Relationships are HARD work - Printable Version

Relationships are HARD work - Printable Version

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Relationships are HARD work - eddie_7 - 12-07-2016

I think McCarthy has a good point about having traditional marriage conditions(women being virginal) while leaving out other conditions(fidelity of the man). Personally I think for LTR/marriage to work there should be some sacrifice on both parties. In the future when I decide to enter into LTR/marriage I plan on making the resolve to be faithful to the woman just as she will be faithful to me.

Relationships are HARD work - calabrese americano - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-06-2016 10:30 PM)philosophical_recovery Wrote:

Would you cast her aside and say "go find another man" because she's had a single dick inside of her when you've been inside a few dozen slutty holes?

Come on, man.

I've recently discovered that it really depends on who the single dick is. I'm in a relationship with an EE woman who has only been with two men: her EE ex-husband and an American guy whom she met while she lived in the USA for a year after her divorce. The American guy is an absolutely repulsive individual (even by American standards). I have to deal with the aftershocks....so in this case, I think maybe a sloot with 50+ would be less of a psychological burden.

Relationships are HARD work - rockoman - 12-07-2016

Relationships - hard work?

The strongest person in a relationship is the one who has the most options outside of that relationship - h/t Roissy I think.

We now live - as Houellebecq wrote - in a free market world with regard to relationships, where everybody can swich suppliers and customers very easily.

If you are in a relationship, make sure you are the one with the most options outside of that - ie you have more potential suppliers or customers.

Relationships are HARD work - calabrese americano - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-07-2016 09:27 AM)rockoman Wrote:

If you are in a relationship, make sure you are the one with the most options outside of that - ie you have more potential suppliers or customers.

I think that this might be the 2nd best advice you can give a young man who is entering the dating world, after telling him to work out.

I've learned it the hard way...it doesn't matter how low quality a man is...if he has sexual options and his current woman knows about those options, she'll develop an obsession.

Relationships are HARD work - Rob Banks - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-07-2016 01:50 AM)philosophical_recovery Wrote:

There's always going to be prettier girls, another virgin girl, you have it. You can continue learning game, stacking bills, and improving until your body actually starts to give out. But if your value systems are in line, your families are intact, I truly wonder what the risk really is. It's not something amenable to statistical analysis. Is she going to help you continue to improve? Is she going to be supportive? These are the questions worth asking to me.

Quote: (12-07-2016 01:52 AM)McCarthy Wrote:

However, what really matters is not the virginity itself, but the legal framework and the cultural environment in which the relationship develops. You could marry a non-virgin 80 years ago in Europe and no divorce would happen. Why? Divorce simply was not a possibility.

For all the folks here who praise virginity. Make sure you control (almost impossible IMHO) the female environment of your super virgin brides until menopause, because the day your unicorns (I see lot of pedestalizing, here) get inside the idea that they did not enjoy their lives enough, you will bite the dust as the guy who married the slut.

Quote: (12-07-2016 02:04 AM)philosophical_recovery Wrote:

Virgin does not necessarily = trust
Not virgin does not necessarily mean untrustworthy

As I said earlier:

Quote: (12-06-2016 11:16 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:

Now, before anyone misunderstands me, I am not saying that virginity is the only thing that matters. Obviously, a virgin chick who was fat or had a bitchy, disrespectful attitude would not be desirable for marriage. Virginity is a necessary, but not sufficient, condition for a woman to be considered marriageable.

Relationships are HARD work - LikeABaller - 12-07-2016

My father married a virgin, my grandfather married a virgin, why shouldn't I marry a virgin?
You guys summed it up perfectly.

Relationships are HARD work - Constitution45 - 12-07-2016

I think in this pump and dump culture, we are so underdeveloped when it comes to forming long lasting relationships. Thank god a considerable amount of my adult life, I was living in the traditional East. A lot of men in their 20s, who have a lot going for them are lacking heavily in this department. The women becoming disenfranchised quickly and care more about their careers, while the men haven't even started on the ladder. These are not just 'beta' guys, I have heard talking and sounding like wimps when it comes to women and relationships. I'm referring to businessmen, police officers etc. The culture is too strong and undermining.

Relationships are HARD work - Constitution45 - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-07-2016 07:33 AM)eddie_7 Wrote:

Very interesting points made about virginity. I agree with John_Galt that it is the mental/emotional changes women are likely to undergo when their virginity is taken by a man that are more pertinent than the mere physical aspects. I have a feeling that the woman is likely to be "imprinted" by their first man especially if he makes a strong "alpha" impression on her psyche. Perhaps other men who enters into a LTR/marriage with that women will have to remove that impression and imprint his own in order to garner her devotion to him.
I wonder if this also happens to a lesser extent in situations where even though she didn't give the man sexual access, she is nevertheless profoundly affected by the "alpha experience" of an interesting man letting her into his world which she will remember for many years.

Also agree with StrikeBack that considering the enormous risk and sacrifices of entering into LTR/marriage, having high standards such as virginity is quite understandable.

Good point, if you are applying principles of self improvement, game and have some understanding of the natural dynamics between men and women. You are already way ahead of the curve and will most likely leave a strong impression on girls you come across.

Relationships are HARD work - Rob Banks - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-06-2016 10:30 PM)philosophical_recovery Wrote:

Would you cast her aside and say "go find another man" because she's had a single dick inside of her when you've been inside a few dozen slutty holes?

Come on, man.

Quote: (12-07-2016 01:52 AM)McCarthy Wrote:

And BTW, you guys are not virgin either...

Seriously? Are we really equating male and female virginity?

The male body and mind does not undergo changes upon losing virginity the way the female body does. Sure, getting laid for the first time affects men, but not in the same way. Some would argue that a man becomes more desirable to women if he's fucked other women before.

As Rawmeo and I pointed out, the vast majority of our civilized male ancestors married virgin women. Non-virginal women were considered unmarriageable. Non-virginal men were not. The reason why more men stayed virgins was because there were virtually no single women out there looking for hookups, and going to a whorehouse was considered dirty. I'd even be willing to bet that a lot of men were not virgins at marriage. It was not uncommon for men around 25-30 to marry girls 14-18. Do you really believe all those men remained virgins until age 25-30? I doubt it.

In fact, the term "virginity" originally only applied to women.

Yes, premarital sex is a sin for men, too. Absolutely. But that doesn't mean they're equal. Premarital sex is a sin for both men and women, but it happens to have far greater consequences for women. That's just nature.

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Quote: (12-07-2016 07:44 AM)eddie_7 Wrote:

I think McCarthy has a good point about having traditional marriage conditions(women being virginal) while leaving out other conditions(fidelity of the man). Personally I think for LTR/marriage to work there should be some sacrifice on both parties. In the future when I decide to enter into LTR/marriage I plan on making the resolve to be faithful to the woman just as she will be faithful to me.

What I said about premarital sex applies to extramarital sex as well. It is sinful no matter who does it, but it has far greater consequences when a woman does it.

In fact, the term "adultery" originally only applied to a man sleeping with another man's wife. In other words, if a woman cheats on her husband, the woman and the man fucking her are both committing adultery.

I agree that it is probably best for men not to cheat on their wives, but in the past, it didn't used to be uncommon for a wealthy or powerful man to cheat on his wife, and the wife wouldn't leave. It is only recently, under feminism, that it is considered such a big deal. Nowadays, if a woman doesn't leave her husband when he cheats, her friends will see her as a "pushover" and a "doormat."

Relationships are HARD work - John_Galt - 12-07-2016

As Rob Banks pointed out above, if God, or Darwin, or the Flying Spaghetti Monster etc intended for mens and womens virginity to hold equal weight and be viewed same, he'd have given men the male equivalent of the hymen, i.e. a physical piece of evidence to prove virginity.

Some of you have been so brainwashed you don't even realize you're spouting out illogical feminist talking points.

Relationships are HARD work - McCarthy - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-07-2016 07:19 PM)John_Galt Wrote:

As Rob Banks pointed out above, if God, or Darwin, or the Flying Spaghetti Monster etc intended for mens and womens virginity to hold equal weight and be viewed same, he'd have given men the male equivalent of the hymen, i.e. a physical piece of evidence to prove virginity.

Some of you have been so brainwashed you don't even realize you're spouting out illogical feminist talking points.

See you in twenty years whether you still keep you virgin wife by the time she has vaginal dryness and wrinkled face, or jump to a younger one. The problem will not be in her, but in you, for having been a player and your bonding towards her being weaker since she is not a highschool sweetheart, just a wrinkled number.

PUA second youth = Slut second youth.

Just take a look at the title of the thread to see where is the problem we are talking about.

And no, don’t call me feminist. I am patriarchal as f***, despite my pair bonding with women being destroyed by feminism and having fucked way too many girls.

Relationships are HARD work - Rob Banks - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-07-2016 08:44 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

PUA second youth = Slut second youth.

Quote: (12-07-2016 08:44 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

I am patriarchal as fuck...

Those are contradictory statements.

If you believe PUA = slut, then you believe in gender equality i.e. you're not "patriarchal as fuck."

Relationships are HARD work - McCarthy - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-07-2016 09:03 PM)Rob Banks Wrote:

Quote: (12-07-2016 08:44 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

PUA second youth = Slut second youth.

Quote: (12-07-2016 08:44 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

I am patriarchal as fuck...

Those are contradictory statements.

If you believe PUA = slut, then you believe in gender equality i.e. you're not "patriarchal as fuck."

Do you know the meaning of shotgun wedding? In a patriarchal society, PUA behavior is as punished as slut behavior.

Relationships are HARD work - philosophical_recovery - 12-07-2016

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Relationships are HARD work - McCarthy - 12-07-2016

In a patriarchal society, women are either owned by their fathers or by their husbands. (Pater Potestas anyone?)
PUA lifestyle and slut lifestyle are only possible in "feminist" societies.

It seems to me that some folks here have swallowed the feminist propaganda that "men did what they wanted" in patriarchal societies.

But let’s not derail the topic of the thread.

Relationships are HARD work - McCarthy - 12-07-2016

..

Relationships are HARD work - John_Galt - 12-07-2016

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Relationships are HARD work - Rob Banks - 12-07-2016

Quote: (12-07-2016 09:12 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

Do you know the meaning of shotgun wedding? In a patriarchal society, PUA behavior is as punished as slut behavior.

For the last time, male promiscuity and female promiscuity are both bad, but female promiscuity is worse and has harsher consequences.

Do you not understand logic? Just because I say "A is not as bad as B" does not automatically mean "A is good."

Quote: (12-07-2016 09:19 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

In a patriarchal society, women are either owned by their fathers or by their husbands. (Pater Potestas anyone?)
PUA lifestyle and slut lifestyle are only possible in "feminist" societies.

It seems to me that some folks here have swallowed the feminist propaganda that "men did what they wanted" in patriarchal societies.

Yes, the PUA lifestyle and slut lifestyle are not possible in a patriarchal society, but for different reasons.

In a patriarchal society, the slut "lifestyle" (if you can even call it that) is not possible because women are forbidden by their fathers, and discouraged by society, from being sluts. Slutty women, and even women who merely aren't virgins, are often considered unmarriageable in a truly patriarchal society. That discourages women from behaving like sluts.

The reason men cannot be PUAs in a patriarchal society is because there are very few women willing to have casual sex and short-term relationships. The main reason it is considered a sin for a man to have premarital sex is because he is ruining the woman and disrespecting her future husband. Aside from potentially getting the woman pregnant (which can be avoided by pulling out or using condoms), there aren't too many downsides for a man to be a player while he is single.

Nowadays, there are many women who are open to casual sex and commitment-free relationships. If you decide not to fuck a willing girl, another guy will. You're not being virtuous or "saving" anyone by choosing not to be a player in today's society. Most of these girls' fathers wouldn't even care if they found out their daughter was having casual sex. The way I see it, as long as you're not lying to women (promising them love and long-term commitment only to pump-and-dump them), then I see no problem with being a player.

Relationships are HARD work - McCarthy - 12-07-2016

Rob Banks, you built the logics straw man by accusing me of believing in "gender" equality since I put PUAs second youth at the same level that slut second youth.

BTW: "gender" does not exist, it is a concept entirely pushed by feminists. Next time, call it sex.

Relationships are HARD work - Rob Banks - 12-08-2016

Quote: (12-07-2016 11:48 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

Rob Banks, you built the logics straw man by accusing me of believing in "gender" equality since I put PUAs second youth at the same level that slut second youth.

If you believe that PUAs and sluts are equal, then you believe that patriarchal societies had it wrong in condemning female promiscuity more harshly than male promiscuity, and that has historically been an unfair "double standard," as the feminists would put it. That is not a "straw man." It is a logical conclusion based on your own words.

Male promiscuity and female promiscuity are both bad for society, but that does not mean they are equal. They are bad for different reasons, and one is worse than the other.

Quote: (12-07-2016 11:48 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

BTW: "gender" does not exist, it is a concept entirely pushed by feminists. Next time, call it sex.

Ah, but I did not refer to sex as "gender." I merely used the term "gender equality," which is a term describing a specific belief that leftists tend share. Would you rather I called it "sex equality?" That would only confuse people.

Relationships are HARD work - McCarthy - 12-08-2016

Quote: (12-08-2016 12:13 AM)Rob Banks Wrote:

Quote: (12-07-2016 11:48 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

Rob Banks, you built the logics straw man by accusing me of believing in "gender" equality since I put PUAs second youth at the same level that slut second youth.

If you believe that PUAs and sluts are equal, then you believe that patriarchal societies had it wrong in condemning female promiscuity more harshly than male promiscuity, and that has historically been an unfair "double standard," as the feminists would put it. That is not a "straw man." It is a logical conclusion based on your own words.

Male promiscuity and female promiscuity are both bad for society, but that does not mean they are equal. They are bad for different reasons, and one is worse than the other.

Quote: (12-07-2016 11:48 PM)McCarthy Wrote:

BTW: "gender" does not exist, it is a concept entirely pushed by feminists. Next time, call it sex.

Ah, but I did not refer to sex as "gender." I merely used the term "gender equality," which is a term describing a specific belief that leftists tend share. Would you rather I called it "sex equality?" That would only confuse people.

I did not say PUA = SLut, I said slut divorcing for someone better = PUA divorcing for someone better.

The usage of the word "gender" as replacement for "sex" is VERY new.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender#Ety..._and_usage

On sex equality:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Equ..._the_Sexes

Relationships are HARD work - John_Galt - 12-08-2016

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Relationships are HARD work - Rob Banks - 12-08-2016

Quote: (12-08-2016 12:33 AM)McCarthy Wrote:

I did not say PUA = SLut, I said slut divorcing for someone better = PUA divorcing for someone better.

Yes, I agree, divorcing your husband or wife without a really good reason is equally bad whether you're a man or a woman. You should have specified you meant divorce. You said "PUA second youth = slut second youth" which could easily refer to someone cheating on their husband or wife with a younger partner. You never mentioned anything about divorce. There's a HUGE difference between cheating and divorcing.

Relationships are HARD work - McCarthy - 12-08-2016

Quote: (12-08-2016 12:59 AM)Rob Banks Wrote:

Quote: (12-08-2016 12:33 AM)McCarthy Wrote:

I did not say PUA = SLut, I said slut divorcing for someone better = PUA divorcing for someone better.

Yes, I agree, divorcing your husband or wife without a really good reason is equally bad whether you're a man or a woman. You should have specified you meant divorce. You said "PUA second youth = slut second youth" which could easily refer to someone cheating on their husband or wife with a younger partner. You never mentioned anything about divorce. There's a HUGE difference between cheating and divorcing.

I took the term from Rollo, I think. Sorry for the confusion, then.

Relationships are HARD work - XXL - 12-08-2016

this thread..

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