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Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet
#76

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-28-2016 05:36 PM)weener Wrote:  

I don't know how Ukrainian girls survive on what they eat, when you see them go to a restaurant they will often just have some watery soup with a meatball in it, and some bread.

I sometimes feel guilty when I go food shopping, people are looking at my food on the conveyer belt like wolves, a lot of people cannot afford any meat, and as I work out i'm ordering kilos of steaks etc.

Sometimes you can get the opposite.

I once had a Ukrainian chick who loved to eat. She need the salad, soup, dinner , desert... the whole bit.

Yet she had a amazing body considering she had a kid. I general find that Slavic women don't age well after 35. This same chick never used sunscreen as most can't afford these luxuries.

In my initial pipeline for my upcoming Kiev trip strange I came across 3 girls this week alone who had 10 year US visa's... seems they are handing them out like candy.

Once chick told me a crazy story how she fooled the immigration guys saying she gained weight so could have her kid in the US and American citizenship. She knew no one in the US and yet figured out how not to pay any legal for medical expenses.

Ukrainian girls are very resourceful. [Image: blush.gif]
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#77

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

I like how Roosh puts it: "Experts at mineral extraction."

If only you knew how bad things really are.
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#78

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-28-2016 02:08 PM)scrambled Wrote:  

The typical Ukrainian guy simply has better food, hotter girlfriend, and superior culture to the typical American and his McDonald's/Walmart "Kultur".

Culture dating wise, yes.

I don't think it's fair to say that their life is better though. There is almost zero opportunity for them. They have no way out unless they are very talented and can land a job with an EU company. And even then, if they lose that job they're right back where they started.

There is a reason so many of the men hit the bottle so hard.

When men have nothing to live for that's what they turn to. Men get fulfillment from career. It helps shape our identity. And they have almost no prospects in that part of life.
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#79

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-28-2016 04:30 PM)WeekendCasanova Wrote:  

Quote: (08-28-2016 01:00 PM)scrambled Wrote:  

The "only makes 200usd" a month factoid is misleading, things (besides luxuries) are ten times as cheap. The currencies can't be directly compared, nor can the true quality of life. The working class Ukrainian eats far better than the average American, for one thing.

Get out of here.

If you want to call expired meats, and old bread "better", then sure. After rent expenses, and everything else, Ukrainians don't have much left over for food and whatever else. My girl in Kyiv earns roughly $600 USD a month, makes her own food, but I couldn't survive on what she eats. Don't even get me started on the smoking epidemic in Ukraine, and most of EE if we're being honest.

I just want to point out too (for the people saying that they eat better than Americans) that $600 USD is more than double the average salary for Ukrainians.

For those of you interested, my Kyiv girl wrote a post for my blog: http://thisistrouble.com/2016/08/18/live...ling-life/
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#80

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-28-2016 06:58 PM)rishboy77 Wrote:  

Quote: (08-28-2016 05:36 PM)weener Wrote:  

I don't know how Ukrainian girls survive on what they eat, when you see them go to a restaurant they will often just have some watery soup with a meatball in it, and some bread.

I sometimes feel guilty when I go food shopping, people are looking at my food on the conveyer belt like wolves, a lot of people cannot afford any meat, and as I work out i'm ordering kilos of steaks etc.

Sometimes you can get the opposite.

I once had a Ukrainian chick who loved to eat. She need the salad, soup, dinner , desert... the whole bit.

Yet she had a amazing body considering she had a kid. I general find that Slavic women don't age well after 35. This same chick never used sunscreen as most can't afford these luxuries.

In my initial pipeline for my upcoming Kiev trip strange I came across 3 girls this week alone who had 10 year US visa's... seems they are handing them out like candy.

Once chick told me a crazy story how she fooled the immigration guys saying she gained weight so could have her kid in the US and American citizenship. She knew no one in the US and yet figured out how not to pay any legal for medical expenses.

Ukrainian girls are very resourceful. [Image: blush.gif]

I would day late twenties!. You would think that the over 30's would be easy pickings in Ukraine but they have a list of demands as long as your arm, finding the right man is critical as being a single woman of that age in Ukraine has a social stigma, your family are nagging you every day, neighbours are gossiping about you, and most guys their own age are chasing after 21 year olds.

Also the older women sniff you out right from the start, which is nice sometimes as there is no pretence, she know's what you want right from the start

Younger women are easiest, I met a 45 year old American in Ukraine recently who was new in the country and he was saying things like "I met this really hot girl who wanted to go home with me recently, but she was only 21 it felt wrong" lol, before long he was ploughing his way through the student population of Ukraine.

Yes Ukrainian girls are very resourceful, years of dealing with bureaucracy, queuing, and having to fight for survival no doubt.
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#81

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

^ I'm starting to understand what you guys are talking about. I'm not in Ukraine yet but started pipelining and getting bombarded with 100 questions. These women will study your online profile just looking for any red flags.
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#82

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 02:18 AM)Schlep Wrote:  

^ I'm starting to understand what you guys are talking about. I'm not in Ukraine yet but started pipelining and getting bombarded with 100 questions. These women will study your online profile just looking for any red flags.

I think the best thing to do, is just disregard the questions. In any case, you won't be able to fool these women about your reasons for traveling to Ukraine. I mean, you're not the owner of a charcoal-importing business, are you? So, you're here mainly for the women, they will know that, no point in denying...

But, you can look better to their suspicious eyes, if you have other interests in the country, like learning the language(s), knowing the culture. But more than anything, just frame yourself as the leader of the interaction, by just refusing to answer (as in deflecting, or just ignoring) their bothering questions.
If you answer them all, you'll look needy.
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#83

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

^ solid advice GS. Thanks...
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#84

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 03:51 AM)Schlep Wrote:  

^ solid advice GS. Thanks...

You're welcome. Don't forget that you are in a position of power. They (Ukrainian chicks) have beauty, youth and quality pussy, sure, but, you have the key to a better life for them (you are the key to a wealthy Western life), and also, there are many of them, plenty of beautiful Ukrainian women "on the market".

So, try to forget the Western mentality, where a beautiful young woman is the next best thing after God, and enter a FSU mentality, where a non-alcoholic wealthy man with his shit together, is the next best thing after God!

Also, note that it's almost September. Meaning, the Ukrainian chicks had quite a lot of (needy) foreigners at hand during Summer, but, the ones still on the market (vulnerable now, given that they just lost the Summer battle) know that Winter is coming, bloody fast, and foreign men will disappear from the Ukrainian land until the next warm days... So, if you are in Ukraine in September or October, the spoils of the (Summer) war should be yours! [Image: banana.gif]
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#85

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

About girls ordering not much food: Done on purpose as they don't want to look like slobs in front of a potential western boyfriend/husband. Also their bodies don't need as many calories.

The idea that hungry Ukrainians are jealous of your steaks is misleading; they as staring because the "eat mass amounts of red meat will make me muscular" thing is an American affectation.

Go to, say, the supermarket at Gulliver in Kiev, it puts Whole Foods to shame, yet is filled with families and students buying high quality domestic and imported products. No one looks hungry there.

In rural Ukraine, Carpathian region, poorer on paper than Kiev, women at food stalls sell fresh sheep's cheese in blocks and homemade sausages for relatively cheap, like a perpetual farmers market, without SWPL. No one looks thin, even in not-wealthy Carpathia.
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#86

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 05:50 AM)scrambled Wrote:  

In rural Ukraine, Carpathian region, poorer on paper than Kiev, women at food stalls sell fresh sheep's cheese in blocks and homemade sausages for relatively cheap, like a perpetual farmers market, without SWPL. No one looks thin, even in not-wealthy Carpathia.

In the (European) countryside, people, and it's been this way for centuries, are never starving (they keep -and hide from the taxman- good food, selling the lower-quality stuff to city dwellers).

But it's in the low-class urban suburbs that you find malnourished kids. Just check for yourself: enter the square common spaces behind somewhat derelict buildings, where families take fresh air in the evening... look at the people, old before their time, at the children, very thin and playing with broken toys... that's another reality, far from Kreshiatik...
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#87

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 06:15 AM)Going strong Wrote:  

Quote: (08-29-2016 05:50 AM)scrambled Wrote:  

In rural Ukraine, Carpathian region, poorer on paper than Kiev, women at food stalls sell fresh sheep's cheese in blocks and homemade sausages for relatively cheap, like a perpetual farmers market, without SWPL. No one looks thin, even in not-wealthy Carpathia.

In the (European) countryside, people, and it's been this way for centuries, are never starving (they keep -and hide from the taxman- good food, selling the lower-quality stuff to city dwellers).

But it's in the low-class urban suburbs that you find malnourished kids. Just check for yourself: enter the square common spaces behind somewhat derelict buildings, where families take fresh air in the evening... look at the people, old before their time, at the children, very thin and playing with broken toys... that's another reality, far from Kreshiatik...


I just want to point out that these kind of urban areas are not exclusive of Ukraine, in Western Europe there are many like this too, and in the US probably there are also some similar slums (eg. Detroit..), poor life decisions affect the families, and probably those kids parents are alkoholics/drug addicts.. These cases are everywhere in reality. Ukraine always had more and better food than Russia, and they export what not goes to internal consumption. Western Ukrainians are known in FSU for being big/chubby and eating a lot...
As for the salaries, Ukranians sure are resourceful and a lot of money is paid under the table, so normally the official figure does not represent reality, also the cost of groceries is possibly right now the cheapest in the world (excluding meat and fish), so if someone does not need to pay housing he can live with 200 or 300 usd with a reasonable nutrition, and possibly some booze (a 0,5 beer is 8 hryvna, 30 euro cents...) in any magazine. If you throw housing expenses, or at least the rent, since the energy expenses (water, electricity) are also among the cheapest, then the scenario changes a lot.

But I would say 200usd guy in Ukraine can have a better life than a 550 euro (minimum salary) portuguese guy living in a Portugal ruled by EU authocracy, with the highest cost of electricity, water, gasoline/diesel, and communications in Europe. Also the cost of the vices are much higher than in Ukraine in a highly state regulamented country.

Another thing about Ukrainians is that these guys got free University formation, and most of them know how to do many stuff, a mechanical engineer knows how to repair cars/trucks or quickly learns how to, just an example, they can easily make some side money. On the contrary in EU most of the people go to university to take meaningless courses in humanities, and even management courses have a small real life application.

Sure life is no paradise for Ukrainains, but a guy who can make it there has some good chances at having an happy life. If he cant make it there he can easily "wife hunt" back home.
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#88

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Interesting that a Ukrainian waiter was telling me curre ntly the average salary is below 150 Euro a month. Seems lower than I had envisaged.
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#89

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Average monthly salaries reported to State Fiscal service:

https://ukrstat.org/en/operativ/operativ...pp16_e.htm

Yes, yes, there is a grey economy, which some experts says is up to 40% of the real economy. Even if you added 40% to wages (and there wouldn't be an exact increase), it is still not a whole lot. While things like medicine are technically free, you still need to bring the doctor a bottle of vodka or some money to get looked at.
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#90

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 05:50 AM)scrambled Wrote:  

About girls ordering not much food: Done on purpose as they don't want to look like slobs in front of a potential western boyfriend/husband. Also their bodies don't need as many calories.

The idea that hungry Ukrainians are jealous of your steaks is misleading; they as staring because the "eat mass amounts of red meat will make me muscular" thing is an American affectation.

Go to, say, the supermarket at Gulliver in Kiev, it puts Whole Foods to shame, yet is filled with families and students buying high quality domestic and imported products. No one looks hungry there.

In rural Ukraine, Carpathian region, poorer on paper than Kiev, women at food stalls sell fresh sheep's cheese in blocks and homemade sausages for relatively cheap, like a perpetual farmers market, without SWPL. No one looks thin, even in not-wealthy Carpathia.

I'm talking about standing in the queue somewhere like Puzhata, not a date!

If an old lady gets 1000 a month pension, and you spend double that in a supermarket shop, trust me she's going to be jealous and not thinking about her muscles

Yes the supermarket in Gulliver is probably fancy, go to ATB in the suburbs then see the difference. It sounds like you are judging the whole of Ukraine by what you have seen on and around Kreschatik [Image: dodgy.gif].

Nobody looks thin at the market? Nonsense, maybe a lot of the Babushka sellers are podgy because they are eating their stock out of boredom.

We're getting way off topic now, I think this thread was supposed to be about Odessa [Image: confused.gif]
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#91

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

"Look at the people, old before their time, at the children, very thin and playing with broken toys... that's another reality, far from Kreshiatik..."

I'm in country right now (excursion to Lvov) and just told two Ukranians about that, neither are rich and one is working class. Their response: accurate, but only circa 1991.

I have been touring by car and train all over central and west Ukraine; I am not making snap judgments based on "Central" Kiev. I just don't see the "Save the Children" Africa like conditions the internet presents; the idea that people go hungry here is a joke, almost every "украинец" has a potbelly. The kids aren't hungry, except for more ice cream, of which there are vendors everywhere. They have plenty of toys since "Карпатія" produces wooden domestic made ones, sourced from the still abundant forests, sold for cheap. The Chinese made Walmart style plastic junk in the USA don't play here.

I'm not trying to deny any observations you personally have made, or to gloss over the problems that are very much present, only to present a more realistic view based my experience. Ukraine just seems like a European country to me, not a starving kids & Chernobyl distopia where the native supermodel women want to leave desperately with any guy who has 10 phrases of Russian memorized. I could see myself living here, except for the cold.
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#92

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 10:18 AM)Kissinger2014 Wrote:  

Average monthly salaries reported to State Fiscal service:

https://ukrstat.org/en/operativ/operativ...pp16_e.htm

Yes, yes, there is a grey economy, which some experts says is up to 40% of the real economy. Even if you added 40% to wages (and there wouldn't be an exact increase), it is still not a whole lot. While things like medicine are technically free, you still need to bring the doctor a bottle of vodka or some money to get looked at.

Similar but albeit not as bad a situation with neighbouring Belarus - http://finance.tut.by/news509987.html

However I dont see hordes of starving and malnourished walking down Prospekt Nezavisimost nor dyevs flinging themselves at every expat they can find. Many people like in Ukraine work under the counter and can survive to make ends meet. They do so by a combination of things, i.e living with their parents, sharing rentals, double jobbing or growing their own food at the dacha.
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#93

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 12:32 PM)scrambled Wrote:  

"Look at the people, old before their time, at the children, very thin and playing with broken toys... that's another reality, far from Kreshiatik..."

I'm in country right now (excursion to Lvov) and just told two Ukranians about that, neither are rich and one is working class. Their response: accurate, but only circa 1991.

I have been touring by car and train all over central and west Ukraine; I am not making snap judgments based on "Central" Kiev. I just don't see the "Save the Children" Africa like conditions the internet presents; the idea that people go hungry here is a joke, almost every "украинец" has a potbelly. The kids aren't hungry, except for more ice cream, of which there are vendors everywhere. They have plenty of toys since "Карпатія" produces wooden domestic made ones, sourced from the still abundant forests, sold for cheap. The Chinese made Walmart style plastic junk in the USA don't play here.

I'm not trying to deny any observations you personally have made, or to gloss over the problems that are very much present, only to present a more realistic view based my experience. Ukraine just seems like a European country to me, not a starving kids & Chernobyl distopia where the native supermodel women want to leave desperately with any guy who has 10 phrases of Russian memorized. I could see myself living here, except for the cold.

I can tell you of places around Odessa, precise Odessan suburbs 45 minutes from the center, where you could go see for yourself. But granted, it's because most of the families there have drug-related problems (think the grand-grand mothers raising the kids). Very low-income places. Kids with cardboard-made toys, I am not kidding, and very small and thin.

Anyway, I have walked around Odessa main commercial street, derebesomething, with a typical Ukrainian family, lower-middle-class people on once-in-year holiday, and believe me they could not buy even side-of-the road food, their kids were just looking at the restaurants like Dicken's characters', with wide and sad eyes. I ended up buying food for this family, like I was in the Phils...

And you are right, almost all Ukrainian men have a beer belly and generally are massive and slow dudes, but, just wait for the next generation, the post-Maidan crisis generation, they will be thin, they'll grow up with less food...

Also, there is no denying my "people, old before their time" FSU description: compare a 40 years old French or Italian dude with a 40 years old Ukrainian, lord!... or a 35 years old Parisian or Milan woman with a 35 years old Ukrainian pre-babushka: sad!

This said, I do not deny that Ukraine, for us, is perfectly livable and millions of miles from Africa-conditions, of course.
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#94

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Going Strong, I usually agree with you, but in the last sentence I have to disagree a little, if you walk in the city center of Kiev and even Kharkov there are plenty of good looking guys in their late 30s and 40s, probably you will see more in Milano or Paris, but you will see a lot of strange people in these places too (feminists, migrants, beggars, punk's...) on the outskirts of these cities I bet there there are many busted dudes too...
Also there is plenty of fine looking and thin women in the 35-40 or even older in Ukraine, the young babushka I think it is a myth, sure some women really get busted, but that can be motivated by many factors, abusive husbands, marriage and the subsequent lack of motivation to not indulge in binge eating...well, not just the lack of access to good nutrients, it happens too to some ladies in France or Italy...
I worked in an office while I was in intern with 8 woman, all of them busted and the older was probably only 40...
I go inside any navigation agency in central Odessa, and most of the ladies working there well past their 30s are still very bangable.
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#95

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 02:10 PM)Rocha Wrote:  

Going Strong, I usually agree with you, but in the last sentence I have to disagree a little, if you walk in the city center of Kiev and even Kharkov there are plenty of good looking guys in their late 30s and 40s, probably you will see more in Milano or Paris, but you will see a lot of strange people in these places too (feminists, migrants, beggars, punk's...) on the outskirts of these cities I bet there there are many busted dudes too...
Also there is plenty of fine looking and thin women in the 35-40 or even older in Ukraine, the young babushka I think it is a myth, sure some women really get busted, but that can be motivated by many factors, abusive husbands, marriage and the subsequent lack of motivation to not indulge in binge eating...well, not just the lack of access to good nutrients, it happens too to some ladies in France or Italy...
I worked in an office while I was in intern with 8 woman, all of them busted and the older was probably only 40...
I go inside any navigation agency in central Odessa, and most of the ladies working there well past their 30s are still very bangable.

No problem, compadre. Thing is, ladies in central Odessa or Kiev, are the kinda winners in life, but on the other hand, the women that one sees far from these prestigious places, are the losers, and look a lot less beautiful, and a lot more busted.

Anyway, it's clear that there is one and only one defect in Slavic genes, it is the tendency to get fat after 35, tendency explained by the regimen of past generations (hardships, potatoes, potatoes, xolodomor and back to potatoes: bad for genes).

But ok, things are changing quite fast in this world. Same way there are less (vodka-) drunk people in Russia, there are less fat people in Ukraine. People are adapting and bettering themselves, both in Russia and Ukraine.
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#96

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Ukrainian guys are probably the skinniest I have seen personally, many either seem to be rake thin or have a pot belly. The skinny ones are not going to die of starvation, Ukraine after all is the breadbasket of Europe and staple cereals, fruit and veg are cheap enough. Then again many are not healthy, real meat is a treat for them hence doner kebab places are becoming increasingly popular, they can get some protein for a dollar or so.

The better looking guys I have seen have been in Odessa, an outdoorsy city and the guys workout more.

As far as older women goes i'm personally rarely attracted to a woman over 35 in Ukraine, many of them will have let their figures slide due to marraiges/kids and diet. I recently went to Latvia and I was shocked, the first time in a long time where I had been attracted to women of this age, they have more money and are more independent, great skin, stylish, there was even a woman that must have been mid 50's that I would have boned.

Quote:Quote:

They have plenty of toys since "Карпатія" produces wooden domestic made ones, sourced from the still abundant forests, sold for cheap. The Chinese made Walmart style plastic junk in the USA don't play here.

Yes the evil of plastic toys, I haven't seen any kids pulling a wooden train on a piece of string in Ukraine yet but who knows [Image: dodgy.gif]
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#97

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

"they will often just have some watery soup with a meatball in it, and some bread."

Makes little sense. What Ukrainian soup is watery and has "meatball(s)" in it? None I have ever seen. You could have at least made up a believable story, like Borshch or mushroom soup, ones actually served in Ukraine.

What man, did you have to exaggerate to the point of having girls live off of watery soup, like some POW camp? Why not say, Gruel? Or could you not stop with your fabrications altogether?

No meat huh? Desperate for Kabobs? There are not many kebab stands at all; Ukraine grows more than produce, but has cattle, poultry, and even more so, hogs. Hence the meat and pork served in abundance in the cafeterias like Hata.

Ukranians are not even close to being the thinnest; you must have not been to East Africa, or Asia.
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#98

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

-_-

Bruising cervix since 96
#TeamBeard
"I just want to live out my days drinking virgin margaritas and banging virgin señoritas" - Uncle Cr33pin
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#99

Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Quote: (08-29-2016 03:23 PM)scrambled Wrote:  

"they will often just have some watery soup with a meatball in it, and some bread."

Makes little sense. What Ukrainian soup is watery and has "meatball(s)" in it? None I have ever seen. You could have at least made up a believable story, like Borshch or mushroom soup, ones actually served in Ukraine.

What man, did you have to exaggerate to the point of having girls live off of watery soup, like some POW camp? Why not say, Gruel? Or could you not stop with your fabrications altogether?

No meat huh? Desperate for Kabobs? There are not many kebab stands at all; Ukraine grows more than produce, but has cattle, poultry, and even more so, hogs. Hence the meat and pork served in abundance in the cafeterias like Hata.

Ukranians are not even close to being the thinnest; you must have not been to East Africa, or Asia.

Ukraine has more than two types of soup believe it or not. Your observations made about Ukraine clearly come from doing daygame on Kreschatik, or playing with your Iphone at McDonalds.

Loads of chicken kebab stands, especially in Odessa. Sorry you didn't see any in Gulliver.

Your claim that Ukrainians eat way healthier than Americans is ludicrous. And with your plastic toy comment I wonder if you might hail from the Amish community?
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Odessa, Ukraine 2016 Datasheet

Hi, I was wondering people recommend Odessa in Autumn. Looking for decent nightlife and receptive girls.

Or maybe Kiev is best?

Any info appreciated!
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