[MasterBacja]

I wouldn't usually straight up ask for advice (especially since, to date, i've offered little in the way of advice/data to the forum) but I'm in a situation that's throwing me off slightly because i'm having a hard time getting a read on it. I might just be too close to the situation to assess properly, so i'm looking to get some outside opinions on this one. I'm posting this here so as not to bog down the game forum proper with what's probably a cut and dried situation.

Short background: Friend of mine and i meet up with a girl he's been banging, she's already out early evening at a bar with an engaged friend. We show up, engaged friend has to leave, girl my buddy is banging immediately (without provocation) gets on the horn to invite her friends out. She's working on two of them, one of them shows up. Obviously looking to even up numbers, obviously hooking her friend up, obviously a cakewalk for me. Things go as expected because my in-person game is solid, the table was set for me, and i must have gotten the "thumbs up" from the broad doing the inviting. It's just as easy as i expected - make incidental contact which is reciprocated, then escalate it, hand her my phone with the "add number" screen up (which she obliges without hesitation), then later isolate her for a makeup at the bar. She resists coming home with me because she's "not a slut" (lol) but without a lot of pressure she changes gears and comes back to my place. Penetration commences, things go fine, take her home in the morning.

During the "rendezvous", she's almost OVERLY complimentary. Things like "guys like you are trouble, you're too hot to keep talking to me", "you're perfect", "you fuck SO hard" (which almost made me laugh out loud). I mean, things that borderline made me think she might be a weirdo. Thing is, she seems well adjusted for the most part otherwise, is a solid 8, and didn't act overly slutty outside of letting me bang the first night. Any hangups and other shit traits seemed limited to the usual early-20s girl shit - nothing remarkable.

St. Paddy's weekend was two nights later - we end up in the same general area and she's texting me begging me to meet up. Meet up and she's all over me, asking to come home with me. Take her home, repeat the first time pretty much (including excessive ego stroking) and she stays a bit longer the next morning before leaving. Talks pretty openly with me, seems normal, tells me she wants to see me again soon.

....And that's where it gets fucked up. I am a world-renowned shitty texter, and that's gotta be a large part of the issue. We text off and on (mostly flirty small talk) throughout the next week and she's out of town for the weekend so i don't press the issue. Work on locking down a hangout and she's pretty much avoiding answering anything concrete. Any extended silence (24 hours or so) is met with either a snapchat sent to start convo or her liking something of mine on instagram. I would usually initiate conversation a couple hours after she would do that and she'd respond quickly and be super talkative. Still though, keeping everything at arms length and brushing off attempts at locking anything down. She gets back, says she's tired and wants to take a nap so i offer to "fuck her to sleep". She just dismisses it like "i'm so tired i won't even need help to sleep". Ok then...

I'm seeing the writing on the wall so i push for a make or break (for myself) by offering a meetup to continue conversation in person two days after she'd gotten back (a Tuesday). Homegirl claims she would "love to" but "may or may not have pink eye". I assume this is bullshit and lay it out there like "up to you", she doesn't respond at all to that and i go radio silent for the rest of the night and the entire next day. Hear nothing from her.

Thursday (last thursday) she starts liking my shit on instagram, but doesn't reach out. Later that night, throw out a text to gauge response saying "how's the pink eye?". She responds pretty quickly and goes full blown chatty cathy, at one point even sending a screenshot of a convo confirming that she really did suspect she had pink eye. Good on ya, not just a bullshit excuse. Won't stop texting me all night long, continue talking the next day, at which time i drop "what are you doing this sunday? BOGO burgers at (burger place), bloody mary bar, you wanna tag along?". She replies yes immediately, acts crazy excited - fucking a, locked in.

Sunday: Text her to confirm around noon, she says she's still in then adds "cool if i meet you at your place? aka can i take a nap in your bed after we get back?". She meets up, we go get burgers and drinks, good conversation (i crush in person) and obvious signs of interest like arm touching and hard eye contact. The weirder stuff though:

-mentions "if you ever meet my mom....(blah blah blah):
-keeps complimenting my intelligence in such a way i'm led to believe she was screening me out for "dateability". I can't elaborate because it was more a sense i got rather than anything directly pointing to that.
-legitimately offers to pay for drinks at second place we went, with a genuineness not usually observed my yours truly in these situations.
-making callbacks to things i had said earlier, attempting to establish inside jokes with me.

She mentions wanting to kiss me a lot, but i withhold because i'm going for the bang and for some reason making her wait amuses me. I know she's coming back over anyways. Get home, obviously don't nap, bang most of the day and she leaves with a whole "we gotta hang out again soon" and all that. She'd never been to the sushi place in town so i offer that possibly during the week, she says definitely. No problem.

This week? Monday was relatively minimal convo, a bit of back and forth but nothing established enough to keep me entertained. Tuesday (a night i typically keep free) i ask her what she's doing, she says she's going to that sushi place with two friends. I play that into "you owe me sushi then, but hangout at my place is acceptable alternative payment. when are you free?". She says "tomorrow is the best day this week for me" i say "tomorrow it is". A couple texts back and forth then i leave it for the night. No messages from her either.

The next day (yesterday), ask her how the sushi was and she says they didn't even end up going. Ok then, i give her "we can go tonight?". Long delay, hits me with "just got out of work, crazy day!". Ignores the offer. I respond to the "crazy day text", she doesn't answer. A bit later i send another small-talk text, no answer. An hour and a half after my first response to her text about her getting out of work with no response, i send "So i’m getting pretty hungry and there’s a bonfire i’m gonna go to - not sure if you still had any intention of hanging out or whatever but i guess tonight’s not going to work for me" and head over to a friend's house for a bonfire (there really was a bonfire). She responds almost immediately with "ok have fun". I don't respond. 45 minutes later she texts "Are you off Friday?". I respond an hour later "Nah i work".

So, what's actually going on here? This should be easy given her behavior in person, i'm working on pipelining this for regular pussy/whatever else and it's like pulling teeth to lockdown anything in person. That's common and i've been through it enough to expect it, but the way she acts when we actually meet up is like a complete 180. Am i giving her too much control of the proceedings? It's unintentional if so, but i can see a good case being made for that. She did attempt a reschedule, but only after i flipped the script and made it feel like i cancelled on her - although she seemed content to just wait me out at that point even after agreeing to come over the night before. In the meantime i'm working on other options as it is, but this one is simultaneously my best and worst lead depending on the day. My only real thought is that my "ABC" sales-like attitude is killing momentum but i can't call it. Sorry for the long post, i'm a longwinded dude. Any thoughts on this one or should i just pull the plug and let her get a hold of me when she senses i'm doing my own thing?

[Isaac Jordan]

tl;dr for anyone else who wants to chip in: OP fucks a girl, puts her on a pedestal, puts up with her bullshit and then wonders why she keeps flaking.

OP, here's your solution:

1. Stop whatever you're doing and move to a private location where you won't be seen.

2. Drop your pants.

3. Use one hand to lift up your cock, and with the other, feel around underneath for a loose, wrinkly sack of skin containing two oval-shaped organs. THESE ARE YOUR BALLS. Love them, cherish them, and get ready to live a new life with them in it.

4. Delete this chick's number and go approach 10 other women.

I don't mean to come off as an asshole, but it's behavior like yours that makes it possible for girls to act this way. By constantly putting up with her bullshit, you're enabling, nay, ENCOURAGING her to treat you like some dancing monkey that she can enjoy when she feels like and ignore when she gets bored.

If you were fucking three other women right now, would you put up with this shit? Would you be friends with a man if he treated you this way? Would you put this much time and effort into this girl if she were a 5 instead of an 8?

This girl's beauty (and/or your desire to lock her down) has created a level of thirst in you that has blinded you to her cunty behavior, ironically amplifying the behavior itself.

Forget about this girl. Go find someone else who actually respects your time and attention.

[WestIndianArchie]

Way too thirsty.

You already banged, and now you're all up on her clit sniffing around.

Ease back, radio silence, and go on about your life.

As for her behavior
1) she's turned off by needy behavior
2) she fucked you, but didn't invest much
3) she invested a lot, and is unsure about a relationship
4) she's getting bigger dick from somebody else
5) her ex just got back into town
6) she's not sure if this hetero thing is for her, maybe she should go back to being a closeted Lesbian

Basically her being flaky or standoffish could mean anything.

You can't see into her mind. You can't even see her, so your likelihood of predicting her next move is nil.

The only way you win this game is having other options, because you can't beat someone with logic when they don't use logic.

WIA

[MasterBacja]

That was pretty much the response i was expecting. Thanks for the input guys, i doubted i'd get any responses based on how long the post was.

You are both spot on, but i think due to the long post a few things might have gotten lost in translation or misconstrued. Using the word "recovering" was probably a bit misleading too - i was looking to "recover" but certainly it was more of a "restart". I'm an efficiency guy and i was mostly wondering what the highest percentage move is with girls like this, taking into consideration that she's unable to keep control of any frame in person and is only good at that via text. I think you both made the (fair) assumption that i'm not currently working on anything else - i can see why you'd assume that but i have a few plates spinning right now so this isn't all or nothing for me.

And as far as enabling this behavior, let's be honest - i'm not creating anything and it's not as though i've given her the keys to the box my balls are kept in. She was going to do it anyways and i'm not making her more or less likely to do it in the grand scheme, although i agree with your sentiment about not taking this type of behavior from a man. The reason i even posted asking for advice, which i normally don't, is because i had bent beyond what i normally would with this girl into an area i was too unfamiliar with to guarantee a win. I don't like "losing" social interactions and i don't like using radio silence on girls who have shown this much interest - it eliminates any certainty you may have created (or believe you've created). I was looking for alternate strategies or confirmation that none exist.

The update is i just pulled the plug on it and went about fucking the other prospects. Not as high-quality, but you can't win them all. Got two new prospects this weekend which i feel like i would have gotten regardless of whether or not the chick from the OP was more open. The lesson as always - don't care too much. Thanks for reiterating that guys.

[brick tamland]

@OP - all the useful text advice on RVF is 'Less is more'. After the first bang you had the upper hand. Roosh has said on his blog that never assume you'll see her again. So there was no need to fumble trying to make her your booty call. No need to try hard. You actually sent mixed signals and muddied the water. She probably wanted no-frills fun and you were The Man for a while, until all you did after the first bang. Making her your F buddy can only happen on YOUR terms - you shouldn't signal that you'll communicate often, reply to all her texts, be readily available, keep trying to set up dates or condone her flakes.

[456]

I think I see what OP is getting at -- when a girl is throwing down "this is the best D i've had" game in a believable way, you expect her to reciprocate with absolute non-flakiness outside of the bedroom. Maybe she is sheltered and hasn't had much great sex before, maybe you're just SO different than her ex, maybe she's full of shit. The point is, she's talking the talk.

I'd say, lay low, and the next time you're in the sack with her, maybe in between fucks 1 and 2 when she's really turned on but you're kind of still in refractory mode, give her a nice hand-in-hair grab, controlling her neck and moving her eyes right to yours, and tell her she's your fucktoy and if she wants to fuck, set a time and stick to it. None of this "oh actually" or ambiguous bullshit. You want this dick? Don't waste my time.

I know this sounds insane, but if you actually own her P, and she believes her own hype about you, and you nail the tonality (she=fucktoy, don't play games), she will simultaneously be turned on and think you're just dirty talking her, and also kind of "get" that she should spare you the text-ambiguity-flakiness she is so used to throwing at lessor suitors.

If she really feels you how you describe, she will realize "oh shit I better be better about that". Some girls genuinely feel "i GOT to see him tonight!" during their post-lunch work doldrums, but feel crappy a few hours later and flick their bean to the thought of you. Sexual camel and all. So you're just conveying "I don't work that way -- if we're making plans, we're keeping them" with a subtle insinuation of an ultimatum.

I know ultimatums are an admission of weaker position, but in this case, it all rests on her "extreme interest in person" -- for whatever reason, your sexual chemistry with her is off the charts, but you won't deal with time-wasting just for her gash.

This advice breaks a lot of conventions, but given the right frame and if your instincts about her are accurate and she's not just flaking to trade up to better D, giving her some straight talk (the same way you might to a guy friend who is slacking in some way), combining it with the ultimate moment of your power in your domain (between rounds of sex), you may snap her out of her beta-bait textual habits without coming off butthurt.

[MasterBacja]

^^^That's more along the lines of where I'm coming from and why i'm thrown off. I'm not naive enough to believe flakiness won't still exist, and not dumb enough to think i don't have to put in work to maintain this position - but it's a complete 180 from the in-person aspect to the texting aspect. She absolutely owns the frame though text, i absolutely own it in person.

This has to come down to deficiencies in my text game altogether. It's a form of "pedastalizing" that isn't trickling through into my actual life. Through text, i'm clearly elevating her value unintentionally by not sticking with my (somewhat perceived by her) strength - the fact she's giving every sign that i'm crushing the puss. Regardless of whether or not she's being honest, she's "talking the talk" as you put it and to a degree "walking the walk" (no pun intended).

My conclusion this far out on this one is that i'm not being sexual enough. She's clearly filed me away in her mind into that category. By sending texts carrying any other weight or towards any other end, i'm blending in with the betas she's used to chewing up and eating alive. I'm making it easy by not just hammering away at the one weak spot i'm equipped to exploit with her. If looked at the right way, she's not even flaking in the popularly accepted sense - she's refusing to hangout in capacities that aren't sexually motivated or sound up front like the kind of things she's used to guys inviting her to do. I likely can't outright go full booty call with her (at the risk of "scaring the cat" at this point) but i need to keep running the plays that have scored all my points up until now.

[456]

Then hit her with some dirty texts.... "I want you tonight" or "I was thinking about [sexual moment she was particularly into]" or "let's de-stress later" -- it doesn't have to be explicit, but it should be obvious that you aren't trying to do some "normal date segue to the unknown" thing. See if that helps.