[jariel]

Introduction
I recently had a conversation with a fellow member through private message in which I mentioned to him that I could talk all day about women and the relationships we have with them.

I believe we've covered some interesting topics thus far in Real Talk Sessions, but I don't believe we've even really scratched the surface yet. We're going to continue to get deeper into non-traditional topics and aspects of game, and we're getting to hit them hard, like a Colombian culona after a bottle of Aguardiente.

For this edition, we'll take a look at compliments, where they fit into the game, and how modern men should approach modern dating.

Compliments: Don't Feed The Animals
We all know attention is for women what sex is for men. Women go out of their way to receive compliments because they serve as confirmations that someone is paying attention to them. Most of the time, they'd prefer for that attention to come from other women. "Oh, you're hair looks amazing" justifies the time and money she spent on having it done, and it signifies to her that her hair looks better than the person's who complimented her.

As for men, in most cases, your compliments may receive a "thank you", but you're just as likely to receive a cynical response, a defensive response, or even no response at all. Women only take well to compliments from men they want to receive compliments from. If whatever she's doing to attract attention, is attracting unwanted attention, she gets upset because she knows she didn't do it for that person. She didn't put on that Sue Wong dress with those Jimmy Choo heels so some random guy who's never going to get to hit it can put his bid in.

Ultimately, the waters for compliments are too muddy.

First off, I think anyone who takes the time out of their day to acknowledge another person's existence should at least be treated with the decency of a "thank you" without there being any expectation of further investment.

Secondly, I'm not a fan of ego boosting. As it is, the thirst out in the field is strong, women are having their egos boosted all the time by wannabe suitors who seem to subconsciously think that a particular woman has never been told how pretty her eyes are or how great her smile is -- Breaking news, an attractive woman has likely been told all of her life how attractive she is, the fact that you're telling her doesn't give you a special place in her heart. If anything, it earns you a roster spot on Team Lame next to Captain Thirst.

Lastly, compliments do have a place in the game, but that place is nowhere to be found in the first quarters of the contest. Moreover they should be earned over time; just telling a woman how great she is just because she exists and is front of you at the moment is not encouraged.

Unfortunately, some men think they're spitting game by dishing out compliments, Exhibit A:



While I'm sure you could imagine the ending if we were 75 minutes into a typical Hollywood rom-com shitshow, in the real world, this guy Cam failed with flying colors. Another poster called his response "gay", and other white knights and females came to his rescue, but that brave poster wasn't too far off.

The girl didn't come to his dorm room to be consoled and told a series of sweet-nothings. She went there to see if he was going to have the balls to do what she knew he wanted him to do, leave a pool of her fluids on his sheets while his suite-mates jacked off to the sounds of her moans from the other side of the wall.

With his inaction, Cam proved to her that he wasn't THAT dude, so at the end of the day, all he has is this story about that one time he had a girl he liked in his room, running damaged damsel in distress game, and he ran Hallmark game in response and got a hug out of it for his efforts.



I have a strict no compliments policy.

It doesn't make sense for me to go out of my way to pay extra attention to a woman who hasn't invested anything in me. Women can get sweet nothings and kind words from others, but not me, not when it's early in the game and we've established no relationship whatsoever.

If you're the type that dates older women, I encourage you to be "nicer" to them than you would say a college-aged chick, but still no compliments.

Contrary to popular belief, compliments aren't game, and have no place in the initial stages of seduction, if you've been dating a chick for three months, and she's looking good on one of your date nights, feel free to let her know you appreciate her looking appropriately as your date, until then...

Dating: A Woman's Game
Forget whatever you thought about the word "dating". To women, dating is what they do when they go out into social settings with guys who they don't plan on sleeping with and enjoy those settings on those guys' dimes.

There are women out here who are serial daters, they go out with a lot of men, but there's never a plan to be in a relationship with any of those men, and they reserve their bodies for the ones who wouldn't dare take them to Olive Garden to share a bowl of breadsticks.

I've had more than one chick send me a text to let me know she was at "Blah blah restaurant" and if I was hungry, she'd bring me something when she came over after her date. You want to be the guy getting the text, not the guy who doesn't realize he's paying for food for the guy who's actually going to fuck his date.

For you, the man, dating doesn't begin until after you've had sex with the woman. At that point, you can figure she's invested whatever time she has into the relationship with you, but she's also submitted her body to you for your personal pleasure. If after that happens, you still want to enjoy her company in social settings, then you two are dating.

Until then, keep dates cheap and simple, that means don't offer her a try-hard date --if you've ever seen the movie Hitch, Will Smith's first date with Eva Mendes was incredibly try-hard and unbecoming of a so-called player. Furthermore, either make her pay her way or if you don't mind paying, at least make her contribute something to the evening. You can tell her to stop off and get a bottle of wine, a case of Altoids, anything that's needed for your night out. The point is to let her know, through action, that she will be expected to do things for you too and sometimes those things will require her to come out of pocket.

[Akula]

"Breaking news, an attractive woman has likely been told all of her life how attractive she is, the fact that you're telling her doesn't give you a special place in her heart. If anything, it earns you a roster spot on Team Lame next to Captain Thirst."

Truer words have never been written. Yet most guys still don't get it these days, even with all the lame validation seeking on Instagram, Facebook etc. staring them right smack in the face 24-7.

I think a lot of it has to do with young boys and men growing up in single female (or female-dominated) households these days. I know my mom had me pedastalizing every girl on the block, and still would not be against me towards single-moms in their 30s and 40s just so I get married. It's hard to be very self-aware and get rid of that mindset. Doubly so to lose the "compliment game" that many were brought up with (and that actually worked, somewhat, back in old-school days if you did it right).

I guess the other part is the media's mixed or awful messages being shoved down all our collective throats all day, every day & everywhere. Plus men being so much more emasculated and/or not knowing what to do given all the conflicting signals they get and give.

I never compliment unless I'm into one of my relationships and I'm being a bit of a jerk or it's some kind of offhand casual reference that is quickly followed up by a slight joke about some deficiency i.e. push-pull. No need at all to inflate any girl's ego especially today in the crazy women-seeking-constant-validation world we live in. And as "dating" doesn't really start until after the b*ng anyway she should be the one enamoured with you and giving you the odd compliment now and then as you begin to spend more time with her.

Great post.

[Apollo21]

If you play the typical rom-com dating game then you're
just putting yourself in a box.

The ultimate goal is to create real relationships with women
that inspire and excite them. And the real point of compliments is to show
genuine appreciation not a cheesy attempt to get a girl to like you.

Sadly some guys think they have to compliment a girl to get ahead
because that's what they see in movies..and because it does actually work
some of the time. Then again, just about anything will work some of the time.

However It's not what I'd call a formula for success.

[Felix88]

If you disregard their looks I find looking for qualities to compliment women beside their look is hard as fuck (I don't compliment their looks, I just roll my eyes and tease when a broad think she is cute, pretty whatever) since many women have nothing to offer beside their bodies. And I'm speaking about Asian women in Asia here, can't imagine how it is in developed countries.

[jrocker]

I agree with some of this, but I don't agree with a strict no-compliments policy. I strongly believe that almost every woman has insecurity issues, and figuring out those issues and utilizing them in game is a great way to build rapport and connection. I agree that fawning is silly, but if you've played the game well at the initial stages and she is attracted to you and you have DHVed, then getting a compliment from you (in an area where she probably has not gotten many compliments in the past on) is golden for developing rapport.

[Ensam]

(03-28-2015 04:36 AM)jariel Wrote:  

I've had more than one chick send me a text to let me know she was at "Blah blah restaurant" and if I was hungry, she'd bring me something when she came over after her date. You want to be the guy getting the text, not the guy who doesn't realize he's paying for food for the guy who's actually going to fuck his date.

Every now and then I'll buy a chick I'm not fucking dinner because I'm bored and don't mind the company. However, I've adopted the Adam Carolla philosophy on treating people to dinner - you can order anything you'd like but if I'm paying the leftovers are coming home with me.

[jariel]

(03-28-2015 09:27 AM)jrocker Wrote:  

I agree with some of this, but I don't agree with a strict no-compliments policy. I strongly believe that almost every woman has insecurity issues, and figuring out those issues and utilizing them in game is a great way to build rapport and connection. I agree that fawning is silly, but if you've played the game well at the initial stages and she is attracted to you and you have DHVed, then getting a compliment from you (in an area where she probably has not gotten many compliments in the past on) is golden for developing rapport.

The question always lies in what exactly has she done to warrant the compliment?

Her existence and the circumstances surrounding said existence don't warrant your observation, especially considering the fact your observation is likely one that's been noted by a million other guys. When you're trying to come across as different, you don't want to unintentionally remind her that you're really just like everyone else.

For example, when I go out, I never compliment how a girl looks. I expect her to look good. In fact, because we're out, I understand that in that particular moment, I'm seeing her at her absolute best, so what I'm complimenting for? Taking the time to do what I expected her to do anyway?

Here's my problem with complimenters, and why I go against it, complimenters find themselves looking for things to compliment her on, it's also rare for a girl to return your compliment, so you say, "Those shoes are pretty daring for that dress, but it works." She replies, "Thanks."

When women are going to compliment you, they just do it outright, like one may say, "I love your tie." Which is another way of saying, "You look good."

Let them do the fawning and the observing.

You can sit back and judge quietly.

If your goal is to develop rapport, a good vibe based on mutual interest and expressed commonalities over a reasonably extended period of time will achieve that goal, quality women already feel pretty good about themselves, besides their natural insecurities, so if you're dealing with them, you don't have to go above and beyond to lift them up.

[xxMarco]

In my early days I used to compliment women all the time. Wasn't a good look. It was bad game on my part but I didn't know any better.

I had people like my mom, uncle, cousin who had been married for years telling me how to get girls. Maybe it worked for them back in the day but these days compliments get you nowhere and make you look like a bitch.

I only compliment women now in the bedroom or when I get good head.

The last few girls I have dated always complained that I never complimented them.
"You never tell me I'm pretty" type stuff.

[WesternCancer]

The Cam example at face value is beta bitch boy game, but to me if you make some assumptions its butter smooth.

- the comment shows the guy's position and what company he works for, we don't know what site it is or what article he's commenting on. It looks like a normal website so the guy has enough smarts to talk himself up with conventional sappy love shit, and leave out the part where he assfucks her so hard she skips class for two days. He calls her his crush because its sounds better than "my fuck buddy and I"

- above average looks, not scrawny, tall (if that woman is average height), typical bro attire. doesn't prove anything but the probability is higher that hes not completely retarded with women or socially.

- shes in his room listening to him play guitar. No girl whos "just friends" with a guy or using him as an emotional tampon is going to go over to his place at night and hang around. shes going to drag his ass to starcucks and control the frame -- guitar game recognized.

- shes telling him about how they wouldn't work due to her being damaged goods. Shes vulnerable and seeking approval from someone she is attracted to.

- him putting the guitar in her hands is him keeping his frame. He's not endlessly trying to say theres nothing wrong with her. Hes aloof, playing his guitar and calculating his next move. He's leading her and her emotions.

- not sure what to make of her noticing the crack. either she didnt pay enough attention or has never been to his place before or hes never played guitar for her before.

- his compliment cuts right to the bone of her insecurities. it acknowledges she 'looks' broken but there's nothing wrong with that, shes perfect the way she is. aka everything a girl wants to hear.

The guy had been pushing her away too much, she comes over to his place late one night, he plays her guitar, she opens up. He gives her a rare taste of compassion/vulnerability and then fucks her brains out.

[MY DETROIT PLAYAS]

(03-29-2015 12:55 AM)xxMarco Wrote:  

In my early days I used to compliment women all the time. Wasn't a good look. It was bad game on my part but I didn't know any better.

I had people like my mom, uncle, cousin who had been married for years telling me how to get girls. Maybe it worked for them back in the day but these days compliments get you nowhere and make you look like a bitch.

I only compliment women now in the bedroom or when I get good head.

The last few girls I have dated always complained that I never complimented them.
"You never tell me I'm pretty" type stuff.

Secretly they are paying you a compliment. You are separating yourself from the normal protocol. Pretty girls hear it so much they are pretty immune to it anyway. Now you are judging them strictly on the content of their character and what they bring to your life in the way of benefit(outside of their beauty)

Once you are comfortably out of the friend/orbitor zone ie post fucking, a sincere non sexual compliment can serve to further dampen her panties.

When she sees you are a guy who sparingly gives them out, its more meaningful (even cherished). Point is - when it's clearly done at your own behest and not as a means to an end it makes all the difference in the world.

[jariel]

(03-29-2015 01:45 AM)WesternCancer Wrote:  

The Cam example at face value is beta bitch boy game, but to me if you make some assumptions its butter smooth.

- the comment shows the guy's position and what company he works for, we don't know what site it is or what article he's commenting on. It looks like a normal website so the guy has enough smarts to talk himself up with conventional sappy love shit, and leave out the part where he assfucks her so hard she skips class for two days. He calls her his crush because its sounds better than "my fuck buddy and I"

- above average looks, not scrawny, tall (if that woman is average height), typical bro attire. doesn't prove anything but the probability is higher that hes not completely retarded with women or socially.

- shes in his room listening to him play guitar. No girl whos "just friends" with a guy or using him as an emotional tampon is going to go over to his place at night and hang around. shes going to drag his ass to starcucks and control the frame -- guitar game recognized.

- shes telling him about how they wouldn't work due to her being damaged goods. Shes vulnerable and seeking approval from someone she is attracted to.

- him putting the guitar in her hands is him keeping his frame. He's not endlessly trying to say theres nothing wrong with her. Hes aloof, playing his guitar and calculating his next move. He's leading her and her emotions.

- not sure what to make of her noticing the crack. either she didnt pay enough attention or has never been to his place before or hes never played guitar for her before.

- his compliment cuts right to the bone of her insecurities. it acknowledges she 'looks' broken but there's nothing wrong with that, shes perfect the way she is. aka everything a girl wants to hear.

The guy had been pushing her away too much, she comes over to his place late one night, he plays her guitar, she opens up. He gives her a rare taste of compassion/vulnerability and then fucks her brains out.

I think your assertion requires jumping through too many hoops just to connect dots that aren't even there, I'm not sure how you arrived at it, and I don't think there's a need to break too many of your points down but he is/was an administrative assistant at Lenovo, which sounds like he makes copies and picks up lunch for the DMs, so I'm not sure what you gleaned from that information, anyway, it's pretty clear he didn't smash, here's his response to the poster who called him "gay":



Again, my problem with wannabe complimenters and "smooth talkers" is that they're missing the point, when you're constantly looking for the "right thing" to say, you end up saying some shit that just closes the pussy doors shut. Sometimes, women don't want or need you to say something that makes them feel better, they need you to just act. Broken bitches are broken bitches, there isn't anything you can tell a broken bitch to fix her, if she doesn't want to fix herself, she's not fixable. Notice how she brought up the fact that she's broken to disqualify any idea of there being a relationship between the two, there's no information that says that's now his chick, or that he hit it, just that she thanked him for being there and gave him a hug.

I'm going to take that at face value, sometimes give credit where credit is due, but if you find yourself having to translate everything to find a way to give credit, then there's not really any credit to be given.

[Iso]

A girl tells you that she is broken, what is the player response to that assuming you want to fuck her right there?

[Ingocnito]

(03-29-2015 07:43 PM)Iso Wrote:  

A girl tells you that she is broken, what is the player response to that assuming you want to fuck her right there?

I see that as you might suspect, it's an open door IOI invite which will inevitably be laden with shit tests and levels of LMR to break through, unless she's already in heat.

My response might be smartass like:"Good, let's see how many pieces there are."

Whenever a girl has told me she's broken, for whatever the reason, either that first encounter, or the 2nd, we're having some form of sex.

Also, be prepared to put your listening ears on if things aren't sexualized and escalated when she says it, because usually she's about to download her past story of b.s., which later you'd better be able to reference to escalate comfort, despite the boner-killing hearing her babble sometimes is.

As sick as it might seem, that's one of the best things a girl can tell you if you're looking for the bang.

[Ingocnito]

It's one thing to be charming, another to be a complimenting whore. I think GIO or another vet on here may have covered a piece on how to charm women by simply showing interest in their hardships, and showing you understand their lives trials, on their level, from their point of view. No compliments needed.

If I do give a compliment early on, it's not directly tied to their personal beauty, but rather a choice they've made for the encounter, and never overly descriptive or much interest shown:
"That's a nice dress"
"Matched the ear rings and the bracelet I see"
"You drive a 5.0 Mustang, nice choice"

NOT
"I just have to say, your eyes are so pretty I could get lost in them"
"Your hair is so pretty in that light.."

and ESPECIALLY NOT anything with a "you go girl" encouragement behind it like:
"well you've done so much with your career I can tell you've worked very hard, and nothing will stop you"
"with your looks I can't imagine you have difficulty getting what you want"

^^^ just dump the sands from the hour glass on her pussy if you say that crap.

[jariel]

Ingocnito...

[jariel]

(03-29-2015 10:06 PM)Ingocnito Wrote:  

I think GIO or another vet on here may have covered a piece on how to charm women by simply showing interest in their hardships, and showing you understand their lives trials, on their level, from their point of view. No compliments needed.

Gio is a goddamn beast. I mean I absolutely love his content, he's got an amazing attitude and work ethic, and although I may be a bit younger, we both have a love for the young girls, so I would kick it with him anytime.

If you have a link to that thread, please post it.

[Pride male]

What about complimenting other women while with her?

[Roardog]

Totally agree with Incognito. I'll rarely give a girl I haven't banged yet a compliment but if I do it will be on a choice shes made, not on her looks or some other kind of ego inflation.
For example the other day I went to a BYO restaurant with a girl and she brought a nice bottle of wine so I said "that's a nice wine".

I'm a bit more generous with my plates. One of them has been hitting the gym hard and lost a couple of kg's so I told her arm's looked good. But I see this as positive reinforcement of behavior I want to continue so it's worthwhile.

[jariel]

What we're splitting the difference on is the concept of a compliment versus that of an acknowledgment.

A compliment is something you use to indicate to a woman that there's something about her that draws you towards her.

An acknowledgment is simply an observation of something that's positive.

Compliment: "You look beautiful tonight."

Acknowledgment: "I like those Chanel earrings, you have good taste."

[BlurredSevens]

I disagree a bit with the OP.

Compliments are a major part of my game.

In fact, a girl I banged on Saturday told me that she decided to go on a date with me because "You complimented me on my hair. I put a lot of work into it and and no one ever notices, so I was intrigued by you."

I don't go around telling girls they are beautiful or anything like that, but a well placed compliment can work wonders.

Knowing how to manipulate the girls ego is very powerful, and strategic compliments are one method for doing so.

edit: jariel, I missed your post right before mine. I think we are talking about the same thing now.

[jariel]

(03-30-2015 05:24 PM)BlurredSevens Wrote:  

I disagree a bit with the OP.

Compliments are a major part of my game.

In fact, a girl I banged on Saturday told me that she decided to go on a date with me because "You complimented me on my hair. I put a lot of work into it and and no one ever notices, so I was intrigued by you."

I don't go around telling girls they are beautiful or anything like that, but a well placed compliment can work wonders.

Knowing how to manipulate the girls ego is very powerful, and strategic compliments are one method for doing so.

edit: jariel, I missed your post right before mine. I think we are talking about the same thing now.

Cool, I mean, women want to be complimented, but they want to be complimented by certain men. If you're not one of those men, then your compliment doesn't really matter. The thing is most guys use compliments because they think that it's the compliment that's going to help them get the interaction to where they want it to go. At the end of the day, it's not the compliment that's going to get the job done, it's going to be the other things that come into play in the course of the interaction.

[BlurredSevens]

(03-30-2015 05:31 PM)jariel Wrote:  

Cool, I mean, women want to be complimented, but they want to be complimented by certain men. If you're not one of those men, then your compliment doesn't really matter. The thing is most guys use compliments because they think that it's the compliment that's going to help them get the interaction to where they want it to go.

Exactly, yes, this is where I come back to agreement with you.

I don't compliment because I want to make her feel good or win her approval, I compliment because I objectively like what I see, and I am a person that speaks his mind.

I think that is probably the difference between being charming and confident, and being a cowardly supplicant or a flatterer.

[kaotic]

I'm with team acknowledgement, I'll drop a girl a line about her top or earrings on the first date, you can see their eyes light up, as long as you play it cool.

As with an LTR, i'll drop a line about her lipstick "I like that shade on you" or maybe a sundress "you should wear those more often".

If I do a full on compliment like "well don't you look cute today" and she thanks me I always follow up with a neg of some sort such as "that's your only compliment for the day/month" and tease her.

This is rare, and honestly, if I want to compliment her....I'll just smack her ass in public and won't say a word.

You see it all day on IG and FB dudes who give girl compliments, then guys like us who'll hashtag #basicthings or talk shit. Guess who'll she respond to ?

To be honest I started tuning out girls I know that act like this, especially if I see this shit in person, I can't believe how fucking thirsty dudes are.

[RockHard]

(03-29-2015 02:40 AM)jariel Wrote:  

Sometimes, women don't want or need you to say something that makes them feel better, they need you to just act. Broken bitches are broken bitches, there isn't anything you can tell a broken bitch to fix her, if she doesn't want to fix herself, she's not fixable. Notice how she brought up the fact that she's broken to disqualify any idea of there being a relationship between the two, there's no information that says that's now his chick, or that he hit it, just that she thanked him for being there and gave him a hug.

Yep, she's in the middle of friendzoning him and he validates her. If he really wasn't interested in fucking her, and really was interested in being her friend, then he should have gone Dr. Phil on her: what the fuck is wrong with you and why don't you quit making shitty choices instead of waiting for Mr. Right to come along and love you as you are? But that'd probably be a mistake because she's not interested in fixing herself, she's just feeling bad because she got a rejection and needed an ego stroke. She'll maybe get interested in fixing herself when she's got 2 kids and she's staring at 40 and it's just too damn late.

Broken but beautiful my ass. That crack in his guitar is going to open up some more, it's going to develop this annoying rattle, and eventually the structural integrity will be compromised and it'll be 6 slack strings and a couple useless pieces of wood. Cam sounds like a guy who doesn't know shit about guitars, either.

Jariel, your recent posts are must-read stuff.

[Moma]

Jariel is on point and remember that game advice is very location specific. He is Miami based and Miami is teeming with up to date gold diggers and wannabe gold diggers. If you try to go against his advice WHILE in that zoo, you will not get optimal ROI on a seasoned 305/786 lizard. I speak to <insert family member> there and there is an absolute consensus on what J is spitting. Where I am, however, I don't have to be as cold blooded. This means, it's location specific (as with every piece of advice). However, for North American lizards, it's a great rule of thumb.

Glossary:

305/786: Miami area codes