[CleanSlate]

So I've been thinking I'd create another stream of income (other than my job) by creating an app and selling it for a dollar via app stores for iphones and androids.

I don't have an idea yet, but I know C and a few other programming languages. So I'm sure I can put those skills to good use outside of my job and make some money.

Has anyone ever done this and made enough money to travel comfortably around the world without a 9-5er? Or is more like a $10k-20k per year side gig where you still have to have a job or find another stream of income?

Also, my sticking point with this is that I feel if I've come up with an idea, there's already an app for that...

[Seadog]

My brother made a facebook app about 7 years ago and then used the engine to basically make dozens of copy cat apps.

He's an electrical engineer/programmer by trade, and essentially he made sort of a McDonalds monopoly type engine. Every few hours you get more coupons to open up, you need to collect a set, at which point you would win like a $25 gift card to where ever. Like those games, 6/7 were easy to collect, one was super rare. Now, he also had it set up that if you invite friends, complete offers, like it, you'd get more coupons. The guy who was the brain child behind it knew various marketers, so he was able to team up with them to get money from people doing these offers, then he harvested cell numbers, and marketed to them. A little greasy I guess, but if you're getting something (even virtual coupons) in exchange for your phone number, you should know something is up. Then he also introduced the ability to straight up buy coupons which people did. Paying $25 for 1000 chances to win a $25 card. But I guess lots of bored people sitting in their homes all day trying for the thrill of a win.

The first year, the app made like 500k split 3 ways. He piggy backed off the popularity of restaurant games (roll up the rim, McDonalds monopoly etc) but different enough to avoid legal stuff.

The problem was the shelf life of these games was short. Marketing consumes all his time now. Constantly making copy cat games, running promos with better odds, specials on buying coupons, mailing out gift cards etc.

Then a couple years ago facebook changed how these apps deal with money. Essentially any money had to go through fb, and of course they're going to take a nice cut for themselves. Between that, the increased competition, the declining popularity, the fact that the new games he introduces, while making a short term bump can cannibalize the others means he's getting by now, but the gravy train is over.

He hasn't had a real job in like 2 years, and sadly he doesn't have the gumption to travel or really better himself. He's a typical introverted computer engineer, happy sitting around his house with his machines.

[Veni Vidi Pimpi]

I had thought about this too but like Seadog, I am worried the gravy train may be over. Look for benchmarks on how much time it takes to develop and test and app and then maintain it every month. Multiply this by say $20/hr (for your labor) and see how much you need to make for it to be worthwhile.

My perception of current app markets are there are some big hits, a few middle or the roaders, and a lot of dogs. Part of this is you need a lot of downloads to make decent money with ads and people are really not paying for even $1 apps unless it is real special.
This article is a few years old but illustrates the problem:
http://www.flurry.com/bid/88014/The-Grea...droid-Apps

[Spike]

^^ If you don't shoot, you'll always miss.

[CleanSlate]

(03-08-2015 01:13 PM)Veni Vidi Pimpi Wrote:  

people are really not paying for even $1 apps unless it is real special.

See that's the thing I'm concerned about, which spurred me to ask this question. 95% of my apps on my phone are free, and none of them are more than $0.99. The ones that I paid for either have no free version or similar free apps that do the same thing, and I had a very particular need for the purpose/function that it serves.

Maybe I should change the thread title to like "How to monetize programming skills" or something, to broaden the discussion beyond apps.

[H1N1]

I have an app that is also tied to one of the physical products my company sells. My personal opinion is that most apps that are valuable in the next couple of years are likely to be so because they increase the efficiency of every day tasks, or aspects of your life you like to monitor. In my view, this is the real potential of the 'internet of things' - networked devices are one thing, whether it's 6LoPan that wins out or something else isn't really important, but the ability to effectively and efficiently manage basic tasks via your smartphone is where a lot of the immediate potential is in my view, particularly where the hardware itself is either stand alone tech or able to run off your home network.

It's important to understand a few things, in my experience, about the app dev world. Firstly, most, but not all, app developers are actually quite low grade computer scientists. The best guys are drawn to more dynamic and intellectually challenging areas of computer science. That means that the market is largely flooded with quite low grade apps with poor potential for monetising.

Secondly, apps themselves are notoriously difficult to monetise. Think of any major app that has been bought for billions/millions - the only thing they all have in common is that they are none of them profitable. You can speculate as to the psychology of why, but you only need to look across the market to see that the only way people are making money is by being bought out, and to achieve that you generally need large-scale international buy-in to your service. If you just develop another game, or another messenger, there are 10 new ones a day, and you are unlikely to stand out.

In short, my own opinion is that apps are actually a very poor use of any programming skills you may have, unless you are able to offer something of more significant, less ephemeral value, for which the app is merely a convenient interface.

[Crownife]

I'm working on this now. App is out, doing an update to make it self sustainable. Generally, it's going as well as H1N1 described.

But before it's self sustainable, it's got to be advertised like a mofo.

[Alche]

In a few more months I will know the answer to this.. while my app doesn't have in-app purchases, if it takes off its a nice stream of income to live off of.

Ideally you want an app that has in app purchases. Candy crush makes ridiculous figures every day.

[inostranec]

(03-09-2015 01:50 AM)Alche Wrote:  

In a few more months I will know the answer to this.. while my app doesn't have in-app purchases, if it takes off its a nice stream of income to live off of.

Ideally you want an app that has in app purchases. Candy crush makes ridiculous figures every day.

This.. I am working on a couple of apps at the moment too. As fas as I know it doesn't have to be a paid app to make money. It can make money through adds. I know a couple of people who make from 115$-350$ a day from their apps. It depends on the number of downloads and how long are the people using your app.
And I would suggest developing something for android first, while the revenue of an IOS app is 5 times(I am not sure about the number though) more than the android one, there is always a chance of rejection by apple for your app. While android market takes every shit you throw at them. I know an indian who puts a free mp3 downloading app to the market every once in a while until it's deleted because it's against the law but he makes 3k a day. After the app is deleted from the store he makes another one in the next couple of weeks, rinse and repeat.
I am very eager to see what it will bring me as an experience and moneywise in the near future.

[Crownife]

What I'm trying to figure out is how to get a consistent stream of people into the app.

Sure I can advertise for a month, but after that, it either dies or it thrives.
Not too sure what this mainly depends on.

How easy it is to share your app? - Facebook sharing is a viable solution, but it has to be very easy to do this. Front page thing or a pop up?
How good your app is? - No one really...goes out and tells their friends about this cool new app they played...

[weambulance]

(03-08-2015 04:03 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

(03-08-2015 01:13 PM)Veni Vidi Pimpi Wrote:  

people are really not paying for even $1 apps unless it is real special.

See that's the thing I'm concerned about, which spurred me to ask this question. 95% of my apps on my phone are free, and none of them are more than $0.99. The ones that I paid for either have no free version or similar free apps that do the same thing, and I had a very particular need for the purpose/function that it serves.

Maybe I should change the thread title to like "How to monetize programming skills" or something, to broaden the discussion beyond apps.

You could just moonlight as a freelancer, working on other peoples' projects. Yeah, you're not going to become an overnight millionaire, but you have a much better chance of turning freelancing into location independent income than you do of striking it rich with a one in a million app. If a project you freelanced on tanks, well, you still got paid.

If you're freelancing, there's nothing stopping you from trying your luck with an app on the side, anyway.

[Alche]

(03-09-2015 09:03 AM)inostranec Wrote:  

(03-09-2015 01:50 AM)Alche Wrote:  

In a few more months I will know the answer to this.. while my app doesn't have in-app purchases, if it takes off its a nice stream of income to live off of.

Ideally you want an app that has in app purchases. Candy crush makes ridiculous figures every day.

This.. I am working on a couple of apps at the moment too. As fas as I know it doesn't have to be a paid app to make money. It can make money through adds. I know a couple of people who make from 115$-350$ a day from their apps. It depends on the number of downloads and how long are the people using your app.
And I would suggest developing something for android first, while the revenue of an IOS app is 5 times(I am not sure about the number though) more than the android one, there is always a chance of rejection by apple for your app. While android market takes every shit you throw at them. I know an indian who puts a free mp3 downloading app to the market every once in a while until it's deleted because it's against the law but he makes 3k a day. After the app is deleted from the store he makes another one in the next couple of weeks, rinse and repeat.
I am very eager to see what it will bring me as an experience and moneywise in the near future.

While Android does allow you to list your app almost immediately, they do have restrictions. When I first listed my app it got removed and I had to clarify they made a mistake in which they did. I've had to fix a ton of issues and will be relauncing it in a few weeks.

Yeah I know apps don't need in app purchases, but if you make something addictive WITH that you are pretty much set for life. The one thing I know little about is how much money ads generate. I've placed a banner ad in mine but won't know until it is on the market.

Also is anyone experienced in advertising apps? I'm assuming in-app advertising is the best method?

Thanks

Edit: @inostranec, do you know how many downloads they have to be making that per day?

[inostranec]

One of them had 150000 total downloads and other 250 or 300000. But I also know a guy who made nothing from 100000 downloads. It's really important to know how to use ads but don't ask me yet. If the user downloaded it once and deleted after 5 minutes it won't be making money, it should have a usability that they come back every now and then.

[Alche]

(03-10-2015 12:51 AM)inostranec Wrote:  

One of them had 150000 total downloads and other 250 or 300000. But I also know a guy who made nothing from 100000 downloads. It's really important to know how to use ads but don't ask me yet. If the user downloaded it once and deleted after 5 minutes it won't be making money, it should have a usability that they come back every now and then.

ok thanks. Also what are your thoughts on ads that obstruct the app versus cleanly placed apps that aren't in the way of any features?