[Gosh900]

Which is the best way to game girls in those countries?
In my country and in lots of other places in the West asshole game is the way to go if you wanna be successful with girls.
I didn't have much of success before I discovered the pick up community because I was a bit of a chode and too much beta.
Now I'm way more assertive and "asshole" and girls, here in Italy, respond way better to me! I'm not a playboy, but I have an adequate sexual life.

The question arises because I have the feeling that east european girls respond to another kind of behaviour.

My first insight of that go back to when I was 18yo.
I was in New York City attending an english course and in my class there was a stunning 18yo russian girl originally from Kaluga (then moved to Moscow).
Back then I didn't know how to pick up chicks and I was beta as fuck with crippling approach anxiety.
I wasn't a virgin because luckily I'm kind of a good looking guy so I managed to be engulfed in a relationship but I didn't have any experience regarding how to deal with girls.

The teacher of that school was a dork.
He made us doing really awkward things such as acting in front of the entire class, go outside and asking people for money to donate to a charity, ask random people to have a picture with us and shit like that because he thought that the best way to learn english was to speak it.
So far so good.

One day, though, he made me perform a really weird shit in front of the entire class.
He picked me and that russian girl and he told me to approach her, he said: "how would you approach a girl? Let's say you two are in a club..."
I was shocked. I didn't know what to say.
I tried to babble something like: "I would ask her to dance, buy her a drink and invite her at my table" (looooool) but he was a real jerk because he wanted more and more.
The girl didn't look shocked though, she just smiled. Probably in Russia they are accustomed to shitty approach.

Anyway, with time we connected more.
On one of my last days in the school while I was checking my facebook during a break she asked for my facebook. I gave it to her.
On the last day we greeted each other warmly but nothing happened.

Then I went back in Italy (it was mid September).
I thought all was finished with this girl but it turned out that I was wrong.
In November, without saying nothing to me, she came in Italy. Not a tour of all Italy, just one city: Milan which is the city where I live and since there isn't much to see in this city compared to others I interpreted that as a proof that she wanted to meet me.
There were two problem though:
1) I wasn't in Milan in the week she came (it was holiday in Italy)
2) I was still a complete beta who was afraid to even ask her something on facebook about her travel (I knew she was in my city because she posted lots of pictures on her facebook and instagram)

That's pretty much all for now. There wasn't an happy ending with this girl because I never had the guts to contact her (more of my feelings for her a bit later on in this topic)

I had other experiences with FSU girls back then (before I discovered the pick community and when I was still a chode). I met them in London, in Amsterdam and even here in Italy.
I'm not going to tell these stories here because otherwise the topic would be too long but, even though nothing happened I connected very well with those girls.

Flashforward to mid 2012: one friend on mine introduced me to the pick up community! As basically everybody did I picked up the book "The Game" and I was left astounded! From there my life changed. I read and watched basically everything on the market related to pick up girls.
I also started going out to pick up chicks with some guys of the italian community and with time I improved a lot.

Then it dawned on me.
If I was getting girls in Italy, who know what I could get in Russia where girls were after me even when I was a total chode!

So, some weeks later, there I was. On a plane headed to Moscow.
I pictured in my mind myself getting threesome and banging girls left and right but that couldn't be more far from the truth.
I didn't have any success. I had some k-close of course but nothing further happened.
The majority of girls were turned off by my attitude and they didn't like when I touched them right off the bat. They yanked my hand away and said: "what are you doing?" giving me the classic look....

I was acting like I did in Italy. I was cocky, a jerk and an asshole. That worked fantastically in Italy and in the West but not so much in Russia.

Months later when I tried the same kind of game in the Baltic countries and other east europen countries I witnessed the same shit.
Girls didn't like that, it looked like I was too aggressive. Maybe they weren't accustomed to that kind of approach. I don't know.

Guys who were way uglier than me, with creepy body language and that were offering drinks left and right had more success than me and my friends!

So, I started to wonder: do eastern european girls respond to another type of game than western girls?

I would like to hear your opinions on that

It appears to me that the best way to game FSU girls is to run nice guy game but with assertiveness in the interaction.

Sorry if I digressed a little, but I wanted to make clear what my background was and how I ended up asking myself that question.

[jimukr104]

Quote:

he majority of girls were turned off by my attitude and they didn't like when I touched them right off the bat. They yanked my hand away and said: "what are you doing?" giving me the classic look....

Nice guy caveman game works but touching tends to work. Maybe you did it in a sexual direct way without minor kino 1st?
Also maybe you were too tanned? Seems they dislike Turks and their aggressive game and Italians can often be mistaken for Turks. If you were with a posse...that might explain a bit.

Also what is your age? If you are young you certainly will have competition from older guys.

[Gosh900]

(09-05-2014 04:39 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

Quote:

he majority of girls were turned off by my attitude and they didn't like when I touched them right off the bat. They yanked my hand away and said: "what are you doing?" giving me the classic look....

Nice guy caveman game works but touching tends to work. Maybe you did it in a sexual direct way?

No, I just did the classic things that has to be done at the start of the interaction to convey a sexual frame
I gently touch their shoulder or hip, I go for high fives, holding hands ecc...

It looks like they don't like it when you do it right off the bat, don't know why..

[Greek kamaki]

Oligarch and money game certainly work in these countries.The girls mainly judge you by your financial assets.They make some exceptions only for Slavs.
With Russian girls you do not need to touch them at all.Everything plays within the conversation.It is like a dance between the two parts and when an agreement is reached she comes to your bedroom.Russians are very byzantine not like catholics.Being a superior individual means you do not have to care for any of her needs regarding intimacy.They pay with the same coin.
Contrary to that in Poland etc you have to touch a lot and the girls like that.They are more affectionate and confused about the West.There is not this step by step agreement.

[OnlyMarryInTajikistan]

I would sum it up like this:

1. You must be alpha. This means you must have all of the alpha mindsets and behave like an alpha, and that implies you will sometimes be an asshole. There is no way you can intentionally tread on eggshells trying to be nice, yet alpha at the same time. It is impossible. You'd be surprised how much shit FSU girls can take, don't think that just because she is sweet she wants you to tiptoe around her. Don't be cocky, but absolutely do not try to be "nice guy".

2. There must be a connection. Especially with the best girls, 8.5s and up, emotional connection seems to mean more to them than to most girls. I am not entirely sure why, but this has been my experience. Especially given their Disney mindset, she wants to feel like she has met her soulmate. This doesn't mean you should verbalize that at any point, but you should try to create that feeling in her mind.

3. Once you create a connection then she has decided she wants you. A poster somewhere on this board said they are very mercenary, either all-in or all-out. Strong yes or strong no. You have 1-2 dates to create this feeling, probably only one. If you make it to the third date, she has made the decision. At this point it is just a matter of waiting until she puts out, keeping in mind why she is holding out. She wants to create a positive perception in your mind. Therefore you must start pushing for sex as early as the second date, breaking down her resistance by "chipping away" at LMR and at her resistance to isolation. This will reduce the time it takes to get the lay, the more no's you receive, the stronger her perception of having resisted, until there comes a point in her mind she has resisted "enough". If you have done your job right, this should come no later than date 5. It can come as early as date 2, but as a rule it will usually come on 4 or 5. If you do not persist, you could be waiting years.

[Gosh900]

(09-05-2014 04:50 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

Oligarch and money game certainly work in these countries.The girls mainly judge you by your financial assets.They make some exceptions only for Slavs.
With Russian girls you do not need to touch them at all.Everything plays within the conversation.It is like a dance between the two parts and when an agreement is reached she comes to your bedroom.Russians are very byzantine not like catholics.
Contrary to that in Poland etc you have to touch a lot and the girls like that.There is not this step by step agreement.

Are you from Greece?
I noticed that FSU girls are way more uncommunicative and taciturn than south european girls.
When I approach an italian girls she open up way more easily (if she is into me of course).
Russian girls, on the other end, aren't so receptive. Sometimes they really kill the vibe with very short answers.
In these case I try to escalate but if they stopped me I don't know what to do and I eject myself.

Also, I'm above-average in the money department but I can't compete with the Moscow guys at the high end clubs.

[OnlyMarryInTajikistan]

(09-05-2014 05:01 PM)Gosh900 Wrote:  

(09-05-2014 04:50 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

Oligarch and money game certainly work in these countries.The girls mainly judge you by your financial assets.They make some exceptions only for Slavs.
With Russian girls you do not need to touch them at all.Everything plays within the conversation.It is like a dance between the two parts and when an agreement is reached she comes to your bedroom.Russians are very byzantine not like catholics.
Contrary to that in Poland etc you have to touch a lot and the girls like that.There is not this step by step agreement.

Are you from Greece?
I noticed that FSU girls are way more uncommunicative and taciturn than south european girls.
When I approach an italian girls she open up way more easily (if she is into me of course).
Russian girls, on the other end, aren't so receptive. Sometimes they really kill the vibe with very short answers.
In these case I try to escalate but if they stopped me I don't know what to do and I eject myself.

Also, I'm above-average in the money department but I can't compete with the Moscow guys at the high end clubs.

You don't need big money to play this game. If you try to go down that route you will get boxed into a category where other men will do better than you, or you will essentially hire a part-time prostitute, as Greek Kamaki admits he often does. That is fine if that's what you want, but I don't think it is.

An Italian girl may be warm to you upon approach but then she will flake on you. You know this better than I do. A Russian girl will be a bit offstandish, but if she is still standing there, she is testing you. She will be silent for about 5 minutes, during which you must "prove yourself" to her. During this time she will throw out shit-tests, which of course you must pass. After you get through this, she warms up to you, will accept the instant date and, quite probably, the date.

Your ROI will probably be higher in the FSU than in Italy, assuming you want relationships. If you don't, go somewhere else, the FSU is for relationships.

[Gopnik]

How long did you stay in Moscow? It seems that you were expecting to get fast sex, ONLs etc but from what other members have written, these are rare in the FSU.

Did you go on dates there? If so, how were your logistics? For many girls the fact that you're a tourist and are leaving soon is often a deal breaker.

I think the problem is that your expectations were to high with Moscow. The general consensus is that these girls are difficult to bang, there isn't a hookup culture like in the west. The reason men go to these locations to meet women is not because you get easy sex from them but because there exists male-female polarity and they have overall better personalities than western girls (plus, the average talent is great of course).

From my experience it's better to tone down a notch your cockiness when you start an interaction. This is also a no brainer if her English is not too great cause she won't get your jokes anyway (or do you also speak Russian?). Once she has shown interest and obviously once the kiss is out of the way, it's fine to go a bit caveman and make her horny. From then on it's logistics and LMR but keep in mind that ONLs are not common.

You may find this article useful: http://www.rooshv.com/3-principal-types-of-game

[rishboy77]

(09-05-2014 05:35 PM)OnlyMarryInTajikistan Wrote:  

(09-05-2014 05:01 PM)Gosh900 Wrote:  

(09-05-2014 04:50 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

Oligarch and money game certainly work in these countries.The girls mainly judge you by your financial assets.They make some exceptions only for Slavs.
With Russian girls you do not need to touch them at all.Everything plays within the conversation.It is like a dance between the two parts and when an agreement is reached she comes to your bedroom.Russians are very byzantine not like catholics.
Contrary to that in Poland etc you have to touch a lot and the girls like that.There is not this step by step agreement.

Are you from Greece?
I noticed that FSU girls are way more uncommunicative and taciturn than south european girls.
When I approach an italian girls she open up way more easily (if she is into me of course).
Russian girls, on the other end, aren't so receptive. Sometimes they really kill the vibe with very short answers.
In these case I try to escalate but if they stopped me I don't know what to do and I eject myself.

Also, I'm above-average in the money department but I can't compete with the Moscow guys at the high end clubs.

You don't need big money to play this game. If you try to go down that route you will get boxed into a category where other men will do better than you, or you will essentially hire a part-time prostitute, as Greek Kamaki admits he often does. That is fine if that's what you want, but I don't think it is.

You don't need "big" money in the FSU but you need money. This is not the West where at 21 year old drunk hottie is more likely to go home with a 25 year better looking young guy with no job then a 45 year old suited up and buying her drinks.
I have never understood the fact that if a guy wants P4P where is no need to go out and game since it is readily available and probably cheaper.
Hell I think 60% of the girls on Mamba are pro's or semi's.

Getting bottle service for instance has it's pro's & con's but it's no different then the locals who buy bottles too.
It's easy to figure out the working girls if your not sure. Escalate quickly with her to you go back to your your place to continue the party in a humorous manner. Kick her & her friends out ASAP if your getting any hint the girls are working.
Works for me.

[Greek kamaki]

(09-05-2014 05:01 PM)Gosh900 Wrote:  

(09-05-2014 04:50 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

Oligarch and money game certainly work in these countries.The girls mainly judge you by your financial assets.They make some exceptions only for Slavs.
With Russian girls you do not need to touch them at all.Everything plays within the conversation.It is like a dance between the two parts and when an agreement is reached she comes to your bedroom.Russians are very byzantine not like catholics.
Contrary to that in Poland etc you have to touch a lot and the girls like that.There is not this step by step agreement.

Are you from Greece?
I noticed that FSU girls are way more uncommunicative and taciturn than south european girls.
When I approach an italian girls she open up way more easily (if she is into me of course).
Russian girls, on the other end, aren't so receptive. Sometimes they really kill the vibe with very short answers.
In these case I try to escalate but if they stopped me I don't know what to do and I eject myself.

Also, I'm above-average in the money department but I can't compete with the Moscow guys at the high end clubs.

The receptivity of Russian girls depends solely on your clothes,shoes and how you carry yourself if you project the image of being relatively wealthy.If they approve of your appearance they make everything easy there is no complication to be met because this is also bad for them.
Whether asshole with nice clothes or nice guy with expensive shoes for the Russian girl it is the same she sees the $$.Moreover the guys who make money in the FSU have all the alpha qualities they maybe bad as hell so she presumes you are the same but it does not matter anyway.
Generally FSU girls are not interested in how you made your money if you are a drug dealer or a plastic surgeon.All they want to see is the liquidity or at least the glimpse of it.

[OnlyMarryInTajikistan]

(09-07-2014 12:36 PM)rishboy77 Wrote:  

You don't need "big" money in the FSU but you need money. This is not the West where at 21 year old drunk hottie is more likely to go home with a 25 year better looking young guy then a 45 year old suited up and buying her drinks.
I have never understood the the fact that if a guy wants P4P where is no need to go out and game since it is readily available and probably cheaper.
Hell I think 60% of the girls on Mamba are pro's or semi's.

Getting bottle service for instance has it's pro's & con's but it's no different then the locals who buy bottles too.
It's easy to figure out the working girls if your not sure. Escalate quickly with her to you go back to your your place to continue the party in a humorous manner. Kick her & her friends out ASAP if your getting any hint the girls are working.
Works for me.

You need money in the sense that you must be of respectable status, but the girl's purpose for seeing you CANNOT be your money. The value you give must never be monetary. There must be some kind of personal value involved. Not only because you don't want a whore using you for your money, but because even if you went down that route you could not compete with the millionaires in Moscow clubs.

[jimukr104]

Quote:

Generally FSU girls are not interested in how you made your money if you are a drug dealer or a plastic surgeon.All they want to see is the liquidity or at least the glimpse of it.

Agree BUT if they want to see money in the liquid form than usually they are whores lol.
Most FSU girls see wealth as a status symbol in the MATERIAL that it buys. That is why they are considered materialistic. FSU people don't save, they spend it all(e.g. good food, cars, cloths, flats).

The guy who just shows a women his bank statement showing a million dollars is going to more likely get the cold shoulder than the guy who is driving a 60k BMW , wearing Armani suits and owns a pimp flat and buying her sushi and cocktails. They make judgement on the lifestyle that the wealth affords NOT the dollar amount accumulated.

But if it is liquidity she wants ..she is a prostitute obviously.

Quote:

I have never understood the fact that if a guy wants P4P where is no need to go out and game since it is readily available and probably cheaper.

Tell me about it..in 2001 you could buy a girl for the same price as 2 value meals at Mc Donalds or a club entrance fee. Sometimes it just made more sense to grab a girl standing at the bus stop lol..who wasn't a regular whore even(STUDENT).


Honestly I don't understand the modern sex tourists in Kiev. I hear the girls demand the same price as FSU chicks get NYC, etc. Seems like they like the adventure of being in a foreign guy looking to sponsor in a foreign country.

That being said...the whole way they set up clubs over there so one must
get a table and bottle service is certainly a drain.

There actually use to be clubs..the top ones and there was no bottle service or tables even. Eric Aisner started most of those clubs but he was pushed out and the mafia type club culture took over. So today you are competing with the wannabe mini oligarchs who want to buy everyone drinks.