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Nelson Mandela, South Africa's first black president, dies aged 95

R.I.P.

R.I.P.

RIP.

Like all great Men who have walked the earth, he was also a Boxer:

And also like all Great Men who have walked the Earth, he was also a smoker:





They don't teach this stuff in school, do they?

To Mandela:

You will always be remembered.

RIP.

there is a new autobiography in theaters about his life, I recommend it. It's very well done, but sort of long( 2 and a half hours). The actor who plays Mandela is the same actor that played Stringer Bell in the Wire.

We've lost a good one. Nelson Mandela was a personal hero of mine. You will be missed.

RIP.

G once again breaks it down with picture proof.

I think the smoking and boxing traits go hand in hand with a man having the balls to take risks and live life like a real mutherfucker.

Let's not derail into the hazards of smoking, because the point is, despite the hazards all the great playboys still do which = more risks = better quality girls + better life experiences.

A giant of a man. Few can lay claim to the impact and lives they have transformed like Mandela. More and more these great men leaves us and their is a void in the next crop (us) whom need to fill those shoes.

RIP and rest in paradise.

Gonna go against the grain here.

While certainly a courageous and brave man, Nelson Mandela was ultimately a useful idiot for the political forces behind Mbeki and Zuma.

Prior to his ascendancy to power, South Africa was the shining light of the African economy- a bastion of stability in a continent of chaos. Far safer than its neighbours, an agricultural powerhouse which was gradually gaining respect as a strong place for international business. The downside of course, being poverty for the native black population.

Today, South Africa is regarded as a basket case. It's no longer a place which attracts talent, conversely, it suffers from a massive brain-drain. Crime is rampant, South Africa now has world-leading rates for murder, assault, rape (adult, child and infant). International business no longer thrives in Jo'burg and CT - elite talent simply does not want to go there.
Native blacks are free, great, but they are still shockingly poor and now even more vulnerable to crime.

Mandela was undoubtedly an admirable bloke, but you can only judge a politician by the benefits they bring their nation
On that metric, he and his ANC have been an abject failure.

Quote: (12-05-2013 06:33 PM)Starke Wrote:  

Gonna go against the grain here.

While certainly a courageous and brave man, Nelson Mandela was ultimately a useful idiot for the political forces behind Mbeki and Zuma.

Prior to his ascendancy to power, South Africa was the shining light of the African economy- a bastion of stability in a continent of chaos. Far safer than its neighbours, an agricultural powerhouse which was gradually gaining respect as a strong place for international business. The downside of course, being poverty for the native black population.

Today, South Africa is regarded as a basket case. It's no longer a place which attracts talent, conversely, it suffers from a massive brain-drain. Crime is rampant, South Africa now has world-leading rates for murder, assault, rape (adult, child and infant). International business no longer thrives in Jo'burg and CT - elite talent simply does not want to go there.
Native blacks are free, great, but they are still shockingly poor and now even more vulnerable to crime.

Mandela was undoubtedly an admirable bloke, but you can only judge a politician by the benefits they bring their nation
On that metric, he and his ANC have been an abject failure.

Going to be a Great White Flight similar to Zimbabwe?

Quote: (12-05-2013 06:33 PM)Starke Wrote:  

Gonna go against the grain here.

While certainly a courageous and brave man, Nelson Mandela was ultimately a useful idiot for the political forces behind Mbeki and Zuma.

Prior to his ascendancy to power, South Africa was the shining light of the African economy- a bastion of stability in a continent of chaos. Far safer than its neighbours, an agricultural powerhouse which was gradually gaining respect as a strong place for international business. The downside of course, being poverty for the native black population.

Today, South Africa is regarded as a basket case. It's no longer a place which attracts talent, conversely, it suffers from a massive brain-drain. Crime is rampant, South Africa now has world-leading rates for murder, assault, rape (adult, child and infant). International business no longer thrives in Jo'burg and CT - elite talent simply does not want to go there.
Native blacks are free, great, but they are still shockingly poor and now even more vulnerable to crime.

Mandela was undoubtedly an admirable bloke, but you can only judge a politician by the benefits they bring their nation
On that metric, he and his ANC have been an abject failure.

South Africa was nothing more then a big hustle in its old days. The old white stock was kept happy with agriculture and some resources but the real wealth was always being (and continues to be) shipped of shore to oligarchs in the Netherlands and the UK.

Mandela was able to bargain power, political capital power but he couldn't get the 'keys to the purse' and the old stock was not going to give up the wealth unless it was taken from them. Your faced now with a situation to push ahead a violet revolution, and maybe get nothing, or gamble that you can use political means to get access to the wealth and resources through strategy and time. From a rational play he took the best option as it ensured him gains and power politically.

The money/wealth was never going to be given back without force and blood. This is a important lesson. and I used it many times during the loony OWS movement. These rich guys, they are scared of you only when you go at them with a club, gun, or knife. They are scared shirtless of the common man with a gun but will never give the common man shit unless he takes it from them.

The mess is that you have now is stock of petty Black South Africans whom act as gate keepers to the top end of the old stock of SA whites whom continue to send the countries wealth off-shore. What is left is a rich and wealthy stock of Black SA, but there is nothing else as a means of opportunities and ability for economic advancement for the rest of the SA Black lower class.

Its nothing more then wealth stealing. The economy is still not in the hands of the Black SA population and its obvious to see. It has 4 times the size of GDP of Serbia yet is just as poor (GDP x PPP) wise. It has more money per capita then Ukraine but you don't hear people wallowing about that place even though its was worse shape.

The White SA stock don't like the instability and ship their kids of to Canada the first chance they can. Black SA stock see better opportunities else where and go to Europe to be doctors and start business up. Brain drain is one issue for sure but its a lot more complex then you paint it to be. The main issues stem from the inability for South Africa to control its wealth, the rest of its issues stem from that starting point.

Quote: (12-05-2013 06:49 PM)Kingsley Davis Wrote:  

Quote: (12-05-2013 06:33 PM)Starke Wrote:  

Gonna go against the grain here.

While certainly a courageous and brave man, Nelson Mandela was ultimately a useful idiot for the political forces behind Mbeki and Zuma.

Prior to his ascendancy to power, South Africa was the shining light of the African economy- a bastion of stability in a continent of chaos. Far safer than its neighbours, an agricultural powerhouse which was gradually gaining respect as a strong place for international business. The downside of course, being poverty for the native black population.

Today, South Africa is regarded as a basket case. It's no longer a place which attracts talent, conversely, it suffers from a massive brain-drain. Crime is rampant, South Africa now has world-leading rates for murder, assault, rape (adult, child and infant). International business no longer thrives in Jo'burg and CT - elite talent simply does not want to go there.
Native blacks are free, great, but they are still shockingly poor and now even more vulnerable to crime.

Mandela was undoubtedly an admirable bloke, but you can only judge a politician by the benefits they bring their nation
On that metric, he and his ANC have been an abject failure.

Going to be a Great White Flight similar to Zimbabwe?

SA's white flight has been even larger than what went down in Mugabe's Zimbabwe.
1 million whites have fled SA since black-rule - off to places like Aus & NZ.

Essentially, the white upper and middle-class have disappeared.
The remainder are those who cannot afford the move to a Western country and hardcore lefties who see their current hardship as deserved punishment.

The white South African emigres I've met all tend to have a look in their eyes of survivors from a zombie movie, even 2 decades later.

Quote: (12-05-2013 07:01 PM)Starke Wrote:  

Quote: (12-05-2013 06:49 PM)Kingsley Davis Wrote:  

Quote: (12-05-2013 06:33 PM)Starke Wrote:  

Gonna go against the grain here.

While certainly a courageous and brave man, Nelson Mandela was ultimately a useful idiot for the political forces behind Mbeki and Zuma.

Prior to his ascendancy to power, South Africa was the shining light of the African economy- a bastion of stability in a continent of chaos. Far safer than its neighbours, an agricultural powerhouse which was gradually gaining respect as a strong place for international business. The downside of course, being poverty for the native black population.

Today, South Africa is regarded as a basket case. It's no longer a place which attracts talent, conversely, it suffers from a massive brain-drain. Crime is rampant, South Africa now has world-leading rates for murder, assault, rape (adult, child and infant). International business no longer thrives in Jo'burg and CT - elite talent simply does not want to go there.
Native blacks are free, great, but they are still shockingly poor and now even more vulnerable to crime.

Mandela was undoubtedly an admirable bloke, but you can only judge a politician by the benefits they bring their nation
On that metric, he and his ANC have been an abject failure.

Going to be a Great White Flight similar to Zimbabwe?

SA's white flight has been even larger than what went down in Mugabe's Zimbabwe.
1 million whites have fled SA since black-rule - off to places like Aus & NZ.

Essentially, the white upper and middle-class have disappeared.
The remainder are those who cannot afford the move to a Western country and hardcore lefties who see their current hardship as deserved punishment.

The white South African emigres I've met all tend to have a look in their eyes of survivors from a zombie movie, even 2 decades later.

Like I said those wealthy white SA agriculture and Admin people never had the real wealth either.

Debeers has been off-shore for 100 years+ and steals 98% of South Africa's diamond wealth.


Those wealthy SA folks you met (and I know also) weren't fuking with De-Beers type money. I am talking Billions and Trillions being stolen at wholesale levels.

Quote: (12-05-2013 06:33 PM)Starke Wrote:  

Gonna go against the grain here.

While certainly a courageous and brave man, Nelson Mandela was ultimately a useful idiot for the political forces behind Mbeki and Zuma.

Prior to his ascendancy to power, South Africa was the shining light of the African economy- a bastion of stability in a continent of chaos. Far safer than its neighbours, an agricultural powerhouse which was gradually gaining respect as a strong place for international business. The downside of course, being poverty for the native black population.

Today, South Africa is regarded as a basket case. It's no longer a place which attracts talent, conversely, it suffers from a massive brain-drain. Crime is rampant, South Africa now has world-leading rates for murder, assault, rape (adult, child and infant). International business no longer thrives in Jo'burg and CT - elite talent simply does not want to go there.
Native blacks are free, great, but they are still shockingly poor and now even more vulnerable to crime.

Mandela was undoubtedly an admirable bloke, but you can only judge a politician by the benefits they bring their nation
On that metric, he and his ANC have been an abject failure.

I am curious. Why blame the people fighting for their freedom and not the people keeping them down to preserve their own wealth and power?

Quote: (12-05-2013 07:48 PM)j r Wrote:  

I am curious. Why blame the people fighting for their freedom and not the people keeping them down to preserve their own wealth and power?

The most prominent members of the group 'fighting for their freedom' have merely used the figurative decapitation of white South Africa as a means of lining their own pockets.

The families of Zuma and his cohorts are now worth hundreds of billions of dollars.
For Africa, this kind of tribal nepotism isn't a surprise but until the 1990s, South Africa had somehow escaped it. That's not the case anymore.

South Africa is a glimpse into the future of many Western nations. It's irrelevant whether the people at the top doing the stealing are white or black. They could be purple and it wouldn't make a difference to the underlying problems. The point is that the middle class has been completely destroyed and/or fled, which only exacerbates the social, political and economic problems in a country. If you lose the middle class, you lose the country.

There are tons and tons of South Africans working as illegal kindergarten teachers in Taiwan for bad wages, under bad conditions. Many (but not all) live in what are essentially self-imposed ethnic ghettos and only interact with the locals under duress. They are some of the most miserable, bitter and confused people I have ever met and clearly neither belong here nor want to be here. Yet even being a disaffected, exploited diaspora with little to no chance or desire to integrate into the host culture is preferable to them than remaining in their home country.

What does that tell you about where they are from and how Mandela's legacy is working out?

R.I.P.

Quote: (12-05-2013 07:34 PM)kosko Wrote:  

Debeers has been off-shore for 100 years+ and steals 98% of South Africa's diamond wealth.

Those wealthy SA folks you met (and I know also) weren't fuking with De-Beers type money. I am talking Billions and Trillions being stolen at wholesale levels.

How many nations on Earth have anything close to resembling equitable distribution of national resource income?
Maybe Norway, but not many more.

DeBeers isn't 'stealing' anything, it merely operates as a monopoly within a legal framework. This was so under Apartheid SA, it remains so today.

A diamond monopoly didn't cause the drastic spike in violent crime, the destruction of the business climate or the flight of 1 million of the most highly-educated citizens.

Firstly, RIP the man, the legend, Mandela.

Secondly, dated a smoking hot blonde Sth African 19yo chick a few weeks back. I knew it would get interesting.

Asked 'why did you leave Sth Africa?'. She said her mum ran over and killed a black carjacker with her in the seat at 11yo, their house in a gated compound with security guards was burgled x 4, when she was 16yo some carjackers put a gun in her best friend's mouth and stole their car. Then 2 of their 4 rottweillers were killed when poisoned meat was thrown into their compound.

Spent 3 years growing up in Germany before moving to London to study.

Sth African chicks... they make you harden the fuck up.

Not saying I can't understand why poor impoverished blacks would carjack whites but can also understand why whites would get out of the country ASAP.

I'm more upset about Paul Walkers death. His movies had hot chicks.