[Laner]

The American mentality strikes me as one of, "When its broke, we will build a new one".

So it makes sense, some of the shitholes in the USA are in the process of being discarded, and the people are moving on to new and better places. It might happen faster in the US than other places also because of the mindset of the people. Americans are doers, and they have an optimism and bravado that makes the people its best asset and not some opiate addicted NE shitsville.

I tend to agree with some places in SF or LA being a bit terrifying in their all-out destruction of civilized society and how fast and hard they seemed to embrace it. Zero Fucks Given by the people at the bottom, so much that they make a point of putting it directly in everyone's face. This is not normal and is something I have never seen anywhere else.

[Easy_C]

America isn't entirely a dump. It's getting heavily "brazilified" where some areas are heavily gentrified, clean, high-class residential and shopping areas and most of the rest is heavily run down.


I've lived all over the place and in my experience a lot of the most pleasant towns, communities, and best kept up infrastructure can be found in the Rockies.

[porscheguy]

As far as safety goes in the US much of the country is as safe, or safer than Europe. I live in a high income area that will never see diversification. If you look out of place in my neighborhood, we’ll take notice. I don’t lock my doors.

Even in most of the shittiest parts of the US, it will be obvious when you’re in a shitty area, and for the most part, if you mind your business and keep moving, you’ll be fine.

Most of the violence in the us is between people who know each other. If you’re not an antagonistic, dishonest person who likes to hang out in shitty neighborhoods, it virtually guarantees a life free from danger.

Government may corrupt at the top, but in most of the US, paying bribes is not the custom when dealing with low level government employees.

Our interstates are in mostly good repair and safe for travel.

Most Americans can afford to eat steak once or more per week.

As crazy as our healthcare seems, if you’re broke, uninsured, and show up to an ER, you will receive treatment.

What percentage of Americans use airports on a regular enough basis to even ponder their condition? 10%? 20?

Has Cernovich done anything since he was on 60 minutes?

[TheUsual]

(01-14-2019 04:51 PM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:  

Saw this tweet by Cernovich and thought it was interesting.

[url=https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/1084921426723823616][/url]

People who've traveled significantly internationally, is this true in your experience? Compared to the other countries you've visited, how does the US stack up?

Some observations I've made:

1. Our airports are an absolute disgrace. The planes don't take off on time. The buildings are falling apart. The employees are surly and the security scans are invasive. We look terrible to the outside world.
2. America feels significantly less safe than the places in Asia I've been to. One night in Asia, I was angry and insomniac and stormed out of my apartment at 3:00 AM, wandering the streets randomly. I ended up blundering into a homeless encampment. Nobody paid me any attention and I just walked right through it unmolested. If that happened in the US I'd be lucky to escape with my life.
3. US Supermarkets are astonishingly well stocked. The sheer variety of stuff you can get at a simple Ralphs is unbelievable, and there's one on every corner.
4. Road infrastructure is pretty bad, and public transit is non-existent. Taking the bus is a last resort, as opposed to a default mode of transportation.
5. Housing in America is bigger and nicer than Asia, and not significantly more expensive unless you're trying to live in a major city or California. My apartment would be considered palatial in Asia.
6. It's extremely difficult to make friends in the United States. Asia has a ton of little bar and places in every neighborhood, where you can stop in and have a drink, and it's expected that you'll chat with the people around you. American bars are unbelievably expensive, and they're set up so that everyone sits at their own table and doesn't interact with the people around them.
7. The American healthcare system is terrifying. I've had Asian friends with 7 figure bankrolls tell me they don't want me to come to the US 'cause they're worried about being sent to the hospital and ending up with a gigantic bill. I can't say that they're wrong.
   

What kinds of things have you guys noticed when comparing the US to the rest of the world? Is the US a dump?

Wait I'm genuinely curious as to why you lumped #3 in with a list of complaints about the US. Isn't this a good thing about our country? As for the other points I'm about 99% in agreement with most of the other replies here. I will say this about the airports I've been in JFK and LA and they're absolute heaven compared to the hell that is NAIA in Manila.

[35 year old Virgin]

Yes, I can't even lose my virginity

[Geomann180]

America is a rough and you just gotta find your diamond in it. A lot of countries don't even have that,

As for Cernovich, I've stopped giving a shit about his opinions a few years ago with all the talking out of both sides of his mouth that he does. Don't take his word for it, find out for yourself.

G

[SamuelBRoberts]

(01-14-2019 08:28 PM)TheUsual Wrote:  

Wait I'm genuinely curious as to why you lumped #3 in with a list of complaints about the US. Isn't this a good thing about our country? As for the other points I'm about 99% in agreement with most of the other replies here. I will say this about the airports I've been in JFK and LA and they're absolute heaven compared to the hell that is NAIA in Manila.

'cause it's not a complaint, just an observation.

[EndsExpect]

(01-14-2019 04:51 PM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:  

[url=https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/1084921426723823616][/url]

What kinds of things have you guys noticed when comparing the US to the rest of the world? Is the US a dump?

Here is the issue. American corporations have been dumping their money into large cities for the past 15 years. Those cities also tend to be very poorly run and managed. They are very liberal and the voters don't really give a shit how poorly the city is run, how clogged it gets with homeless, how abysmal the crime rate is.... ect. Instead they are crusading against plastic bags and carbon dioxide... and attack police. So... Yes, most major US cities are shitholes, and there is no Guilianni coming to save them.

On the same token suburban and rural America is being starved for tax revenue and growth.

[ShotgunUppercuts]

The sky isn’t falling .

[moneyshot]

It may be a (multi-)cultural wasteland in many of the urban parts. The living conditions themselves are great (if you stay out of the bad parts, like anyone with common sense would in any place in the world).

[BlueMark]

American cities are fine if you compare them to developing countries (most of Latin America, Africa, India, Southeast Asia).

But it sure feels like one if you compare it to other developed countries. Compared to European countries (pre-2015) or Japan/South Korea/Taiwan/Singapore, the USA feels stuck in the past.

Large, dense American cities like SF and NYC seem to suffer from an unwillingness to look at countries with more successful urban infrastructure and learn from them. Politics always gets in the way as well, which means any solutions that actually get implemented are done with 5x the cost (e.g. NYC 2nd ave subway) or in a sloppy way (e.g. I can't read many of the new next-train signs in the NYC subway because they are blocked by the damn ceiling lights when I look down the platform).

[PapayaTapper]

Complaining is expressing dissatisfaction or annoyance about a state of affairs. There there is a difference between complaining and providing useful critique.

Expressing your feelings for a better America is one of the most patriotic things an American do.

Complaining about America is not.

If Cernovich is saying America can do better I agree. If he's just complaining then he can just stay wherever he feels is "better" and not come back

[Delta]

This is laughable and a clear example of "grass is greener" bias. It's not debatable that the U.S. offers a superior quality of life to most of the world, just look at which way the immigration flows. But fine, maybe that's strawmanning and everyone agrees it's trivial to compare the U.S. to developing nations, and the argument is that it has fallen behind the rest of the developed world (e.g. Western Europe). America's negatives are well-known, so I won't bother going into them here, but I can also point to plenty of ways in which Americans have it better than citizens of other developed nations:

-Roads. Local roads in Europe are horrifically narrow and crappy. After visiting Europe, driving back home was a breath of fresh air.
-Smoking. Far fewer people smoke in the U.S. than in Europe.
-Terrorism, or relative lack thereof. This isn't us doing anything right so much as having an ocean separating us from the riff-raff of the world, but it still counts.
-Air conditioning. I couldn't believe how many places in Europe do without A/C. In the U.S., if it's above 80 Farenheit you'd better believe every business is blasting that shit like there's no tomorrow... and it feels amazing
-Business friendly environment, leading to much greater selection of virtually any product or service for the consumer.
-Spaciousness. If you're used to living in the states, everything in Europe feels a bit on the cramped side.
-The "nice" neighborhoods are way nicer in the U.S. I've never seen houses that look remotely like this outside US/Canada, but here it's pretty common:

-Sandwiches. What other countries call "sandwiches" are a joke. Europeans would lose their mind with delight if they saw a $7 convenience store sub in the U.S.
-Innovation. A hugely disproportionate amount of the world's technology and innovation is born here, meaning Americans get to be the first to enjoy them.
-Healthcare quality. Yeah the cost is outrageous, but if you're going to point that out, you need to also mention that the quality of care and the [lack of] wait times are top notch.
-Higher education. Again, can be fucking expensive, but notice a pattern scrolling through these? Also, college doesn't have to be expensive. Most of the hand wringing about the cost of college in the U.S. is done by mediocre students who incorrectly perceive themselves as too good for community college.
-Optimistic attitudes. Take it with the proper grain of salt, but America does more than fine in happiness surveys.
-Freedom of speech. Other countries pay lip service to this idea, but then make exceptions for "hate speech" or whatever other nasty label they can slap on thoughts that the ruling class doesn't like. America is the one place where you can bet your ass the public would not remotely tolerate any law against expressing an opinion.

And this is just off the top of my head.

I'm in no way arguing that America is wholly superior to everywhere else; Western Europe certainly has its advantages as well. But there's way too much bitching done by Americans who are incapable of seeing the good in their home country. Calling the U.S. a dump is idiotic.

[eradicator]

No, we are good for now, but if we follow in the footsteps of Europe and import several million migrants to line the streets, we will have to deal with the rape gangs, the spike in violent crime, the masses of Muslim migrants who refuse to adapt to their new countries and instead insist that the host countries adapt to them.

I'm not even sure what Mike is referring to in that tweet. We get shitloads of tourists.

[TigerMandingo]

(01-14-2019 10:46 PM)eradicator Wrote:  

No, we are good for now, but if we follow in the footsteps of Europe and import several million migrants to line the streets, we will have to deal with the rape gangs, the spike in violent crime, the masses of Muslim migrants who refuse to adapt to their new countries and instead insist that the host countries adapt to them.

Wrong target. There are millions of Muslims living in america already and they are peaceful and productive members, despite whatever propaganda we keep hearing.

I don't know why dudes on the alt-right are so scared to mention the elephant in the room: black crime. It is THE overriding issue plaguing American cities and part of what is making them unlivable. Not MS-13, not Mexican Mafia, not a supposed Islamic terrorist in Dearborn. Black crime.

[eradicator]

It can work. There is a decent amount of productive Somali immigrants in Minnesota

https://pics.ballmemes.com/believe-in-so...003647.png

However, if we open the floodgates and let anyone in, we will have the same problems as Germany, France, and Sweden.

[WalterBlack]

(01-14-2019 09:27 PM)BlueMark Wrote:  

American cities are fine if you compare them to developing countries (most of Latin America, Africa, India, Southeast Asia).

But it sure feels like one if you compare it to other developed countries. Compared to European countries (pre-2015) or Japan/South Korea/Taiwan/Singapore, the USA feels stuck in the past.

Large, dense American cities like SF and NYC seem to suffer from an unwillingness to look at countries with more successful urban infrastructure and learn from them. Politics always gets in the way as well, which means any solutions that actually get implemented are done with 5x the cost (e.g. NYC 2nd ave subway) or in a sloppy way (e.g. I can't read many of the new next-train signs in the NYC subway because they are blocked by the damn ceiling lights when I look down the platform).

I've been in London, NYC in the last few weeks and I live in LA. A couple of observations:

LAX airport is a disaster - you get stuck in traffic just going from one terminal to another, it can take 20 mins to get to your terminal. The planes may take off on time, but the overall layout of the airport is shit. Public transport connections to LAX are horrible. It would take 90 mins to get to my place on public transport. I could drive there in 15 -30 min depending on traffic.

Los Angeles roads are a disaster. There's potholes everywhere, and some roads in India are a higher quality than LA. I blame the city of Los Angeles, when I drive from Los Angeles into Burbank the quality of the roads improves drastically.

Subways - LA's doesn't go anywhere - it's not even underground in a lot of places, it's at street level and goes through traffic intersections. Some of the lines aren't even train lines - they're dedicated bus lanes with a bus on them. That's just embarrassing.

NYC subway looks like nobody's done shit about it for the last 50 years. In a lot of stations there's no signs indicating when the next train is coming, or if there is one it's barely visible. In the trains themselves, some have no maps or nothing to indicate where the train is.

London's roads and subways are of a way higher standard than both LA and NYC. There's clear signage everywhere.

I've been in LA for over 10 years - it's gentrified a lot over the years, but there's homeless everywhere now - they used to stay near skid row in downtown LA. I live close to a public park and there's been a homeless guy camped out there for the last couple of years.

I've been to Tokyo and Hong Kong. Their subways are all superior to LA and NYC.

Having said all of that, I do like living in the US. I became a citizen in the last year.

[Fortis]

No way.

I've been to about 10 countries and lived abroad 2 times in my life. Once in the Carribean for a short time (less than a year) and now in China.

Honestly, USA is not a dump and I say this as a dude is was rather bitter about his life in usa back in the day.

1. Tons of nutritious and easily-accessible food in any major city

Unless you're a moron with no willpower it's so easy to get a great, healthy diet. Even if you're broke and you have to eat big, scary GMO food (the paranoia about GMO food is horseshit, btw), you can still get lean meat and vegetables every damn day and never go hungry. People in America don't die of starvation. They die from being too damn fat. Fucking hilarious.

2. Reasonably Safe

I lived in a pretty bad American city for most of my life.

The # of times I have been robbed? 1.

Am I street smart? No, but I am aware of who is around me. If some weirdo who looks like he smells bad and probably is trippin on drugs is approaching me I know to cross the street or go away.

There are shootings and stuff in my area but that's mostly gangbangers each other, not normal citizens getting assassinated Sicario-style.

As much as guys like to glorify how safe asia is, it's just as crime-ridden in many ways but it's just white collar crimes. People charging you more money or denying you entry to places for not being one of them. Sure, it's not violent crime but it's criminal bullshit and it stacks and can get you in trouble.

Tyrone steals your watch and maybe beats your ass. He's a pest but he's avoidable and his crimes usually get him killed or locked away forever.

In Asia the damn cops are the actual gangsters. Enough said. The amount of palm-greasing and bribery that goes on makes you wonder who in there right mind DOES NOT want to be a cop in Asia. Seems like the easiest fucking job with 0 oversight.

They're both crooks, but some people just hide it better.

3. There's money

let's be real. Most of us could not travel and hate on America if we didn't at least get our move abroad start-up cash working some job in USA. The dollar is fucking dope and I pray to my lucky stars every night that my passport has USA on it.

4. Our culture is/was governed by a strong, robust code of ethics

I'm not religious but I do think that Christianity as the cultural fabric of the west was one of the things that made USA great. You are expected to help people in need. Up until recently, if you interfered with criminals trying to fuck up your neighborhood the cops commended you and any charges you incurred could be dropped or reduced since all the witnesses and the judge knew you did a good thing.

Things have changed but I do think that most people in America do stick to a code of sorts when it comes to shit like that. If some low-class punks get pushed out by angry property owners few people give a shit about the rights of those losers.

In many other places on this earth? If you're an outsider and you protect yourself, loved ones and strangers from some bullshit you might be the one that everyone's angry with because you touched one of the glorious locals of shitholistan.

5. We have a culture worth exporting

All these other countries with shit to prove want SO badly to export their lukewarm, limp-dick cultures, but it simply doesn't work. America culture at its greatest is just fucking inspiring. Sometimes I'm talking to a stranger about where I'm from and I feel a bit of pride. Objectively, I'm not from anywhere someone should care about but then I think of all the great things produced in my home state that have changed the world and I'm like "fuck yeah!"

6. Americans are pretty altruistic

In the USA I've been absolutely hammered and people have put me in a taxi and thrown the driver some cash and I got home. I have also done the same for strangers and I'm hardly a Samaritan. Just a regular American.

I've never seen this go down in Asia once. I got too drunk in China and I woke up on the sidewalk in front of my house with my keys and wallet missing. The best part a bunch of people were standing around me talking about what could be wrong with me. No one moved to help me. I could have been dead for 10 hours and no one would have known.

7. Our buildings don't look great but they're often built to last

If you've seen architecture in a lot of other countries (barring Europe) it's pretty but in 2 years that shit is falling apart. In america you regularly see houses that are 100+ years old that look beautiful and tell the story of the period they were from.

8. The hottest bishes from all over the earth come to USA

I've heard Colombian and Dominican friends say that they see hotter Dominican and Colombian girls in Miami than they do in their respective countries. They're trolling a bit I'm sure, but let's be fucking real. A chick who has top-tier looks but not much money can lock down a dude making lots of cash and just cruise for life in USA.

9. Doctors know what the fuck they're doing

People take for granted how good American medical care actually is. It's expensive as fuck and the system is broken, but if you've ever been to a hospital in a place like China you sometimes feel like you know more than these old sawbones types. I had a friend get a UTI and the doctors gave him meds. That shit didn't' work and it got so bad he had to fly back to Australia to get treatment. How the fuck does that happen?

10. The Education system is not that fucking bad

I know guys cry about feminist conditioning in classes, but the right public and private schools in the right states blows many places out of the water when it comes to actual efficiency. Elementary school kids are not doing homework until 9pm like they are in China and they grow up with better social skills in many cases. Studying until 10pm every night from 5-18 makes you a bit autistic. Who knew?

I will say that China's elementary school shit is A+ but after elementary school you're turning your kid into a robot if you don't send them to an international school or do something else.

The education system is China has kids going to school like 6-7 days a week in some cases but do you actually feel like you're dealing with someone who is outright smarter than you? I do meet some super smart local dudes my age, but for every dude who is mega smart and went entirely through their country's school system I meet 20 guys who are way smarter who studied in the West. We still produce some of the finest minds in the world when we aim to teach.

[Fortis]

(01-14-2019 10:57 PM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  

(01-14-2019 10:46 PM)eradicator Wrote:  

No, we are good for now, but if we follow in the footsteps of Europe and import several million migrants to line the streets, we will have to deal with the rape gangs, the spike in violent crime, the masses of Muslim migrants who refuse to adapt to their new countries and instead insist that the host countries adapt to them.

Wrong target. There are millions of Muslims living in america already and they are peaceful and productive members, despite whatever propaganda we keep hearing.

I don't know why dudes on the alt-right are so scared to mention the elephant in the room: black crime. It is THE overriding issue plaguing American cities and part of what is making them unlivable. Not MS-13, not Mexican Mafia, not a supposed Islamic terrorist in Dearborn. Black crime.

I'd still say you're both off target. Also, don't a lot of alt-right youtubers and their affiliates talk about black crime? That's hardly a new problem.

I do agree, but I'd say you can also go deeper than that and say the biggest issue plaguing American cities are (((banking cabals))).

But seriously, America's wages have stagnated for decades yet taxes keep going up to pay for nebulous wars that go nowhere and contribute nothing to the bottom line.

Black culture is pretty fucking retarded but that's pretty easy to clean up.

Slice up welfare
Highly discourage divorce
Stop letting the government import cocaine to our cities to fund god-knows-what
Institute stop-and-frisk in places with dire crime problems (Chicago).

I know dudes will look at me sideways for that last one, but hey.


Our own government preying on us, though? Now that's an intractable problem.

[Trumpian]

America is a "dump" in the cultural sense. What is it like 60% of Americans never even get a passport issued? I find it pretty hard to relate to my countrymen on that account alone.

But as far as amenities, housing, infrastructure (minus public transport), job market, nature/environment, etc. it's better than almost anywhere else in the world. There's a handful of countries that would be better to live in but they all have smaller populations than Texas, and the COL/income ratio isn't anywhere comparable.

[Kona]

I forget how much Hawaii is different from the mainland.

Aloha!

[Fortis]

Even then, Trumpian. How is a place a dump if 60% of the population does not want to leave? You can't even pay some people to bother traveling.

If anything that means the place has done its job. It's pegged them down to a single location and has them paying taxes without all the hassle of tracking them. That is not a dump, my friend. If anything, that means the culture gives most people everything they want. I'm speaking broadly and there are many things America supposedly doesn't have but I have yet to find a country that is the full package in the way that America almost is.

You want to see /spiritual/natural beauty? You have several states to choose from. Some of those places are bigger than countries and more beautiful than many countries. I'm from a pretty lame place by all accounts and we have some beautiful nature if you know where to look.

You want to get a world-class education? You got several schools and countless "hidden" ivy league schools.

You want to eat 100% organic cherries grown with manure from meerkats? I gotchu, fam.

You want to start a business? You can do it in 30 minutes.

You wanna fuck a girl from a different country every week? Move to any major coastal city and fire up tinder or get some boots on the ground.

Contrast that with most of the world. They'd gladly put up with the shit I hate if it meant they could have my life in America but honestly, I don't want citizenship in most countries on this earth. The only reason I've even looked into a second citizenship is because America is sorta odd right now. If USA never had any major problems I would actually think a second citizenship is a waste of time and energy. You spend all this money trying to curry favor with a strictly inferior nation. Fuck all that.

Wanna see real dumps? Leave the first world nations and then get back to me about USA being a dump.

[Trumpian]

Well low rates of passport issuance are usually only seen in the 3rd world, as the people don't have the money to travel. America is an anomaly in that regard. Part of it is North America is pretty cut off and expensive to travel from compared to the rest of the world. But mainly, Americans just aren't interested in the world around them. That lack of inquisitive spirit makes them rather boring to talk to frankly.

My main gripe though having lived in Europe is the public transport. The idea that you need to buy a car just to function in most American cities is insane. There's $4 trillion in Federal expenditure each year, and they can't build a high speed rail? That's American hyper individualism for you. No sacrifice for the common good. Everybody wants their own gas guzzling f -150.

[RawGod]

Housing is much more affordable in the USA than in Australia or New Zealand. There is a wide swathe of heartland America, including many cities from 100k to 1m with good living standards, where you can live cheaply and well compared to Down Under.

[Foolsgo1d]

It has dumps but overall its not a dump. Too many criminals and mental cases who should be locked up and away.

I would rather be in the USA than some thid world shit hole or even second tier country if things went bad. Look at any disasters in those areas and most people are quick to turn on you or jump ahead.