[Dalaran1991]

Every fucking time I read a WIA's long post:

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(01-24-2015 04:06 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

(01-23-2015 06:51 PM)General Mayhem Wrote:  

I think that if your SMV is high enough, no girl is going to put you on the back burner. I'm sure any guy who has been around long enough notices that the higher your SMV gets the more girls there are willing to drop everything for you.

LOL

This is part of the problem with the SMV metaphor.

But let me pose it a different way.

Has a player ever banged better man's girlfriend or wife?
Taller, Richer, More Social, More Famous? Whatever mix of factors thought to affect SMV?

I have. Plenty of players have. Something that shouldn't happen does happen, and happens frequently. It's not an aberration, but reality fucking up the theory.

Good stuff both by Cobra and by WIA here.

SMV is all good and well, but all that this does is prevent a woman from blowing up a marriage in most cases if it's 2+ in difference.

That does not mean that she won't cheat on you if she is a slut, goes out non-stop and "needs" her girls' night out.

That also does not mean that she won't do something stupid as WIA has put it.

Over time I have become quite good at assessing those female traits mostly through my intuition. I could tell you very quickly which woman I know well would give you more shit-tests, make your life more difficult, has a tendency to cheat if the circumstances are right etc.
It is similar to how I can actually assess a Player, a guy who will cheat on a girl etc. - there are some excellent signs and they are not hard to miss.

The wolf recognizes his kind and the wolf also recognizes an easy prey. Paradoxically the wolf is also the best one when assessing a hard-to-get prey - a woman who is LTR-worthy.

Also - women are essentially war-widows - they are emotionally driven creatures of opportunity. SMV are useful for LTRs, but only to a degree.

I also realized recently that the male attraction scale goes to 12. Leo DiCaprio is a male 12 for whom fame has catapulted him to such heights, that he can have a Royal Harem of 10s (wealthy super-models in their prime). Thus even a male 10 is not invulnerable. And frankly even a male 12 can be cheated upon if the time is right and a strong guy with Game approaches her at the right time.

[CactusCat589]

I think this question can't be asked without understanding the legal aspects.

The way I've always seen it is that LTRs, with the toxic combination of laws and judicial bias in favor of all women, impose artificial handicaps on the player. Pretty significant ones too.

Outside an LTR, you can go scorched earth and erase trace of a bitch from your life and move on to the next one. Just give her radio silence, delete her number, done.

LTRs are obviously a sliding scale. What I'm talking about is a circumstance where you and the girl are living together, thereby subjecting yourself to cohabitation laws where you can get kicked out if you live in the wrong place. At the extreme end, there's marriage. It's like you're Argentina but now Messi isn't allowed to play for you.

Women know they have the advantage in LTRs. They know you can't make a clean break and run for it, so they can and will exploit this ruthlessly. It's like a chessmatch where before, you were sweeping her in <10 moves. In a real LTR where the conditions are met that she actually has some measure of legal control over you, she gets to move twice for every one of yours.

So LTRs require you to actually be a better than just a good player. The average American male is pretty under-repped. They lock down or get locked down by plenty of pretty women, but the morass of feminist laws raises the bar to an unnatural degree, and it's disastrous when they start settling down.

[Onto]

(01-24-2015 04:06 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

End up asking the age old question, how to keep a woman happy?

Maybe the question should change, how does she keep me happy?

Or better yet, why would I ever associate happiness with a woman?

Well that last one might be too jaded...

WIA

Actually that last one is a great one and in my opinion, the most important. I think it's a question a man arrives too after he's been through it all and is through with it all.

There's a saying, "Love is life's greatest teacher, because it's lessons are the most harsh." If you don't know your lover well, life will punish you most severely. ~ Mark Dillof , "Awakening with the Enemy"

LTR's, as many posts here have mentioned, are a way of learning about yourself, the others, and life in general. Is it the only path towards self-knowledge? No, but it's very popular.

Will an LTR test your frame/game? Absolutely, like nothing else. Especially if you're the adorer in the relationship. Is this a good thing? Sure, it's not a bad thing, other than the constant testing to see if you can walk the tight-rope of maculinity in it's relation to a woman and there are rewards for doing it well.

LTR's, more than anything else, are founded on individual modes of being that just mesh perfectly with one another for that period in thier respective lives and self-development. Ever see a couple walking down the street legitimately "in love" and say to yourself, "What is he/her doing with them?"

Their modes mesh. We can try and rationalize at a distance that he must be a sugar daddy or she must be kind, cook well, and give amazing blowjobs, but it's really more than that and one would have to know them and their history to know what it was.

General Mayhem said, "Women are the ultimate mirrors whether you like it or not." Well spoken.

Reminds me of when Joseph Campbell said, "Instead of picking the moat from the other's eye, pluck the beam from your own". Carl Jung called it projection. When we cast our own shadow/dark side onto the other in order to fault it and/or fix it, so we don't have to do it within ourselves. This is not specific to one gender, both men and women do it. It's a fundamental part of the human psychology.

The person we are most serious about are often both everything we loath about ourselves and everything we lack in ourselves. Isn't that the perfect combination? The perfect compliment? True love? It's been said the things we fall in love with are the very things we hate and try to change about them later on.

So to make the most out of every LTR one should be asking themselves all the while, "What is about her I find attractive?", "Is that thing something I lack in myself? Or something I loath about myself?"

This kind of questioning can take all the fun out of an LTR though, but I think it's better to gain self-knowledge, than stay asleep.

I attached a sketch I bought many years ago made by a Japanese artist in San Francisco (so I was told). Notice how much bigger the man's arms are (representing action/leading). I wonder if the arms would be as big if a Western artist had sketched it.

I keep it with me as a reminder, because when you feel "the love" it's easy to fall asleep from Cupid's arrow and just forget.

[General Mayhem]

(01-24-2015 05:31 PM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

(01-24-2015 04:06 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

(01-23-2015 06:51 PM)General Mayhem Wrote:  

I think that if your SMV is high enough, no girl is going to put you on the back burner. I'm sure any guy who has been around long enough notices that the higher your SMV gets the more girls there are willing to drop everything for you.

LOL

This is part of the problem with the SMV metaphor.

But let me pose it a different way.

Has a player ever banged better man's girlfriend or wife?
Taller, Richer, More Social, More Famous? Whatever mix of factors thought to affect SMV?

I have. Plenty of players have. Something that shouldn't happen does happen, and happens frequently. It's not an aberration, but reality fucking up the theory.

Good stuff both by Cobra and by WIA here.

SMV is all good and well, but all that this does is prevent a woman from blowing up a marriage in most cases if it's 2+ in difference.

That does not mean that she won't cheat on you if she is a slut, goes out non-stop and "needs" her girls' night out.

That also does not mean that she won't do something stupid as WIA has put it.

Over time I have become quite good at assessing those female traits mostly through my intuition. I could tell you very quickly which woman I know well would give you more shit-tests, make your life more difficult, has a tendency to cheat if the circumstances are right etc.
It is similar to how I can actually assess a Player, a guy who will cheat on a girl etc. - there are some excellent signs and they are not hard to miss.

The wolf recognizes his kind and the wolf also recognizes an easy prey. Paradoxically the wolf is also the best one when assessing a hard-to-get prey - a woman who is LTR-worthy.

Also - women are essentially war-widows - they are emotionally driven creatures of opportunity. SMV are useful for LTRs, but only to a degree.

I also realized recently that the male attraction scale goes to 12. Leo DiCaprio is a male 12 for whom fame has catapulted him to such heights, that he can have a Royal Harem of 10s (wealthy super-models in their prime). Thus even a male 10 is not invulnerable. And frankly even a male 12 can be cheated upon if the time is right and a strong guy with Game approaches her at the right time.

This is a great topic of discussion.

In my original post I meant to say that if your SMV is high enough you won't be subjected to a lot of the petty bullshit and flakiness that a lot of guys here complain about.

Beyond that it gets a lot more complicated, as you gents have pointed out.

The wolf analogy is very fitting.

I think after a while in the game there are a lot of women that you know you could never date, despite looks or a great personality. You know the kind of girls who have cheated on a 4 year relationship with you.

Some of those girls are sweethearts to an extent.

A few years back I was banging a girl who had a boyfriend of 4 years that was a basketball stud at another school. I had this broad whipped, doing my laundry, cleaning my room, she would wait for me to get dinner wither her every night.

Seems like a cool chick right?

The dark side of it was when we would be banging and he would call her, she would literally hop off my dick, talk to him for a few minutes, then come hop right back on.

You bet your ass I would recognize a chick like that again.

Once you have been involved with shit like that it's hard to believe that it couldn't happen to you.

SMV isn't enough.

The best you can do is to find a girl worthy of an LTR. Even then, she is still a woman.

[General Mayhem]

Update:

Experiencing the shitstorm that will happen when you are blackout drunk at 2 am and your girl decides its a good time to get mad at you for having side bitches is an excellent test of frame.

Having a crying girl on your hands is like diffusing a bomb.

Crying is probably the ultimate shit test.

[Dalaran1991]

(02-05-2015 01:00 PM)General Mayhem Wrote:  

Update:

Experiencing the shitstorm that will happen when you are blackout drunk at 2 am and your girl decides its a good time to get mad at you for having side bitches is an excellent test of frame.

Having a crying girl on your hands is like diffusing a bomb.

Crying is probably the ultimate shit test.

No shit.

I remembered one night my ex didn't want to help sex so I was wrestling her around. Then she started sobbing and tears were running like a dam breaking.

I'm a heartless motherfucker but something like that just stops me dead in my track looking dumbfounded. I felt really guilty. Normally if a girl was crying because she was mad at something stupid I would just laugh and walk out, but when a girl is crying because you are clearly doing something to her, Jesus man I just can't.

I guess I'm still human.

[Pride male]

I would like to add, choosing a mate for a LTR is also a major test of your game.

[kaotic]

(02-05-2015 01:00 PM)General Mayhem Wrote:  

Update:

Experiencing the shitstorm that will happen when you are blackout drunk at 2 am and your girl decides its a good time to get mad at you for having side bitches is an excellent test of frame.

Having a crying girl on your hands is like diffusing a bomb.

Crying is probably the ultimate shit test.

Yup had that happen to me last week, we just got past 1 year of knowing eachother.

I've never been in a fight with my main the entire year we've dated. Not even a petty argument.

She smokes outside with an old dude, then gets a drink and a kiss on the cheek inside from this guy.

So naturally being territorial, I close my tab and collect myself and walk outside without saying a word.

Then she follows me outside asks why, I calmly call her out describing what she did, that she insulted me in front of my friends, it didn't matter if he was old or young, she storms off and away from the car, I command her to get her ass back here and get in the car. I asked how she would of felt if a woman did that to me.

She said she would of fought the girl. Case closed.

She started balling her eyes out and said beggingly please don't leave me.

We got food after, passed out and never ate it, and I fucked her in the shower in the morning.

I warn her on the way to her car, to NEVER pull that shit ever again or we're done. She gets this sad puppy face look on her face and apologizes. She said again I really hope you don't leave me.

She felt bad the entire day, dread game and a solid frame extinguishes any sparks of falling out of line.

[Travesty]

^ Never trust that chick. Never.

[zombiejimmorrison]

(01-24-2015 08:24 PM)CactusCat589 Wrote:  

I think this question can't be asked without understanding the legal aspects.

The way I've always seen it is that LTRs, with the toxic combination of laws and judicial bias in favor of all women, impose artificial handicaps on the player. Pretty significant ones too.

They lock down or get locked down by plenty of pretty women, but the morass of feminist laws raises the bar to an unnatural degree, and it's disastrous when they start settling down.

Yes. This is the missing piece about LTR's in the West. You can't look over this crucial point. It's both a blessing and a curse, depending on how you see it, player culture wouldn't exist if most girls are getting into LTR's early. Its definitely a test of game in the West.

LTR's for the most part are easy and mostly entered to have children, women pair bond after they lose their virginity, they can really be happy with their first even if he is a supplicating beta. This hook up culture exists in overdrive right now, it wouldn't be to this extent if the laws were not against men and in favor of women. They have freedom without consequence, its a very unnatural state.

If you have a kid or two with a woman, and she doesn't have the safety nets of child support, alimony or social welfare. She'll put up with a lot first before she even considers leaving, let alone entertain her hypergamy. Add in her virginity and pair bonding, its a walk in the park. Not much need for game knowledge, but with game its fail proof.

[kaotic]

(02-05-2015 07:51 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  

^ Never trust that chick. Never.

I never fully trust any girl dude.

Why do you think I'm constantly gaming and banging on the side ?

She was at the bar already when the old man walked up to her and got her a drink.I don't think she expected that dude to kiss her cheek.

We were both pretty drunk, emotions were a bit high.

I've had a girl completely flirt with me in front of her twice. She got riled up haha.

White she HAS earned alot of trust, she's pretty damn submissive to me, I've got very strong frame, I know she loves me, she really is a genuine nice girl, BUT I'm not stupid to where I'd put all my eggs in one basket.

[SouthernCasanova]

Yes and no. You're enduring constant gaming or you'll end up getting fucked due to slipping and becoming complacent; You have a sort of "care-free" zone if you game a bitch effectively for a few months, resulting in her trying to get you back to Alpha state if you fall off. If you're just a outrageously good-looking bastard, and the girl is about 1-2 or 3 (Not sure why you'd do a shitty thing like commit to a 6 if a 9) points below you in SMV, your game is getting eye-fucked by bitches everywhere.

[General Mayhem]

(02-06-2015 12:48 PM)kaotic Wrote:  

(02-05-2015 07:51 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  

^ Never trust that chick. Never.

I never fully trust any girl dude.

Why do you think I'm constantly gaming and banging on the side ?

She was at the bar already when the old man walked up to her and got her a drink.I don't think she expected that dude to kiss her cheek.

We were both pretty drunk, emotions were a bit high.

I've had a girl completely flirt with me in front of her twice. She got riled up haha.

White she HAS earned alot of trust, she's pretty damn submissive to me, I've got very strong frame, I know she loves me, she really is a genuine nice girl, BUT I'm not stupid to where I'd put all my eggs in one basket.

The biggest downfall I see my friends making right now is that they are leaving themselves without any options.

I trust my girl a fair amount but I won't stop spinning plates.

[Distant Light]

Don't want to talk about this type of stuff but LTRs are MAINLY about self-discovery...

Any needy guy can get himself in a relationship whether he manipulates his way or is just "spam approach". The thing is "choose" from a place of abundance and when it's made the ability to to see yourself in new aspects as a result of the relationship. Being how I am it's very "alien" to hear about guys in bad/horrible relationships because it begs the question "how did it even begin?"

I always jokingly tell people I'd need to know a chick for 1-3 years in a wide range of circumstances to even consider such a thing...

Realistically though I understand I'm not built for relationships, I've had tons of girls mention they want a relationship BUT because I don't believe in monogamy their willing to just have sex...Thing is I tend to like too many different types of women, the variety of personalities is very refreshing. (As they show different aspects of myself)

Add to the fact that I like BEING ALONE I've only brought 2 girls home to my actual place both times once morning hit I was thinking "Damn now I want my alone time".

[General Mayhem]

(02-07-2015 01:11 AM)Distant Light Wrote:  

Don't want to talk about this type of stuff but LTRs are MAINLY about self-discovery...

Any needy guy can get himself in a relationship whether he manipulates his way or is just "spam approach". The thing is "choose" from a place of abundance and when it's made the ability to to see yourself in new aspects as a result of the relationship. Being how I am it's very "alien" to hear about guys in bad/horrible relationships because it begs the question "how did it even begin?"

I always jokingly tell people I'd need to know a chick for 1-3 years in a wide range of circumstances to even consider such a thing...

Realistically though I understand I'm not built for relationships, I've had tons of girls mention they want a relationship BUT because I don't believe in monogamy their willing to just have sex...Thing is I tend to like too many different types of women, the variety of personalities is very refreshing. (As they show different aspects of myself)

Add to the fact that I like BEING ALONE I've only brought 2 girls home to my actual place both times once morning hit I was thinking "Damn now I want my alone time".

I definitely agree on the self-discovery thing, especially once you understand the red pill, know that "the one" is a myth, and that monogamy isn't the only way to live.

Like I'm in this relationship but I would probably go nuts if I wasn't spinning plates on the side. The personality of one girl isn't enough. She fulfills some needs but I have a dedicated side piece that I have an entirely different relationship with.