[PapayaTapper]

Let me boil it down a bit further

(09-28-2015 04:37 AM)heman29 Wrote:  

ok, just to summarize my mistakes:

1 I should have not made out for son long if we're not gonna have sex, and I must be the one to end the kiss/makout. I forgot about this one in this case.

At the risk of repeating myself for the sake of clarity: If youve never had sex with a particular girl you should not make out with her at all until you are going to have sex. You are diminishing your "mystery" by doing so. Unless your goal is to just make out that is

(09-28-2015 04:37 AM)heman29 Wrote:  

2 when we were making out in my car on our second date, after 10-15 mins I should have said something to get in her apartment.

Your chance of success would have been better if you'd gotten her into her apt before you started making out...(see 1 above). Making out should be the mid-point of a continuous process with the bang being the end. Unless you can / want to bang her in the car

(09-28-2015 04:37 AM)heman29 Wrote:  

3 In our last date, I should have kept my frame, and I should not have agreed to meet up with her friends included, and definetely I should have ejected when she said a guy was also coming and her female friends left, so it was just the three of us.

Yes

(09-28-2015 04:37 AM)heman29 Wrote:  

Anything else?


Anyway it went wrong mainly cause, for some reason, her interest in me dropped a lot in a few days God knows why. Had she kept the same interest level, we would have gone to have a drink and to dance as I suggested, and I would have probably gotten her in my bed by the end of the night which was the original plan, like I've done with previous girls...

There's no mystery. I've explained exactly why her interest waned. Girls brains, especially younger, are addicted to excitement / intrigue ("tingles") much like a drug addict is addicted to their substance of choice. They exchange their "magical" vagina for those tingles.

If you give too much too early she OD's and then effect wears off (she gets bored). When it comes to you and getting pussy if she gets bored, ie sees you as just another ordinary chode trying to get her goodies without giving her what she wants (excitement / tingles), she may as well have OD'ed for real because you're dead to her and her pussy. Or put another way: Her boredom = no pussy

In summary

Your goal should be to control the flow of "tingles" so that they peak right at the exact moment your logistics do.

[heman29]

but I think I did fine until date 2, right?

I mean, she and her friends invited me to go to a club with them.
We all went to have dinner, to have some drinks and to the club. Once inside I made out with her, grinded like crazy etc. I suggested to go to her place cause we were pretty horny, so I said it was more comfortable there but she did not want to leave her friends (-L-), so after an hour or so she was holding my hand, hugging me etc
I drove them home, we made out a bit more in my car and that was it. I did not say anything about going into her apartment cause it was 06:00, I was very tired, she was tired and feeling a bit sick.

I asked her out for a second date five days later. I suggested to go to have a drink and to dance but she said that "she had a cold" so she prefered to go to a shopping mall and have a tea.
We went, had a very nice conversation for 1.5 hours, I kissed her, we made out, she held my hand, I hugged her etc. Once I drove her home, we made out in my car like crazy etc SO HERE IS WHERE I SHOULD HAVE EITHER STOPPED THE MAKEOUT OR GOT INTO HER APARTMENT TO MAKE SOME PROGRESS HEADED TO SEX.
As I said, I was double parking so...how do I do it right in this situation? Do I tell her I am going to park? do I let her get into her apartment and I go to park? I dont want this same problem to happen ever again.

Anyway I've had this same situation happening with other chicks, and after making out in my car and touching their pussy and stuff, they have suggested to go to her room, or somewhere more private. Not in this case.


You all know what happened on "date" 3.

[Deepdiver]

As was said upthread women are fickle they run hot and cold - do not want what the can have and want what they can not have...

A couple of your comments that made me say WTF WTF WTF were you thinging to myself:

"1. Many girls come to ask me to dance, one after another, after another...like 5 or 6 girls/women."

WTF - Dance with each one of them especially the hotter ones and give them a vulva ride on your thigh sliding to your knee with some solid man meat contact during your various Salsa, Merenge and Bachata moves and spins - get them all wet and bounce with a subtle - "let's get out of here and go have sex" or "lets go back to your place" ... feminists understand this and hamsters understand this - not love, not marriage, not LTR - JUST SEX.

Any time you spend time together she should be trained like pavlov's dogs that she is going to sex you up and you are going to smash for the hard bang period. Then when she is hooked on you for sex you decide when the meets occur - short, medium or long rotation - you control the frame because you have other females in rotation. I always had a Tuesday/Thursday night gal, a Wednesday Gal and a Friday/Saturday gal most on sleep overs at their places or if she showed she was normal at mine - I being male would once in a while get oneitis and invariably that's when you lose control of the frame - a school teacher I was banging then got exclusive with decided she had to go on vacation with her hot Eurasian GF - Huh? She came back pregnant by a guy she met on vacation and I was already hitting it with the other females in rotation. The day she got on that plane was the day I went sane and reactivated the rotation.

"2. She even got on top of me in my car"

WTF - she mounts you in the car - unzip it and let her ride it front or back - go for a hard slide and glide until you feel a nut coming then pull it out and cum all over her back legs face etc... you should have condoms stashed in your car - after she rides you a bit slide one on and smash it... When you did not bang her she assumed you lost interest or worse saw her as a special love interest romantic she is the one special snowflake and did exactly that flaked.

Its been said so many times in this forum with Facebook, Twitter, Tinder, Dating Sites, Instagram, Periscope etc etc the modern fuck buddy has so many opportunities to flake you have to always be closing (for the bang) or they just do flake.

It is bang first with today's women and then after a few decent bangs then let a relationship develop if that is what you want - keeping in mind the moment you get oneitis is the the moment she takes control of the frame and she loses respect and or interest and then flakes off to the next shiny object or swinging dick dangling in front of her.

In my extensive life's experience I never lost a woman because I was banging another in rotation however as soon as I went exclusive with just one woman it was guranteed she would be gone within 6 mos to a year.

They always want what they can't seem to have and vice verse.

[heman29]

(09-28-2015 03:04 PM)Deepdiver Wrote:  

As was said upthread women are fickle they run hot and cold - do not want what the can have and want what they can not have...

A couple of your comments that made me say WTF WTF WTF were you thinging to myself:

"1. Many girls come to ask me to dance, one after another, after another...like 5 or 6 girls/women."

WTF - Dance with each one of them especially the hotter ones and give them a vulva ride on your thigh sliding to your knee with some solid man meat contact during your various Salsa, Merenge and Bachata moves and spins - get them all wet and bounce with a subtle - "let's get out of here and go have sex" or "lets go back to your place" ... feminists understand this and hamsters understand this - not love, not marriage, not LTR - JUST SEX.

Any time you spend time together she should be trained like pavlov's dogs that she is going to sex you up and you are going to smash for the hard bang period. Then when she is hooked on you for sex you decide when the meets occur - short, medium or long rotation - you control the frame because you have other females in rotation. I always had a Tuesday/Thursday night gal, a Wednesday Gal and a Friday/Saturday gal most on sleep overs at their places or if she showed she was normal at mine - I being male would once in a while get oneitis and invariably that's when you lose control of the frame - a school teacher I was banging then got exclusive with decided she had to go on vacation with her hot Eurasian GF - Huh? She came back pregnant by a guy she met on vacation and I was already hitting it with the other females in rotation. The day she got on that plane was the day I went sane and reactivated the rotation.

"2. She even got on top of me in my car"

WTF - she mounts you in the car - unzip it and let her ride it front or back - go for a hard slide and glide until you feel a nut coming then pull it out and cum all over her back legs face etc... you should have condoms stashed in your car - after she rides you a bit slide one on and smash it... When you did not bang her she assumed you lost interest or worse saw her as a special love interest romantic she is the one special snowflake and did exactly that flaked.

Its been said so many times in this forum with Facebook, Twitter, Tinder, Dating Sites, Instagram, Periscope etc etc the modern fuck buddy has so many opportunities to flake you have to always be closing (for the bang) or they just do flake.

It is bang first with today's women and then after a few decent bangs then let a relationship develop if that is what you want - keeping in mind the moment you get oneitis is the the moment she takes control of the frame and she loses respect and or interest and then flakes off to the next shiny object or swinging dick dangling in front of her.

In my extensive life's experience I never lost a woman because I was banging another in rotation however as soon as I went exclusive with just one woman it was guranteed she would be gone within 6 mos to a year.

They always want what they can't seem to have and vice verse.

when she got almost on top of me in my car, we had been making out for like 10-15 minutes. I tried to touch her pussy and she stopped me. Like two mins later I tried moving my hand underneath her jeans but she stopped me again.
We made out for another 10 mins or less and we got out of the car and I walked her to the hallway and when she opened the door she stopped me again.

Anyway, I am not spending any more time thinking about this chick.
If she reaches out and wants to have a normal date I am in, if not, she can go fuck herself after what she did on our last date.

[heman29]

Little update:

she changed her whatsapp pic to one in which she's holding a little heart souvenir and her status says: " thanks :*** "

So I guess the real issue here is that she's been seing another guy all this time, and she has decided I am not the winner. Meh.

[PapayaTapper]

(09-28-2015 05:13 PM)heman29 Wrote:  

Little update:

she changed her whatsapp pic to one in which she's holding a little heart souvenir and her status says: " thanks :*** "

So I guess the real issue here is that she's been seing another guy all this time, and she has decided I am not the winner. Meh.

"It's never really your pussy. It's only just your turn" ...from someone else on forum I cant find

[TomArrow]

(09-28-2015 05:29 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

(09-28-2015 05:13 PM)heman29 Wrote:  

Little update:

she changed her whatsapp pic to one in which she's holding a little heart souvenir and her status says: " thanks :*** "

So I guess the real issue here is that she's been seing another guy all this time, and she has decided I am not the winner. Meh.

"It's never really your pussy. It's only just your turn" ...from someone else on forum I cant find

which leads back to the one profound question of life: listen to the same good lp over and over again or listen to one song on every one before throwing it away.

[AneroidOcean]

(09-28-2015 05:13 PM)heman29 Wrote:  

Little update:

she changed her whatsapp pic to one in which she's holding a little heart souvenir and her status says: " thanks :*** "

So I guess the real issue here is that she's been seing another guy all this time, and she has decided I am not the winner. Meh.

No, the real issue is your game. If she was letting you touch her boobs and make out with you for 40 damn minutes, you fucked it up.

Everyone in the thread has pointed out the multiple errors in your ways, but you still like to make statements like the below that are wrong:

(09-27-2015 04:20 PM)heman29 Wrote:  

As I already explaind, since she changed and screwed everything I could not execute my plan.

You did not execute your plan. You let her modify your plan in multiple ways, basically making it her plan.

You didn't have logistics covered (you were double-parked but somehow this is a problem not of your creation).

You didn't freeze her out after escalating in the car and getting turned down multiple times.

There are whole lists of things you can improve in this thread. Stop blaming (at least partially) other factors. Learn from the advice given, make an improvement. You owe it to yourself.

[eradicator]

You need to offer bait to bring the pussy home. If she likes music tell her you have a good playlist on spotify that she might like. Then bring her up and escalate and try to bang.

If she is an athlete or yoga girl, have some sort of beverage like coconut water to offer her to rehydrate after the drinking and dancing. Then get her upstairs to escalate and then bang.

You get the point, you don't want to make a slut feel like a slut, no matter how big of a slut she is, give her plausible deniability. "We just went upstairs to listen to some music, and the next thing I knew, we were fucking! I didn't see that coming!"

etc

Yes there is definitely something off with your game right now

[heman29]

yes, ok I agree.

I should have kept my frame and not let her change plans.
I should have not made out for 40 minutes if we're not gonna bang.

The thing is that with previous girls, once we were making out in my car they suggested to go upstairs or to go somewhere more private but they all let me touch their pussy and boobs, not in this case; she just let me touch her boobs a bit, and she stopped me from touching her pussy twice, so she was not that 'receptive'.

In any case it seems she's been seing another guy so this made her less 'receptive'. See what she did on date three. I asked her out and she tried to include her girl friends plus one guy, so at this point she was not interested anymore.
I wonder why she chose to change the original date to a group event and waste my time, instead of simply declining my date. I guess she thought it was 'nicer' to change our date to a group thing instead of telling me hey I am not interested anymore/I am busy/I dont have time, blah, blah.

Yes, had I been smoother...I could have maybe ended up banging her, fine.

[LeeEnfield303]

This "thrird date" needs to be the LAST date. Next!

[heman29]

(10-01-2015 07:50 PM)LeeEnfield303 Wrote:  

This "thrird date" needs to be the LAST date. Next!

just a little update:


So before our third "date", I asked her how long she was gonna be in my city, and SHE LIED TO ME AND SAID THAT SHE WAS GONNA BE HERE FOR A LONG TIME.
Well, she left my country one week ago, forever. She went back to her home country.

Weird. So she said she was gonna be here for a long time, then we had that disastrous third 'date' in which she did not want to get physical...and two weeks later she went back home and said bye to all her friends here on her FB wall.

what da f?


I did not contact her after that day, but she did not even say bye to me. Nice...

[Designate]

You seem too distraught about the whole situation with this girl.

After you fucked up and failed to seal the deal with this chick, she was a total cunt to you.

That should have been the end of it, no more thoughts given. Next her and move on.

An abundance mentality should be your philosophy.

Constantly approaching new women should be your modus operandi.

No Girl Can Hurt A Man With Options
Always Be Willing To Lose Her At Any Moment

[birthday cat]

heman29 – what do you want out of this thread?

Here is the pattern I see.
1) You give the forum your interpretation of what happened with this girl that you were obsessing over. Everything you say reeks of neediness and I’m certain that neediness was communicated to the girl through your body language, tone of voice, and especially through your actions.
2) Forum members with infinitely more experience than you give you excellent advice.
3) You rationalize why nothing is your fault.

So what do you want? Do you want sympathy because the girl didn’t say bye to you before she left? Seriously? Do you want sympathy because the girl lied to you? Humans lie all the time. It is part of our nature. Women lie more than men and especially in their dealings with men. I cannot imagine a type of human interaction that is more likely to involve lying than when a woman has to deal with a needy man. So what do you expect?

(09-28-2015 05:44 AM)CrashBangWallop Wrote:  

The real problem here is simple:

You are not dominant/manly enough.

get the sorted and the rest will fall into place.

On a scale from 1 to 10, your level of over-analyzation in this thread is at about 20. You are obsessing over little details like “I wonder why she chose to change the original date to a group event … blah, blah” and you are missing the big picture which is that you are acting like a needy little boy.

Oh my god what do I do if she asks me why I’m parking my car – JUST PARK THE DAMN CAR.

Oh my god, I’m so nervous, I can’t ask to use the bathroom at her place, what if she doesn’t have sex with me after I go up there? – Has it occurred to you that the guys who suggested this tactic (Travesty and Roosh) might know something you don’t know? She may or may not have sex with you but she will respect you more for going after what you want (Heartiste Commandment XIII)

Fill up your schedule with self-improvement activities. These activities will give you more confidence and you will be too busy to obsess over a single girl. Start talking to a lot more girls so you won’t obsess over a single girl. Get a game resource and start learning. No offense, but you have a lot to learn. Read the Roosh Program

[PapayaTapper]

(10-19-2015 03:27 PM)heman29 Wrote:  

(10-01-2015 07:50 PM)LeeEnfield303 Wrote:  

This "thrird date" needs to be the LAST date. Next!

just a little update:


So before our third "date", I asked her how long she was gonna be in my city, and SHE LIED TO ME AND SAID THAT SHE WAS GONNA BE HERE FOR A LONG TIME.
Well, she left my country one week ago, forever. She went back to her home country.

Weird. So she said she was gonna be here for a long time, then we had that disastrous third 'date' in which she did not want to get physical...and two weeks later she went back home and said bye to all her friends here on her FB wall.

what da f?


I did not contact her after that day, but she did not even say bye to me. Nice...

I'll tell you exactly "what da f?"...You were thinking about her infinitely more than she was about you becasue she wasn't thinking about you at all. Why? Because a "makeout" with a chick means something to you (I'm closer to getting laid). Whereas a make out with another random dude means about as much to her as what you had for b'fast Tuesday 3 weeks ago to you...NOTHING as in she doesn't even remember it beyond a vague recollection.

It's a hard lesson for most guys to learn but hopefully it will start to sink in

[duedue]

(09-28-2015 05:29 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

(09-28-2015 05:13 PM)heman29 Wrote:  

Little update:

she changed her whatsapp pic to one in which she's holding a little heart souvenir and her status says: " thanks :*** "

So I guess the real issue here is that she's been seing another guy all this time, and she has decided I am not the winner. Meh.

"It's never really your pussy. It's only just your turn" ...from someone else on forum I cant find

This should be part of K12 education.

[nampa1234]

(09-27-2015 09:26 AM)jayyrod1 Wrote:  

It's o.k. to compromise a little, to show your flexible and not 'controlling ', i.e., time, date, place, etc etc, but you should never let her delegate or steer away from your plan. If it's clear that she is not going to compromise and insists that she can't do anythi ng unless it's on her time then you say, " well xxxxx, i called/texted/messages to see if we could get a fun date going but it seems that you have too much going on right now to date properly. If you find some proper time for dating, you've got my number. No hard feelings buddy." And end the interactions for atleast 3weeks. You can try a restart after that but your looking fir her ti attempt to reconcile. She may still text and talk and you HAVE to have to deny her this. Keep it short and Use a lot of radio silence. She will do this if you left her with a good impression but she's really fishing for attention. The goal here is to show that you dont have time to chit chat or text extended periods without getting anything out of it. There are other girls and better ways to spend your time so dont be afraid to exercise this.

Never allow a woman to invite friends, male or female. If she tries to then you tell her that, ' you were looking forward to getting to know you, and showing you a good time. I don't know your friends and i asked you out to know you better, not them. '
She'll make up some excuse about how cool /awesome they are and you should totally let them come. Agree and disassociate.
Ex,. " I'm sure your friends are every bit as cool as you say but look, im not gonna be that guy that tags along with a girl while she's hanging out with her buds. You wanna get with them? Go for it, when you wanna have some fun and create some stories to tell your friends, call me. In my mind, dating is not a group activity. And you dont want your friends seeing how interesting/sexy/funny/fun anyways unless your making competition *smirk*"

Use it line for line or insert your own words, doesn't matter. The onlu that matters is that you see how and why these conversation snippets work at gauging interest, getting compkiance, demonstrating value (personal time value) and setting/maintaining frame. You figure that out and the words will come but my best advice, and most consolidated is this. " be firm, but flexible. Be strong yet yielding. Show willingness to walk away, and stick to it if she gives reason. This is your life to live, on your terms. Invite her to join. If she won't do it, or wants to change things more than your willing to allow, walk away andn prove to her, and yourself, that your time and desires are unaaffected by no one save your self."

As for your above wuestions, your looking at it the wrong way. You are trying to apply logic to an illogical creature. If there is a reason she did all that then my guess ( and its the same with every girl) is that she's shit testing me. When you allowed this to happen and didn't eject, you told her that ," girl you can do what you want and ill follow you around because I'm thirsty and feel good just being near." When you fail these shit tests, then your just like that guy friend she brought along.
If i were you, and compromised to dinner with friends then I would have said this when she was manipulating her friends to the xlub.
" look girl, this date was supposed to be for us getting to know each other, i let you bring your friends to dinner when i should have spent my time better else where. I'm willing to give you this last shot to prove tha t you can be a fun girl that I'd like to get to know but your gonna have to tell your friends, buddy boy included, that your sorry to have to do this but you are going to hang out with me and you will call/text then later."
Let her hamster reel but STICK TO YOUR WORD! - Many men are afraid to show anger thinking it turns women off. This is true only in certain cases but here, showing a little bit of anger (controlled, not offended butthurt boo hoo in lashing bacm anger but irritated and controlled, show some) works to your benefit. It shows that your not like hose bitch boys but rather the man in charge. Give her the chance to leave her friends and say , it was nice meeting you, if she says no, if they do not go then I do not go.

Overall, you went from alpha to beta in 3 dates. Exactly like hat guy she brought along. When you didn't put your foot down and draw the line, you turned in to the orbiter.
Not trying to be mean buddy just saying it how I see it

I know this is an old post, and I appreciate the masculinity, but these women are so deluded with over choice, that the reality is they probably conciously think they are doing nothing wrong. Their world is one of supplicators and they think guys are just nice and there and I am so awesome, lol.

You should respond with girl excuses, e.g. "got a message from a friend for a cool party or heard there is a good bar event." If she doesn't want to go, bail. She probably knows what's up, but it gives more plausibility.

[Ronzo]

Just an interesting one, how about accepting the 3rd date however unexpectedly turn up with a bunch or your male friends aswell, and just ghost the girl and talk football, or allow your mates to chat her friends up. I rekon that could get her jealous and work, however currently my game is low so don't know. What do you reckon peeps?