[Dr. Kahn]

These very manly character traits: Mental discipline, denying yourself instant gratification, enduring long grueling hours, being self-motivated, ability to work in a team while also capable of working all by yourself. Huge amount of patience, focus, not getting distracted, etc are necessary to competently study hard in the hard sciences.

Study is hard work. In fact, studying hard is soo hard that engaging in manual labor after intense hard studying sounds like a relief.

Studying pushes you further and farther than sports could ever do.

Studying hard instill strong masculine traits of thinking rationally, post-phoning instant gratification, increases focus, mental discipline, etc far more than playing sports would ever do.

Sports is just working "hard at fun"; while studying is working "hard at working hard".

Studying is the ultimate manly virtue.

Studying is far more alpha than playing some sports.

Academic programmes are intensively competitive. Especially at elite schools. So touting the competitiveness of sports as the reason why sports makes you alpha is ridiculous, because hard science academic programs at elite schools are brutally competitively. So much so, that at least one student every year commit suicide by jumping off the bridge at my school.

You will never hear of athletes committing suicide every year because their best doesn't measure up. This happens every year to exceptional students who cannot cope with the level of academic rigor at elite schools.

That is the level of pressure you have to deal with. Do you have any idea the kind of pressure cooker i am talking about?

This whole idea that sports makes you a man, while studying hard doesn't, is thoroughly misguided in my opinion.

The reality is that working in hard sciences requires greater mental discipline, focus, patience, teamwork(paradoxically, also the ability to also work independently), denying yourself instant gratification, long-term thinking, rationally processing information, etcetera -- All characteristics of a full grown man -- all these character traits are needed to study and excel at hard science subject. Study is hard work. Studying hard instill these values in you. Far harder and more challenging than playing some sports.

Academic is SUPREMELY MORE ALPHA than sports.

[Caribou]

delete

[Gmac]

Is this thread beta?

[Guitarman]

On one hand I agree that studying the hard sciences should be considered more alpha than sports. The reason for that is that our modern world is built on the back of hard studied and discovered science and technogy. However, that's not how the best looking chicks see it. At school as well as at Uni the best girls were always with the sports playing meat heads, they considered the more intellectual hard sciences student " nerds" or "geeks", or a "swot" in the UK. Relegating us to the status of "incel".

On the other hand having seen your other posts I do wonder if you are a new type of troll, a Muslim African Arab pseudo intellectual sports hating Troll.

[Cobra]

I can't say anything more.

[Sooth]

(01-08-2016 06:55 AM)Cobra Wrote:  



I can't say anything more.

[Dr. Kahn]

I think there is some primary confusion between MASCULINITY vs ALPHANESS. They are not the same thing, in my view.

But before i get to that, i want to say, thanks for the thoughtful reply(and I am not trolling at all, as it should become clearer the more you read below)

I personally found the argument that "because something has competition and teamwork(e.g playing sports), therefore it is alpha" to be an underdeveloped argument. That is why i created this thread as a thought experiment to examine the nature of "playing sports makes you alpha" argument.

I agree with you on "what girls finds attractive". At the end of the day, the bottomline is passing on your genes. It is about reproduction.

However, how about people that put on makeup and emote on screens(actors)and boy-bands faggots. They get plenty of girls, they are not masculine. Are they still alpha? Does this go against the argument of "women are attracted to what is masculine". Clearly these actors and boy bands are faggots. Yet, women want to fuck justin bieber despite the fact that he is clearly not remotely masculine.

It is very interesting the way masculinity is defined. And the overlap between alpha and masculinity.

Masculinity may or may not attract girls.

In my view, central to alphaness is the ability to attract girls.

An alpha may not be masculine e.g justin beiber and boy-bands faggots.

Masculinity cannot be defined in relations to women-- it stands alone, rock solid; while alpha is partly defined in relations to women.

That is why i think you can be masculine without playing sports; but you cannot be alpha without playing sports; due to the fact that a larger part of being alpha is defined in relations to women.

Here is also where is gets even messier: In the context of fame. If you are world famous -- you automatically get girls. Does that makes you masculine? Absolutely not. But with regards to women in the context of alphaness, i think fame makes you alpha.

I think the problem is that, masculinity and alphaness, tends to be inter-used and exchanged a lot. I am guilty of that myself.

I think these are the distinctions that needed to be fleshed out.

(01-08-2016 06:54 AM)Guitarman Wrote:  

On one hand I agree that studying the hard sciences should be considered more alpha than sports. The reason for that is that our modern world is built on the back of hard studied and discovered science and technogy. However, that's not how the best looking chicks see it. At school as well as at Uni the best girls were always with the sports playing meat heads, they considered the more intellectual hard sciences student " nerds" or "geeks", or a "swot" in the UK. Relegating us to the status of "incel".

On the other hand having seen your other posts I do wonder if you are a new type of troll, a Muslim African Arab pseudo intellectual sports hating Troll.

[Cobra]

I'm taking a wild guess that you listened to our podcast last night.

[Dr. Kahn]

Just thinking about it some more, here is an even more stark question:

If you have two choices:

Act and be like a total faggot e.g. boy-bands faggots all the way. With effete as fuck mannerisms, up-talk, weird gay mannerisms, wearing makeup, etc but you will get laid like justin beiber

versus

Be a truly, highly developed, ultramasculine man; but get laid far, far less -- 5 or 10 times a year.

Which one will you choose to be?

That is why i think there is a solid distinction between masculinity and alphaness. They can overlap, of course. But the distinction is still there.

[Sooth]

An Alpha is someone that females want to breed with.

Females don't give a flying fuck about hard sciences or academia when it comes to men. They don't care about how hard you worked studying. They have no concept of a hard days work physically or intellectually. Struggle and battling adversity is a masculine trait which they know nothing of. It's completely beyond their conception.

The only way advanced knowledge can help you in regards to women is if it boosts your confidence in being yourself.

Edit - Or if you have used it to gain a large number of followers on social media.

[dads]

(01-08-2016 07:18 AM)Dr. Kahn Wrote:  

I think there is some primary confusion between MASCULINITY vs ALPHANESS. They are not the same thing, in my view.

But before i get to that, i want to say, thanks for the thoughtful reply(and I am not trolling at all, as it should become clearer the more you read below)

I personally found the argument that "because something has competition and teamwork(e.g playing sports), therefore it is alpha" to be an underdeveloped argument. That is why i created this thread as a thought experiment to examine the nature of "playing sports makes you alpha" argument.

I agree with you on "what girls finds attractive". At the end of the day, the bottomline is passing on your genes. It is about reproduction.

However, how about people that put on makeup and emote on screens(actors)and boy-bands faggots. They get plenty of girls, they are not masculine. Are they still alpha? Does this go against the argument of "women are attracted to what is masculine". Clearly these actors and boy bands are faggots. Yet, women want to fuck justin bieber despite the fact that he is clearly not remotely masculine.

It is very interesting the way masculinity is defined. And the overlap between alpha and masculinity.

Masculinity may or may not attract girls.

In my view, central to alphaness is the ability to attract girls.

An alpha may not be masculine e.g justin beiber and boy-bands faggots.

Masculinity cannot be defined in relations to women-- it stands alone, rock solid; while alpha is partly defined in relations to women.

That is why i think you can be masculine without playing sports; but you cannot be alpha without playing sports; due to the fact that a larger part of being alpha is defined in relations to women.

Here is also where is gets even messier: In the context of fame. If you are world famous -- you automatically get girls. Does that makes you masculine? Absolutely not. But with regards to women in the context of alphaness, i think fame makes you alpha.

I think the problem is that, masculinity and alphaness, tends to be inter-used and exchanged a lot. I am guilty of that myself.

I think these are the distinctions that needed to be fleshed out.

(01-08-2016 06:54 AM)Guitarman Wrote:  

On one hand I agree that studying the hard sciences should be considered more alpha than sports. The reason for that is that our modern world is built on the back of hard studied and discovered science and technogy. However, that's not how the best looking chicks see it. At school as well as at Uni the best girls were always with the sports playing meat heads, they considered the more intellectual hard sciences student " nerds" or "geeks", or a "swot" in the UK. Relegating us to the status of "incel".

On the other hand having seen your other posts I do wonder if you are a new type of troll, a Muslim African Arab pseudo intellectual sports hating Troll.

I think you need to go outside and take a nice long walk. I don't mean to patronize you, but I do think, as someone (possibly?) new to the red pill you're getting way too caught up in this "alpha" thing. You read all these articles talking about Alpha vs Beta, and why would you want to be on the losing side of that? Unfortunately, Alpha generally describes qualities that that facilitate reproduction. Or, things that make you more attractive to the opposite sex. I know as someone who probably has the qualities you listed, and I don't doubt that you're probably brilliant, these traits are not the things that will endear you to women, like shooting 50% from the field will. Or batting for power, or running a clean post route.

[Dr. Kahn]

Hmmm... i think i see your point.

Basically, if what you do can be used to signify status. That is all that matters. I guess alpha is what signifies status to the right of the deviation. ... higher status.

So, if you can somehow package what you are doing or what you are(selling bananas on the street corner, academics, sports, etc) to signify higher status, that denotes alphaness. Sports easily denotes status more than academics. So at the end of the day, it is all about salesmanship.

I will also add that girls don't care how hard justin beiber worked too. Saw a video of him as a no-name street performer once. He was "busking" on the city steps.

(01-08-2016 07:47 AM)Sooth Wrote:  

An Alpha is someone that females want to breed with.

Females don't give a flying fuck about hard sciences or academia when it comes to men. They don't care about how hard you worked studying. They have no concept of a hard days work physically or intellectually. Struggle and battling adversity is a masculine trait which they know nothing of. It's completely beyond their conception.

The only way advanced knowledge can help you in regards to women is if it boosts your confidence in being yourself.

Edit - Or if you have used it to gain a large number of followers on social media.

[Pride male]

Brains>brawn. Knowledge is power. Intelligence not brute strength allowed Europe to conquer the world.

[Dr. Kahn]

hmmm.... Europeans are able to use their intelligence to achieve things that signify status... hence reaping the benefit of white god factor.

It is all about selling what you have in a way that signifies higher status. Whatever it is that you are selling.

(01-08-2016 07:57 AM)Pride male Wrote:  

Brains>brawn. Knowledge is power. Intelligence not brute strength allowed Europe to conquer the world.

[MKDAWUSS]

I'm of the opinion that the poll is flawed.

[Sooth]

Brains by themselves are not better than brawn in regards to attracting women. Brains alone are worthless when it comes to women.

You have to apply brains to the physical world in the form of work, creating some value and only then will you be attractive.

Women are value thieves, not knowledge thieves.

[Hades]

If a guy is actually smart and dedicated to academics, he might as well play to his strengths and work hard on schoolwork.

Likewise if a guy is talented and busts his ass at sports, he should do that.
Alpha/beta shouldn't factor into it.

It is good to recognize that for a lot of the 'highschool jocks' who did sports, that's the highest status they'll ever be in life.

[Dr. Kahn]

(01-08-2016 08:12 AM)Sooth Wrote:  

Brains by themselves are not better than brawn in regards to attracting women. Brains alone are worthless when it comes to women.

You have to apply brains to the physical world in the form of work, creating some value and only then will you be attractive.

Women are value thieves, not knowledge thieves.

That is it. Thread closed. Nothing else needs to be said after this.

So succint and captures everything.

+1 rep from me.

[Guitarman]

I have to say Justin Beiber sounds bloody awful in that vid. Basic open chord guitar strummery, thin reedy annoying voice that is off pitch most of the time. His attractiveness to women is due to the studio trickery and ghost songwriters that made him sound and look a lot better than he really is.

Honestly, he would not be up to scratch as lead vocals/ rhythm guitar in any of my bands!

[Duke Castile]

I have one question; does studying raise your testosterone?

[polar]

OP : false dichotomy. Real men do both.



In fact, by the time you're benching the entire Encyclopedia Britannica, you know you've got it made.

[The Beast1]

Depends on what you're studying.

STEM? Sure I can vouch for that.

Humanities? Might as well tuck your junk behind your legs at that point.

[Dr. Kahn]

(01-08-2016 09:07 AM)Fisto Wrote:  

I have one question; does studying raise your testosterone?

I counter: Can a low T man be more alpha than a high T man?

There are a lot of athletes and rappers who are pure simps due to being raised by single moms, are they alpha because they have high T even though their mentality is wrecked? I think they are masculine, but not alpha. Jared has a lot of threads on masculine men(athletes,rappers) getting used, abused and disposed off by women.

This goes to Sooth's argument that at the end of the day, it all boils down into how it translates in the physical world. Whatever it happens to be. If you are brainy, and you can signify higher status through your brains: having Harvard diploma, being president, etc that will let you slay pussy because it signifies status.

Testosterone results are biochemistry, and if that doesn't translates in behavior in physical world for whatever psychological reason, it doesn't matter.

I guess at the end of the day, it all boils down to: Can you sell it? How do you sell it?

[WestIndianArchie]

For humans, alpha has nothing to do with smarts or strength. It's the will to do what is necessary that gets a man to the top.

WIA

[Truck'n]

I don't get it, there is nothing alpha about purposely engaging in tasks that are non-rewarding and grueling. Sometimes to acheive your alpha goals, you might need to persevere in tasks that are hard, but the condition of being alpha is to maintain status on the top. Subjecting yourself to non-rewarding work is the opposite of alpha.