[HOD]

I am currently in the Guangdong province where most of the top 1% of Chinese Millionaire and Billionaire live, and addition is home to the most Chinese migrant workers, that help build and create the wealth of these new Millionaire and billionaire lifestyle.

I am starting to realize, by purchasing name brand products, I am perhaps enabling and helping to fund the top 1% agenda, or is this simply economics that move the global economy and provide jobs.

On one side, China has improve the lives of average Chinese lower and middle class.

But is it actually better lifestyle for everyone in the world.

I am starting to believe by buying more middle class products like Tom shoes vs sporting Italian suits, would help strengthen the middle class and boycotting the purchase of luxury goods like BMW, Mercedez Benz, ultra luxury items, or staying at 5 star hotels. Perhaps living a simpler life maybe the answer to helping the middle class.

Are perhaps, the 1% grip on the economy is too strong for us as individual consumer to make any changes.

[TooFineAPoint]

First off, I suggest thinking of the "wealthy" in these terms:


Also -- this I'm not sure about but it seems plausible -- don't a lot of the ultra-wealthy get that way by selling tons of cheap stuff to lots of cheap people? In that sense, the handmade Italian suit might be by a top notch tailor & fabric supplier, but these guys who are foremost in their craft are more likely to be artisans who make good money but nowhere near "1%" wealth. Whereas the dude who owns a factory making cheap flip-flops might be the exploiter you despise. Or he might just be a guy providing a lot of jobs to make a product you don't need so he is best ignored rather than despised.

[262]

There's always going to be a top 1%, in any system.

Your time is better spent trying to move up to a more comfortable %, than waiting for society to make another futile attempt at equal outcomes (see the old Soviet Union, old Communist China, modern Sweden, etc).

Politics in one picture:

[GlobalMan]

262 nailed it.

[HOD]

(03-16-2016 04:18 AM)262 Wrote:  

There's always going to be a top 1%, in any system.

Your time is better spent trying to move up to a more comfortable %, than waiting for society to make another futile attempt at equal outcomes (see the old Soviet Union, old Communist China, modern Sweden, etc).

Politics in one picture:

I realize that, what I'm trying to say is that, currently the 1% control 90% of the wealth. I don't mine the 1%, I just want the ability to accumulate wealth, be base more on meritocracy and more competitive for everyone.

I just hope someday its more like the 1% control 50% of the wealth, versus today.

[RatInTheWoods]

When we lived in tribes and small communities we had about equal wealth.

I don't mind putting up with the 1% thing, in a western country I can work hard and live in the 2% comfort, more abundance man has not known since the dawn of time.

We are the first generation of men that didn't HAVE to go to war, have freedoms, peace, security and comfort above every single generation that ever lived.

I don't mind the 1 %

[262]

(03-16-2016 04:43 AM)elimanning Wrote:  

I realize that, what I'm trying to say is that, currently the 1% control 90% of the wealth. I don't mine the 1%, I just want the ability to accumulate wealth, be base more on meritocracy and more competitive for everyone.

I just hope someday its more like the 1% control 50% of the wealth, versus today.

My bet - with my money in the S&P 500 & MSCI EAFE - is that over the long term, humans WILL become more efficient and more meritocratic.

That means the pie will get bigger, as we've seen with increasing living standards across the world.

But, that increased meritocracy ALSO means the market will become more efficient at rewarding high-performers, especially the top 1%. So, expect them to take an even greater share than today.

That's not a bad deal for anyone, though. Sure, the top 1% get a bigger % slice of the pie, but because they increased the SIZE of the pie, the 99% are also better off.

Finally, and most importantly, note that as the market becomes more efficient, there'll be more movement between the top 1% and the 99% over time. Increasingly, to stay in the top 1%, you'll have to deliver hits on a more frequent basis.

We've seen the results of not doing that already, with wealthy inheritors literally snorting their family's fortunes up their noses, for instance. We've also see the results going the other way, with formerly unremarkable guys like Warren Buffet amassing fortunes through a combination of hard work, intelligence, and yes, luck.

However, if you were to limit the top 1% to a certain % of the pie, you would reduce their incentive to deliver hits. That % of the pie would then go to those who did less to create it, ironically reducing everyone's incentive to create, resulting in a downward spiral.

Of course, that assumes that you CAN limit the top 1% to a certain % of the pie. What will happen in practice is that the 1% will find some way around that. We already see that, with wealthy individuals and large companies moving or keeping their wealth away from more limiting governments.

Getting back to you, you've got your shot at getting money. You can BE in the 1% if you work hard and smart, and get lucky. The 1% having a smaller % won't get you anywhere, especially over the long-term.

P.S. Note that all the above applies to the SEXUAL market too.

[KevCapitalist]

First of all is education. No 'illuminati' No '1%' Be able to name names, what these people run/fund, and know how they act against your interests. Watch out for BS conspiracy theories with no supporting evidence. Understand negative trends are usually started by well meaning people and gain momentum with the funding of those who see their continuation beneficial. And that no one is a mustache-twirling villian; simply there are ideological zealots & nepotists.

[germanico]

Theres no such thing as a "middle class brand".

The big brand and the budget brand are owned by the same corporations. If you want to weaken the grip of the ruling class, stay out of their game as much as you can.

Is like Monopoly. They have you running around the board thinking that you can "win", all while they own the board, the dice, the tokens, and they print the Monopoly Money you hoard.

Buy from the artisanal producers that still make things to last you a lifetime. Custom handmade suits and shoes instead of Tom shoes. Why would you want to dress like a middle class office drone anyways?

[zero1]

Speaking of incentives, this is what made me decide to stop running an online business in Australia. Paying 40% income tax, along with all the accounting requirements, just didn't seem fair to me, and I decided it wasn't worth the effort. Now living in a 3rd world pussy paradise on below 1st world poverty level income, I'm having a quality of life that I believe is much better. So much free time too due to a lack of a job and business.

If a country wants to attract entrepeneurs or people who believe they have a way to fix a deficiency somewhere in a market or society, then they need to provide incentive for those people to sacrifice their time and money and also the risk of failing. Watching the 1% pay no tax, whilst plebians pay 40% tax with the very real risk of failure, provides no incentive for me and I assume many others to take any risks with new business ideas. The solution however isn't to dismantle the 1%, because again the same problem occurs: no incentive to implement your ideas. The solution is to provide a pathway for plebians to reach the 1%. Create the incentive through a fair tax system, equal competition, and eliminate needless red tape which only large corporate monopolies can get through with their lawyers (think FDA drug approval), and innovation will happen.

The leftist idealism of socialism/communism fails to acknowledge that a lack of incentive to live like a king compared to 99% of people stifles innovation. Why should anyone take risks when they're going to be heavily taxed on the off-chance they're actually successful? This is one of the reasons I like Trump's policies: a 10% corporate tax rate and 25% income tax. I'd incorporate a US company as a foreigner for sure, and work hard on my ideas, with a tax program like that. As it stands currently, the effective tax rate is some 60% after calculating a 30% corporate tax combined with the income tax after withdrawing the profits. Complete and utter delusion and greed by progressives within the US is what has made that country plummet off a cliff since Reagan. And the left are too stupid to see the simple solution. Why? Because of their gigantic egos that someone might actually be better than them and out-perform them in a free market, where actual results are rewarded by consumers, and not ad-hominem rhetoric and jumping over each other as to who's the biggest victim and therefore deserves the most special treatment at someone elses expense.

We will always need a 1%, it's the way a good capitalist society works - it's the reward for the innovators, and serves as encouragement and motivation for the plebians that they too can reach it. But everyone should have an equal chance at getting there, and this is currently not the case. Whatever is preventing this needs to dismantled, even if that includes dismantling the current 1% because they're using artificial tactics to keep people from joining them fairly. That's not cool, and that needs revolution in my opinion, if needed. As anyone aware would know, cronyism and corruption and corporate welfare for select entities are examples of why we are not operating in a free market at all, but in a corptocracy run by the elite. As long as this is happening, I won't play their game when I can simply live overseas. I'm sure others share similar views.

[The Beast1]

You want to stick it to the 1%?

Here's how you can do it, but you'll be sort of a hipster doing it.

1. Buy 2nd hand clothes. Go to a tailor for suits and get originally cut fabric.
2. Don't buy brand name products.
3. Cook everything from scratch.
4. Buy food from locally sourced places (local farmer markets/butchers)
5. Buy an old car and repair it when it breaks.
6. Bank at a credit union

Seems about right for me.

[thoughtgypsy]

I care not about the 1%, but I do care about the 0.01% and their top-down hierarchy of bought and paid serfs. The ones who wish to turn me into a data point and milk me for all my productivity for the rest of my life. The ones who want to destroy women and overturn the nuclear family so that there are no networks independent of their monitoring and control.

It is easy to think that we are a small piece of the pie, that our own actions are meaningless. But by definition, we make up the bulk of the pie, and while we have less economic impact, it is much easier for us to reach a critical mass by our actions. While our assets and wealth are a much smaller slice, our ability to remove labor, discretionary spending, and consumption gives us tremendous power when done on a large enough scale.

Before I would go out in downtown DC and drop $200 in a night. I'd buy designer clothes at steep prices and spend like no tomorrow. And I was considered one of the frugal ones. Looking back on it, I see it all as wasted profligate spending. It was all to distinguish me by 5% among the other guys all fighting over the same entitled group of women who would never last a decade of marriage. It is a system that encourages young men to piss their money away chasing empty insecurities. In another time that money would have gone towards building a legacy, but we live in strange times.

I think there are better ways to spend it. Now I am focused completely on where my money is going. In Asia, I tried as much as possible to limit the amount of money that went towards the corrupt centralized government. I avoided services that gave the majority of their money to government (Taxi services, tourism, immigration fees, taxes, etc). I used services that cut out the middlemen as much as possible (Uber, local market vendors, direct tipping of help). I gave money instead of food to the poor kids that the cartels force to hustle roses on the street corners. I found out that a lot of tips didn't go directly to the servers. 50% went to the owner (presumably some of which had to go to the local politicians so they wouldn't shut them down) and the rest to the workers. So I started palming money to the workers instead of tipping. There are ways to do it.

It's given me a better appreciation for money. I rarely go out and drop huge sums anymore. I've already achieved most of what I've ever wanted to in life. Now I'm focused on enjoying life and seeking value. Once (if) I've got the travel bug out of my system, it will serve me well. I will hustle hard and save up fast, and when the time comes my first moves will be buying up income generating assets (i.e. AirBnb apartments) and serving the people who support said assets well. Let the workers control the means of production, and give an incentive for the producers to produce. If enough people do it, we're certainly on to something.

[thoughtgypsy]

edit: food instead of money

[Snowblind]

For there to be winners in life, there have to be losers. The trick is... not to be a loser. You should always be trying to take small steps up the ladder, any way you can (stay true to ethics and good morals though). Literally any other ideas go against human nature and engender dangerous ideas of unreachable utopias.

Play the game like there is no 1%. There's just you, your goals, and the soft people that fall behind you. Everything else is a construct or a distraction or a pretend enemy or obstacle you're never going to get the opportunity to climb over, or fight. Do the best you can with what you have, and look after those that look after you.

[Samseau]

(03-16-2016 04:18 AM)262 Wrote:  

There's always going to be a top 1%, in any system.

Your time is better spent trying to move up to a more comfortable %, than waiting for society to make another futile attempt at equal outcomes (see the old Soviet Union, old Communist China, modern Sweden, etc).

Politics in one picture:

This is true for 90% of cases but every now and then a genuine political revolution comes along that improves the world by a thousandfold. If progress never occurred we'd still be living like serfs in the feudal ages or slaves in the Roman times.

[El Chinito loco]

(03-20-2016 02:18 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

You want to stick it to the 1%?

Here's how you can do it, but you'll be sort of a hipster doing it.

1. Buy 2nd hand clothes. Go to a tailor for suits and get originally cut fabric.
2. Don't buy brand name products.
3. Cook everything from scratch.
4. Buy food from locally sourced places (local farmer markets/butchers)
5. Buy an old car and repair it when it breaks.
6. Bank at a credit union

Seems about right for me.

Those are good practices and nothing hipster about any of that at all. That's pretty much how I live now. It's a good way to live since you aren't tied down by useless material shit or unhealthy living.

For the general list i'd add the obvious one which is avoid consuming mainstream media and getting wrapped up in commercial team sports crap. This includes going to see the latest tentpole shitfest, mindless shows, buying sports merchandise etc.. Try to be a patron of high quality art and entertainment. I'm guilty of spending money on garbage in the past as i'm sure everyone has. I'm certainly tightening up on this a lot since mainstream media and hollywood studios directly feeds the 1%.

Plus general prudent financial planning also tightens up the amount of value they can extract from you.

It's good to diversify your assets and business so you pay minimally into the tax system. A lot of the 1% gains their real power through government largesse and subsidies.

Don't carry debt unless you're using debt to actually make money. The modern banking system is designed as wealth extraction from everyone else except the elite.

[Putin Closes]

(03-23-2016 08:58 PM)El Chinito loco Wrote:  

(03-20-2016 02:18 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

You want to stick it to the 1%?

Here's how you can do it, but you'll be sort of a hipster doing it.

1. Buy 2nd hand clothes. Go to a tailor for suits and get originally cut fabric.
2. Don't buy brand name products.
3. Cook everything from scratch.
4. Buy food from locally sourced places (local farmer markets/butchers)
5. Buy an old car and repair it when it breaks.
6. Bank at a credit union

Seems about right for me.

Those are good practices and nothing hipster about any of that at all. That's pretty much how I live now. It's a good way to live since you aren't tied down by useless material shit or unhealthy living.

For the general list i'd add the obvious one which is avoid consuming mainstream media and getting wrapped up in commercial team sports crap. This includes going to see the latest tentpole shitfest, mindless shows, buying sports merchandise etc.. Try to be a patron of high quality art and entertainment. I'm guilty of spending money on garbage in the past as i'm sure everyone has. I'm certainly tightening up on this a lot since mainstream media and hollywood studios directly feeds the 1%.

Plus general prudent financial planning also tightens up the amount of value they can extract from you.

It's good to diversify your assets and business so you pay minimally into the tax system. A lot of the 1% gains their real power through government largesse and subsidies.

Don't carry debt unless you're using debt to actually make money. The modern banking system is designed as wealth extraction from everyone else except the elite.

Meh. I am a fan of corporatism as long as it DRIVES DOWN cost. Without corporatism you wouldn't have efficiency that you are used to in the 1st world. Living in the Philippines I keep finding myself going back to western places who actually aren't run like some backwater store.

Can't begin to tell you how hard it is to find a store to have a product you want in stock.

The PH is a great example on how local protectionism fucks over the local populace. Yes the 1% control a lot of wealth BUT they usually have services that are vastly superior to any other SME business. However,you allow foreign investment in, even bigger companies with even better services would come in and wipe out all the SMEs within a year.

I trust an ayala property more then any other shady local company. Cause they deliver a consistent good product.

Its just a way of life that people will gravitate to 1-5 brands for a niche, its human nature. This is how the 1% is made.

[BIG BOSS]

You're not a bernie supporter are you? The same people end up on top anyway. With all this talk of 'monopolies' I would hope to see mention of the Federal Government which is the greatest monopoly and the most elitist entity of all. Uber-rich people are people who take advantage of situations, nothing more. They're no different than an average person whos main interest is self interest.