Quote: (04-22-2016 04:49 AM)evilhei Wrote:  

Quote: (04-22-2016 04:16 AM)The Black Knight Wrote:  

Just looked at a 2016 Kia Forte LX for 36 months at a local dealership:

Monthly: $139/month
Down payment: $699
Lease Acquisition Fee: $595

How can this be so cheap? I think Kia Forte must be in Europe Kia Ceed. This car in Europe is 16000 EUR. it seems that in US the same car is 699 + 139 x 36 + 595 = 6298 ? Or i'm missing something and the car lease works differently in US?

Miles are limited to something like 12,000 miles per year limit and of course with a lease you have to give it back after 36 months or however long the lease agreement is.

...or get a van.

Been making some cash doing courier gigs, or lugging stuff around the country. Pays for itself really. Stick a mattress in the rear, and logistics won't matter!

I have some experience buying used cars, but damn, where you live must be real expensive.

I bought a '14 caravan sxt with 36k miles for a little over 10 grand over here in the south. It was in a fender bender, so I spent another 2 grand making sure nothing was wrong and replacing the front bumper among other things.

One thing though, unless you are okay with having a car that may have some airbag problems ( it is, so I need to take it to the dealer soon) then always buy a car that was not in any accident what so ever.

If you are okay with older cars and you know some mechanics you can get a real good deal on some cars. I got a nice sweet white '01 camry v6 with 140k miles that had some damage for 1500, but I sold it after 2 years because no air bags was not worth it, haha.

Quote: (04-23-2016 06:42 PM)Soundbyte Wrote:  

I have some experience buying used cars, but damn, where you live must be real expensive.

I bought a '14 caravan sxt with 36k miles for a little over 10 grand over here in the south. It was in a fender bender, so I spent another 2 grand making sure nothing was wrong and replacing the front bumper among other things.

One thing though, unless you are okay with having a car that may have some airbag problems ( it is, so I need to take it to the dealer soon) then always buy a car that was not in any accident what so ever.

If you are okay with older cars and you know some mechanics you can get a real good deal on some cars. I got a nice sweet white '01 camry v6 with 140k miles that had some damage for 1500, but I sold it after 2 years because no air bags was not worth it, haha.

I feel you man, my DD is part of that fucking takata recall and I drive around 800-1100 miles a week. Every time I get on the highway or see a nasty accident I think "fuck man, you should really go to the dealership and have them fix the airbags" but always procrastinate and put it off. Maybe I'll go tomorrow.

Find a used Avalon, Corolla or (maybe)Civic. Ive had Toyotas the last ten years and swear by them. My DD Avalon has had nothing but gas and consumables for 7 years, is about 2 months away from 300k miles, and still gets 29 mpg.

If you're serious about buying the car, make sure the seller lets you take it to a mechanic to put up on the lift for a safety or pre-purchase inspection. Pay the man for about an hour of his time and you will know things the test drive and on-ground inspection can't tell you: wheel bearing/ball joint wear, brake pad life left, engine and transmission oil leaks, condition of exhaust, computer codes in the ECM history, etc.

When you first meet them for a test drive, make sure it's early in the morning and the car hasn't been driven (put your hand on the engine to make sure it's cold). Ask them to start it while you look at the exhaust. If it's pulling oil in to the combustion chamber thru worn intake valve guides, you'll see some smoke. A good indicator of poor oil change history. Also might show worn rings. In some cars this symptom goes away if the car has been warmed up.

I don't know what California used car prices are like, but here in the UK used cars are cheap cheap cheap! I just picked up a nicely specced 1995 BMW 320i for £475 ( a bit under $700). It's got a few little issues but generally runs good. Anyways here are my tips.

1. I don't subscribe to the idea that low mileage cars are necessarily better. Modern cars use a lot of pladtics in vital components like radiators and water pumps. Plastics degrade over time and on a low mileage car are less likely to have been replaced. Same goes for stuff like cambelts, shocks/struts, mufflers etc. In any event, modern fuel injected vehicles, if properly maintained run up huge mileages trouble-free. The two lowest mileage cars I've bought turned out to have the most issues simply due to age-related deterioration.

2. When viewing cars ask if the owner has the service history. If he has a folder full of receipts then you have evidence that the car has been maintained and you can check and make sure that vital maintenance has been performed.

3. A good tip when looking over cars is to check the tires. If they're mismatched bargain-basement brands then it's a good indicator that the owner has spent the bare minimum on maintaining the car. A matched set of Michelins or Goodyears tell a very different story.

4. Before you go and look at a car sniff around some internet forums dedicated to that make/model and try to find out what its common faults are and whether they are expensive or easy fixes.

5. Unlike some, I wouldn't hesitate to look at European cars, especially older ones. Base model W201 or W124 Mercedes from about 1985-1992 aren't very sexy, are built like tanks and mechanically very simple.

I agree, UK used cars are peanuts at the moment. Scrap price is back on the up though (just took a load in at £65/ton) so car prices will also rise slightly. For my UK brothers, a great tip is to run the reg number through

https://www.gov.uk/check-mot-history

This gives you a great insight into how it's been treated in the past. I use this when someone is offering a car very cheap but says 'just needs X to get through MOT'. 90% of the time they're barefaced liars, and 10% of the time I make a few quid.

I've owned for my own use the equivalent of a car every six months throughout my driving career. Used to be very hard on them My one tip would be that generally speaking you get a good one or you get a pup. If it's a pup then move it on, don't keep patching it up.

Well said Slickyboy. A couple things I'll add...

>Japanese motors are the key. Subaru is good, but they carry a luxury premium. You can count Subaru out if you are trying to be frugal.

>Don't forget about Nissan. I have owned 2 Nissan Sentras. They get nearly 35 miles to the gallon. They last forever. I spent around 3K on each of them. Purchased with 125k-150k miles on them.

>Assume all cars are going to drop dead at 200k miles. They may very well go beyond that; I have known of plenty of vehicles that went further. However, as a rule, I will not make a purchase if I cannot get a decent return on investment before hitting the 200k mile mark.

>Japanese motors are the best, and 4 banger Japanese motors are the best of the best. (For the geeks, 4 banger refers to a 4 cylinder motor)

>Don't buy from a used car lot! I hope you are a very confident alpha male. Nevertheless, stay away from the used lots. These guys have ZERO honor and ZERO integrity. There may be some exceptions out there, but you aren't going to know the good guys from the bad guys. Just don't do it. Private owners are the way to go.

>An inspection from a professional is a brilliant idea. Ask the seller if you can take the car to a local mechanic. Pre-purchase inspections are a thing. They are usually around $50-$75. Make this the last step before you buy. Better to drop 75 bucks on an inspection than get ripped of for thousands of dollars.

>Its a good idea to take a few friends with you. More eyes means you are more likely to pickup on some discrete body damage that might indicate a previous wreck. Or, for example, you'd be more apt to learn that the rear passenger side door power window button isn't working.

Quote: (04-21-2016 11:13 AM)Tim in real life Wrote:  

As of this writing, I have been earning US$2K for a used car.

Since I am new to this, the only tool I have at my disposal is CarFax.

What procedures beside smog testing I need to pass?

I appreciate the help I can get.

Thanks.

The best advice that I never received growing up-Look hard at the person selling. Ask yourself if the transmission had just gone to shit would this person fix it or sell it to the next chump(you). Usually the best people to buy from are well off older men, followed by well off older women, followed by women, followed by young men, followed by immigrants. Older men have the knowledge money and ability to fix shit. Older women are gentle on cars and have the money, but may not have the knowledge. Younger women don't know shit dont have money but usually drive slower. Young men dont have money, have few or no morals, and will drive any car into the ground. Immigrants usually come from places where everyone fucks everyone else all day every day. Often it can be worth it to look in out of way places say on craigslist where even if there is a discount on a car, it likely wont get sold because the population is too small. Also advertising that you are looking or knocking on doors when you see a car you like can put you in the driver seat(he has no other offers to leverage you with). Its generally better to buy a car that is newer and japanese if you cant do repairs yourself because you can spend the value of the car in repairs quickly. The transmission is usually one of the first things to go, so if the person has done a tranny replacement that can be a big savings. Learn to do things like oil and brake changes yourself, they couldnt be simpler. Good luck, and don't be hard on yourself if things dont work out perfectly.

Also since this is your first outing, you might look at is as more of a project. Try to look at say 20 cars(if for no other reason just to get a sense of the things that go on in a negotiation, sale). Also I like to try to talk them down in price before i go to look at something. I managed to beat one white male down on price for my dad, and he literally had the next buyer there offer to buy the truck for $1000 more. The old guy honored his price even though he had someone else there now willing to pay more. This is why you want to buy from them, they can afford to do the right thing. There is a reason 4/5 cars don't sell on ebay-4/5 people are lying about them.

It's not about the mileage, it's all about the condition. I've learned over the years not to care about that number on the odometer. Rather I go over every aspect of the car, check it thoroughly and asses the overall state. Ask the owner to drive you around the block couple of times, he's driving style will indicate how the car was used. If you can get a friend who knows the type of car you're interested in to help you judge it. Never spend your entire budget just to buy the car, leave 1/5 of the money you have for initial service and repairs. Change the cam belt, fluids and filters IMMEDIATELY after purchase even if the guy claims he changed them last month and shows you the receipt. You have no way to properly determine the age of these things so just assume he's lying and they're shot, it will save you a major headache later on and guarantee some degree of reliability. And one other thing, tires are THE MOST IMPORTANT thing in any vehicle. Your car will do only as much as the tires will allow so you really should get a quality set of rubber even if it means quitting beer for some time.

^^

Piggybacking on the mileage/condition (and OP's thread).. I'm finding that there tend to be some type of vehicles that are more mechanically maintained than others.

Ones that are owned by people/families with children.

I've got three kids myself. The last thing I wanted was to be stranded somewhere with the kids in tow.

I had a minivan accident a couple months ago, the insurance company totalled the van out. I'm currently driving a coupe, and it's not easy with three kids. So I'm in the market for a multi-passenger (6+) vehicle.

I've been browsing the web, CL and the trader books. Whenever I see an SUV for sale, it's either priced ridiculously high, has upwards of 200,000 miles, is a rebuilt/salvage title, "needs a little work to be roadworthy" (i.e. some $1500 part), or some combination of the above.

When I search minivans, while some of them may have high mileage, they're usually in good/great mechanical shape, well taken care of, but the inside may just need a good cleaning.

The inside of my minivan wasn't the cleanest, but it ran solid until the accident.

Quote: (05-14-2016 11:40 AM)George is King Wrote:  

I've been browsing the web, CL and the trader books. Whenever I see an SUV for sale, it's either priced ridiculously high, has upwards of 200,000 miles, is a rebuilt/salvage title, "needs a little work to be roadworthy" (i.e. some $1500 part), or some combination of the above.

20__ Random Whatevermobile LS - GOOD PAINT, LOOKS GOOD, RIDES FINE, RUNS STRONG TRANSMISSION SLIPS, ASKING $ABOVE BLUE BOOK FIRM!!!! NO LOW BALLERS!! WILL TRADE FOR SOMETHING WORTH UNDENIABLY MORE PLUS CASH!

-85% of Craigslist

My favorite are Northstar Cadillacs with 'NEEDS A WATER PUMP.' Right...

Quote: (04-28-2016 12:41 PM)god Wrote:  

>Don't buy from a used car lot! I hope you are a very confident alpha male. Nevertheless, stay away from the used lots. These guys have ZERO honor and ZERO integrity. There may be some exceptions out there, but you aren't going to know the good guys from the bad guys. Just don't do it. Private owners are the way to go.

Hey now... I will say a sad majority of us are scummy depending on the area, that is no lie

Lot of good advice in this thread. Buying a new car never made sense to me financially. Having a car payment on something that depreciates so quickly? One of the most foolish things financially to do.

Stick to private owners, I've never liked car dealers. Cars in posher areas tend to be better taken care of.

Y'all need to check out this website, it shows the latest leasing deals.

http://leasehackr.com/

A loaded Denali Sierra for 353 or 358 for an F150 SuperCrew

Shit, you can event get a pony for 277 with the EcoBoost engine or spend 306 on a Challenger R/T

You could get an accord, Camry, Fusion, Altima for around 250ish.

Quote: (05-15-2016 11:01 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

Lot of good advice in this thread. Buying a new car never made sense to me financially. Having a car payment on something that depreciates so quickly? One of the most foolish things financially to do.

Stick to private owners, I've never liked car dealers. Cars in posher areas tend to be better taken care of.

Buying new makes sense only in very special cases. Some blogger I was reading summed it up brilliantly: "Why lose your money on depreciation in first 4 years, let some poor idiot take the plunge for you." XD

Dealers I avoid like the plague, in Poland dealer lots are full of polished wrecks, only fools who know nothing about cars buy there.

European Automotive Technician and Independent Auto Dealer here.

I have a dealers license now but for at least ten years I bought strictly from the general public (mostly Craigslist) and auctions open to the GP: Charity, Police, Surplus Auctions. Some good advice, some I agree, with some I dont.

My main disagreement is advising Japanese and American vehicles over German or Swedish vehicles. There are good and bad vehicles from every manufacturer. The truth is German cars offer some of the nicest vehicles ever designed. Once you have owned a nice BMW, Mercedes, or Audi (not talking about A4's, 3 series or C-Class) you will never drive another Japanese or US vehicle ever again. Maintenance can be expensive if you have dont do your own work but it is largely a myth that European car parts are more expensive than others. I get my parts from the local junkyard and all parts there are priced the same regardless of manufacturer. If you pay an independent shop for parts and labor or, God forbid you take you car to the dealership, you probably will pay more for maintenance in dollars per mile. However if you want class, styling, performance, and interior luxury you cant do better than MB, BMW, Audi, Volvo or Saab.

One poster mentioned your $2K price point as a very problematic price point and he is right. Most used cars for sale at that price have an equal amount ($2K) of needed deferred maintenance. Paying just one or 2 grand more can get you into a much better pool of used cars. Some of the techniques i use while buying from the public are:

Buying the buyer, not the car. I want to buy my cars from employed, middle to upper-class people in good neighborhoods, with homes not apartments. I want my seller to have several cars newer and nicer than the one I am planning to buy. When the seller doesnt really need the money you are more likely to be able to bargain down to your price as well as buy a car that the previous owner had the means to pay for scheduled maintenance.

Ask for service records, comprehensive records instantly establish a car as more valuable than the same car all other things being equal. Don't be afraid to look under a car, its like seeing a woman without makeup. If the seller is amenable ask to perform a compression test on the cylinders. This can offer you critical information on the health of the motor. Make sure that there are no leaks (fluid leaks and or vacuum/exhaust leaks.

I tell people to pay attention towards your senses. If a car smells funny, something looks or feels funny investigate it. Things that can be determined this way-
Smell: Burning coolant (sweet maple syrup like smell), Burning Oil-grey smoke (smells like a lawnmower or other two cycle motor), Burning excess fuel black, sooty smoke (often smells like sulphur or eggs) could be bad catalytic converter, bad gas, running rich. Moldy smell means car may have been in a flood or had a heater core leak. Cigarette smell and mold are two of the most difficult smells to get rid of.
Hearing can alert you to knocks, lifter noise, muffler problems, exhaust leaks, brake/rotor/wheel problems.
Feel can tell you problems with Misfiring cylinders, transmission, alignment, suspension, wheel/hub bearings, etc.
Sight can tell you whether the car has been in an accident (deployed airbags, uneven body lines and seams, wavy, aftermarket paint job covering up bondo.) Make sure that all the warning lights (airbag, ABS, CEL, etc.) come on when the key is in the second position.
Unscrupulous dealers resell cars with deployed airbags and Check Engine Lights disabled. You live in SoCal which has the most extensive smog testing in the nation. Any DTC code from the most innocuous will disqualify your car. Another $2000 investment may be necessary just to be able to pass smog check. Bring a code scanner or ask the owner if he minds you getting the codes read at an auto parts store.

As far as mileage goes I have a saying: Cars dont get to be high mileage cars by being neglected. Usually cars start needing many major components replaced around 150K miles. A car with 200K has often gotten over this hump and can have another 50-100K left in them. This is mostly Japanese and European cars as many American cars are simply just not designed to last over 200K.

The good news is there are many good deals out there on Craigslist if you are prepared to complete your due diligence. I buy cars for between $700 and $1500 all the time and usually they need something simple like a fuel pump, AC compressor, or alternator and they are good to go. I am also talking about good looking cars with leather, sunroof, power everything, etc. I drive good looking European cars between 10 and fifteen years old. I always get compliments on my cars. Right now I am driving a 2006 Volvo S60 2.5 Turbo which i paid $1300 for. It needed a new radiator, condenser and hood. I got all the parts for about $3-400 and did all the work in my driveway in one day. Interior is in beautiful shape and it only has 150K miles. So including registration, sales tax and license I am still under $2K.


The most common catastrophic failures that end most cars lives are overheating/head gasket failure, timing belt failure, or transmission failure. Make sure your timing belt and water pump has been changed, your coolant system is in good functioning order and your transmission fluid and engine oil is clean and not leaking.

^^^AboveAverageJoe, great advice man and even better Voltaire signature. Looking forward to more posts from you.

Quote: (05-15-2016 11:27 AM)Cattle Rustler Wrote:  

Y'all need to check out this website, it shows the latest leasing deals.

http://leasehackr.com/

A loaded Denali Sierra for 353 or 358 for an F150 SuperCrew

Shit, you can event get a pony for 277 with the EcoBoost engine or spend 306 on a Challenger R/T

You could get an accord, Camry, Fusion, Altima for around 250ish.

That Chevy lease for $37 was a killer deal.

http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?...sh)/page17

http://slickdeals.net/f/8377299-2016-che...and-0-down

http://leasehackr.com/blog/2015/11/25/ep...nth-0-down

For that price, you really are better off leasing than buying a used car.

Some folks combined it with their costco gift card and their monthly payment was -27.

Yeah, they were getting paid 27 bucks a month to drive a car.

Quote: (04-23-2016 02:12 AM)wi30 Wrote:  

Mazda 6 i sport.

In near great condition. A few minor dents/scratches.

KBB put it at 9,200-10,000 for fair market value. I got a pretty good deal.

It seemed near impossible to find a legitimate car under 100K in this market. Cars are overpriced relative to miles in my market anyways.

People are poor now. New cars are expensive so everyone is "being smart" and buying used. The used market is full. Maybe the lease market, as shown above might be a better option for someone who drives a lot. If a person doesn't drive a lot, maybe full time Uber and a bicycle might do it.

Gentle bump.. What's the consensus on surplus vehicles ?

There's a surplus auction coming up in my neck of the woods. It's a city auction, the majority of the cars appear to be former squad cars. Mileage ranges anywhere from 37K on an '06 to 125K on an '09.
There's also some detective cars, a few parking bureau cars, some work vans, and a few minivans sprinkled in. The mileage on most of those seem to be consistent with either the national average of 12K/year or marginally below. An '08 Impala with 85K, am '05 Taurus with 43K, etc.

Potential pros would be that the vehicles are mechanically kept in tip top shape. The interiors may be roughed up, but those are easier fixes than a blown rod or frame damage.

Potential cons are that it's an "As Is, Where Is" sale, meaning that I can't have my mechanic put it on a lift before buying.

Anybody ever buy a decommissioned cop car ? Or any tips on what to scrutinize with these particular type of vehicles ?

AboveAverageJoe has great advice.

I'll offer mine, having simply bought and sold plenty of used cars in my life under $5k. I'm not a car guy and don't drive a lot, so I usually stick to cheap shit.

The most important thing is to buy from a Private Seller, and get a read on him/her when you go look at the car.

- It's a numbers game, which means a method of attrition.
- Email the seller and get very basic info. This will eliminate half the cars, since some will be sold, and some will not respond.
- Call the seller on the phone before looking. This will eliminate half the cars, either by factual information they give you, or if they sound like someone you can trust.
- Go see the car. This will eliminate half of the cars, based on first impression of the car. To save time, don't go very far to see the car unless the seller will be there. First impression of the seller will eliminate half the cars, since there are a lot of people you just don't trust.
- Drive the car. This will eliminate half.
- Ask questions and talk to the seller. Of those people you trusted on first impression, only half you'll trust after talking to them. Ask stupid and questions like oil, accidents, # owners, anything about the car, even if they already addressed it on the seller page. The goal is to get them to talk.
- The final negotiation process will eliminate another half of the cars.

The above reasons are why I (average consumer) don't go to car lots. Sales people can fake you out more than your average Joe/Jane. There's still a chance a seller can fool you, but it will be rare.

Negotiating:
1. Find every little thing you can wrong with it, bring it up as if it pains you, let him explain it (even if it's already in the seller listing). Be brief, succinct.
2. You want the car and need it now, but you're really torn, because of the shape it's in and the price.
3. Negotiating happens in person, not on the phone and definitely not text / email.
4. Low ball the offer. Goal is for seller to come down first. Or maybe they take the low ball.
5. Don't use your financial hardships in negotiations (they don't care why you're poor). Do use your financial limit in negotiations. It's ok to say "I only really wanted to spend $1800" when you might be willing to spend $2000. It's not ok to say "I only have $1800" when you actually might be willing to spend $2k. People want to and will tend to believe you.
6. When you're done, make sure he knows you feel like he barely won the negotiation. You're glad you have the car, but you maybe paid slightly too much. Good sales people (good negotiators) always make the other person feel good about themselves.
7. Despite all those negative things mentioned above, be nice and friendly and willing to joke. It's just as annoying to sell a car as it is buy it, so make it a little fun for both of you. In the end it's only money you're at ends about.

It's so similar to sex and relationships.

Open your mind to vehicles outside the range of what you would consider. A few months ago my brother had mentioned wanting to buy a pick up as a second vehicle. Then he mentioned how insane the prices were on old, beat shit. 4WD trucks hold their value. I suggested to him to look at full size SUVs. Specifically Suburbans. A few weeks later he got a '02 Suburban for $1400. It was a LT trim which had leather seats, sunroof, etc and 230K miles. It has a few scuffs and scrapes, and the driver's seat cover and foam are shot (normal on them.) He's spent probably another $1400 since he's had it. Tune-up shit mostly. A new set of Michelin LTX tires. But now he's got something that's reliable and could easily have another 100K-150K miles left in it.

One of the best ways to determine how good a car is, is the general condition of it when you look at it. Is it clean? Is it really clean? I'm not talking did the idiot run it through the automatic car wash and spend five minutes to vacuum it. I'm talking about does it look like it was owned by a person who always kept it clean? You can tell the difference. What about the check engine light? Is it on? In most states, if it's on, it won't pass inspection. Why is it on? If they didn't fix the issue, what other issues went unrepaired? Can he discuss the service history? If it has 200K miles on the clock and it's still on the original tie rods and ball joints, struts and wheel bearings/hubs, it's going to be a sloppy car. I could go on, but I've got other stuff to take care of.

What's the process of negotiating with private sellers? I'm looking to buy a car from Craigslist, and the listed prices are consistently a grand or two above the KBB and Edmunds Private Party Values. Should I assume the sellers are offering these quotes at face value, or are most people purposely high-balling their asking price because they expect to be negotiated down from their initial offer, however low it may be? Should you ever agree to purchase a car for higher than its KBB value or is that being a sucker?

Also, what is the convention for arranging a pre-purchase inspection at a mechanic? You come to a tentative agreement on price with the seller, and then do you ask the seller to drive the car to the mechanic himself, or do you give him a security deposit as a surety and take possession of the vehicle and drive it to the mechanic yourself?