[ChicagoFire]

@RDF
To each his own I guess. I personally don't like seeing politicians screwing the world up. Why can't there be a "leave her better than you found her" version for politicians?

"The rot goes further back in the Bush clan, Prescott's grandfather was part of a group that made a fortune reselling defective rifles to the North during the Civil War, which his clan and the other 19th century oligarchs agitated for."

That's news to me. I've known for years that Prescott Bush was in cahoots with the Nazis. Maybe I should capitalize TREASONOUS to get the point across the Bushes are scum.

[zigZag]

The way the world is going now I feel like If a guy like Stalin died today there would be a large group of people saying nice things about him.. telling him to Rest in peace and all that stuff. This guy was a horrible man who did evil shit. I'm not saying piss on his grave... What I'm saying.. Dance on it.

[911]

(12-01-2018 05:23 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 01:21 PM)durangotang Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 05:14 AM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

Im not asking you to hold my my hand Sweetheart nor do I need you to point me in the direction of fucking "rabbit holes" Good Sir... (Please note Im restraining myself from calling you a condescending butt licking faggot)

But rather than just dismiss your seemingly conclusive (ie informed) statements as products of your personal knowledge as being extracted from your anus I thought Id provide you an opportunity to provide one reasonable source or reference to support your seemingly summary dismissive rendition to a significant 94 year old American, veteran, war hero's , POTUS and public servant who was instrumental in ending the Cold War.

Im pretty familiar with with "Google" you fucktard.

Are you?

Lol. So sensitive.

Not sensitive...drunk. I'll withdraw the "butt licking faggot" and "fucktard"

Note to self: No posting on RVF after the 3rd or 4th scotch

One of the best things about RVF is that almost nothing is outside the Overton Window. But its standard practice to at least provide some source when stating a more extreme position.

I have no strong opinion of Bush Sr beyond my existing impressions. If he was in fact a Satanist, and pedophile then my opinion of him would change. But the facts are the facts

911's post with the video of the interview with author Roger Stone is interesting and I might even read the book if I get around to it.

Im not naive. I have little trouble believing that anyone who operated at that level of power, money and influence has a proportional amount of dirt under the carpets and skeletons in the closet. You cant really have one without the other

"Behind every great fortune lies a great crime"- Honore de Balzac

But I still have seen no evidence that he was a Satanist or kiddie phucker. Doesn't mean he wasn't...just haven't seen anything to support that.

If you have any sources that would support that he was and you feel are credible then I'd be interested and Im sure others would as well

I'll bump up this thread when I come up with relevant and accessible material about the dark spiritual dimension of the Bushes. For now, suffize to say that Skull and Bones are not exactly a Christian fraternity. HWB's role in the attempt on Reagan's life is far better documented, Stone's book would be a good start.

[911]

(12-01-2018 05:37 PM)dicknixon72 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 05:23 PM)911 Wrote:  

The rot goes further back in the Bush clan, Prescott's grandfather was part of a group that made a fortune reselling defective rifles to the North during the Civil War, which his clan and the other 19th century oligarchs agitated for.

Source? Not asking argumentatively; genuinely curious

I've posted hastily from memory, and got the wrong war. Prescott Bush's father, Samuel Bush, was indeed a high-level war profiteer, but that was during WW1. I've conflated him with JP Morgan, who made out like a bandit selling defective rifles to the Union army.

Samuel Bush was a bigtime unscrupulous war profiteer on his own right though, this is a well-documented fact. Cal State prof Eric Karlstrom on Samuel Bush:

Quote:

Among the most pro-active implementers of this centuries-old project to establish a one-world government are the Bush family, two of which have risen to become U.S. presidents. A brief summary of their major accomplishments should be sufficient to indicate that their activities constitute the highest crimes against the people of the United States and humanity.

II. Samuel Prescott Bush (1863-1948: George W. Bush’s great grandfather). Founder of the Buckeye Steel Castings Company in 1894, Remington Arms Company, and Chief of the Ordnance, Small Arms and Ammunition Section of the War Industries Board for World War I.

In 1918, just after the US entered World War I, Bush became chief of the Ordnance, Small Arms and Ammunition Section of the War Industries Board. In this capacity, he sold weapons made by manufacturers such as his own Remington Arms Company to 75% of the WWI combatants on both sides. Congressional committee hearings in 1934 by U.S. Senator Gerald Nye attacked Bush and other weapons salesmen as war profiteers and “Merchants of Death.” Salesmen from these companies had helped to manipulate the nations into World War I and then made astronomical profits from the sales of the weapons, at the taxpayer’s expense of course. In 1914, the German army under the Kaiser, armed mainly by Samuel Bush, was the largest and best armed in the world. After WWI, the German army was forced to disarm, but Bush was allowed to keep his many millions, and his arms business thrived. In 1944, Bush was awarded a huge government contract to make armor casings for WWII. Most of the records and correspondence of Samuel Bush’s arms deals have been burned “to save space” in the National Archives. This pattern of the systematic deletion of large portions of the public records is typical of all the Bushes.

http://12160.info/profiles/blogs/the-bus...war-making

[Pride male]

(12-01-2018 06:22 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

The way the world is going now I feel like If a guy like Stalin died today there would be a large group of people saying nice things about him.. telling him to Rest in peace and all that stuff. This guy was a horrible man who did evil shit. I'm not saying piss on his grave... What I'm saying.. Dance on it.

I thought there were people grieving over Stalins death. Dont the Russians revere Stalin today? Wasnt he voted the greatest Russian of all time?

[Leonard D Neubache]

Stalin was like a father that mercilessly beat and whipped his son from birth until that son was capable of fighting in the heavyweight division.

The son would not be where he is today without the father, but in the end he was still the man who mercilessly beat and whipped him for decades.

[911]

The son would have been a lot further if Stalin didn't crush his knee as a teenager, and he also totally maimed his older brother. Trotsky and Lenin on the other hand just beat the boys to death.

Leftie normies lionize Trotsky, think Lenin had some good sides, but think that Stalin was where the Russian Revolution went bad, when in fact Stalin was slightly better than the other two.

Stalin's stock went up a bit after Yeltsin, who was an absolute traitor-whore to his nation. Boris was the deadbeat dad who spent all his salary on booze and let his family starve, while Jo was the violent dad who brought home the bacon.

[CynicalContrarian]

Another dead globalist.

No loss there whatsoever.

The only good globalist is a dead globalist.

[Pride male]

(12-02-2018 03:06 AM)911 Wrote:  

The son would have been a lot further if Stalin didn't crush his knee as a teenager, and he also totally maimed his older brother. Trotsky and Lenin on the other hand just beat the boys to death.

Leftie normies lionize Trotsky, think Lenin had some good sides, but think that Stalin was where the Russian Revolution went bad, when in fact Stalin was slightly better than the other two.

Stalin's stock went up a bit after Yeltsin, who was an absolute traitor-whore to his nation. Boris was the deadbeat dad who spent all his salary on booze and let his family starve, while Jo was the violent dad who brought home the bacon.

And Mao? Why put a man who killed tens of millions of his countrymen on their money?

[Syberpunk]

(12-02-2018 01:13 AM)Pride male Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:22 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

The way the world is going now I feel like If a guy like Stalin died today there would be a large group of people saying nice things about him.. telling him to Rest in peace and all that stuff. This guy was a horrible man who did evil shit. I'm not saying piss on his grave... What I'm saying.. Dance on it.

I thought there were people grieving over Stalins death. Dont the Russians revere Stalin today? Wasnt he voted the greatest Russian of all time?

Jesus, could you imagine Hitler being voted the greatest German of all time? One has the fewer death camps and famines and is despised, the other has mass starvations and bigger death camps and overall death toll and is beloved, and not an eyelid batted.

And we wonder who won WW2?

[Days of Broken Arrows]

(12-01-2018 12:21 PM)PolymathGuru Wrote:  

wasn't this the guy who wanted to create the new world order?

It was. But when he said that the world was a completely different place.

We'd had over 30 years of the Cold War. People dismiss this, but "Russia bombing" was a threat that several generations grew up with. I'd recommend researching this if you didn't live through it. It was a major part of our culture, running through Reagan's policies to movies (like "The Day After") through pop songs (Sting's "Russians").

When the Cold War dissipated, countries were left wondering what would happen. This is where "New World Order" came in. What he meant was that with the Cold War behind us, a new sort of diplomacy might emerge where countries wouldn't constantly be at each other's throats.

The U.S.'s new diplomacy with Russia is taken for granted now, but it was a major, major deal at the time. Boomers and Gen X-ers grew up viewing the old Soviet Union as the Ultimate Enemy. The phrase mostly came out of this change.

We did get a New World Order, but not in the way George Bush I imagined. We just changed enemies. And not only did the situation get worse in some ways (Sept. 11), but corporations got bigger and gained massive power, bringing an ominous new meaning to his phrase.

But in 1991, when the Berlin Wall had recently fallen and the Soviet Union was no longer a black cloud to America, this phrase meant something positive -- and not at all what it signifies in retrospect.

[griffinmill]

What I don't get is how the media eulogises these people. They did the same with John McCain. Both of these men were serial warmongers with a penchant for death and destruction (particularly in countries where death and destruction could be wrought on mostly brown people). Yet the media paints a misty-eyed picture of these two as heroic statesmen. Their crimes far outweigh Trump in basic morality. Bush's crimes are legion. Yet the same media treats Trump as Literally Hitler for... wanting to control the borders?

[eradicator]

From what I understand, many in China speak fondly of Mao(he did some good things, some atrocities and some really stupid things with good intentions, the one child policy leading to mass infanticide and a shortage of women). as well as Idi Amin(the Ugandan dictator), some Ugandan criticizes that lived through his time say things were better under the dictators rule despite the mass ethnic slaying s, atrocities and gross economic mismanagement. No one does this for Hitler but apparently they do it for Mao, Amin, and Stalin.

I don’t get it.

[rpg]

(12-02-2018 09:11 AM)griffinmill Wrote:  

What I don't get is how the media eulogises these people. They did the same with John McCain. Both of these men were serial warmongers with a penchant for death and destruction (particularly in countries where death and destruction could be wrought on mostly brown people). Yet the media paints a misty-eyed picture of these two as heroic statesmen. Their crimes far outweigh Trump in basic morality. Bush's crimes are legion. Yet the same media treats Trump as Literally Hitler for... wanting to control the borders?

They do it to make Trump look bad.

[moneyshot]

Media pulling the same shit with another dead famous Republican as they did with McCain. Suddenly he's appreciated for what he accomplished after he was pilloried by the same mainstream press during his time in his highest office/position. Bunch of disingenuous crap.

[TigerMandingo]

Stalin is a complicated character. Yes he was a monster. But he also presided over an army that defeated the greatest evil the world has ever known. So he has that going for him.

[TravelerKai]

(12-01-2018 03:18 AM)dicknixon72 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 02:20 AM)durangotang Wrote:  

So pardon me if I am not fucking glad this son of a bitch is dead. I only wish it was as a result of a trial for treason, so that there may finally be a restoration of justice in this country.

Don't forget HW Bush was also responsible for major escalation of the manufactured war on drugs, including extensive CIA and military involvement.

When people like to blame Clinton for the mass incarceration of black men, many forget that Bush actually started it with his War on Drugs, that actually was a massive front for CIA and DEA activity that would flood black neighborhoods with drugs. Reagan may have had a small part in starting it (maybe large) but Bush poured gasoline on it.

Anyone lately that hates Trump or is opposite of Trump gets revered these days and their sins not only forgiven (not a bad thing) but also forgotten (the real crime). These days idiotic nig nogs are not just blacks, but also liberal whites too.

We really screwed up as a society letting history be written by particular group of liberal people.

[TravelerKai]

(12-02-2018 09:35 AM)eradicator Wrote:  

From what I understand, many in China speak fondly of Mao(he did some good things, some atrocities and some really stupid things with good intentions, the one child policy leading to mass infanticide and a shortage of women). as well as Idi Amin(the Ugandan dictator), some Ugandan criticizes that lived through his time say things were better under the dictators rule despite the mass ethnic slaying s, atrocities and gross economic mismanagement. No one does this for Hitler but apparently they do it for Mao, Amin, and Stalin.

I don’t get it.

It's a bit more complicated than this, but nobody likes a loser. Mao exited on his own terms and was not captured, nor committed suicide. He even had children. Hitler had/done none of these things.

Hitler may have done a handful of good things for the German people, but he did not live to see it through. Mao made a shitload of mistakes but did not completely fuck it all up and died at an old age.

The victors get to write history, while true to a degree, neglects the skill and sometimes luck it took to get to the end.

[stugatz]

After my initial "fuck Bush" post, another thought. I think Bush's Willie Horton ad was one of the most effective political ads of all time. It's getting a lot of fresh discussion this week.

Nothing racist about it at all. Dukakis's furlough policies extended to all prisoners were so stupid the ad wrote itself. Democrats only denounce it because it was aggressive and worked.

Despite Dukakis being a Greek Orthodox Christian, I was always shocked at what a bleeding heart he was.

[LoveBug]

Is it worth it kicking on til 94? I know I’ll feel different when I’m older but I feel you die when your old anyways, which is why I go so hard now, dietarily/pills etc

[renotime]

(12-02-2018 02:49 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 03:18 AM)dicknixon72 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 02:20 AM)durangotang Wrote:  

So pardon me if I am not fucking glad this son of a bitch is dead. I only wish it was as a result of a trial for treason, so that there may finally be a restoration of justice in this country.

Don't forget HW Bush was also responsible for major escalation of the manufactured war on drugs, including extensive CIA and military involvement.

When people like to blame Clinton for the mass incarceration of black men, many forget that Bush actually started it with his War on Drugs, that actually was a massive front for CIA and DEA activity that would flood black neighborhoods with drugs. Reagan may have had a small part in starting it (maybe large) but Bush poured gasoline on it.

Anyone lately that hates Trump or is opposite of Trump gets revered these days and their sins not only forgiven (not a bad thing) but also forgotten (the real crime). These days idiotic nig nogs are not just blacks, but also liberal whites too.

We really screwed up as a society letting history be written by particular group of liberal people.

The Iran Contra affair was started under Reagan's administration.

All the drug dealers went to jail and all the politicians got promoted.

[Philosopher]

(12-02-2018 01:13 AM)Pride male Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 06:22 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

The way the world is going now I feel like If a guy like Stalin died today there would be a large group of people saying nice things about him.. telling him to Rest in peace and all that stuff. This guy was a horrible man who did evil shit. I'm not saying piss on his grave... What I'm saying.. Dance on it.

I thought there were people grieving over Stalins death. Dont the Russians revere Stalin today? Wasnt he voted the greatest Russian of all time?

He was leading in the polls until the producers intervened and Alexander Nevsky was first, Petr Stolypin was second, and Stalin had to settle for bronze.

[Philosopher]

Quote:

It's a bit more complicated than this, but nobody likes a loser. Mao exited on his own terms and was not captured, nor committed suicide. He even had children. Hitler had/done none of these things.

Hitler may have done a handful of good things for the German people, but he did not live to see it through. Mao made a shitload of mistakes but did not completely fuck it all up and died at an old age.

The victors get to write history, while true to a degree, neglects the skill and sometimes luck it took to get to the end.

Not quite true as we have Thucydides "Pellopenesan War" written by the losing side, the Athenians. Not to mention the Civil War account by Jefferson Davis. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSyCn93CgM8

[Max RNR]

I was a Medic on a Mechanized Infantry Brigade in Gulf War One.

My CiC was GHWB. I didn't like him, but he knew his stuff and was respectable.

I would have served 20 (and was on track to do so), but then someone gave up the ghost and got Clinton in.

So I left.

If the course was stayed (and I am looking at you, son), Saddamn would have been overflown until he died and real regime change could have taken place.

Impatience is the mark of a young man.

Sour grapes, but ftw, right?

RIP GHWB. Tread lightly and carry a big stick, always.

Blessings upon you.

[Dusty]