[Unfadable]

Hey guys, looking for some input. Apologize for the poor English in advance.

Background:
I am 32, single, have no kids, and no debt. I live in the US but am from the FYROM. I have a paid condo in the states and own my family home in Europe. Current living expenses are around 15k USD/y, take home is around 95k. My living expenses in Europe, if I were to move back, are around 6000 a year.

I do cyber security, and my job has a pension that I could retire and draw at age 53, that, as of now, is 36k USD per year. I have been offered a job with almost double the salary, but no benefits. After paying the added health insurance and everything, the take home would be around 180k.

I have been debating taking the new position, adding to my nest-egg, and retiring in the FYROM at 40

If all I planned to do with my life was work until retirement, the answer would be easy: work until 40 and chill out. Really though, I am the only one left to pass on my family name, and starting a family has been weighing heavily on my mind. The issue I am having with that, however, is I really do not want to start a family in the states.

Has anyone been in a similar situation? How did it turn out/ how is it going? I have spent many sleepless nights over the last few months wondering what to do.

[Brodiaga]

I had to google FYDOM (Macedonia). I've never been there, but 6K per year, even with a paid off house, would give you very little room for maneuver in any country. If I were you, I would aim for a bigger amount even if I was planning to retire in the cheapest country on Earth.

You didn't mention your current net worth which is understandable, but it's hard to give you specific advice without knowing at least the approximate amount/range.

The 36K per year pension starting at 53: is it already vested? If you quit today, will you still get 36K per year, ideally adjusted for inflation, 20 years from now? If so, accepting the higher paying job offer is a no brainer. Earning 2X after tax means you have to work half the time to reach financial independence.

Depending on your current savings and how much you can get from your condo in the US by either renting or selling it, you have probably already reached bare bones FI (Financial Independence) given that you plan to retire in your home country. However, unless you hate what you do for a living, it would be a waste to shut down that firehose of cash (your job) and move to your home country at this age just to find a wife.

Is taking a sabbatical an option for you? If so, maybe you can take 6 months off to give it a try. Some companies offer career breaks/sabbaticals with an option to come back to the same job. You can also try to negotiate delayed start at that new job you've been offered. If you spend a few months in your home country, you can probably find a decent girl and then decide what to do next: stay there and work remotely (I understand that working remotely from abroad may be hard or even impossible in your line of work). Move back to the city where you currently live? Perhaps move to a more conservative/family friendly area in the US and work remotely from there?

If your plan is to retire by 40, you are on the right path and will most likely achieve this even before you reach that age, especially if you get that high paying job.

You'll probably get some great advice on RVF about game, finding a good wife and starting a family, but i don't think this is the right place to get advice on investments, money management or early retirement. For that, I would recommend the MMM forum (Mr Money Mustache). Just keep in mind that it's infested with liberals and SJWs. Use it for money-related tips and avoid political discussions.

[Kissinger2014]

Are you sure all the details are correct? Something does not seem right. Correct me if I am wrong, but you are stating that -

Current situation: 32 years old, take home pay $95,000. If you stay until 53 (21 more years), you get a pension $36,000 per year.

Option B: Work at a less secure job (presumably as a contractor) that gives you no benefits, but take home pay of $180,000?

If what I wrote is true, I think it is no brainer to take option B. The extra salary is $85,000 per year.

Put aside going back to your country and retiring/raising a family. Just assume you keep that job or a similar job just for 10 more years, and you live your same lifestyle:

$85,000 per year (the extra you are making in your new job) X 10 = $850,000

Using the 4 % rule, that is over $34,000 per year in income. (so basically building a nest egg at 42 that will be similar to the pension you would get at 53 year.

And cyber security is not a dying field. When you reach your financial goal, do not think of yourself as being `retired` but `financially independent.` You can: continue working in the United States in the same field, go back to Macedonia and work part-time, do whatever you want...

If your skills are good enough to get you a $180K job right now, even if your new job sucks, it should be easy for your to find something else that pays higher than your current gig even if it has a pension.

[DaveR]

Great comments above... I will add: 20 years is a very long timeframe in tech-related industries. Is that position going to be stable over that period? I would lean towards taking a higher salary now.

Also, have you considered trying to set up your own consultancy? I guess it depends on what your specific role is, whether it lends itself to working remotely (from home) and how good you are at networking. Could you find a business partner and strike out on your own? Spending a week per month in the US may allow you to have the best of both worlds instead of delaying family life for a decade.

[Unfadable]

Thanks for the replies guys. To shed some more light on the subject, and to why this isn't such a no brainer to me:

I work the at type of agency that my pension is as close to a guarantee as you can get these days. Also, my salary will continue to grow and in 10 years my take home could be approximately 125 by the time I am 42 if all goes well. The guarantee is hard to walk away from with 9 years already put in. For your question, brodiaga, if I walk away now I get nothing. A break to test the waters is not an option either.

As I said in the OP, if I wanted walk and retire, the money now option is an easy choice, however, I am trying to plan for a potential family. Right now, my expenses are low. I eat food from the home and ride my bicycle to work. If I were to start a family, I could see that expense increasing 4x, which is where the pension may come into play.

Apologies if this was a bit confusing, thanks for the advice so far.

[Contagion]

Math has never been my strong suit.

Another poster mentioned Money Moustache, but I would also recommend Reddit Financial Independence. All they talk about is how long it's going to take you to reach early retirement. It's worth checking out, you'll have various posters running the numbers.

https://www.reddit.com/r/financialindependence/

Big thing that I would do in your situation is to run the numbers (yourself or via an expert/professional) and see if whatever your goals are, are feasible.

While I can't comment on the math, I can comment on something you need to think about, which I'm surprised you didn't write in your original post as it was pretty big news, especially for your home country. It was just announced on June 13, 2018 so it's very recent news and should've been fresh on your mind:

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/13/we-have-...spute.html

Quote:

'We have a deal,' say Greece and Macedonia over name dispute
Greece, Macedonia reach historic accord over name
Macedonia will be known as "Northern Macedonia"-PM
Deal will pave way for Macedonia's EU, NATO membership

Macedonia recently resolved a dispute over the country's name with Greece, which makes them eligible to apply for membership to the European Union. If the country should ever decide to accept the euro and if they do join the European Union, then your calculations for cost of living per year in Northern Macedonia just got a whole lot higher. Keep that in mind, that's very important and should've been mentioned in the OP.

[Kissinger2014]

(08-05-2018 08:23 PM)Unfadable Wrote:  

Thanks for the replies guys. To shed some more light on the subject, and to why this isn't such a no brainer to me:

I work the at type of agency that my pension is as close to a guarantee as you can get these days. Also, my salary will continue to grow and in 10 years my take home could be approximately 125 by the time I am 42 if all goes well. The guarantee is hard to walk away from with 9 years already put in. For your question, brodiaga, if I walk away now I get nothing. A break to test the waters is not an option either.

As I said in the OP, if I wanted walk and retire, the money now option is an easy choice, however, I am trying to plan for a potential family. Right now, my expenses are low. I eat food from the home and ride my bicycle to work. If I were to start a family, I could see that expense increasing 4x, which is where the pension may come into play.

Apologies if this was a bit confusing, thanks for the advice so far.

Unless you work for the U.S. federal government (not a state government), I would not be overly confident that your pension will be there in twenty years -https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970204138204576605482876191482

Regardless, unless you love your current job and its work culture (maybe work from home, no stress) but you expect to work 3 times as much in the new gig, just doing the math, it makes no sense to stay at your current job.

Again, if you are being offered a job at $180 K, you must be fairly competent at your work (or slept with the hiring manager ). Even if this new job does not work out, you would still be able to find a job that pays more than what you are currently earning (if not be able to go back to your old job).

[Brodiaga]

(08-05-2018 08:23 PM)Unfadable Wrote:  

Thanks for the replies guys. To shed some more light on the subject, and to why this isn't such a no brainer to me:

I work the at type of agency that my pension is as close to a guarantee as you can get these days. Also, my salary will continue to grow and in 10 years my take home could be approximately 125 by the time I am 42 if all goes well. The guarantee is hard to walk away from with 9 years already put in. For your question, brodiaga, if I walk away now I get nothing. A break to test the waters is not an option either.

As I said in the OP, if I wanted walk and retire, the money now option is an easy choice, however, I am trying to plan for a potential family. Right now, my expenses are low. I eat food from the home and ride my bicycle to work. If I were to start a family, I could see that expense increasing 4x, which is where the pension may come into play.

Apologies if this was a bit confusing, thanks for the advice so far.

This makes your decision more difficult, but it looks like a lot of it depends on whether or not you see yourself staying in the current job until your pension at least partially vests. For example, if you can only get it if you work there until age 53 and there is no way you will work that long, then you don't have a pension and should look for higher paying jobs.

Another thing to consider is work/life balance at your current vs new job. There are people out there who earn very high salaries but work long hours and feel miserable. Make sure you know what to expect and weigh all the pros and cons.

Also, a man who has achieved so much by age 32 will not just sit on his ass all day even if he retires early. There will be opportunities out there to make money for somebody with your skill set, determination and work ethic. However, you need to learn more about these opportunities in advance, particularly your options for working remotely or doing consulting gigs from your home country if you decide to move there.

[Apoc]

(08-05-2018 04:28 PM)Unfadable Wrote:  

Has anyone been in a similar situation? How did it turn out/ how is it going? I have spent many sleepless nights over the last few months wondering what to do.

Are you seriously this worried? Based on your post, you have already won in life (at least the financial part) and should spend more time thinking how to enjoy your crushing victory, rather than worrying too much how to make even more money. I agree 100% with Brodiaga's post above, you need to consider this decision based on all aspects of your life, not just dollars. By all means do spend a couple more years stacking paper, but start planning what happens after that.

Related post from the already mentioned MMM:
https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/03/...hangeable/

Quote:

Many of us are focusing our energy on building up the wall of protective money and insurance policies around us to ever-greater heights, working one last year and funding one last insurance policy against an obscure risk, when really our deficit is not in money. It’s in confidence.

[username]

Unfadable,

I agree with you that starting a family in the US isn't so desirable and especially marrying an American girl, that's a disaster waiting to happen and 99% would think you were the devil because of your plan of leaving the US to live in a foreign country permanently.

How often do you get vacation time? If I were you I would travel back home ASAP and start meeting girls there and try to find one that fits well with you. If you find a good one stay in contact with her as much as possible. Visit her every time you can and start setting the stage. After a good amount of time you should know if she is right for you. Make sure her goals and time table (when to have kids, when to get married, etc.) match up or will fit with your plans.

Assuming you are a US citizen, you can do a fiance visa and bring her over. She probably won't like being in the US and miss her family back home but if you found a good one she will understand it is in the best interest of you and your future family together. Make a plan that you two will live in the US for X amount of years and afterwards return back home in a good financial situation.

[Unfadable]

Thanks for all of the replies guys, really appreciate it. After going over this thread and talking to someone I trust, I've decided to stop stressing out so much, take the higher paying job now and stack up some more money to reevaluate things in a few years.

[SlickyBoy]

(08-06-2018 08:49 PM)username Wrote:  

Assuming you are a US citizen, you can do a fiance visa and bring her over. She probably won't like being in the US and miss her family back home but if you found a good one she will understand it is in the best interest of you and your future family together. Make a plan that you two will live in the US for X amount of years and afterwards return back home in a good financial situation.

Have to caution against this part though - bringing her to the US for anything more than a short duration trip opens up the risk that she will see you for less than the value you are in her home country, and she will immediately consider other options.

This happens all the time with guys who bring a hottie back from SEA or South America. It only takes about three or four months of exposure to ruin most foreign women and turn them into Americunts. It happens sooner with women from some cultures versus others, but the risk is definitely there unless you are a very high value guy in the US. Even then it's a risky bet. There really is no safe amount of long term exposure for a woman on a finacee visa who "agrees" to move back in X number of years.

I think you already have the right idea though - raising a family is challenging enough without competing with the corrupted culture, big daddy government, the divorce courts, etc. Good luck & hope it works out for you.

[Alpone]

I'd recommend the Boglehead forums for financial advice. That place is packed with high-earning lawyers, doctors and tech entrepreneurs who understand financial planning.

https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/index.html

Also, bringing a foreign girl back to the U.S. will make her just like American girls in all the worst ways.

[SW15]

(05-16-2019 10:19 AM)SlickyBoy Wrote:  

(08-06-2018 08:49 PM)username Wrote:  

Assuming you are a US citizen, you can do a fiance visa and bring her over. She probably won't like being in the US and miss her family back home but if you found a good one she will understand it is in the best interest of you and your future family together. Make a plan that you two will live in the US for X amount of years and afterwards return back home in a good financial situation.

Have to caution against this part though - bringing her to the US for anything more than a short duration trip opens up the risk that she will see you for less than the value you are in her home country, and she will immediately consider other options.

This happens all the time with guys who bring a hottie back from SEA or South America. It only takes about three or four months of exposure to ruin most foreign women and turn them into Americunts. It happens sooner with women from some cultures versus others, but the risk is definitely there unless you are a very high value guy in the US. Even then it's a risky bet. There really is no safe amount of long term exposure for a woman on a finacee visa who "agrees" to move back in X number of years.

I think you already have the right idea though - raising a family is challenging enough without competing with the corrupted culture, big daddy government, the divorce courts, etc. Good luck & hope it works out for you.

(05-16-2019 07:25 PM)Alpone Wrote:  

Also, bringing a foreign girl back to the U.S. will make her just like American girls in all the worst ways.

I would also advise against bringing a woman from Asia or Latin America into the United States. Most of the major U.S. cities, including where I live (Dallas, Texas) are essentially mating cesspools. It's ideal to keep a woman from a better place out of a U.S. mating cesspool. I don't even think a rural, unpopulated United States area is safe exposure within the poisonous U.S. culture. For instance, West Texas is one of the most sparsely populated areas of the United States. Even if I was able to get well paying, location independent work within the United States and move to rural West Texas with a woman from Asia or Latin America, I'd still be concerned about the creeping influence of the large Texas cities (Dallas, Houston, San Antonio, and Austin), not to mention the New York and Los Angeles influence through mass media.