[Lumiere]

I will start. I only have a few but, when I think of more, I might compile mine into a post for my blog.

Feel free to add your own :

1. The words 'I am sorry' should never be followed by 'but you'. If a chick does something wrong - especially a chick you are dating and you call her on it and she does apologise - she should just apologise.

Real apologies are never followed by the words 'but you' and then a description of what you did wrong to cause the problem in the first place.

Call her on that shit.

2. Girls you just met inisisting on you buying them drinks / meals. Girls who insist that this should be the case 'because you are the guy' are the worst. They have been raised to think that their company should be paid for.

If they justify it by saying well, you invited ME out so you should pay. These girls are parasites. Don't get mad at them or call them parasites just politely point out that you invited her out so you can both enjoy each others company and not so you could pay for her to tolerate your presence. Give her the joy of actually dating a guy with a backbone and a pair of balls for a change.

3. Girls texting you - shortly after you got their number and you have invited them out - saying they are not interested / too busy too meet you but requesting you to become her facebook friend.

You are here right now in the EXACT SAME CITY in the EXACT SAME WEEK and she does not want to meet you ?!

Why is fucks name would you want to become one of her facebook friends if she won't even make time for a chat over a coffee or a beer with you. Please explain it to me.

When I hear about guys who actually accept this shit it makes me want to grab them by the neck and shove rusty razor wire down their urethra.

Of course if you accept, which most guys will, you will just become one of her troop of facebook admirers. Constantly socially proofing her and telling her how cool or hot she looks in her latest photo without her having to do a damn thing for you in return.

As she never even made the effort to meet you, beyond your initial chance meeting, of course she will totally forget who you are within a week as you fade into the background chorus of her admirers - all singing in the key of B.

B for beta.

A better reply when she ask you to facebook her would be something like 'sorry, not interested in being one of your facebook fucktards but let me know if you want to meet up and swap orgams' or something like that. Another acceptable reply would be 'Sorry I only facebook girls after I have sex with them. House rules. No exceptions'.

Then, even if she does not meet you, damn sure she will at least remember you.

[Oblivion77]

(06-11-2011 01:44 PM)Lumiere Wrote:  

I will start. I only have a few but, when I think of more, I might compile mine into a post for my blog.

Feel free to add your own :

1. The words 'I am sorry' should never be followed by 'but you'. If a chick does something wrong - especially a chick you are dating and you call her on it and she does apologise - she should just apologise.

Real apologies are never followed by the words 'but you' and then a description of what you did wrong to cause the problem in the first place.

Call her on that shit.

2. Girls you just met inisisting on you buying them drinks / meals. Girls who insist that this should be the case 'because you are the guy' are the worst. They have been raised to think that their company should be paid for.

If they justify it by saying well, you invited ME out so you should pay. These girls are parasites. Don't get mad at them or call them parasites just politely point out that you invited her out so you can both enjoy each others company and not so you could pay for her to tolerate your presence. Give her the joy of actually dating a guy with a backbone and a pair of balls for a change.

3. Girls texting you - shortly after you got their number and you have invited them out - saying they are not interested / too busy too meet you but requesting you to become her facebook friend.

You are here right now in the EXACT SAME CITY in the EXACT SAME WEEK and she does not want to meet you ?!

Why is fucks name would you want to become one of her facebook friends if she won't even make time for a chat over a coffee or a beer with you. Please explain it to me.

When I hear about guys who actually accept this shit it makes me want to grab them by the neck and shove rusty razor wire down their urethra.

Of course if you accept, which most guys will, you will just become one of her troop of facebook admirers. Constantly socially proofing her and telling her how cool or hot she looks in her latest photo without her having to do a damn thing for you in return.

As she never even made the effort to meet you, beyond your initial chance meeting, of course she will totally forget who you are within a week as you fade into the background chorus of her admirers - all singing in the key of B.

B for beta.

A better reply when she ask you to facebook her would be something like 'sorry, not interested in being one of your facebook fucktards but let me know if you want to meet up and swap orgams' or something like that. Another acceptable reply would be 'Sorry I only facebook girls after I have sex with them. House rules. No exceptions'.

Then, even if she does not meet you, damn sure she will at least remember you.

I would add:

- Being late to a date.
I mean significantly late, like 20 min or more - or informing you of a major delay with 5 min or no notice.
I used to ignore these things being accommodating, telling myself you have to be understanding and not petty and anal. Still, I have learned that especially at the beginning, you cannot let much slip, as certain type of girls are just trying to see with how much they can get away with - trying to test boundaries and limitations (i.e. how alpha or beta you are). Maybe they are not doing it consciously but they do throw these shit test more often than not. Since I call them out immediately on these things I ended up dating only girls that have certain standards and are not wasting my time.

- Returning phone calls day(s) later.
Maybe it is the culture I come from (Italian) but I have zero tolerance for this type of behavior. You must call someone back the same day they called you. In Italy your personal life (i.e. love-life) comes before everything else, therefore you do make time to meet someone or to call them back. It is how parents raise their children "you would call back your worst enemy if he were to call you at home".

In American's culture your job plays such a preponderant role that people tend to resked personal engagement as if they were business meetings and this behavior encompasses every aspect of their personal life. Coming from Europe that is indeed a major problem.
I want romance, momentum, passion, spontaneity, not a packaged dating life where I fill the slot of my schedule weeks in advance.

Once had a chick that liked me (and that asked me out contacting me out of the blue after tracking me down at a party where we randomly met), returning my first phone call 3 days later, leaving a message saying she was busy with work during the week, hence the delay. LOL. Seriously? maybe it is a cultural barrier but what are people like this thinking? Obviously I never returned her call and that was it. What is peculiar is that some of my American friends didnt have a major issue with what she did.

Last but not least, regarding buying drinks or dinner I completely agree with Lumiere, the entitlement of "you must pay" is the quintessential sign of a parasite. Do not misunderstand me, I tend to pay on the first date and have no problems doing it, I'm far from cheap, but if you sense she demands that you do take care of her on any occasion, then walk away. Her parents clearly made a great job ingraining into her brain middle ages values.

[YoungGunner]

(06-11-2011 03:32 PM)Oblivion77 Wrote:  

(06-11-2011 01:44 PM)Lumiere Wrote:  

I will start. I only have a few but, when I think of more, I might compile mine into a post for my blog.

Feel free to add your own :

1. The words 'I am sorry' should never be followed by 'but you'. If a chick does something wrong - especially a chick you are dating and you call her on it and she does apologise - she should just apologise.

Real apologies are never followed by the words 'but you' and then a description of what you did wrong to cause the problem in the first place.

Call her on that shit.

2. Girls you just met inisisting on you buying them drinks / meals. Girls who insist that this should be the case 'because you are the guy' are the worst. They have been raised to think that their company should be paid for.

If they justify it by saying well, you invited ME out so you should pay. These girls are parasites. Don't get mad at them or call them parasites just politely point out that you invited her out so you can both enjoy each others company and not so you could pay for her to tolerate your presence. Give her the joy of actually dating a guy with a backbone and a pair of balls for a change.

3. Girls texting you - shortly after you got their number and you have invited them out - saying they are not interested / too busy too meet you but requesting you to become her facebook friend.

You are here right now in the EXACT SAME CITY in the EXACT SAME WEEK and she does not want to meet you ?!

Why is fucks name would you want to become one of her facebook friends if she won't even make time for a chat over a coffee or a beer with you. Please explain it to me.

When I hear about guys who actually accept this shit it makes me want to grab them by the neck and shove rusty razor wire down their urethra.

Of course if you accept, which most guys will, you will just become one of her troop of facebook admirers. Constantly socially proofing her and telling her how cool or hot she looks in her latest photo without her having to do a damn thing for you in return.

As she never even made the effort to meet you, beyond your initial chance meeting, of course she will totally forget who you are within a week as you fade into the background chorus of her admirers - all singing in the key of B.

B for beta.

A better reply when she ask you to facebook her would be something like 'sorry, not interested in being one of your facebook fucktards but let me know if you want to meet up and swap orgams' or something like that. Another acceptable reply would be 'Sorry I only facebook girls after I have sex with them. House rules. No exceptions'.

Then, even if she does not meet you, damn sure she will at least remember you.

I would add:

...

Last but not least, regarding buying drinks or dinner I completely agree with Lumiere, the entitlement of "you must pay" is the quintessential sign of a parasite. Do not misunderstand me, I tend to pay on the first date and have no problems doing it, I'm far from cheap, but if you sense she demands that you do take care of her on any occasion, then walk away. Her parents clearly made a great job ingraining into her brain middle ages values.

http://vksempireofdirt.com/?p=846- I agree with what the post suggests: girl on a date should at least pretend to reach for the check

ill add:

-talking on the phone during a date without excusing herself or apologizing.

-bringing any friends or uninvited people to a date

and most of all cockblocking, though that deserves its own post

[The Duke]

(06-11-2011 01:44 PM)Lumiere Wrote:  

If they justify it by saying well, you invited ME out so you should pay. These girls are parasites. Don't get mad at them or call them parasites just politely point out that you invited her out so you can both enjoy each others company and not so you could pay for her to tolerate your presence. Give her the joy of actually dating a guy with a backbone and a pair of balls for a change.

Nice post, I agree with most of it. I'm not sure about this part though for latinas. A Pervian girl invited me to her house and we stopped by the store to pick up a bottle of Absolute. I was going to pay for 1/2 but she insisted on paying for the whole bottle. She kept saying "Yo invito". That means "I invite". My Spanish teacher told me it also means "my treat". It's similar to "I hope" and "I wait" meaning the same thing in Spanish. This is built into the language -- it's the way they think. In Serbia, people asked me "Is it true that people in America split the bill, like in Hollywood movies?" They told me that splitting the bill was ridiculous and petty. They use a system of taking turns, but one person gets the whole bill. Same in India. In India, it was like an insult if I tried to pitch in for my portion when someone else invited me.

Lumiere, with all your travels, I assume you already are aware of all this. Was your advice here for dating Western girls, or do you do it for all chicks?

[Lumiere]

I buy drinks for cool people - male and female - all the time. This advice is directed towards dealing with chicks that behave in a transactional manner and demand that you pay for them.

[Basil Ransom]

(06-11-2011 03:32 PM)Oblivion77 Wrote:  

- Returning phone calls day(s) later.
Maybe it is the culture I come from (Italian) but I have zero tolerance for this type of behavior. You must call someone back the same day they called you. In Italy your personal life (i.e. love-life) comes before everything else, therefore you do make time to meet someone or to call them back. It is how parents raise their children "you would call back your worst enemy if he were to call you at home".

In American's culture your job plays such a preponderant role that people tend to resked personal engagement as if they were business meetings and this behavior encompasses every aspect of their personal life. Coming from Europe that is indeed a major problem.
I want romance, momentum, passion, spontaneity, not a packaged dating life where I fill the slot of my schedule weeks in advance.

Once had a chick that liked me (and that asked me out contacting me out of the blue after tracking me down at a party where we randomly met), returning my first phone call 3 days later, leaving a message saying she was busy with work during the week, hence the delay. LOL. Seriously? maybe it is a cultural barrier but what are people like this thinking? Obviously I never returned her call and that was it. What is peculiar is that some of my American friends didnt have a major issue with what she did.

Totally with you. I'm American, yet I feel so foreign in this aspect - I'm forever perplexed as to why Americans define themselves so much by their job. I guarantee, for 95% of people, no one gives a **** but you about your job. You aren't a heart surgeon, girl. If I dropped every girl who put her career above me, I wouldn't be left with much.

The girl may have been trying to raise her value by showing disinterest. Not that that works on a man with dignity, but that's what American girls think.

[Nonpareil]

1 is the worst. It must be nice to be a woman; nothing is ever your fault.

2 is also bad, but at the same time if I ask a girl on a date I have no problem paying most or all of the tab, but at least they can offer to cover some of it (which I always accept) or pump-fake on the check.

3 is stupid. No guy likes being 'taken for drinks', but at the same time I don't get how women's minds work sometimes; so what if you aren't interested? The average guy is a sucker and you get a free meal out of it. You can always ignore his calls and texts if you don't like him.


I would add;

- Trying to change the venue of the date.
- Not letting you kiss her during a date; what did you expect was going to happen after a few cocktails? In fact all LMR is bullshit...I just fingerbanged you but I don't get to fuck you?

[Lumiere]

Thought of another one :

Dont ever let chicks you are dating drag into the 'do you think I am fat?' bullshit.

If a woman ask that just reply by asking 'Do YOU think YOU look fat? You must have asked me that for a reason.'

If she insists on knowing your opinion just tell her that what you think does not matter but if she thinks she looks fat maybe she can improve her diet and excercise more.

If I ever catch anyone one of you guys getting caught in this trap and try to escape it by saying some bullshit like 'I like your curves' or 'well that just means there is more of you to hold' I will personally come around to your house and give your nuts a wax job with dry sandpaper.

[CupCake]

(06-11-2011 03:32 PM)Oblivion77 Wrote:  

- Returning phone calls day(s) later.

Maybe it is the culture I come from (Italian) but I have zero tolerance for this type of behavior. You must call someone back the same day they called you. In Italy your personal life (i.e. love-life) comes before everything else, therefore you do make time to meet someone or to call them back. It is how parents raise their children "you would call back your worst enemy if he were to call you at home".

YES.

I have never understood why chicks do this. I get the "I'm busy with school" routine all the time, which is complete bullshit. I know this bitch is probably on Facebook for at least a few hours. And you know she's glued to her phone. If she doesn't pick up the phone the first time, you're being ignored. End of discussion. Since you're from Italy, let me tell you: a brief encounter I had with an Italian women overseas changed my perspective of dating forever. Sometimes I think I should move to Italia.

My contributions:

1.) Never allow a woman to tell you who you can hang out with. That's the sign that you are owned. I have seen several men allow their women to do this to them and I was in shock. I genuinely felt bad for them.

2.) Never let a woman create drama with you while on a night out. Just ran into a drunk couple on the street the other night. They were fighting about where to go. The bitch was getting passive aggressive and the dude just insisted on following here around all night. My first thought was "Why is this guy letting this bitch ruin his night?" Go have fun and let the bitch find her own way back home.

[Chad Daring]

Down dressing.

I've dumped many girls for this. The first two dates they're done up, looking good, then every time the two of you are together after that its sweatpants and a hoodie with fucked up hair and no make-up.

Its disrespectful and its her way of saying that she doesnt give enough of a shit about you to take a few minutes to look good for you.

[Oblivion77]

(06-12-2011 06:06 PM)CupCake Wrote:  

(06-11-2011 03:32 PM)Oblivion77 Wrote:  

- Returning phone calls day(s) later.

Maybe it is the culture I come from (Italian) but I have zero tolerance for this type of behavior. You must call someone back the same day they called you. In Italy your personal life (i.e. love-life) comes before everything else, therefore you do make time to meet someone or to call them back. It is how parents raise their children "you would call back your worst enemy if he were to call you at home".

YES.

I have never understood why chicks do this. I get the "I'm busy with school" routine all the time, which is complete bullshit. I know this bitch is probably on Facebook for at least a few hours. And you know she's glued to her phone. If she doesn't pick up the phone the first time, you're being ignored. End of discussion. Since you're from Italy, let me tell you: a brief encounter I had with an Italian women overseas changed my perspective of dating forever. Sometimes I think I should move to Italia.

Yeah, I dont want to highjack this thread but I want to add a couple of (hopefully) useful insights regarding dating girls from Italy or other Mediterranean countries.
A major aspect is that once you start dating you become part of her life way before sex takes place. The decision is made pre-emptively - while in the USA she only drops the bs, shit tests etc after you bang her or after 4-5 dates, ergo after a LOT of time. She becomes invested way later - perhaps because she is used to serial dating and has become numb to feelings, therefore her stance is closer to "he has to stand out among the other suitors" rather than "I want to get to know this person to see if we are compatible".

Interesting cultural differences:

- An Italian girl that is busy when you ask her out would often try to include you in her schedule no matter how busy she is.
For instance, lets say you ask an Italian chick out but she has to go pick up her younger brother at school or has to baby sit. She might suggest you join her, even if it would be a very unglamorous date, while she has to do those things.

The underlying key element is not if you go or not, it is that she is open, that you are included, involved into her life since step 1. It is normal. You dont have to defend fiercely your boundaries or look disinterested or "busy". In America it would be "I'm really swamped this week, lets hang next week-end!" (that maybe is 5-10 days away

- Italian girls like spontaneity and abhors scheduling too far in advance.
For instance, I was dating an Italian and an American chick at the same time a while ago.
My American female friends kept on suggesting me to ask the American chick out for a "big night" like Saturday way in advance "call her on Monday to ask her out on Sat". Mmm....ok, initially it was a weird concept for me to grasp but I went along with it. It worked and the American chick sounded happy.
I called the Italian right after to ask her out on Friday (remember, it was Monday), her reply (and she was interested) was "yeah, Friday should work but I mean, it is sooo far away, god only knows what can happen between today and Friday, unless you are free sooner lets just talk on Friday morning and we will figure something out".

It was evident scheduling so far ahead killed any romance for her. She sensed she was just a slot in my packaged schedule. I went out with both chicks and when I asked her about it jokingly, the Italian confirmed she found unusual to be asked out so far in advance.

Keep it in mind!

Further contribution to the thread:

- Never let a girl make you wait in front of her place in your car if she isnt ready. She needs 15 min more? buzz me in and let me seat on your couch while you are getting ready.

To extrapolate from all the specific examples people are suggesting: MANNERS folk, manners! this is what I feel lot of guys are really complaining about when they refer to American chicks!

[CupCake]

(06-13-2011 12:06 PM)Oblivion77 Wrote:  

- Italian girls like spontaneity and abhors scheduling too far in advance.

This would be a refreshing change.

[K-man]

(06-11-2011 03:32 PM)Oblivion77 Wrote:  

I would add:

- Being late to a date.
I mean significantly late, like 20 min or more - or informing you of a major delay with 5 min or no notice.

Ha-ha, I guess Lumiere would not agree to add that to his list, since he was late like 2 hours when we were supposed to grab a beer together! But in his defense, he was with a girl in the meantime and he did let me know, so it's cool.

[wi30]

I've never been a big fan of authority, so if a girl tries to tell me what to do or demand anything from me I drop her like a bad habit. Basically the same as what CupCake said, I refuse to become pussy whipped or lose the upper hand. I've seen too many guys ruin their lives going down that road.

[Dueyz]

(06-14-2011 07:01 PM)wi30 Wrote:  

I've never been a big fan of authority, so if a girl tries to tell me what to do or demand anything from me I drop her like a bad habit. Basically the same as what CupCake said, I refuse to become pussy whipped or lose the upper hand. I've seen too many guys ruin their lives going down that road.

I'd agree. This is a bad way to start things, and a sure sign of things to come. I can appreciate a strong woman, but you simply don't want a personality stronger than yours if you're a strong man. Unless you're a gay dude, and that's what you're into.

[Arobin]

(06-11-2011 03:32 PM)Oblivion77 Wrote:  

- Being late to a date.
I mean significantly late, like 20 min or more - or informing you of a major delay with 5 min or no notice.
I used to ignore these things being accommodating, telling myself you have to be understanding and not petty and anal. Still, I have learned that especially at the beginning, you cannot let much slip, as certain type of girls are just trying to see with how much they can get away with - trying to test boundaries and limitations (i.e. how alpha or beta you are). Maybe they are not doing it consciously but they do throw these shit test more often than not. Since I call them out immediately on these things I ended up dating only girls that have certain standards and are not wasting my time.

What do you do in this case? Do you just abort mission on the date? Do you admonish her when she arrives? I always want to call the girl out, but I never do because I don't know how I'd restore the fun/playful vibe afterwards to make progress with her on the date itself.