[Parlay44]

(12-14-2014 07:57 PM)bigbait Wrote:  

(12-14-2014 07:42 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

I'm telling you this from experience. All the best programmers are self taught.

It is true that many great programmers are self taught, but it also true that the majority of the worst programmers are self taught. Most self-taught programmers are not employed as programmers because they are not good enough.

It is also true that any great programmer in the sense that they have only learned .01% of what they know from any schooling, bootcamp or university.

(12-14-2014 07:42 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

Save your money and buy a book. Read through it 10 times.

No one becomes a great programmer without reading countless books, blog posts, journal articles and code written by other people.

I've come to learn that being a good programmer is about building your own private code base. You basically copy and paste and steal from yourself. You create kind of a universal template that you can reuse and tweak as you go along.

[bigbait]

(12-04-2014 09:57 PM)swishhboy25 Wrote:  

Hey y'all, I had a brief question about all you software engineers / people working in tech. Can't thank frenchcorporation's http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-26260.html thread enough.

Another thought on this - the path to getting an internship is very different from the path to getting entry level job. Without relevant coursework the most important part of getting the internship is piquing the curiosity of the people screening your resume and the interviewers. What you want to do is make one or cool demos of something that people can see - something graphical. The first reason is that this is always more engaging to play with something interactive, the second is that the people remember better what they can see. You can get away without any backend component of a demo that wows someone. By the way, if you focus on this route, don't make a game. It will seem immature (even though it isn't)

[elabayarde]

Go to the Minneapolis re-employment/workforce, center....they are free there.

[DumbfromBirth]

Great advice parlay. It might seem obvious to some but I unrealistically expect to learn everything first time round. Been teaching myself css and dabbling in xcode while my phone apps being developed. Time to go over the stuff 2 3 4 times and see where im at and if it starts flowing more naturally.

[birthday cat]

Has anyone complete one of these bootcamps or worked with someone after they completed a bootcamp?

I've been advised that it takes 6 months to 1 year to get someone ready for an entry level programming position. The bootcamp might only be 3 months but it takes a newbie 2 to 3 months to prepare for the bootcamp and people need another 3 to 6 months of practice or an internship before they are really ready to be an entry level programmer. Do you guys agree?

The cost of the bootcamp is not a concern for me as I'm not going to the bootcamp myself. I'm working with some people that may hire bootcamp graduates.

[CookieDough]

(12-14-2014 08:13 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

I've come to learn that being a good programmer is about building your own private code base. You basically copy and paste and steal from yourself. You create kind of a universal template that you can reuse and tweak as you go along.

How do you access your code base? There are a lot of possibilities. Github, Pen drive, Web sharing sites like dropbox.

[HermeticAlly]

I went to a three-month bootcamp about 1.5 years ago. I'm fluent in self-taught Japanese but had never done any programming. I did really well and got a gig with a big company about two months after I graduated. I've been at my job ever since and really enjoy working there as a developer. To me it's just a job and I never code anything in my spare time, but my employer has the resources for me to advance my learning/abilities on the job, and I've spent some time learning CS concepts that weren't covered in my course. However, in practice, that stuff doesn't come into play in my work real often.

I had a great experience and huge ROI, but I think that I'm on the upper end of outcomes. There were 1 or 2 other students in my class who were better than me, but they got lower paying startup-y jobs that are way more demanding workplaces. On the other hand their skills have probably improved faster than mine.

[fiasco360]

Finished my MS in mechanical engineering, still considering going this route. The current market for my degree is medicore at best and starting salaries are equal of not slightly worse for me.

[Tigre]

(03-24-2017 12:20 PM)birthday cat Wrote:  

Has anyone complete one of these bootcamps or worked with someone after they completed a bootcamp?

I've been advised that it takes 6 months to 1 year to get someone ready for an entry level programming position. The bootcamp might only be 3 months but it takes a newbie 2 to 3 months to prepare for the bootcamp and people need another 3 to 6 months of practice or an internship before they are really ready to be an entry level programmer. Do you guys agree?

The cost of the bootcamp is not a concern for me as I'm not going to the bootcamp myself. I'm working with some people that may hire bootcamp graduates.

From the just released Stack Overflow developer survey:

Quote:

What Kind of Learning Do Developers Recommend?

Take online courses 64.7%
Buy books and work through the exercises 49.9%
Part-time/evening courses 31.9%
Contribute to open source 31.5%
Bootcamp 22.4%
Conferences/meet-ups 22.3%
Return to college 21.3%
Participate in online coding competitions 15.3%
Get a job as a QA tester 14.3%
Participate in hackathons 11.7%
Master's degree 11.2%
Other 10.0%
None of these 2.6%

23,568 responses; select all that apply

Want to learn to code but don’t know where to start? More developers say you should take an online course than any other method, followed by getting a book and working through the exercises.

If I was interviewing, I'd respect a self-taught guy with verifiable skills more than I would respect a boot camp graduate.

Ideally you would want someone who has been working a long time in that career because they enjoy the job. The difference in productivity between a talented developer and a mediocre one is multiples.

[birthday cat]

^ I wonder if bootcamps scored low because they surveyed developers with experience and bootcamps are usually for beginners. However, I agree that online courses are probably the best option. The guys I work always want to see projects that a developer has worked on independently when they interview them. Anything a developer creates in a bootcamp is something he had help with so it might not represent his true ability.

[puckerman]

I took one class back in 1997. It was a total waste of money. Your best bet is to get out and build a network if possible.'

Also, try writing some programs yourself so that you can show them to anyone who wants to see them. Build a demo-reel, so to speak.

That being said, IT is a vastly overrated career field. Most people get out of it in a few years.

[roid]

(12-14-2014 05:50 PM)TopPanda Wrote:  

A word of encouragement - NONE of the best guys I have worked with have majored in IT/compscience. The best guy I ever worked with majored in English.

The best guys are always from Comp Sci. Do not be misled. There is a reason why Google seldom hires its top engineers from non Comp Sci background.