It looks like some Ukrainians are getting more and more pissed off with sex tourism and with Turk sex tourists in particular. I don't know why they didn't hide their faces though; was this a publicity stunt?

Story in a Turk newspaper (with comments by Turk readers) http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/anti-se...sCatID=351

Video of incident: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4fc_1354238278

Quote: (12-01-2012 06:47 AM)Zak Wrote:  

It looks like some Ukrainians are getting more and more pissed off with sex tourism and with Turk sex tourists in particular. I don't know why they didn't hide their faces though; was this a publicity stunt?

Story in a Turk newspaper (with comments by Turk readers) http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/anti-se...sCatID=351

Video of incident: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4fc_1354238278

Holy shit, that vid was crazy!

Like something out of a Tarantino flick.

The words "Welcome to Ukraine" will take on a whole new meaning after watching that vid.

Crazy local loons!

These liberal countries that need tourist dollars are getting fed up with the sex tourists it looks like. Now these sex starved tourists will have to put pressure on their own governments to loosen these segregation of sexes laws. As for those tourists from the west, they should stop letting women boss them around and act more macho.

damn sex tourists! no game

"Welcome to Ukraine"..

Too bad it's staged.

Nonetheless, I don't blame the local guys. Sex tourists ruin it for everyone.

Staged alright but the video does highlight the problem of sex tourism in Ukraine in particularly Kiev. The negative attitude there by the locals towards Turks in particular is unreal and IMHO justified. I have seen them in action and quite frankly they walk around like they own the place and harassing women. These guys have no game whatsoever.

Quote: (12-01-2012 08:34 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

"Welcome to Ukraine"..

Too bad it's staged.

Nonetheless, I don't blame the local guys. Sex tourists ruin it for everyone.

I agree, looks staged. And even if it's not, listening to the guy in the car afterwards (I speak Russian) he basically says he doesn't want prostitution in Ukraine, doesn't want Ukraine known as a place for guys to come and fuck, and the solution is to create fear so people won't know if instead of a prostitute a couple of Ukrainian dudes might show up.

What the guy is forgetting is that prostitution is run by Ukrainian guys, and for every guy like him, there is another guy, smarter and more deadly, who is already running a prostitution ring as part of organized crime, and he will do whatever it takes to keep that profitable, which usually includes maintaining a good reputation with clients.

For every horrible sex tourist there is a woman accepting money in a voluntary transaction. Why don't these videos or FEMEN shame the women for accepting money?

Because women aren't to blame. They never are. They are being taken advantage of, sleeping with dirty Turks for money so they can have their iPhone needs met.

Quote: (12-01-2012 09:29 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

Because women aren't to blame. They never are. They are being taken advantage of, sleeping with dirty Turks for money so they can have their iPhone needs met.

I agree with you Roosh, at least with women who meet with foreigners on their own accord (which is what this site is all about). But my point was that even to the extent that there are women sleeping with foreigners against their will, there is always a group of Ukrainian men behind it. Many Ukrainian men would gladly sell off their women for a quick buck. It's a dog-eat-dog world.

Here's the same video with English subtitles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pla...zmVJmZgw#!

It looks staged btw.

Quote: (12-01-2012 09:29 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

For every horrible sex tourist there is a woman accepting money in a voluntary transaction. Why don't these videos or FEMEN shame the women for accepting money?

Because women aren't to blame. They never are. They are being taken advantage of, sleeping with dirty Turks for money so they can have their iPhone needs met.

Caveat-- I didn't watch it, I catch that it looks fake to some. If staged to keep foreigners away, the motivation appears the same as real hate violence.

I believe you're thinking logically and therefore missing the point. It is much more visceral and animalistic-- the fact hookers were freely doing it doesn't matter to gopniks. They just feel a crude tribal fear and want someone to hate.

"Foreigners" probably in every culture since human life started, have been the scapegoat that unites the tribe.

You're thinking from a free market perspective and an individual freedom perspective. Since you grew up in USA, your ingrained, trained suspicion and distrust of other-culture people is less than somewhere where foreigners are less common. Immigration, at least legal immigration, is somewhat respected, or at least tolerated in USA.

Gopniks have few outlets, they can't confront the oligarchs that own them. They can't improve their economic circumstances because the opportunities are very low.

Who ya gonna blame? Turks, Russians, Jews... anyone handy.
It helps if they look different.

I just hope the backlash doesn't snowball or focus on my national group.

Quote: (12-01-2012 10:17 PM)dirtypurist Wrote:  

It looks staged btw.

Agreed.

Funny that the men who tied that guy up didn't find it necessary to conceal their own faces, yet found it necessary to conceal the face of the "victim".

As said before, doesn't look too believable.

I have conflicting reactions to this. One the one hand, living in Russia and experiencing the in your face racism (in no other country have I ever stayed home on certain days to avoid skinheads) and cockblocking men, I have sympathy for this turkish dude and dislike for the men - if they actually tried to improve their country's economy (ukraine has massive corruption and education system is mediocre at best) then maybe the women would have other outlets to earn cash. I've been to Ukraine, got face controlled at clubs and had little luck when I went out there. Moscow hasn't been much better.

Otoh, Turkish guys are known all over the world for being horndogs. When I went there with a female friend she was being harassed and propositioned constantly. Turkish guys have swarmed and ruined all the good Latino clubs in Moscow. And even when I was in Tbilisi Georgia last week I heard complaints about Turkish men being overly aggressive to the local women. Combined with the fact that turkey is becoming increasingly Islamist dominated and secularism is on the downslide, I have little love for the country. And get a German person nice and tipsy and ask them about what they think about Turkish immigrants in Germany....
And when I was in turkey, good luck talking with the Turkish women! Very conservative culture with lots of cockblocking.

Being pegged as a Turkish sex tourist has made it very difficult to pickup chicks in Moscow (the clubs here are so loud that I don't have an opportunity to demonstrate my American English)

So yeah tough call but I'm happy this is getting attention - both the racism and bone headedness of Russians/Ukrainians as well as the sexual aggression of Turkish guys. Perhaps by solving the latter problem will help solve the former?

FAKE

ao85 -"Turkish guys have swarmed and ruined all the good Latino clubs in Moscow".

Interesting observation. I have noticed a similar thing here in London where many Salsa places have been largely ruined by large numbers of Turk, Arab, Pakistani (Muslim) men who often arrive in groups and who have little or no interest in Salsa music or dance other than to use it as a way to go after local women and Eastern European women (who make up the majority of the females who go). I have never once seen one of them arrive with a Turkish, Arab, Pakistani etc woman; not once ever. I have no doubt that they would have a fit if there was a single Muslim girl there dancing with non Muslim guys. Hypocrisy and double standards abound with them as always. They can be incredibly sleazy and Salsa's already borderline reputation for having some predatory men has no doubt got that bit worse with their presence.

Many of them actually pretend to be from Latin America and I know of one Iranian who calls himself "Antonio" or some other assumed "Latino" name to try and teach impressionable women.

They are probably the single biggest problem that Latin dance clubs in London have and they have ruined everywhere they go permanently.

I am no fan of men that have an art for turning off women, but the term sex tourist confuses things. I was in Ukraine May and June, and the negative steriotypes that a American / European Caucasian must overcome are significant. The women are hot! I found women responsive in a very tentative way. Nothing easy, or automatic - no way.

Just for sex, Ukraine ought to be far down on the list.

Zak - so you know exactly what I'm talking about. The difference is that London is at least a tolerant city where brown dudes get play from white women hitting on them in the clubs, on the street, or whatever other venue.

In Moscow even as an American (but because I'm not white) it's very difficult to get past face control and the icy attitude at normal clubs so those have been duds.
Latino clubs are the only nightlife scene in Moscow where my race isn't held against me. And then it's ruined by all these over aggressive Turkish guys wh swarm and harass, creating sausage fests and creating a negative vibe. That's why whenever I go to those I always make sure to speak in as much Spanish as possible (lived in Mexico before) to differentiate myself.

But yeah these Ukranian dudes aren't completely coming out of left field.

Roosh is right it does take two to tango. But Turkish guys have ruined eastern Europe for me, so it is what it is.

ao85 - that's a pity mate. The only way to solve it is for strict door control at Latin clubs screening these types out. However, in reality, political correctness rules and it won't happen.

Another good point about how they have turned most clubs and classes in to sausage fests; nearly all classes in London I have gone to have a serious imbalance of men to women. I have witnessed one class with two women and seven men and saw another where men would routinely have to practice dancing with other men whilst they waited for a woman to become free! These fuckers have destroyed some places, but no matter how bad they fuck it up, more of them just keep coming to sleaze over what women there are.

That's why clubs have an expiration date. No club is "cool" forever.
You have to constantly be in the loop on what's hot and where to go.

Quote: (12-03-2012 09:09 AM)ao85 Wrote:  

Zak - so you know exactly what I'm talking about. The difference is that London is at least a tolerant city where brown dudes get play from white women hitting on them in the clubs, on the street, or whatever other venue.

In Moscow even as an American (but because I'm not white) it's very difficult to get past face control and the icy attitude at normal clubs so those have been duds.
Latino clubs are the only nightlife scene in Moscow where my race isn't held against me. And then it's ruined by all these over aggressive Turkish guys wh swarm and harass, creating sausage fests and creating a negative vibe. That's why whenever I go to those I always make sure to speak in as much Spanish as possible (lived in Mexico before) to differentiate myself.

But yeah these Ukranian dudes aren't completely coming out of left field.

Roosh is right it does take two to tango. But Turkish guys have ruined eastern Europe for me, so it is what it is.

I have seen it here in Dublin too but the women here give them a wide berth as these guys sleaze all over them and have absolutely no game. I dont know if they have been smashing the local and EE women over in London but the salsa clubs here have been ruined. They chase the women away. pricks.

This is why it's all about house parties and invitation only nights. A commercial club has to have a ruthless and very "politically incorrect" door policy if they hope to survive medium term. Otherwise patrons, men and women, will vote with their feet and just not pitch up. Who want's to go to the type of club described above.

As for Turkish men, like with any generic X - men, if they can't game Turkish women they're not going to be any good gaming any other women either. And don't give me the "Muslim women are so conservative and won't give them any play" rubbish. Turkey isn't Saudi Arabia, and in any event Muslim chicks are really not much more conservative than any other chicks when living in "the West". Not that it constitutes a study, but I've met more than one or two Muslim girls who could be classed as class A sluts.

Quote:Quote:

As for Turkish men, like with any generic X - men, if they can't game Turkish women they're not going to be any good gaming any other women either. And don't give me the "Muslim women are so conservative and won't give them any play" rubbish. Turkey isn't Saudi Arabia, and in any event Muslim chicks are really not much more conservative than any other chicks when living in "the West". Not that it constitutes a study, but I've met more than one or two Muslim girls who could be classed as class A sluts.

I can't judge them, while we do practically the same. We prefer to have sex with women outside our country, for whatever reason.
The Russia trip guys should take notice, the Turkish don't need visa for Russia. Many 2nd tier cities they pick might have been overrun by them already.

The Russia trip guys should take notice, the Turkish don't need visa for Russia. Many 2nd tier cities they pick might have been overrun by them already.
[/quote]

Can you imagine if with rising incomes and easier visa regimes what they would do to the forum sacred cows of Colombia and Brazil if large numbers of them started to arrive there? It doesn't bear thinking about.