[dontuan]

In studies and portrayals of men in film and literature, it seems like a man who is calm, collected, stoic and even mysterious is what women desire deeply. But in real, dos this old true anymore? I have a friend who is very good looking (no homo), strong and doesn't let the world affect him. He's like the strong yet quiet type, but doesn't seem to get much interest from women. And even the women he goes out on dates with are constantly being entertained by thirsty guys messaging them all day with clever emojis and invites to fun events. He doesn't play that game (he doesn't even have a smartphone) and it seems because of that he can't hold their attention and so loses out.

So is it now better to do this high-energy clown game who's always entertaining women since all the competing dudes are doing that to get with girls? I know its best to be congruent with your nature, but does one need to these days start leaning and developing himself more in that direction at least as much as he comfortably can? Whatever happened to the days when James Dean and James Bond were the epitome of male appeal? Has technology made women's attention span so short and conditioning them to instant gratification that the more refined and classically attractive qualities aren't able to take hold the way they once did.

[sterling_archer]

My observation from real life, which might be pure coincidental, is that high energy, almost ridiculously aggressive (not in the hostile/physical sense of course) guys seem to get all attention. I am extremely irritated by such people and for the life of it can't have that kind of game, nor even try to emulate it. I prefer speaking calmly (but not quietly) and doing occasional cocky and funny stuff, with which I couple gestures and necessary body language, without coming off as incongruent.

[Rudideviz]

In my opinion there is no end all be all rule. It depends on the personality of the girl.

[Dwooly]

Be yourself. EOM.

[Batman_]

Most women want fun, entertaining guys. Women are addicted to stimulation above all else, as a result of our increasingly fragmented attention spans. They want to hear good stories, jokes, and be amused and distracted, they want a rollercoaster of emotions with little regard for things like reason, consistency, and especially stoicism. They'd rather you be talkative, high energy, and probably a little manic/crazy, than a calm and self-contained person.

The stoic/zen sort of behaviors probably don't appeal to a lot of women. However, I would still say it's better to play to your strengths instead of trying to radically change your entire temperament (which can't really be done). There are really two ways to attract women: A) be a generalist - try to appeal to as many women as you can by having an amalgam of traits that women tend to like. You won't be particularly polarizing, and there might only be a very select few women who find you extremely attractive. B) Be a specialist - be highly attractive to certain types of women and completely unappealing to others, which is far more polarizing and inconsistent. This is done by playing up your own strengths, interests, etc without regard for how it can effective your ability to attract other women.

I don't think you should ever "improve" yourself with the intent to attract more women. Go to the gym because you want to get stronger. Practice an art or discipline because you find it fulfilling and meaningful.

[Donfitz007]

From what i've seen women tend to like both to an extent. REMEMBER women are children, the fun guy is going to be more appealing and gain their attention but they risk being simply being a clown or jester instead of actually being a romantic partner. Most of these guys rely on getting girls drunk or rely on their status.

On the other side of the coin, the stoic calm guy (without a key component ill get into later) tends to bore the women. The can't always hold her interest but they are still seen as a mystery to be solved or a powerful figure that should be respected. That calmness is attractive and often scary for women.

Before I get to the key component that makes the stoic guys in movies "attractive" Thugs, and Bad boys do this perfectly.

The key component is excitement, that Emotional rollercoaster that Batman_ spoke of. Think of every movie or game where the stoic guy gets all the girls and he's usually a spy, a special ops soldier, an assassin, a drug dealer, or something of the sort. Girls LOVE that sense of danger and you can achieve that rollercoaster without even being in dangerous situations. Have VERY interesting stories, practice your charm, seem desirable, make her feel like the world revolves around her while you are together but take that ALL AWAY when yall aren't. Spank her when she makes you kinda mad or go days or weeks without talking to her if she REALLY makes you mad. never let her see you out of your comfort zone. keep your emotions neutral so when you do have a big excitement of emotions (whether negative or positive) she's quick to notice and it's much more impactful. She will beg and plead to get you to conform. SToic, calm game or aloof game doesn't work without status and charisma

Ofcourse you don't have to do any of these things, just my observation of what works. Think James Bond and Will from fresh prince. Bond uses his status, calm demeanor, action and way with words/wit to keep women interested. Will uses fun, lots of jokes, an entertaining presence to get women.

[Polniy_Sostav]

Interesting question. From my own experience , women highly respect men who can keep control and calm them down. Deep inside , they see emotional men as weak.
If you are naturally calm and stoic , you can always be eccentric here and there , by behavior and by speech. This will work in your favour.
If you are the energetic type of guy you will become very fast very annoying for a woman.
I found myself many times getting plaudits from women for being able to make them calm down .

[Durden]

(07-08-2018 06:48 AM)dontuan Wrote:  

In studies and portrayals of men in film and literature, it seems like a man who is calm, collected, stoic and even mysterious is what women desire deeply. But in real, dos this old true anymore? I have a friend who is very good looking (no homo), strong and doesn't let the world affect him. He's like the strong yet quiet type, but doesn't seem to get much interest from women. And even the women he goes out on dates with are constantly being entertained by thirsty guys messaging them all day with clever emojis and invites to fun events. He doesn't play that game (he doesn't even have a smartphone) and it seems because of that he can't hold their attention and so loses out.

So is it now better to do this high-energy clown game who's always entertaining women since all the competing dudes are doing that to get with girls? I know its best to be congruent with your nature, but does one need to these days start leaning and developing himself more in that direction at least as much as he comfortably can? Whatever happened to the days when James Dean and James Bond were the epitome of male appeal? Has technology made women's attention span so short and conditioning them to instant gratification that the more refined and classically attractive qualities aren't able to take hold the way they once did.

Things, they are a changing. Another forum member recently had some similar thoughts. I think the digital herding has changed things albeit more for American based chics.

[captain_shane]

I've experimented with both and more recently with calm relaxed game. Super relaxed game where my goal is to be the most relaxed person in the club or environment that I'm in. I've been getting really good results lately with it. Girls escalating on me, trying to sell themselves to me instead of the other way around, etc.

The key I think to being calm and relaxed is that you must have super strong eye contact and relaxed body language. Body language similar to a lion for this to work.

All tension needs to be gone 100%. You can't be this guy in the club and claim to be stoic and relaxed:



Be this guy:



Being stoic doesn't mean being boring. Just a tighter grip on your emotions so aren't acting like a woman. Remember also, 93% of communication is non-verbal. You don't need to be talking at all to be cool. There have been times where I've spoken virtually nothing and girls have told me I'm fucking awesome.

This guy is pretty solid at relaxed game:

[goodvibez]

You can't be anything other than yourself.. with that being said just become the best version of yourself. A musician can never really be a great accountant as someone that has a natural inclination for accounting. A musician can work really hard maybe twice as much to be an accountant, but will stand under the shadows of an organic accountant. Your genetics, life experiences, race, location, and etc has put you on a certain path. Were powerless to a lot of circumstances but thats where you can find your power.

Remember WOMEN DO THE CHOOSING. Women are responsible for the pre selection when it comes to human sexuality. Women pre select men mostly based on looks, physical attributes, and testosterone. The women that liked me I never had to say anything, it wasn't my personality or game. It was the fact that she pre selected me and from there I just didn't have to fuck it up by saying anything stupid or acting retarded. Attraction isn't a choice and you can't make anyone that doesn't like you .. like you.

Your game is like a catalyst for women that have already pre-selected you. Find the women that gravitate to your natural personality, mannerism, and behavior.

[rotinz]

You can only pull off the calm and stoic thing if she also sees you as a bad ass. Women find criminals that are calm and stoic hot if you don't give her the tingles and you are a calm guy she will just label you a creep.

[dontuan]

(07-08-2018 04:32 PM)goodvibez Wrote:  

You can't be anything other than yourself.. with that being said just become the best version of yourself. A musician can never really be a great accountant as someone that has a natural inclination for accounting. A musician can work really hard maybe twice as much to be an accountant, but will stand under the shadows of an organic accountant. Your genetics, life experiences, race, location, and etc has put you on a certain path. Were powerless to a lot of circumstances but thats where you can find your power.

Remember WOMEN DO THE CHOOSING. Women are responsible for the pre selection when it comes to human sexuality. Women pre select men mostly based on looks, physical attributes, and testosterone. The women that liked me I never had to say anything, it wasn't my personality or game. It was the fact that she pre selected me and from there I just didn't have to fuck it up by saying anything stupid or acting retarded. Attraction isn't a choice and you can't make anyone that doesn't like you .. like you.

Your game is like a catalyst for women that have already pre-selected you. Find the women that gravitate to your natural personality, mannerism, and behavior.

Yes I know that, but I feel that social media and smartphones are making it so that women are being primed and conditioned more and more toward the flashy shiny object and so I don't know if there will be much girls left who will appreciate the calm, collected man the way some have in the past. So in a way attraction is a choice in the sense that women can be conditioned and primed to liking certain guys. What's the calm guy to do when it becomes when 98 percent of women now like the entertaining clown? You'll get a lot less interest.

I remember a lot of older movies were slower paced and thoughtful and appreciated, but blockbusters and special effects have changed people's tastes and they need action and the emotional spikes or else films have a harder time holding attention and getting audiences to watch.

And like you said if all girls want the musician now, what's the accountant to do? Just hope a few girls trickle his way?

[Polniy_Sostav]

(07-08-2018 04:42 PM)rotinz Wrote:  

You can only pull off the calm and stoic thing if she also sees you as a bad ass. Women find criminals that are calm and stoic hot if you don't give her the tingles and you are a calm guy she will just label you a creep.

this is so true. but you shouldnt fake it. and it s not tattoos that will make you tough. it s hard to do unless (just like me) you have real stories

[Fortis]

Depends on the country. I think being too crazy in China is weird. I tend to have better results when I sit back.

[jordypip23]

Depends on the chick when it comes to long-term maintenance.

But often times with short-term success & gaming I think more than 50% of the time the high-energy, charismatic guy is gonna win.

[kuqezi]

A wise man (Albert Einstein) once said "Only one thing is absolute, that everything is relative".
It all depends on the situation, moment, time, event and most important it depends on your style and your way of doing things!
You want to be the high energy man at a party, at a sports tournament, sword fighting, axe throwing...etc
You want to be the calm stoic and thoughtful at a dinner, deep conversation, important meeting...etc

The situation is very important.
Learn to adapt and to always show that you're the most valuable person in there. Your vibe, the feelings you transmit come before you even talk.
Sometimes you need to raise your voice and demonstrate your energy but other times only a raise of your eyes will make everyone quiet.

[Noir]

Doesn't matter, what matters is that you're congruent. If you seem to be a high energy guy but in fact are calm, it throws her off and her alarms go off. Same for stoic being excitable.

Be however you are and comfortable in your own skin but be congruent to:

a) your image - what are you projecting and what expectations are you planting in women's mind when they see you across a room?

b) your environment - are you fidgety in a jazz lounge vs. a sloth at a festival?

c) your peers - are your mates complementing you or detracting attention from you; do you look like you all fit in?

You can be charismatic without being an attention whore.

You can be stoic without being boring.

High energy is reserved for certain places but stoic can be anywhere assuming your non-verbals are on point. You know when to smile, when to raise an eye brow, how to communicate sexuality and of course, your general movement and vocal tonality.

I am personally more on the stoic side but I ping between both due to environment, group I am with, vibe and intoxication.

Stoic works better when you are attractive and girls are already into you YET you still need to be able to spike emotions.

With high energy, spiking emotions comes more naturally but you need to be able to 'push' accordingly.

The woman will inevitably affect your approach too and it's the whole trying vs breaking rapport.

High energy is trying for rapport usually and stoic is breaking rapport - there's a time and place for everything -> congruence.

That being said, you can't be at a club at 1AM when it's pumping and be stoic, you gotta dance and provide vibes.

Some guys kill it in clubs, others in smoking areas. The good guys kill it everywhere because they have the chameleon ability to adjust to the vibe on the fly which is precipitated by all the factors above (music, time, location, type of group, size of group, how many people overall in club, dancing vs lounge vs restaurant vs mall and of course... the woman in question).

It's not binary, you can be both and YOU dictate it with your vibe, energy levels, state, group and the list goes on.

edit:

I forgot to mention that stoic is usually most attractive in light of any shit tests/adversity and high energy for teasing. Both have their time and place.

[Trent W.]

Most of the posters have already touched upon all the important parameters for this topic, i.e. your natural inclination, the environment you're in and the type of person you have opposite you.

Your friend might not be getting the results you think he should be getting because of other things. Maybe something is off, he has some technical weakness in some part of his game or maybe he's satisfied with what he's getting.

One concept that I've been finding useful lately is that of acting as the type of man you want to be. That means, gathering all the traits of the type of man you yourself find attractive and implementing them on yourself. For instance, in a given situation you ask yourself "What would the man I visualize as a complete, attractive man do in this situation?". You know the answer already, the reason you ask is to set yourself in action.

By answering this question when you find yourself in certain situations you can act according to the type of male you want to become. It might be stoic, or high energy or either of the two depending on context.

[goodvibez]

(07-08-2018 05:56 PM)dontuan Wrote:  

(07-08-2018 04:32 PM)goodvibez Wrote:  

You can't be anything other than yourself.. with that being said just become the best version of yourself. A musician can never really be a great accountant as someone that has a natural inclination for accounting. A musician can work really hard maybe twice as much to be an accountant, but will stand under the shadows of an organic accountant. Your genetics, life experiences, race, location, and etc has put you on a certain path. Were powerless to a lot of circumstances but thats where you can find your power.

Remember WOMEN DO THE CHOOSING. Women are responsible for the pre selection when it comes to human sexuality. Women pre select men mostly based on looks, physical attributes, and testosterone. The women that liked me I never had to say anything, it wasn't my personality or game. It was the fact that she pre selected me and from there I just didn't have to fuck it up by saying anything stupid or acting retarded. Attraction isn't a choice and you can't make anyone that doesn't like you .. like you.

Your game is like a catalyst for women that have already pre-selected you. Find the women that gravitate to your natural personality, mannerism, and behavior.

Yes I know that, but I feel that social media and smartphones are making it so that women are being primed and conditioned more and more toward the flashy shiny object and so I don't know if there will be much girls left who will appreciate the calm, collected man the way some have in the past. So in a way attraction is a choice in the sense that women can be conditioned and primed to liking certain guys. What's the calm guy to do when it becomes when 98 percent of women now like the entertaining clown? You'll get a lot less interest.

I remember a lot of older movies were slower paced and thoughtful and appreciated, but blockbusters and special effects have changed people's tastes and they need action and the emotional spikes or else films have a harder time holding attention and getting audiences to watch.

And like you said if all girls want the musician now, what's the accountant to do? Just hope a few girls trickle his way?

Maybe in the night club scene sure women like the clowns. But does that mean that the women will fuck them? No. I worked as a concierge in many high end buildings throughout Toronto. Alot of these hot babes had calm and cool boyfriends but they all had similar attributes: Tall, slim, good looking. One woman had a built and muscular black guy. But you get my point.

Remember, women are fickle. They may think they like the loud in your face guys... but the right guy shows up and he is calm, cool, and collective. She immediately has a change of heart. Women can be very indecisive and sometimes they have no idea what they want. Most of these women are living for the moment... so the right place, right time scenario can benefit you. Maybe night game isn't for you try meeting women through social circles, day game, or online.

[Supreme4ever]

It all depends on personality, in which my personality is laid-back cocky Style works in my circles because of sports recognition. But during the nightlife the coked-up hyper guys do stimulate women's roller coaster emotions. Know when to Spike women's emotions in your own way and never be like the norm to be memorable to women.

[Hypno]

Clown game works for a while but its a poor frame. You always have to be the clown. Might work in a night club but its not a good strategy.

Be yourself, but try to express more emotions. Emotions are like crack to women. An old PUA, Ross Jefferies, had this wierd technique that was close to hypnotism (NLP) which didn't work for most people. But one thing he did was create these stories or scripts with emotional spikes, positive and negative, and these are quite good. Find some of his old stuff. He also wrote under a psuedonym The Bishop. Really good stories and you'll get the hang of expressing emotions.

I stumbled upon this myself once. When I was in college there was a financial aid snafu. I had one a scholarship but they misapplied the check and the money wasn't in my account. Because I hadn't officially paid for my classes yet, I was at the back of the line for registration and wasn't allowed to buy discounted football tickets (they sold out). I left financial aid angry and spoke to a fraternity brother in his room, basically just venting my anger. Well he had a girl in there and she saw my emotion (anger) and it was tingle city. She made some excuse to follow me to my apt across the city and we banged regularly for a month.

[Soyouz]

Anyone good at gaming will adapt to the girl he's talking to, and the environment he's in.

You can be in a nightclub in Medellín and meet a girl who prefers a more stoic guy, just like you can cross path with a Japanese girl in Roppongi who would love a more energetic guy than the 10 last guys she met.

In the end, you have 30-60 seconds to quickly seize the person you're talking to, and adapt accordingly.

Many people will say "focus on your strengths, and stay who you are". That's a good advice when it comes to look for a serious relationship. When it comes to banging as many chicks as possible, it's all about adaptability.

[ThrustMaster]

I go with presence, stoicism, and amused mastery. I am quick with a joke but I’m no ones clown. I do ok. You also have to ask yourself what type of women do you want to attract? Different types of ch it’s go for each type.

[dontuan]

Here is a video where they test people's reaction to a guy being masculine vs being less masculine at a bar. Surprisingly, being less masculine gets the edge in most circumstances.

[torridon747]

I don't trust anything buzzfeed churns out.