[Brian Shima]

Why? Im not sure, women are funny creatures sometimes. It took me a while to realize that my cute face was the reason i was doing better than these meat heads and real outgoing guys. Your clothing and body helps of course but you can have a good amount of leeway with both if you have the good looking face..

So shave and get nice facial hair, use facial masks, get your teeth nice, do what ya gotta do for your face. To many guys dont do one thing for their face but will bust their ass in the gym and spend crazy money on clothes..

[Onto]

I don't know man. I had a buddy in college who was 5'4", skinny, and had the most busted pepperoni-face you every saw. He didn't give a fuck though and was a very funny, outgoing guy who pulled very hot ass. I always shook my head in disbelief at the women he would snag.

I think the #1 thing women are attracted to is personality.

[Sidney Crosby]

(01-29-2016 07:44 PM)Onto Wrote:  

I don't know man. I had a buddy in college who was 5'4", skinny, and had the most busted pepperoni-face you every saw. He didn't give a fuck though and was a very funny, outgoing guy who pulled very hot ass. I always shook my head in disbelief at the women he would snag.

I think the #1 thing women are attracted to is personality.

[Onto]

(01-29-2016 08:13 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 07:44 PM)Onto Wrote:  

I don't know man. I had a buddy in college who was 5'4", skinny, and had the most busted pepperoni-face you every saw. He didn't give a fuck though and was a very funny, outgoing guy who pulled very hot ass. I always shook my head in disbelief at the women he would snag.

I think the #1 thing women are attracted to is personality.

hahaha....you don't think so? Well, what is it then?

[Sidney Crosby]

(01-29-2016 08:29 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:13 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 07:44 PM)Onto Wrote:  

I don't know man. I had a buddy in college who was 5'4", skinny, and had the most busted pepperoni-face you every saw. He didn't give a fuck though and was a very funny, outgoing guy who pulled very hot ass. I always shook my head in disbelief at the women he would snag.

I think the #1 thing women are attracted to is personality.

hahaha....you don't think so? Well, what is it then?

Physical appearance
-Height
-Muscles
-Looks
-Clothes

[Onto]

(01-29-2016 08:42 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:29 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:13 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 07:44 PM)Onto Wrote:  

I don't know man. I had a buddy in college who was 5'4", skinny, and had the most busted pepperoni-face you every saw. He didn't give a fuck though and was a very funny, outgoing guy who pulled very hot ass. I always shook my head in disbelief at the women he would snag.

I think the #1 thing women are attracted to is personality.

hahaha....you don't think so? Well, what is it then?

Physical appearance
-Height
-Muscles
-Looks
-Clothes

What about my short and ugly friend, and I mean really ugly? How was he able to pull and ltr really hot girls?

Take two guys with the same great aesthetics. What makes a girl choose one over the other?

[Anabasis to Desta]

I might be one of the prettiest guys on this forum and got 0 pussy freshman year of college.

Girls i never met would approach me at parties and say shit like " You're sooooo beautiful", "If you were a girl i'd turn lesbian for you" etc ... but when i tried escalating they'd shut me down and oftentimes fucked guys who looked like ogres.

I'd argue a man's face is the LEAST important aspect that contributes to his attractiveness. Girls can acknowledge and appreciate your face like they would a painting but it does absolutely nothing in-terms of raw sexual attraction.

Elliot Rodger was a pretty good looking dude but shot up a bunch of people because he got no pussy.



Whereas ugly D-list rapper Danny Brown gets blowjobs on stage and had bitches throwing themselves at him even before he got mini-famous according to friends.



Notice the two guys' facial expressions. A 10 year old can tell you who gets more girls despite their huge disparity in facial attractiveness. As a man the expression on your face which is a reflection of your inner state and confidence, is infinitely more important than your face itself. There are no ugly men. Just weak ones.

Unless they have an obvious genetic defect, i urge guys to stop using their face as an excuse

[PapayaTapper]

(01-29-2016 08:29 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:13 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 07:44 PM)Onto Wrote:  

I don't know man. I had a buddy in college who was 5'4", skinny, and had the most busted pepperoni-face you every saw. He didn't give a fuck though and was a very funny, outgoing guy who pulled very hot ass. I always shook my head in disbelief at the women he would snag.

I think the #1 thing women are attracted to is personality.

hahaha....you don't think so? Well, what is it then?

Yes and no. There's a saying that I believe sums it up best:

"Women are attracted to the men they fall in love with...men fall in love with the women they're attracted to"

This explains why you'll very more often see a hot chick with a busted looking dude, than you'll see a real good looking guy with a sea donkey of a chick (if ever). A guy's personality/game can overcome bad looks (but not vice versa)

As always, Uncle Wayne said it best:

@1:30 "See kid...an ugly broad, might as well take her behind the shed and put one behind the ear...that dog wont hunt. But any dude with a johnson's...he's got a shot because cool...comes from the inside" -Uncle Wayne

Amen brother Wayne, amen

[Sidney Crosby]

(01-29-2016 08:47 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:42 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:29 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:13 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 07:44 PM)Onto Wrote:  

I don't know man. I had a buddy in college who was 5'4", skinny, and had the most busted pepperoni-face you every saw. He didn't give a fuck though and was a very funny, outgoing guy who pulled very hot ass. I always shook my head in disbelief at the women he would snag.

I think the #1 thing women are attracted to is personality.

hahaha....you don't think so? Well, what is it then?

Physical appearance
-Height
-Muscles
-Looks
-Clothes

What about my short and ugly friend, and I mean really ugly? How was he able to pull and ltr really hot girls?

Take two guys with the same great aesthetics. What makes a girl choose one over the other?

Obviously there are exceptions, but 9/10 times the guy I described is getting more attention than your friend in a club/bar.

I think if two guys are equal physically it will come down to personality or money/power, depends what a girl finds more important.

[Onto]

(01-29-2016 09:16 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:47 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:42 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:29 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:13 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

hahaha....you don't think so? Well, what is it then?

Physical appearance
-Height
-Muscles
-Looks
-Clothes

What about my short and ugly friend, and I mean really ugly? How was he able to pull and ltr really hot girls?

Take two guys with the same great aesthetics. What makes a girl choose one over the other?

Obviously there are exceptions, but 9/10 times the guy I described is getting more attention than your friend in a club/bar.

I think if two guys are equal physically it will come down to personality or money/power, depends what a girl finds more important.

I rest my case.

[Sidney Crosby]

(01-29-2016 09:18 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 09:16 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:47 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:42 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:29 PM)Onto Wrote:  

hahaha....you don't think so? Well, what is it then?

Physical appearance
-Height
-Muscles
-Looks
-Clothes

What about my short and ugly friend, and I mean really ugly? How was he able to pull and ltr really hot girls?

Take two guys with the same great aesthetics. What makes a girl choose one over the other?

Obviously there are exceptions, but 9/10 times the guy I described is getting more attention than your friend in a club/bar.

I think if two guys are equal physically it will come down to personality or money/power, depends what a girl finds more important.

I rest my case.

I don't get how you think you won that argument, when you earlier stated "Take two guys with the same great aesthetics.", which is obviously different than your ugly 5'4 friend with good game.

[Dantes]

We have been down this road before.

It is a factor just like Game, personality, presence, and money. They all contribute to getting laid. Accentuate the ones you have and work to improve on the others you are lacking.

[B-Nut]

(01-29-2016 09:05 PM)Anabasis to Desta Wrote:  

I might be one of the prettiest guys on this forum and got 0 pussy freshman year of college.

Girls i never met would approach me at parties and say shit like " You're sooooo beautiful", "If you were a girl i'd turn lesbian for you" etc ... but when i tried escalating they'd shut me down and oftentimes fucked guys who looked like ogres.

I'd argue a man's face is the LEAST important aspect that contributes to his attractiveness. Girls can acknowledge and appreciate your face like they would a painting but it does absolutely nothing in-terms of raw sexual attraction.

Elliot Rodger was a pretty good looking dude but shot up a bunch of people because he got no pussy.



Whereas ugly D-list rapper Danny Brown gets blowjobs on stage and had bitches throwing themselves at him even before he got mini-famous according to friends.



Notice the two guys' facial expressions. A 10 year old can tell you who gets more girls despite their huge disparity in facial attractiveness. As a man the expression on your face which is a reflection of your inner state and confidence, is infinitely more important than your face itself. There are no ugly men. Just weak ones.

Unless they have an obvious genetic defect, i urge guys to stop using their face as an excuse

it does absolutely nothing in-terms of raw sexual attraction.

come on guys, these arguments can be countered just as easily by the endless amount of fake tinder profiles with models where chicks just bang the guy even though he purposely acts like an autistic aspie.

Completely disagree face does not generate raw sexual attraction. Shit, chicks bang millions of guys a day based on face pictures alone online. And they go straight to these guys house. Where exactly is the "game" ? Heck, if a guy is attractive enough she does not even shit test the man, because he is so much smv points above her.

A boring guy with a good face in the women's eyes is a "confident interesting man" while a game aware pick up artist with a bad face can just as easily be a "weird uncalibrated loser" to the same woman.

[Jazzman92]

(01-29-2016 09:16 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:47 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:42 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:29 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:13 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

hahaha....you don't think so? Well, what is it then?

Physical appearance
-Height
-Muscles
-Looks
-Clothes

What about my short and ugly friend, and I mean really ugly? How was he able to pull and ltr really hot girls?

Take two guys with the same great aesthetics. What makes a girl choose one over the other?

Obviously there are exceptions, but 9/10 times the guy I described is getting more attention than your friend in a club/bar.

I think if two guys are equal physically it will come down to personality or money/power, depends what a girl finds more important.

Attention doesn't translate to success. Also a guy with really solid game is just as rare to find as a guy who is very good looking. IMO a man who has an excess of anything (looks, money, status, game) will have a fairly easy time getting laid. Game is just more applicable to other areas of life. Just look at Donald Trump.

[PapayaTapper]

(01-29-2016 09:16 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

Obviously there are exceptions, but 9/10 times the guy I described is getting more attention than your friend in a club/bar.

One of the biggest hurdles for us as guys when learning to game women is the conflation of looks and attraction. While you're right a really good looking guy will undoubtedly have an advantage in garnering initial interest (attention) and opportunity from chicks... bad game will kill that opportunity just as quickly. I don't know how many times I've heard from chicks (both bangs and friends) that nothing makes a guy go from "hot" to "not" faster than bad game / boring personality. It's like throwing sand on the pussy

Conversely, speaking for myself, If I meet and am trying to swoop a hot chick for the first time I really don't give a rat's ass about her personality. I can't put my spam-missile her personality. In fact I've come to enjoy sex with women I don't like personality-wise. It's actually quite liberating because I truly dont give a shit if I never see them again.

Therein lies the one of the many ironies of the male / female dynamic

[Cobra]

So confidence is not a factor? I'm surprised no one brought that up. Yet, it is the single biggest reason that guys get laid.

What's up with these gay posts with focus on facial features above masculine features? I'm pretty sure girls put a lot less value on your face than some of you want to believe.

Come on OP, are you trolling?

[Jazzman92]

(01-29-2016 09:39 PM)B-Nut Wrote:  

it does absolutely nothing in-terms of raw sexual attraction.

come on guys, these arguments can be countered just as easily by the endless amount of fake tinder profiles with models where chicks just bang the guy even though he purposely acts like an autistic aspie.

Completely disagree face does not generate raw sexual attraction. Shit, chicks bang millions of guys a day based on face pictures alone online. And they go straight to these guys house. Where exactly is the "game" ? Heck, if a guy is attractive enough she does not even shit test the man, because he is so much smv points above her.

A boring guy with a good face in the women's eyes is a "confident interesting man" while a game aware pick up artist with a bad face can just as easily be a "weird uncalibrated loser" to the same woman.

True but those fake tinder profiles are using male models. Those guys won the genetic lottery. Its like comparing Abdul the Saudi Prince to the average man.

Whats really interesting about those experiments is that the 7/10 guy does only marginally better than the 5/10 guy.

[Sidney Crosby]

(01-29-2016 09:42 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 09:16 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

Obviously there are exceptions, but 9/10 times the guy I described is getting more attention than your friend in a club/bar.

One of the biggest hurdles for us as guys when learning to game women is the conflation of looks and attraction. While you're right a really good looking guy will undoubtedly have an advantage in garnering initial interest (attention) and opportunity from chicks... bad game will kill that opportunity just as quickly. I don't know how many times I've heard from chicks (both bangs and friends) that nothing makes a guy go from "hot" to "not" faster than bad game / boring personality. It's like throwing sand on the pussy

Conversely, speaking for myself, If I meet and am trying to swoop a hot chick for the first time I really don't give a rat's ass about her personality. I can't put my spam-missile her personality. In fact I've come to enjoy sex with women I don't like personality-wise. It's actually quite liberating because I truly dont give a shit if I never see them again.

Therein lies the one of the many ironies of the male / female dynamic

"Good looking game" is more like a "don't fuck things up game"

It's not exactly an uphill battle most guys face. A lot of naturally good looking guys don't have good game, cause they've never had to develop it.

[Onto]

(01-29-2016 09:28 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 09:18 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 09:16 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:47 PM)Onto Wrote:  

(01-29-2016 08:42 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

Physical appearance
-Height
-Muscles
-Looks
-Clothes

What about my short and ugly friend, and I mean really ugly? How was he able to pull and ltr really hot girls?

Take two guys with the same great aesthetics. What makes a girl choose one over the other?

Obviously there are exceptions, but 9/10 times the guy I described is getting more attention than your friend in a club/bar.

I think if two guys are equal physically it will come down to personality or money/power, depends what a girl finds more important.

I rest my case.

I don't get how you think you won that argument, when you earlier stated "Take two guys with the same great aesthetics.", which is obviously different than your ugly 5'4 friend with good game.

No difference between the examples. Both my ugly friend, and the winner of the two good looking guys, got the girl based on their game (a.k.a personality)

Even more to the point, my ugly friend often got hotter girls than us better looking guys. I suspect when you're dealt as poor a hand as he had (genetically) it forces you to develop in other ways. In his case it was his personality (game). Kind of like people who are blind or deaf developing heightened abilities in other areas to compensate.

I remember talking about it frankly with him once. He said something like he just didn't give a fuck. There was nothing he could do about his face or his height or his physique. In some ways, his being so disadvantaged physically paradoxically gave him a great advantage over others in talking with women.

The darker side of this "not give a fuck" power was when we would get drunk. He would go up to the biggest, jacked guy in the bar and pick a fight. We always had to keep a close eye on him as the night wore on.

He obviously had some kind of deep-seeded insecurity about his appearence if he's picking fights he can't win, but it's that same need to prove himself that led to his success with women.

[PapayaTapper]

(01-29-2016 09:49 PM)Sidney Crosby Wrote:  

"Good looking game" is more like a "don't fuck things up game"

It's not exactly an uphill battle most guys face. A lot of naturally good looking guys don't have good game, cause they've never had to develop it.

I don't disagree with that at all. In fact that's sort of what I said. What I do disagree with is "Girls put much more value on a guy's face than any other physical feature " (the title of this thread) We may just be arguing semantics but "first" doesn't necessarily equate to "most valuable"

[B-Nut]

Also, I have yet to see proof that a so called ugly guy is actually ugly. Males are bad at judging facial attractiveness of other men. Women are the true deciders.

The only way I could believe if a guy is truly ugly but has great game is if he made an online profile and got 0 dates. Haven't seen that happen yet. Guys that get laid in field also get laid online to some degree.

[Onto]

(01-29-2016 09:58 PM)B-Nut Wrote:  

Also, I have yet to see proof that a so called ugly guy is actually ugly. Males are bad at judging facial attractiveness of other men. Women are the true deciders.

The only way I could believe if a guy is truly ugly but has great game is if he made an online profile and got 0 dates. Haven't seen that happen yet. Guys that get laid in field also get laid online to some degree.

I saw the proof with my friend. His face looked like this pizza with zits and blackheads, and scars. It was not a pretty sight. That's why his example to me is so remarkable.

[PapayaTapper]

(01-29-2016 09:43 PM)Cobra Wrote:  



So confidence is not a factor? I'm surprised no one brought that up. Yet, it is the single biggest reason that guys get laid.

Come on OP, are you trolling?

Confidence is an integral component of good game (cant' have the latter without the former) so I'd say it's already an assumed part of the discussion


Edit

(01-29-2016 09:58 PM)B-Nut Wrote:  

Also, I have yet to see proof that a so called ugly guy is actually ugly. Males are bad at judging facial attractiveness of other men. Women are the true deciders.

The only way I could believe if a guy is truly ugly but has great game is if he made an online profile and got 0 dates. Haven't seen that happen yet. Guys that get laid in field also get laid online to some degree.

(01-29-2016 09:43 PM)Cobra Wrote:  

What's up with these gay posts with focus on facial features above masculine features? I'm pretty sure girls put a lot less value on your face than some of you want to believe.

You're right. It's getting kinda gay in here.

[OGNorCal707]

(01-29-2016 09:05 PM)Anabasis to Desta Wrote:  

I might be one of the prettiest guys on this forum and got 0 pussy freshman year of college.

Is it possible that you're not as good looking as you think you are?... I'm half serious, if you're a really handsome dude, you still need to know how to escalate, although I'm sure there will always be some drunk 6 that will throw herself at you to the point where all you got to do is get her alone and she'll do the rest.

[Anabasis to Desta]

^ It's true most people over-estimate their looks.

I get asked if I'm a model about 2-3 a year if that counts for something.

In retrospect, it was my total lack of game awareness and know-it-all personality that turned girls off. Like you said ... below average girls did make themselves blatantly available. I remember freshman year this Finnish blonde I met the same night straight up invited me to her room. I followed her and she starts grinding on me.

Instead of fucking her brains out, I decide to play sophisticated gentleman and start talking about the Russo-Finish winter war of 1939 and how brave the Finns were in defending their country. I thought I was impressing her with my worldliness & how much i knew about her country especially as a black guy breaking the stereotype and what not. Don't think the Sahara could have been as dry as her pussy afterwards.

Negative game is a real thing.