[Trumpian]

Not true. I shit on the Abrahamic religions equally. Theyre all based off the bablings of some related primitive desert semites.

[Pride male]

Would love to see a showdown between communists and Muslims. Both are insanely violent and delusional. It would interesting to see who comes up on top.

[questor70]

(04-04-2019 08:17 PM)infowarrior1 Wrote:  

How does one know morality is being redefined away or to objective good?

IMHO, there is a primorial good that children perceive. Watch something like Winnie the Pooh or My Little Pony. How intense is the level of conflict in those stories? More or less, the world of young children is naively trusting and friendly. This is what we start off believing. Sort of an Anne Frank naivete that people are generally good.
This is what gets bled out of us by life-experience or brainwashing (think Full Metal Jacket basic training).

The world of Conan or Gengis Khan is the complete OPPOSITE of this.

In Conan, while he is lectured about the riddle of steel, those lessons only sink in when his tribe is killed and he is rendered a slave. This is the "redefinition", the loss of innocence, the hardening of the heart.

Braveheart is the same basic story. Same deal with Luke encountering the charred remains of his Aunt and Uncle, only Luke renounces revenge later in ROTJ.

Violence begats violence, hence it sends people down a slippery slope of losing your ability to empathize. There's plenty of evopsych about that too, that war is possible only because there's a mental switch that flips that allows men to kill. I don't know how well that functions in women, but men definitely have it, and it's a double-edged sword.

If you're incapable of doing it, you render your people sitting ducks. This is the argument against lefty peacenik types.



It's hard to understand how brutal, let's say, the culture of Afghanistan is, but in a prolonged environment of warfare like that, it's advantageous to fight fire with fire. Van Driessen types would be wiped out quickly.

In this way, war/violence is a race to the bottom which is very hard to reverse.

It's especially hard to deal with asymmetric warfare where the enemy doesn't follow any rules of combat. They cry foul for every instance of collateral damage while they themselves blow up civilians with impunity. This is why the most effective way to restore peace has been genocide. No survivors = no revenge impulse. The biggest impediment to victory is the more dominant force's own guilty conscience. This is why the bomb was a necessary evil to end WWII but still has plenty of people hating on the US for it.

But this is why forgiveness and mercy are rare virtues.

[Rigsby]

(04-05-2019 05:38 AM)Hannibal Wrote:  

It's more a sign of disrespect to the religion of Christianity.

Even the atheists are too piss scared to call out Islam so they only pick targets that refuse to defend themselves with unbelievable levels of violence.

I was going to put this in the Satanic inversion thread, but it goes as well here:

Nothing against the bible here. I showed it to a couple of christian friends before and they seemed to like it. for what thats worth!

You fucking lily livered, weak, spineless little cunt.

Now do that with a Koran, and show it to a couple of your muslim friends. Do you think that they would like it?

For what it's worth. Cunt.

...


You raise a good point Hannibal.

I have family that shit all over christians, calling them child molesters and whatnot, yet they won't have a bad word said about Islam. Oh no. And it's not just fear of reprisal that holds them back. They are just so indoctrinated with the kool-aid. *

You know what, take down your trousers (not talking to you here Hannibal, just to be clear), squat and push, and do a great big dirty shit on the floor, then take the bible, rip out its pages and wipe your fucking arse with it. Means nothing to me as a fellow atheist/agnostic/seeker/secular christian...

If there is a God, and if that book means anything at all, if it is the word passed down, well, I don't think you will be struck down by the 'big man', so who am I to exact revenge? Like some kind of fascist fucking zealot. Not my place.

You learn, or you don't learn. Life teaches us all if we live long enough.

But I don't want to shit on muslims here. I don't even want to shit on atheists/agnostics (of which I am one). All arguments for another day.

I would, however, like to shit on that little turd-burgler that turned a bible in to some kind of figure of fun, for profit.

For what it's worth!


*
That was until the shit really hit the fan. And who came and saved the day? Giving lifts to the hospital? Even going so far as to have a whip round and give hard fucking cash to cover expenses? And not an inconsiderable amount of cash either. Das right. The Christians from the local church. All unsolicited as well.

It was quite something to see them both truly humbled, literally crying with tears running down their cheeks, as the good grace, the bodhicitta, hit them at the very core of their being, like a 'diamond bullet between the eyes'.

....


Still, none of this proves the existence of God, and I'm not claiming as such.

By his works you shall know him.

I say this as an atheist/agnostic remember, so not raiding/trolling your thread.

Can you not think for one moment, that there is something going on here that you maybe quite don't grasp? Can you not suspend your disbelief just for a minute to be quiet and listen?

I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be mistaken.

No?

Fine. Such is your right. And I'll defend it to the death.

I think I've read most of everything that has been written in this thread, and I don't think any of you are really wrong about anything with the arguments you have put forward. I also don't think I've heard an argument or observation that I haven't heard at least a dozen times before, but there you go.

Come on, this is the Material Pill thread.

Is this the best you got?

I know you can do better.

At least, as a fellow atheist/agnostic/non-believer, I hope so.


In fact, I'll post something up in a minute that you might like. It won't prove the existence or the non-existence of God, but it should touch you in some way.

Just like the twat at the beginning of my post who shat all over the good book.

[sighs] ... is nothing sacred anymore?

For what that's worth!

[BortimusPrime]

(04-05-2019 05:38 AM)Hannibal Wrote:  

It's more a sign of disrespect to the religion of Christianity.

Even the atheists are too piss scared to call out Islam so they only pick targets that refuse to defend themselves with unbelievable levels of violence.

I don't argue with chimps because they'd eat my face, not because I respect them. Furthermore I don't see too many Christian missionaries willing to go out and lose their heads trying to save muslims from the eternal damnation they'll get for having those dancing boys.

[Rigsby]

Just to set out my stall and make sure there's no confusion as to my standpoint on all of this:

I believe, but I don't believe.
I'm sure there is a God. But I'm also sure there is no God.
I think that even if there is a God, he may very well be unknowable to an amoeba like organism like me.
I think that if there really is a God, then he will be knowable to even an amoeba organism like me.

I'm in a truly Quantum State with it all.

In quantum physics, quantum state refers to the state of an isolated quantum system. A quantum state provides a probability distribution for the value of each observable, i.e. for the outcome of each possible measurement on the system. Knowledge of the quantum state together with the rules[clarification needed] for the system's evolution in time exhausts all that can be predicted about the system's behavior.[1][2]

A mixture of quantum states is again a quantum state. Quantum states that cannot be written as a mixture of other states are called pure quantum states, all other states are called mixed quantum states.

Now, some people call that double think.

Some call it hedging your bets.

Others call it the Sound of Confusion (see Spacemen 3).

I call it the 'path'.

Path not yet defined.

So that's me. That's the best I got.

...

But this post isn't about me, it's about Great atheists I have known and loved. That's a play on words with regard to Alexander Shulgin. We'll get in to him a bit more later. About psychedelic experiences. About brain chemistry, about the myriad of ways the mind can meet with God, if only for a moment or two when all the right neuro-transmitters are firing, while all the other right neuro-transmitters are blocked.

Here's a link if you want to take a peek:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TiHKAL

I said in the God thread that I would cover the 'God molecule' and it's there - DMT, so is LSD, hell, you even got Melatonin there too. Do your homework. Just make sure you clean your room first, bucko!

"Tryptamines I Have Known and Loved".

...it then continues with a collection of essays on topics ranging from psychotherapy and the Jungian mind to the prevalence of DMT in nature, ayahuasca and the War on Drugs.

Mushrooms, Acid, MDMA, Ketamine et al will figure big in what I have to say. And I know they really appeal to all you fellow atheists/agnostics.

I hope you don't mind me putting this here, as one of your kind.

I will refute the existence of God in many ways if you allow me. I'm on your side!

But I warn you, should you ever get a moment of pure clarity - it is in that very moment that you may meet with something that can only be described as a 'higher force'. Some call it God. Some don't know what to make of it. But few ever get to that point with their rational or irrational inquisition.

...


Now for the story.

My brother who recently died was a full on militant atheist. Not one of you could hold a candle to him. You are all rank amateurs in the school of militant atheism! I do believe if he could have, he would have rounded up anyone who believed in any kind of God (be they muslim/christian/buddhist) and put them all in to one big pit and burned them all alive! Can you say you would do as much? Do you have the courage of your convictions to that extent? He did!

Not talking about getting a bit uppity here, when any kind of reference to Christianity is made, but full on teetering on violence mode. Bless him.

You all think you're so fucking 'edgy', but do you have what it takes? To dig the pit, mow them down and slaughter them, then boot them in backwards to their end fate in the most undignified of fashions to their final resting place. God rest them.

Adolf and his Nazi boys didn't have a problem with it. Do you?

I'm being flippant here. About a serious subject. You may need a sense of humour as well.

I blaspheme on purpose.

But there is a time and a place for blasphemy, just as there is for wild kinky danger sex.

The way some of you raise your hackles when Jesus is mentioned reminds me of those archetypal SJW's when Trump is mentioned. You are positively bristling and triggered. The amount of snide and snark in this thread is off the scale. But that's ok. This thread is a sandbox.

Let it out. Say what you really think.

Again, I'm being flippant and trite, as we all know we all have to abide by the rules of this forum. And hopefully we all observe the Golden Rule as well without having to be reminded of it.

Fuck, I'm on your side. But you are not bringing your best.

It's a shame my brother died. He'd have ripped both all the Christians and you Atheists a new fucking arsehole. There was no debating him. He was right. In the way that only a seriously militant atheist could be.

Oh, he supped from the Dawkins/Harris trough all right, and more.

Dennett, Hitchens - the Four Horsemen of the new militant atheistic apocalypse, as they have been called self-referentially and self-reverentially.

And you know what, they make a lot of good points too.

And I defend their right to say it to the death. What's more, I defend their right to think it, to the death.

But my bro' went deeper again. He'd have torn the Four Horsemen a new arsehole as well, just for skirting around the issue and not really 'saying what they thought'. Bless him.

He had it all worked out. He had the answers.

If you ever study Buddhism to any extent you will come across a phenomenon known as the Stone Buddha. That's my bro'.

It usually refers to one that is overly pious (Bosch has alluded to this many times with his dealings with people around him) - usually one from the Theravadan school which focuses more on self-discipline rather than transcendence of the 'soul' as Mahayana does. A cold fish.

As Buddhism evolved there came to be a thing known as the Middle Way. No man is perfect. We are not worshiping Gods anyway, so we don't wish or need to be seen in his image. We are but men, fallible, but trying to do the right thing. Let us not be too pious. Too ascetic. Lest we crack and get a raging hard on and start abusing all those pretty little alter boys, kind of thing. Excuse my blasphemy, once again.

But here is the kicker.

For all my Stone Buddha brother's certainty with having the answer (that there is no answer) - he really did have the answer. He really was right. But that didn't make him 'right'.

For all his belief in nothing - I won't call it Nihilism because it was more than that - he still had certain beliefs.

He did not want to be cremated. He wanted to go back in to the earth. The dirt. Not up in flames.

Some that sail the oceans and the seven seas welcome a burial at sea.

But why, if you don't believe in anything, if you've got it all worked out, would you care?

The graveyards are filling up. It's not so easy finding a nice little spot of real estate to spend the rest of eternity.

And again, who came up with the goods?

Das right! Those wicked child molesting Christians!

Pretty sure they weren't told the full extent of my bro's atheistic tendencies, but there you go.

Even so, in their hearts, the true among them, will welcome this lost sheep in to their fold. Or at least I'd like to think so.

One day I will tell them and we shall see.

Perhaps they will decide to dig the fucker up and have a bonfire just out of spite. Who knows? The Lord moves in mysterious ways, doth he not?


An atheist he might have been, but a decent human being he most certainly was.

I'll never forget the rage he showed one day when we were watching the news. Some thugs had broken in to some guy's corner shop and were calling him a 'fucking paki' and beating the shit out of him (the shop owner) before nicking a load of his stuff.

I have no doubt he'd have put those fuckers in a shallow grave as well.

So yeah, you can be an atheist and have morals.

You can believe in nothing at all and feel totally abandoned by any kind of God. And in that moment, God rises. You are free from your shackles to do what thou wilt - that is the whole of the law. Any act can be justified. Any atrocity carried out.

You are a free man. No longer an animal; bound by rules and regulations of religion. You are a God, yourself. Giver of life and death. Keeper of life and death. Taker of life and death.

Builder of worlds. Keeper of worlds. Destroyer of worlds.

Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva...

And in that moment...

You weep.

You fall to your knees.

Just a man. With no God to save you now. No God to judge you.


And finally, you come to know God.


You weep.

Sentient of your own impotence.

And of God's omnipotence.

You find the seed of goodness within you...

And you weep some more, till there is nothing left inside of you.

And you feel cleansed. All your sins washed away.


That's why there's No Religion, No Religion, No Religion, here today!

[Rigsby]

And as for Nietzche who said that God is dead, I beg to differ!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_is_dead


God is not dead at all - he's merely resting and pining for the fjords!

[KMK]

edit: meh, forget it