[CleanSlate]

Best of luck, WTF. Beautifully written. +1

[MongolianAbroad]

Man, this thread hits so close to home...I may just have to write my own location independence thread, there's so much value that comes from these...

WTF, I'm rooting for you, man.

[yankeetravels]

Bro I know exactly what you're going through. I'm basically putting my life on hold in 2018, living with my parents, and took a low stress family job this year to put some money in the bank and long term go live in SEA abroad. I'm in my early 20's and was very fortunate not to have to pay my way through college, so I have come out relatively debt free.

I'm budget conscious to a fault, so money vs. adventure is a very difficult decision. Most guys here say the best is to make it remotely. I went to Asia last year and I don't think I'd ever permanently move with absolutely no plan on how to make money, but I'm slowly but surely getting more of my income remotely rather than needing to be in one place. There's still more steps to take but it's progressing upwards.

I guess my point is I'm rooting for you and I feel like I'm you when you first contemplated this. Money and adventure both have their allure, but at the end of the day, time is something you just don't get back.

[John Dodds]

(06-02-2016 10:53 AM)Peregrine Wrote:  

People taking issue with my suggestions of ODing at 40 missed my point. It was intended to be illustrative. If you want to party, the worst possible path you could take is to grind away for XX years until you are (probably) 55 or 65 and too old to enjoy a good party.

Strangely enough, at your age I would have said the same.
But after grinding away until I was 52 until divorce raped, moved to Thailand, and have had the biggest ten year party of my life.

All I can suggest is, DON'T GET MARRIED in the USA.
It's a complete waste of your life.

[Conquerer7]

Your plan sounds great. Keep us updated on how it goes as I would love to hear.

[jamaicabound]

I know this isn't true 100% of the time but most of the time the money a 20-25 year old is going to earn is shit money. You'll never get back your 20's again, you can always make money later, money isn't going anywhere.

I personally would encourage you to check some cool shit off your bucket list, teach English abroad, travel, have fun, when you get your fill come home and get serious about a career.

I had the same mindset as you in my early 20's, I wanna work put away some money, get a place have parties, have girls over, maybe a pool or a boat, yada yada yada. In reality I did bullshit jobs, lived check to check in my late 20's finally started getting my shit together and by 30 was making 6 figures and continuing to grow it but I really regret not doing more shit in my 20's be it studying abroad, moving somewhere warm getting a house with a bunch of roomates and getting a bartending gig or some other blowoff job and just having fun.

In reality I worked for shit money hungout at local sportsbars and occasionally hit a cool club in River North. I wish I had hadnled my twenties differently. Don't fuck it up.

[teddy bear]

@This

I mean, you have to ask yourself if saving throughout your twenties even makes any sense. As I'm from Poland, let's use it as an example.
The average salary is like 900$/month after tax, whereas over 60% of all workers are paid only ~550$/month after tax. 500$/month is basically what you need to survive - and that's how most people live, from paycheck to paycheck and credit to credit.

So, there is literally no point in trying to save anything on an 500-600$/month salary. If you are on an average salary and you want to STAY in Poland, then sure, it makes a little sense to try and save something (200$/month) by cutting off partying, going out, eating out etc. But if you are of my mindset and you are looking at things like traveling, higher quality of life and living ABROAD, then it's not definitely not worth the hassle, even on an average salary - and most guys below 30, without a few years solid experience won't be able to land any averagely paid job. Depends on the field you are in of course and the country you are from, but in most cases you start from the bottom anyway, so you have to first figure out, whether it's worth to save anything from your current salary and what are your goals. Are you saving for a house, securing income for your future wife or you just want to party the shit out of this life somewhere off in SEA?

The point is, just like Steelex said in an Financial Tips thread:

Quote:

You can't outsave a shitty income

So, first you have to decide, whether it makes any sense to put shitty money above your comfort. Best thing to do - and this is something, that I will be implementing soon as well - is to find a job in your niche, get experience and not worry at all about saving money. Sure, starting to save while you are young, living with parents and so on is great and can give you a nice start, but not everyone has the same possibilities and not all of us can live with their parents or get an salary, that it's worth saving off in your twenties.

If you are forced to do low-paid work, at least make it so, that it counts towards your RELEVANT experience, that you can later leverage for a better job and meanwhile just party the shit out of your life - or whatever you like.

[Peregrine]

Glad you've figured out what you want, WTF. I'm rooting for you.

I went the money route. Have worked some pretty ridiculous hours over the last year and a half, but it was worth it.

“Marry, and you will regret it; don’t marry, you will also regret it; marry or don’t marry, you will regret it either way. Laugh at the world’s foolishness, you will regret it; weep over it, you will regret that too; laugh at the world’s foolishness or weep over it, you will regret both. Believe a woman, you will regret it; believe her not, you will also regret it… Hang yourself, you will regret it; do not hang yourself, and you will regret that too; hang yourself or don’t hang yourself, you’ll regret it either way; whether you hang yourself or do not hang yourself, you will regret both. This, gentlemen, is the essence of all philosophy.” - Kierkegaard

[Razors Edge]

Good thread this.

Ultimately I think the key word here is BALANCE.

How you work that out is the challenge.

[zoom]

Sounds like a terrible plan honestly but if you're okay with being 40 and broke then go for it.

[tomzestatlu]

Good thread and wisdom in it.

I have started another thread, because of different life-experience, but I have something common and that´s age and dillema I am going through.

I am 25 and iff I should trade next 5 years of my life for money, I would do it. As a Polish guy mentioned few posts above, sallaries in this part of Europe are shit. I have army background, which provided good money. Generally, state provides quite good conditions in comparison to private companies and corporations, which only use middle/eastern Europe as cheap work force. There´s historically lowest unemployment rate, but it´s still inredibly difficult to find good payed job unless you are good programmer.

I quit the army, so I could build REAL career in civilian world. But I don´t see opportunity. If there´s and opportunity to trade my time and turn it into well-rewarded promising career in corporate world, then I would do it.

Tips as saving 1000$/month are good, but how can you save 1000$, when average net sallary is few hundred bucks smaller. I could save this much, when I was in the army as CO, living in my office. So maybe, in the end, there will be no other chance, than enlist again.

Generally, the most of the people trade their lifes for small flat and opportunity to wipe their brains with litres of alcohol once a week. No thanks.

Sometimes I do think the way, that I would throw my old life away and start some ultimate adventure. But all of the ideas are one-way tickets.
But booze and chicks isn´t adventure, that´s reward.

[Crash_Bandicoot]

Why can't you do both? Why does every question proposed have to be of extreme polar opposites?

Hear me out:

If you slave away your 20s and 30s, you will make a shit ton of money by the time you hit your 40s and beyond. Let's assume that.

But here's something I saw on my last trip abroad:

A bunch of middle-aged/old men eating fancy meals, living in their hotels, and staring at women. They had a ton of money but their adventurous side of their youth was gone. It's much harder to do crazy, adventurous things as you get older. Heck, I'm not even close to being in my 40s but I can't stand to do things that I used to do in my mid 20s anymore.

And I couldn't imagine hanging out at hostels as a middle-aged man. Completely out of question.

But at the same time, if you party away your 20s and have nothing to save for (exactly like I did haha), then you'll be behind your peers.

So here's a solution for the middle ground (and something that I am currently doing and am very happy with):

Get a stable, decent paying 9-5 job that actually lets you leave by 5 in a large, cosmopolitan city for a few years (I'm going to get shit for praising the stable 9-5 on this forum, I know). You'll have plenty of time outside of work to build a side/remote business, make memories, meet chicks, explore your city (I'm in NYC so there's always new, exciting shit to explore here - 24/7), etc. Do that for a few years and then transition over to something more entrepreneurial/remote. You'll have decent savings by the time you leave in a few years too so you can handle financial failure if your remote/business fails.

Yeah, you won't save as much as if you worked 100 hours a week all through your 20s, but at least you'll still be able to create some memories and go on adventures while working that stable job - all while saving some money.

My 2 cents

[SteezeySteve]

I debate french foriegn legion vs investment banking MandA in my head alot.

If I don't get into a target school I'll probably do the ffl thing because I hate tech so I wouldnt even want to take any jobs outside of wallstreet.

Wallstreet is just option one because id rather be financially stable at 24 instead of having to complete college or start a career at 26.

[zatara]

The FFL is a terrible idea. It gets the dregs of society that aren't capable of getting into their own national armies. You get shit pay, and treated like shit by your NCOs. And your life gets sacrificed recklessly, because your death doesn't arose concern in France the way the deaths of real French soldiers does. Theres literally no reason to join it instead of officer school in your own national army unless you're a criminal or too stupid to meet the entrance requirements locally.

[SteezeySteve]

Adventure
Eu passport/second identity
Jungle wars in Africa or south America

[zatara]

Theres nothing remotely glamorous about sitting in a mosquito ridden jungle in French Guiana getting dysentery and shitting yourself repeatedly. You'd be much better off scoring well in the ASVAB and using that to get a guaranteed MOS that gives you "adventure". The US military has more than enough options for overseas adventurism. And far more fun toys to play with. At least that way you'd have commanders who care about your life, a decent salary/career prospect, and compatriots who aren't Eastern European criminals.

You should really look into first hand accounts of how horrible service in the modern FFL really is. Its much worse than it was in the 1930s now, and even then it was much worse than war-porn like Beau Geste would suggest.

[WhatTheFuck]

As I’ve been in Peru for a little over 6 months now, I feel like it’s time for a update. Overall, coming down here has been the best decision I could have made given my circumstances before. I’ve enjoyed every second of it the good and the bad and have grown a lot as a person.

Living in a foreign country like this long term has given me a lot of perspective on what’s really important, and although some will disagree, I know now choosing adventure was the right choice for me personally. I think it all comes down to the need for novelty in my life, and without out it in the past I have tended to easily stagnate and fall into depression. That’s why traveling has always been like a breath of fresh air for me. The colors around me just seem brighter when I’m in a new unknown environment, my senses more alert.

The first several months I spent traveling around a little bit, then focusing intensely on learning Spanish— took 80 hours of private lessons. I have to say at this point I feel very confident with the language, although it will definitely take me another 6 months to a year living in a Spanish speaking country until I think I would be comfortable saying I am fluent (to a ~90% level or so). Dating Peruvian girls who don’t speak English has definitely been crucial in my progress.

I’ve banged a handful of girls, which I’m pretty happy with. Racking up insane notches was never really my goal, and 2 of these have ended up being long term mini-relationships. The great part of the mini-relationships is that I feel like I’ve built real connections with these girls, and got to dive really deep into Peruvian culture learning more about their world, meeting friends and family, etc.

I got an apartment, living in a second tier city which has been incredibly cheap. Eat out at local restaurants several times a week, go to the bars occasionally, splurge on random things. I don’t really watch what I spend that much, although I do do things like boiling my own water to drink and walk around instead of taking a lot of taxis. I enjoy the exercise and that’s when I do my best thinking anyway. I think overall I spend about $800/month all in.

I’ve also been working on building a little freelance writing business. The last few months I’ve got it up to about $500 a month working very limited hours so that covers about 2/3 of my expenses so doesn’t cost me very much to be down here anymore.

I’ve been doing a lot of touristy stuff too recently.. While In Peru, obviously got to go visit shit like Machu Picchu and do a good amount of hiking when I can. It’s been an epic adventure.

I’m fine on money, but decided it’s time to pop back into my hometown for a few months. I’ll be leaving in a few weeks to head back. I want to catch up with some friends and family for a little bit, as I’ve realized it’s important to me to spend some more time with them. This will also allow me to build my writing business a little more and save a few extra dollars while I’m at it to make up for what I spent on the Spanish classes, etc. I have a good thing going here with a very nice girl right now, so going to be hard to leave her but we have talked about it and she understands.

So many potential ideas for my next adventure, but at this point I’m leaning towards heading to Colombia or Mexico in beginning of January. I would leave in December but going to spend Christmas with the relatives as some of them not sure how long they will be around for still and it will mean a lot to them if I’m there.

Anyway, I think for the next several years I’m going to try and continue this into a permanent lifestyle ideally spending about 8 months abroad per year, 4 months back in the States. Seems like a reasonable balance for the time being, but who knows what the future will bring!

[Bogart]

Bump to this thread.

I’m 25 now and going through a similar thing.

For me finances are solid from family money and my own successful business ventures (ran an insanely successful high end tutoring business for a few years in university, sold out and have since been working high end corporate and not for profit law intern gigs)

I’ve travelled a bunch already but haven’t really done so for more than 2-4 months at a time since I was 18 (although I did do a semester abroad).

Right now I’ve recently graduated with two degrees from a good school and I’m getting qualified as a solicitor in Sydney. After this I can either:

1. Take up a graduate law job offer at a top tier corporate law firm. The main reason I’d do this is because while I have a really solid CV right now I don’t have any long term graduate experience and I assume this could really hold me back later in life. The work would be mind numbing and hours long but at least I’d have a solid base to fall back on/leverage on top of the high quality hodgepodge of policy/law/research/entrepreneurship I’ve got now.

2. Say fuck it, take my chances at getting accepted into a top 40 international masters program in my chosen field (policy/ethics) and go do random shit for the next year or so. I was thinking of partying over summer in scandanavia, the Baltic’s or the Greek isles, then applying to do some human rights fieldwork in Ukraine and or do a russian language course in Minsk or Moscow/St Pete.

I could do this after one more year of work but I’m going stir crazy and it feels like there’s never a right time

Anyone want to weigh in?

[KanoKnows]

I'm 25 and I chose the adventure route. I equipped myself with a skill/trade that allows me to find work quickly when I return home. I travel 3 - 4 months of the year then return home, work and save for the next trip. I find this approach keeps me grounded and the travelling experience fresh everytime.

The digital nomad life is highly over fantasied. Unless you have a skill that translates well into a remote position or have reached an expert level knowledge in a skill. Then dont waste your time.

You will spend your time sitting in a cafe trying to bootstrap a shitty business idea in a high oversaturated market. Its doomed to failure. Everyone and there aunty is trying to open a drop shipping store these days. Importing shite from china with no knowledge of how to actually run ad campaigns or market their low quality products.

Yours 20's are meant for bold undertakings and adventure. These are your prime years. If you wait too long the moment will pass and before you know it you are in your mid 30's and that youth spring in you step and that call to adventure has passed. Only to be replaced by a want for stability & routine.

Only one thing worse than being 40 and broke. Thats being 40 with regrets of not making the most of your younger days. 40 isnt the new 20 im afraid. 40 is still 10 years from 50... Then it may as well be over lets be hoenst lol