Quote: (01-24-2016 07:57 PM)The Father Wrote:
Quote: (01-24-2016 07:56 PM)Anabasis to Desta Wrote:
100%.
the more you study, delve into and ACTUALLY understand sciences like Structural Biology, Combinatorics and Algebraic topology you can't help BUT believe in God.
Tell me more about this. I don't understand.
TLDR: The "proof" Anabasis to Desta cites for the existence of God looks false to me. The more I understand science the more I am committed to atheism.
First, I gave The Father's post a like because earlier I almost wished there were a button for "dislike," which I would apply to the statement made by Anabasis to Desta. Next, since this is my first post to this thread let me state for the record that I was "born" agnostic (with atheistic inclinations) and developed into a full-fledged atheist. By "born" I mean that ever since understanding the question I knew I couldn't believe the religious arguments. My reasoning was simple, and perhaps childish, but then again, I was a child at the time: If God created the world/universe, then who created God? Childish or not, none of my religious relatives (some of whom were very learned rabbis) could answer that question to my satisfaction. But because I could not imagine a better explanation, I decided I didn't know, and that, almost by definition, means agnostic. What turned me from agnostic with atheist inclinations to full atheism was Daukins' "The Selfish Gene." And why am I commenting on this particular post at this time? Because Daukins turned me into a fully fledged atheist by showing how science (evolution theory) can explain not just a lot but virtually everything, whereas Anabasis to Desta cited science (specifically three branches of mathematics) as his proof of the opposite. Hence, his "proof" flies in the face of my own experience: the more I know the less doubt I have that there is no God. And finally, even in my agnostic days, I always believed that the institutional Judeo-Christian religions were sold by lies: In other words, I never believed God spoke to Moses or the prophets, and I certainly never believed the Christian mythology, but then again almost nobody did where I grew up.
Almost needless to say, but I will say it anyway: Nobody that I can imagine, and certainly not me personally, understands everything. The point is that evolution theory explains so much that it becomes clear that even what we don't yet understand is potentially explainable, we just don't know how yet. Furthermore, evolution does not explain how the universe was created, and I have yet to see evidence that physicists are getting close to cracking this question, but my childish question cited above precludes settling it by God either.
Finally, I am reading through the thread for the first time, and decided to take the liberty of responding to some messages before finishing, in real time, so pardon me if I repeated some point previously mentioned by somebody else.
Edit: I now reached Post 29, where A to D explained the connection he saw between certain mathematical sciences and God. It boils down to appreciation of some marvels of nature that he cannot believe to be random, hence there must be a God. I don't think anybody here denies that nature is remarkably impressive, but to me that proves nothing. Certainly things like Fibonacci series (and the Golden Ratio they converge to) do not prove a God to me! On the one hand, I wish I was not arguing here with a banned member who can't respond, but on the other hand, I feel that this argument should be questioned. Here is a quote from his post:
Quote:Anabasis to Desta Wrote:
The basis for the scientific origins of the earth is the Big Bang theory. Which essentially was a "random" event. But the more you study science, especially disciplines like Structural biology, Combinatorics and Algebraic Topology ... you realize the world and the universe is anything BUT random.
Because it's pure perfection.
Symmetry. From DNA molecules at the full cycle of the double helix, to tree branches, sea shells, the human body and even hurricanes all follow the Golden Ratio and the Fibonacci series.
Go spend 3 days out in the woods with nothing but a blanket, a knife and water purifier. Nature itself is a miracle that we fail to appreciate .The Human brain and digestive system is magic. I refuse to believe all this is random. There is "purpose and intent" written all over.