second opinion.

In my personal opinion a fixation on death and existentialism when that normally is not the case is not a function of logically trying to solve a problem, it's brought on by trying to internally make sense of a very consistently dark mood. The mood just happens, your logical brain is just going nuts trying to find out why. This may not be completely untrue in your case.

If you used to be or feel different, then the answers to your questions is not in any book or philosophy. You pretty much just have to learn how your mood responds to your internal and external environment and master it. Finding religion would definitely be a negative, because then once you're "back on track" you will be afraid to leave. Distracting yourself from getting healthier mentally and maybe physically by "seeking the truth" is also bullshit. This was one thing I definitely understood when I was more mentally vulnerable.

I just found that when I learned how to better regulate myself by living a better lifestyle that these dark moods mostly went away. That's why I think lifestyle is >> game in a lot of instances.