[Moto]

I have been in an LTR for almost 9 months. It survived, I think, long distance for 5 of those, only seeing each other for one week during that time. She is darn near a unicorn- a solid 8 who is intelligent (almost done with med school), young, has a great, stable (rich) family with both parents present, is a sweet latina, and still plenty boner-inducing for me. Still, I just can't quite get the lovey-dovey feelings that she wants from me, and I wish I could have.

Back in high school, my virgin and practically virgin days, I would get so in love and obsessed with some girls. I was highly emotional with women, and was along for the roller-coaster ride that they would surely take me for. Now I've become almost too good at controlling my emotions- I've nearly shut them off. It works well for anything other than serious LTR.

Seems to me like I am pretty romantic- lots of handholding, kissing, cuddling. Yet she still accuses me of being "so cold," even for a frio gringo. Perhaps I am going through the motions. I know that I could bang a new girl every week and probably not find her equal in terms of wife material. My staying with her is a logical, calculated choice for reasons I've said above, and is the most wife-worthy woman I've dated or banged by far. Yet, for sure I'm drawn to other women. Part of me very much wants the variety I've had in the past. I've accepted this as inevitable- no matter who I date or marry I will eventually, after a couple months, be biologically driven to sow my seed in strange pastures.

I don't have nearly as high of notch counts as many of you, I'm sure, but it's in the high 20s or 30s. I'm wondering if I've lost my ability to pair-bond, just as we all know women do when they get near those numbers.

Ultimately it's my choice (and hers) but I feel compelled now to bounce some things off the forum here. Stay with the intelligent choice- keep and maintain as best as I can my LTR with the goal of marriage like I would a business decision- or listen to my body and go get some strange? I don't think she's open to an open relationship, though that's the only "happy medium" I can think of. I sure don't like the idea of sharing her. I'll never be 100% sure she was faithful during my considerable time away in another country. I never cheated, part of me sure wanted to. I coulda had some Arab flags. But now is the present, and there are plenty of gorgeous women here in Mexico where I am again. I couldn't help myself from chatting up and getting this one super-sexy girl's number at Starbucks a week ago. The drive to conquer new lands is strong with me. I'm almost 28. Time to settle with my unicorn, or is the game just getting started?

I don't want to be ruled by my feelings, like a woman. Just because I don't "feel as in love as I maybe could/should be" should not dictate or justify moving on against my better judgement. But even doing the best I can, somehow I still come off as too cold for her. We're pretty damned invested in each other at this point.

Thoughts?

[Eddie Winslow]

I can't believe how incredibly similar your story is to mine. I just turned 28 myself, the age when girls start really trying to lock you down. I was actually going to make a similar post but you beat me to it.

I was with a girl for 5 years and then she dumped me like a hot sack of shit. Since getting over that, and learning game, I feel like the spell women used to put on me is broken, for good. My quality is insanely higher than it used to be, but I really just can't be bothered with a relationship even when I try my best.

Here are a few reasons (for me):

-They aren't very funny and are self-conscious, so they are more of a liability than an asset when bringing them around friends or to social gatherings.
-I like sports, poker, hitting on girls, partying with my friends, personal growth and generally doing/going what/where I please when I want to. I never get to do any of these things on dates, let alone in relationships.
-They are expensive. Even in the rare case that they truly pay their own way for anything, or even rarer, but YOU stuff, you have to do 'couple-y' shit like dinners, daytrips, and outtings that you rarely want to do in the first place. And they aren't cheap.
-I too have seen girls ho around enough to be skeptical about any one's real value as an investment, aka long-term partner. And in reality, there's always another 1 or 20 new ones a few approaches away.

That's pretty much it.

I do want to be a father, and I fantasize about having a loving wife and mother to my children when I'm ready. I just don't know how it's going to be possible. Right now, my only plan is to seduce my one amazing, platonic female friend in few years and just get her pregnant.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

You were a virgin in High School and you were not sexually abused as a kid.

Mostly only those that started out with sex before puberty or had some terrible experiences cannot have healthy relationships.

That does not seem to be the case with you. Only because a girl sounds good on paper, does not mean that you will fall in love wit her deeply. That is relevant on other factors than only attraction or being a seemingly good catch. This last element cannot be forced.

I don't even think that there is a negative Player Notchcount that works against you in that regard. You just have to be open for love. Hugh Hafner fell in love every decade once with a main girl while fucking thousands in between. Those few that he loved deeply were special to him.

Personally I use my intuition and my mind strongly when picking a LTR. I will continue fucking others while having a stable LTR. If she cannot live with it, then she may leave or she may not. I am pretty open about it. You can keep it hidden as well, but we aware that divorce might happen in the future. Or there may not come any divorce at all, since women don't leave Alpha men nearly as often as Betas - even if those cheat on them.

[Dagonet]

This is something I and many other men have grappled with. It's a matter that lies at the intersection of biology, morality, philosophy, and social customs.

There's no question that once a man sleeps with many women, and more importantly, learns how to effectively meet and seduce new women, it's near impossible for him to "turn off" that drive. All men have a constant desire for new pussy, but only some men are easily able to get it-- and even fewer still are fully aware of this ability. Knowing you have options and could actually be sleeping with other women can drive a good-hearted man crazy.

No matter what, it will be hard as a grown man with life experience to feel the same butterflies of youthful love forever. Our brains change in our 20s and early 30s. We're meant to be fathers, protectors. If we were too high on love, would we be able to provide for our children? At a certain point, you will be making a decision with a certain degree of rationality.

However, that doesn't mean you have to take the first chance you get. Or any chance before you are really ready. In my own experiences, I've had to reach a point where I am pretty burned out on new notches to really feel ready to appreciate an LTR. Maybe you're just not at that point in your life yet. Certainly, you still have years of sexual market viability ahead of you, and too many men sign those years away to one woman without realizing it.

Some guys will tell you to pick a good woman, and cheat on her discretely to meet your needs. They'll tell you that she secretly likes that you're a desirable man, and it's a natural arrangement for both of you. There is actually a lot of merit to this solution, from a red pill standpoint. However, it takes a toll on your psyche and emotions in the long run. You have to really be okay with it, morally. You might have to constantly remind yourself that it's okay, and resist the urge to admit it to her. This won't be healthy for many men, psychologically. You have to be a certain type of stoic. Or psychopath. I don't think it's worth trying to get your girl's approval to be "open." That just ruins the magic for her, and makes her feel inadequate and unsafe with you. A little subtle jealousy is good, but even if a girl stayed with you in that scenario, she'd be unpleasant to be around soon enough. I don't want to be with a girl who is constantly depressed.

Only you can decide if you're ready to make these sacrifices-- and either way, there is a sacrifice. The best question you can ask yourself is when you want to have kids, and whether this is the right girl for that. How long will she maintain her looks? Will she be a good mother and partner? Do your timelines sync up right to pursue that together? If you can really envision a future with this girl, and be excited to work toward those goals, that will fuel your relationship and reinforce your masculinity in a very pleasing way. It's not so much the death of love, but balancing your desires, your changing goals and brain physiology, and the complexities of going from a child to a man. This is a path we all must navigate. Try not to judge yourself or think the stakes are too high. Allow yourself to relax, not rush, and introspect about where you're heading. No matter what, you will learn and grow. And when you get clarity about what you want, you'll have the tools to get it.

[Travesty]

I think you need to be real with yourself.

This sounds like the reverse version from a woman of He's Such a Nice Guy.

Do you really enjoy hanging out with this chick other than what she has going for her on paper?

You never mentioned once in your intro paragraph about her about how cool she is and how you laugh and do things you both enjoy together. You only listed characteristics.

[Gunner]

This topic feels close to home, I am in Mexico too, if you are in Mexico City let's meet and drink some scotchs.

[Dagonet]

I also concur with Zel and Travesty. Sometimes we can try to convince ourselves that a girl is "right" because of reasons X/Y/Z, but we're really just trying to force things. It is still possible for you to feel deep passion and excitement for a girl in your future. Maybe she'll be completely different than your "checklist" but you'll actually have better chemistry and a deeper desire to stay with her. Maybe it is just cyclical. But why give up on having another great experience in that cycle of love while you're still young and in your male prime.

[Moto]

Thanks guys, I'm going to reflect on this a lot and not do anything hasty.

I do enjoy time with her, but not so much the date and "couple-y" stuff. I used to teach her a little bit of Kung Fu, I need to do some more of that.

I'm going to get back to doing the things I enjoy with her, the things where we laugh together. We used to laugh together quite a lot. I think we can get that back.

Perhaps she is a better match for me on paper than in reality. The Hugh Heffner approach sounds damned good to me now, but I'm not sure I'd really be okay with it morally within myself. I need to be whole, have integrity with my beliefs, no matter what I do. And it would definitely ruin the magic for her, she would not stay long.

I think she went through my phone. Even though I deleted the brief conversation with the girl from Starbucks (another med student haha) she probably saw in the "favorites" section that I had a recent contact with a girl possibly prettier than her. She kind blew up, but in a way the dread game worked temporarily and unintentionally. She found it shortly after I had to call her out on some bullshit, having a 30 min conversation with a dude friend right in front of me. That is a red flag, lots of guy friends. She even tried to friend-zone me in the beginning, I had to tell her I am NOT her friend and I kept going for it. I told her they are just waiting for an opportunity, that is the strategy of most guys but not my strategy.

I don't want kids now. I'm not established enough in a career yet. This coming year will determine a lot, if I want to remain a teacher or go into business or law (which means probably going back to the states). She recently has been saying she wants a baby very soon. This was before she just recently accused me of being so cold. There's been just enough instability as of late for me to for sure not want kids or marriage at this time. I have thought all along she'd be a good mother, though our timelines are not lining up for that now.

I've got some reflecting to do. Thanks y'all. I'm still open to any other feedback.

Gunner, I'll hit you up if I get a good chance to go to DF. I haven't been there yet.

[General Stalin]

I think something along these lines is very relevant to almost all of us here. A lot (most) of us are recovering betas. We've been thrown through a loop in past relationships and stumbled upon the manosphere during a phase of extreme bitterness and frustration. This perfect storm of rejection and rebirth has formed a callused heart, whether contrived or not. I have experienced this same thing.

Growing attached to women in the past has led to emotional anguish, frustration, regret, and depression. These are things we don't want to feel. In conjunction, we learn that being emotionally distant is conducive to drawing females closer to you - it is an important part of game that lures women to you. The mystery and the inability to figure you out and get you wrapped around her finger makes you more intriguing. The crux of this is this is that we can't figure out where to draw the line, if at all. I for one get excited when I'm seeing a new girl and she tells me she can't figure me out or thinks I'm cold/hard etc. when is it okay to let your guard down? Is it ever okay? I personally hate the idea of making myself emotionally vulnerable to a woman, but at the same time I hate the idea of purposely keeping myself at arm's length.

[speakeasy]

At your age, if you found an exceptional girl, especially in America, I wouldn't be so quick to toss her aside. Especially if you've built something meaningful and you plan to be married and have a family at some point.

Keep in mind that your desire for new pussy is insatiable. It's a hamster wheel that leads nowhere. So you will sleep with many new random girls whose names you won't remember in a year. Whatever pleasure you get from one night stands is fleeting. Not much different from an addict looking for another hit. And then another, and another. How long do you want to be on that hamster wheel?

If you truly feel like your girl isn't right for and she's not the one, then do what you gotta do. But if the only reason you're walking away is because of the lure of new pussy just keep in mind that that's an endless rabbit hole that can never be satiated. And in the long run you are ruining your ability to pair bond with any good woman you happen to meet.

[nek]

(07-02-2015 01:52 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

It's a hamster wheel that leads nowhere. So you will sleep with many new random girls whose names you won't remember in a year. Whatever pleasure you get from one night stands is fleeting. Not much different from an addict looking for another hit. And then another, and another. How long do you want to be on that hamster wheel?

As a person who has recently gone on a mini tear after coming out of a long slump, I agree with this completely. Real joy and esteem comes from getting better and from building something, be it your body, career, etc.

[Gustavus Adolphus]

speakeasy articulated my thoughts very well, but the wisdom of the entire forum never ceases to impress me.

There are trials at many points in our lives, and it can be difficult to make these choices.

After a 5 year LTR in my early 20's, I went on a pussy exploration that would make Leif Eriksson proud. In retrospect, it was actually a low point in my life because I had very little companionship. A few years and ex-girlfriends later, I found this community and learned a lot. My perspective changed... My current LTR is just over 3 years, and I have kept a side girl on 6 occasions, usually for 2-3 weeks or so, for the times when my girl gets an attitude and we need some time off. I just go to the bullpen and put in a reliever I've met somewhere, or game someone new. I don't feel bad at all. This is the only way I have figured out to KEEP a girl long term. Otherwise, I will logically try to "fix" what is wrong, which just makes things worse. Sooner or later, the phone rings. I'm not mad or upset with her because I did what I had to do based on her behavior and I'm over whatever the issue was by then.

Last year when I was not yet a member here, my girl was having a particularly bad week and felt like it was perfectly normal and acceptable to yell at me over the phone for something trivial when I was on a business trip and not even in the same city as her. I hung up mid sentence and didn't respond for 4 days. I had too much going on to put up with her shit and if she never called back I was willing to take the loss. An LTR is not a marriage. Plus, I knew she'd be back when she realized she was in timeout and calmed down.

None of the other girls got what my main receives, so there is not a loss of the pair bond in my mind. We have fun dates, passionate sex, and good conversation. However, I would say we are a good pair because both of us are at a high value to the opposite sex. I am 10 years older than her, and met her at age 23. Either of us could hit the eject button at any time and not look back if the other fucks up too badly.

It was reading the following post, which changed how I go about my business of treating females:

(03-12-2014 10:43 PM)Suits Wrote:  

When I read the title, my response was, "how can you get dumped if you don't make the mistake of having exclusive relationships?"

Upon reading your post in its entirety, it is clear that you understand that there is nothing to master about getting dumped.

Never put yourself in a position where a woman can dump you. My personal view (and yours may be as well), that if she isn't getting fatter, she hasn't been too crazy recently and she wants to come over and suck my dick, I'm always open for business.

There is no "break up." The deal is always available.

If you are female, a seven or better, weigh under 120 LB, have recently showered and don't plan on being a bitch, you can come satisfy me sexually on any evening where I don't have a prior commitment.

You may chose not to or promise never to again, but I'm always cool with you changing your mind.

There is no "relationship."

[samsamsam]

I am not sure if my situation is exactly the same and by no means am I trying to derail this thread.

But I was thinking about my ability to bond the other day. I have never been able to be around the girls I have dated/banged for more than a couple of days at a time. I enjoy socializing but also cherish my alone time to work on my projects, read, study etc. Though I have no prospects at the moment, some day (sooner than later I hope) I would like to get married and start a family.

But I have a hard time reconciling this need with the fact that I need my alone time.

[Tigre]

You have two questions or themes mixed together in this post.

- What do you want? Stay or go? LTR comforts and putting down roots vs lure of strange.
- She sees you as frio.

Start with the second one since it's easier to break down.

When you learned game, you might think of it as a series of tools. You understood female motivations and drives. You figured out how to recognize patterns. You have tools and techniques that you can apply when you see a certain pattern.

It could be good for your personal development if you take that feedback on board and use it as motivation to improve. You need to develop a couple more game tools (the cariñoso tools) that you can apply judiciously when called for.

Mastery of that will help you - whether it's with this girl or latinas you'll meet in the future.

I don't suggest you should cave in your whole identity and let her change you at will. But at least listen that what she's signalling and make a gesture from time to time in that direction. It shows engagement, learning and personal growth. She'll respect you for it. Provided you get the dose right and don't go overboard.

How do you go about being warmer?

You could start by figuring out where she stands on the five love languages. Often the one that she looks for is the one she does most often towards you. Which one is that?

Some of this stuff is ridiculously simple but valuable. It could be as simple as grabbing a chocolatina for her on the way home. Or telling her something like "you did good", or "it's good to have you here".

You could also ask her an open ended question. What's an example of something you did for her in the past that she saw as warm. Or an example of something she was certain you were about to do that was warm, but then you didn't do it.

[Gmac]

OP's story hits home hard for me. In fact this thread makes me want to restart the blog again and go a different direction with it... Might even share my story at some point.

[Moto]

Thanks, Tigre. I think maybe the physical touch is not enough. That's primarily the language I speak. That's the main way, I think, she expresses her love too. But I think she needs at least one of the others. I will test these to see which she responds to. It was a little ironic, I kind of flipped the script on her. I said I usually feel pretty loved, but maybe you can show me the kind of warmth you want. Do you really think the guy should be the one more warm, more emotional. She said, "Yes." Haha.. I know she didn't even believe that though.

I can and will learn some cariñoso tools. But I just don't genuinely feel for her what I wish I did, and what maybe I could feel for someone else (not sure to be honest). She does deserve it, aside from some rare acts on her part which I described above.

[Kieran]

I believe age is a big factor in this. At 18 I fell in love easily, but by my mid twenties I could take them or leave them (I may not be the norm but I'd say all my feelings have dulled with age - even something like the joy of visiting a new city is less intense than it was when I was younger).

[The Beast1]

I too can relate. As i've gotten older the "intensity" of my emotions has given way to control. Hilariously i used to yearn for this type of control over my emotions in my youth. Now i miss the emotional rollercoaster. I never realized that it was a feeling of youth.

Honestly, i'm still caught on whether this is a good or bad thing. The level of control over my own destiny and relationships is astounding. In fact, i feel more mature and developed than my own parents who seem to be stuck in the same ruts when i left them.

You'll be able to settle down one day. Unlike women, we have the ability as men to say, "i'm staying in this relationship long term come hell or high water."

Women can't do this simply because most of them lack the logical dissonance to accept situations as permanent (eg i'm married and flirting is no longer acceptable). This all goes out the window when Maslov's hierarchy of needs isn't met.

[Tytalus]

(07-02-2015 11:06 AM)Moto Wrote:  

Thanks guys, I'm going to reflect on this a lot and not do anything hasty.

I do enjoy time with her, but not so much the date and "couple-y" stuff. I used to teach her a little bit of Kung Fu, I need to do some more of that.

I'm going to get back to doing the things I enjoy with her, the things where we laugh together. We used to laugh together quite a lot. I think we can get that back.

Perhaps she is a better match for me on paper than in reality. The Hugh Heffner approach sounds damned good to me now, but I'm not sure I'd really be okay with it morally within myself. I need to be whole, have integrity with my beliefs, no matter what I do. And it would definitely ruin the magic for her, she would not stay long.

I think she went through my phone. Even though I deleted the brief conversation with the girl from Starbucks (another med student haha) she probably saw in the "favorites" section that I had a recent contact with a girl possibly prettier than her. She kind blew up, but in a way the dread game worked temporarily and unintentionally. She found it shortly after I had to call her out on some bullshit, having a 30 min conversation with a dude friend right in front of me. That is a red flag, lots of guy friends. She even tried to friend-zone me in the beginning, I had to tell her I am NOT her friend and I kept going for it. I told her they are just waiting for an opportunity, that is the strategy of most guys but not my strategy.

I don't want kids now. I'm not established enough in a career yet. This coming year will determine a lot, if I want to remain a teacher or go into business or law (which means probably going back to the states). She recently has been saying she wants a baby very soon. This was before she just recently accused me of being so cold. There's been just enough instability as of late for me to for sure not want kids or marriage at this time. I have thought all along she'd be a good mother, though our timelines are not lining up for that now.

I've got some reflecting to do. Thanks y'all. I'm still open to any other feedback.

Gunner, I'll hit you up if I get a good chance to go to DF. I haven't been there yet.

I speak as a married guy who struggles with this - I care for my wife, but I haven't really been in love with her in years. It is truly, a burden. PM me if you want more details about that.

I think a great book to read that is the only red pill LTR book is this one: "Married Man Sex Life Primer" by Athol Kay. Some of it you will find redundant, but he does go into deeper detail on shit tests, loyalty tests and comfort tests that are harder to find in the manosphere.

http://www.amazon.com/Married-Man-Life-P...S7552YHHWA

A man who isn't careful can end up beta-sized by marriage. Lots of guys on athol kay's forums talked about how they were much more alpha before getting married and how women can unintentionally make their man beta. One of the biggest things is failing shit tests.

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comm...e_to_shit/

I'm not sure what to recommend with matters of the heart. It does sound like you want different things at this point in life and have different life goals which is A HUGE FUCKING deal. You can get along and enjoy each other great, but if she wants a family, and you don't, there is some serious huge conflict coming up between you two. I think you really need to decide what you want out of life before making any decision one way or the other.

I do think your idea to try and do the "fun stuff" that caused the relationship to start in the first place is a good idea.

That can be part of the damper on your attraction to her. As well, I know from my own experience, getting burned badly in my youth put a big damper on my willingness to "be in love".

[Fortis]

I thought it was a natural thing to undergo, actually. I imagine that after you've fallen in love a few times that your mind begins to compensate for the insanity that comes with love.

[Parlay44]

Your heart and your cock don't always agree

[Dusty]

I just watched a documentary about Bob Weir from the Grateful Dead. He got married for the first time in his life at age 52.

He joined the band when he was 16, and was smashing groupies for decades. In threesomes and what not. Around age 50, he started questioning if he wanted to be a tom cat forever and decided it was time to settle down.

He was hanging around with a groupie for years who he met when she was 15 (he claims he didn't smash her back then, I think he is lying). She was in her 20s by the time Weir was 50.

He called his sister and said "I think I'm in love." So he married the groupie when he was 52 (in 1999) and they have a lovely family and are still very much in love and he seems happy as a clam being a family man.

He said 52 was a good age to finally settle down, and he's glad he waited.

The point I'm making is not to wait until your 52 (although that might be right for some). The point is we are all on different paths with different timelines, and just because you can't "pair bond" now does not mean there is something fundamentally absent in you. It just means your time hasn't arrived. You can be a playa and a Tom cat and not have much desire to pair-bond, but you are forever changing and your outlook and desires will likely change as your life unfolds, so don't sweat it.

[alpha_i]

(07-05-2015 01:58 PM)Dusty Wrote:  

He said 52 was a good age to finally settle down, and he's glad he waited.

The point I'm making is not to wait until your 52 (although that might be right for some). The point is we are all on different paths with different timelines, and just because you can't "pair bond" now might just mean there is something fundamentally something absent in you. It just means your time hasn't arrived. You can be a playa and a Tom cat and not have much desire to pair-bond, but you are forever changing and your outlook and desires will likely change as your life unfolds, so don't sweat it.

Sounds a lot like my own father. He was a minor celebrity (stage actor) in the late 1960s and married my mother when he was 48 and she was 27. They met in a bar in NYC - she was his main plate for at least four years before he finally agreed to commit to her.

My parents stayed married for 26 years, and were miserable for most of my childhood. Dad lost frame in the relationship for a variety of reasons, and today at age 90 (no joke) he says without a doubt that he should never have gotten married. He has an n-count of over 200 and can still attract women 20-30 years younger than him.

I have learned a lot from my dad - there aren't many players from his generation, aside from Hugh Hefner! But I'd be a lot more open to settling down in my 50s vs. now in my mid-30s.

[carolinasmash]

I was in a LTR once with what I would consider a solid 10 (model) from EE. Tall, dressed well, wore heels, cooked and cleaned for me, paid her own way, ivy league educated, never asked me for a dime (already had a green card) I was on cloud 9 and lost my edge and became completely insecure and lost my center. After she broke it off with me my life spiraled out of control and I almost ended up killing myself over her (in fact I became homeless and nearly drank myself to death). After I recovered from what I considered at the time the greatest loss of my life and even after I finally started to get back in the game I had developed full on erectile dysfunction because I was comparing her to every girl I got...

Well guess what? that loss totally upped my game to a level I had never seen. Because of her I completely stopped caring about any other girl I was with or even saw and came in contact with including the ones I bedded once I got my ability to get my hardon back. The issue I have now is like yours except I'm not playing into it anymore. I have several (good for marriage prospects in my orbit) but I still can't bring myself to let them in. It sucks for me because I used to be a serial LTR guy so I'm still getting used to being with several women. It sounds awesome on paper but it's a major life adjustment and reprogramming.

One thing I've realized is even though I'm struggling with the idea of letting one in I've noticed that my girls in orbit now treat me way better than many of my past g/f's and I actually stay focused on building my career life and focusing on my health rather than getting wrapped up in a women's web. I'm also a better son, brother, friend and uncle and yes it's very hard indeed but I've seen this with my few friends as well that are good at game and we are all the most successful now when it comes to our health, family dynamics and career stability.

In my 20's I was bouncing corporate job to corporate job, not taking care of myself, in and out of depression and it really took a solid toll on me financially and mentally to the point I have still not fully recovered. I don't actually blame women for this but I do blame myself for feeling the need to use a women to fill a void and make me think I was something worth keeping. If I was good enough for her I was good enough.

Many men are like this and most people in general are like this, I measured my dick through my friends, job title, financial standing and most of all the women willing to be long term with me. Now I'm slowly but surely measuring my happiness and well-being through my ability to stand on my own two feet and not allow anyone or anything close enough to knock me off my center. Many of my friends and family now tell me I look ten years younger and are shocked at how I turned my life around and how quick I did it. Including the only women that has the rights to my heart which is my mother.

I'm sure one day I'll be ready to allow women in but that will only be when I feel 100 percent sure that if something happens and I lose her that my life will proceed as normal. It's something every man should learn before they commit. I remember once asking my recovering alcoholic friend if he thought I was an alcoholic. He asked me if you went to the Dr. tomorrow and they said you could never drink again or you would die instantly how would you feel.? I thought about for less than two seconds and said I'd be fine with that. He said you're not an alcoholic. You have to look at women you're with the same way. Ask yourself if this girl dumped you tomorrow how would you handle it.?

If you're not man enough to stand on your own two feet without fear of loneliness or companionship or that you can't do any better then you're not man enough yet for marriage or a commitment and setting yourself up for failure. Don't ever lose yourself in the moment or over someone else. I think the key to a healthy relationship is the ability to hold your own no matter what the fuck is thrown at you from any direction.

[kaotic]

I'm surprised at the amount of guys who can relate to this, as so I can.

I don't think the majority of us will ever feel those "butterflies" we used to when we were kids/teens/young adults.

That's just life experience rationalizing the reality we live in.

Being "aware" of how women/game/dating works further sets us away from those feelings.

The closest I get to it is occasionally thinking about my main and smiling about her or kissing her on the forehead because I want to.

I've been with her almost over a year and a half and coming off a great birthday weekend with her and my friends. All my friends hated my last ex and love this girl.

I enjoy my time with her, she complements my life, she has a few flaws, she's a not a unicorn, no woman is.

She's definitely LTR material, and has been so far.

I've said this one the forum before - I bang on the side. A few weeks ago I had 2 other girls in my harem catching strong feelings so I had to next them. My harem has collapsed and I've got 1 or 2 girls I can bang.

It's been over a month since I've got a new notch, a few mediocre dates.

Speakeasy hit it home for me, new notches and dates are the addiction to the "chase" another dopamine hit on an endless hamster wheel.

It's fun, but you get tired of it sometimes, you want something better, more quality, maybe an LTR.

Right now I'm 50/50 I love my LTR but I love gaming, in my late 20's it looks like I'm leaning towards LTR BUT I bang on the side because it keeps me sane and my sex drive up.

There are a few things I can't really express on here, maybe if I can put it into words I will.

Dagonet drops depth about "sacrifice" and how an LTR/cheating/harem might be only for psychopaths....well maybe I am one. I don't know but somehow I keep it separate and run VERY tight game with these girls.

But I see nothing wrong with being in love and having an LTR even banging on the side as well.

Thing is, I think the more girls I bang, the more I realize how fucked women are, the more I'm desensitized to "love" and having an emotional connection with them. (Isn't this comparable to women with the thousand cock stare? Not that it's a interchangeable term)

We want both, we want that good girl we can lock down, that bad slut we can do anything with. Hate to say it, it's not usually those 2 girls in 1.