[nomadicdude]

Diagnosis this: usually when I go out I pre-game and end up getting plastered beyond belief. At some point in the night I stop remembering stuff. Amazingly, I do much better when I am blacked out then when I'm sober.

For instance, a few days ago I picked up a hot Brazilian chick in a club and made out with her and got her number. I can't remember seeing her in the club, or approaching her, or dancing with her, or getting her number. I have a vague recollection of making out with her a lot but that's it.

This happens at least once a month. A few times I have even banged chicks through this. Once in SE Asia I got plastered beyond belief and my first real memory is having a Norwegian chick in my bed. Again, no memories of the approach, the talk, or dancing.

So wtf does this all mean? I think when I'm sober I'm just a pussy and that heavy drinking brings out some amazing game and increases my confidence. If there was any way to do this while sober then I'd probably get laid 10 times more.

[isis]

(10-16-2011 10:40 PM)nomadicdude Wrote:  

So wtf does this all mean?

I find this too, when I am close to being wasted off my face, I forget my own fears, and find my self doing things and suddenly realising, "woah how the fuck did I get here".

While the next day I pat myself on the back that I at-least went out and had a good time - but wishing I knew how to get to the state of not caring.

[wi30]

It's definitely because you don't give a fuck when you're hammered. I've had similar experiences and it was because I was in confident drunk mode. Trying going out and staying relatively sober a couple times and see how you do.

[iknowexactly]

Blackouts ( not remembering periods of time) is not a good sign relative to alcohol problems.
Meeting hot chicks is not a problem, but are you driving drunk, getting in arguments...

Do you even KNOW if you've been driving drunk?

I had a few patients in prison that caught murder charges driving drunk. And killed somebody. Got Life.
I was the one they complained to about how unfair it was. I didn't care much, and no one else cared at all.

=========================================
CAGE Adapted to Include Drugs (CAGE-AID)

The CAGE-AID is a sensitive screen for alcohol and drug problems. CAGE is an acronym for
C - Ever try to Cut back on your drinking or drug use?
A - Ever been Annoyed by anyone about your drinking or drug use?
G - Ever felt Guilty or ashamed about your drinking or drug use?
E - Ever had an “Eye-opener” or used alcohol or drugs in the morning?
Answering yes to any of these questions indicates a possible alcohol or drug use problem.

[OGNorCal707]

I never get blacked out drunk, and I'm always surprised that people "get blacked out" and still are able to function, the few times I got that wasted I was basically stumbling around in an alley puking my guts out.

Anyways, I too have recently been realizing that I use alcohol as a crutch, one of Roosh's posts last week got me thinking, if I didn't have alcohol where would my game be at?

For me, it's not so much that I overcome my fears or approach anxiety, it just makes me that much more bold, confident, smooth, and "on". I mean maybe it's really that when I don't have a few drinks I'm still slightly nervous on some sub/unconcious level, and drinking just calms those nerves, but for some reason I just feel way more "on point" after 3-4 drinks.

I kind of am trying to challenge myself to only having 3 or a maximum of 4 drinks with a lot of water interspersed between drinks, this is just enough to get me buzzed without getting drunk. Hopefully this will result in tighter game in the long run because I won't be allowing myself to rely on the "magical affects" of alcohol to help my game.

More than anything I'm going to do it because I can't get a DUI, and I hate being hungover. I don't know how some guys can go out and drink hard and stay out late 3-5 nights a week, and still function, maintain a job/career, go to the gym, etc. Especially for older dudes, now that I'm in my late 20's the hangovers hit me hard. Now, I'm trying to make working out and learning martial arts to be my main focuses in life, and hangovers are a major pain in the ass.

[Amour Fou]

I have been having the same questionings myself.

Even though I never have blackouts, I have a low tolerance to alcohol and dislike hangovers and bad night sleeps. Yet, I realise that I am much more balsy and creative (and fun!) when I'm drunk.

My insane craving for the female genitalia pushes me out of the house 3-4 nights a week.

The paradox is, I don't believe it is healthy/I don't find it good to go out drinking so many nights a week, but my crave for pussy won't let me stay indoors, while I only game well with a decent buzz.

I have been going out completely sober most nights, but it is not the same. I wuss out a lot and start feeling grumpy and depressed. I rationalise that "at least I am going out there!" even if I approach much less and spit lesser game without the buzz... whereas I had historically insane game while on a buzz.

Maybe with time and practice I might get the same level of wits, confidence and energy/fun without drinking?

[nomadicdude]

I don't have a car so I don't have to worry about DUI's. It is amazing though that I still manage to find my way home even when I'm drunk. It is like even though I can't remember my thoughts for the night, my brain is still functioning at some reasonable level. It must be if I can game girls without them realizing that I'm pissed off beyond belief.

It just shows you that confidence and aggressiveness is mega important in dealing with chicks because it seems most girls would prefer a mega drunk aggressive guy versus a sober nice guy.

Also, I'm pretty lucky in that I don't get hungover the next day. I can still function, only that if I drink hardcore for two days in a row then I usually want to detox for a few days. I won't feel like drinking. Those Brits and Aussies who can get wasted everyday must have amazing livers.

[Roosh]

The only difference is you approach more and aren't as shy. You haven't sealed the deal when drunk so how can you say your game is good during that time? Like I recently posted, you only think it's good when in fact it's not. Learn the game without being drunk. Until then your results will be low.

[Gmac]

Drunk game is the weakest form of game out there, and I have to admit I rely on it sometimes myself. You should try to ween yourself off of it so you can pull off a similar level of game when you're barely buzzed. That means some serious inner game overhauling and a lot of practice in the field. What happens when you're about to swoop a girl back to your pad and find yourself sober, inhibited, and boring again? You lose the pussy.

[RandalGraves]

Drunk game is weak. The downsides:

- You spend a lot of $$$, and apparently you aren't getting good ROI.
- Whiskey dick!
- More likely to say something stupid and turn her off
- Be unable to deploy game whenever you want (i.e., when you're not drunk at a bar)

The majority of the time when I go out (especially for the main purpose of gaming), I drink very little, less than 3 beers. I've trained myself to summon the confidence and the don't-give-a-fuck attitude without needing alcohol as a crutch. That way, I'm usually opening my first group as I wait to get my first drink.

[Samseau]

Probably the best way to improve sober game is to day-game.

Buy day-bang and get crackin son.

[Spike]

im using drunk game a lot lately. I think its because im having such a bad time here in brazil. i just get wasted all time time and smoke a lot even during the day whereas when im having good times and easier lays i dont need much alcohol or cigarettes.

[mikeymike]

The funny thing is what you're thinking is amazing game while you're drunk isn't really great game you're just to out of it to realize it and care so you keep pressing on and you find that women respond. When we're sober and new to gaming we over analyze everything if we make a comment we're not thrilled with we're already sweating the next thing we're gonna say and we've sunk ourselves mentally before the girls had a chance to. About 5-6 years ago I did a trip to Phoenix and was drunk off my ass every night and had girls coming to the hotel to see me during the day, was closing every day and I thought drunk game was my thing but one of my boys taped me with his cell and showed me my smooth ways and really it was just approaching every half decent girl within reach, talking my ass off and many times once I'd opened a girl and she was showing interest I'd fuck it up by staring at some other girl walking by or just walk away mid talk cause I was too drunk to pay attention. If you can talk to girls drunk you can talk to them sober, you just gotta get over the inhibition...the skills are there. If you can't talk to them drunk either then you got major work to do but really you're prolly not as great with chicks drunk as you're remembering, booze loves to trick us that way but least it shows you what you can do if you get out of your own way.

[Moma]

These days, there is barely a difference between how I feel drunk and sober. I rarely drink when I go out to clubs (cos I'm frugal with mine. As a result, I've been running a lot of sober game.

[Hokie30]

(10-17-2011 01:23 PM)Moma Wrote:  

These days, there is barely a difference between how I feel drunk and sober. I rarely drink when I go out to clubs (cos I'm frugal with mine. As a result, I've been running a lot of sober game.

There is a HUGE difference between DRUNK game and BUZZED game. Drunk game for me never works however when i'm buzzed I still have awareness of all my senses and can spit game with the best of them. The key is to find your optimum alcohol level and maintain that (for me it is about 6-7 shots in <1hr), under no circumstanses should you exceed that unless you really don't care about hooking up that night.

[silent_scope]

If approaching and talking to women is supposed to be fun, then I never have any fun doing this shit when I'm completely sober. I talk myself out of most approaches and the ones I do sack up for, go nowhere fast.

When I'm totally smashed I don't give a shit about anything. I approach a bunch more women, have better conversations, and even get a few phone numbers. But I wake up the next day not knowing who I spoke to or how I ended up with their phone numbers.

These days since I have no wing to roll with, I'm always driving and therefore keeping a close watch on my alcohol consumption.

[CPG]

That's a good point on the difference between drunk vs buzzed game...like others have said here, me gaming drunk only works when I accidentally hit the right balance of fearless approaching + constant escalating. My conversational skills go to hell, and I've wasted more good opportunities drunk because of it than I care to remember. Buzzed gives some of the same fearlessness and comfort zone escalating without turning me into a drooling idiot.

I've become a fan of getting an early buzz and then slowly sobering up as the night goes on with lite beers. It gives a boost for the first few approaches to get things rolling, and keeps that DUI risk low.

Food for thought: the best guy I've winged with always got smashed. He'd get buzzed before grabbing a cab, and drink till he blacked out more than once. Despite this, he was sharp most of the night and could still run decent game at 2 AM, and he racked up a pretty impressive count. Until...he developed a medical problem that he never fully explained, except to say that it came with his doctor basically saying "stop drinking or else". He tried one night out sober, couldn't approach to save his life, got more and more miserable being out, and then announced that he was taking a break from nightlife.

[WesternCancer]

I've been having this problem too. I think its a combination of not giving a shit when you're drunk. I'm also in a better mood/more outgoing when I'm drunk AND in a club. I think for me it helps because I don't think about anything else but what to do to bed this girl. I need to stop using liquor as a crutch, but I'm in university kind of have to have a bit of alcohol or you're that really weird sober guy at the campus bar.

[OGNorCal707]

So you guys think that cutting back on drinking at night venues like bars and clubs, to the point where you're more sober than buzzed will help your game in the long run, because you're not relying on alcohol as a crutch?

It seems like if you do better running game buzzed/drunk, then try to run game sober, you're results will probably drop off and you'll have a longer learning curve.

I think Samseau had it right about day game helping your night game, as far as not needing alcohol, unfortunately I don't live in a "target rich" environment, and don't feel like spending an couple hours a week doing laps around the grocery store, stalking out cute girls to talk to.

[Caligula]

(10-17-2011 12:20 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

Probably the best way to improve sober game is to day-game.

Buy day-bang and get crackin son.

Works the other way around too. Start approaching sober at night and you'll have an easier time approaching during the day.

[Samseau]

(10-19-2011 01:06 PM)Caligula Wrote:  

(10-17-2011 12:20 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

Probably the best way to improve sober game is to day-game.

Buy day-bang and get crackin son.

Works the other way around too. Start approaching sober at night and you'll have an easier time approaching during the day.

Oh of course. But this isn't about improving your approach, its about getting off alcohol dependence. Since drinking at night is socially conditioned, it's easier to approach sober during the day.