[MikeCF]

(07-15-2014 09:08 PM)Vaun Wrote:  

(07-15-2014 05:45 PM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

Naturals come in all shapes and sizes

Why do you think he is a natural? You realize what you know about him is from a book he wrote, right? And that he employed good marketing tactics to sell himself and his image. Nothing exceptional, Ivy league guy gets smart with selling a book. Far from interesting, good at sales and marketing.

Great question. Why is he a natural? Because he wrote a book claiming to have slept with hundreds of women?

Try finding some pics of him online with girls. You won't find many, even though he was supposedly with 100s.

He got crucified on the Opie & Anthony show for being a liar.

[Vaun]

(07-15-2014 09:16 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

(07-15-2014 09:08 PM)Vaun Wrote:  

(07-15-2014 05:45 PM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

Naturals come in all shapes and sizes

Why do you think he is a natural? You realize what you know about him is from a book he wrote, right? And that he employed good marketing tactics to sell himself and his image. Nothing exceptional, Ivy league guy gets smart with selling a book. Far from interesting, good at sales and marketing.

Great question. Why is he a natural? Because he wrote a book claiming to have slept with hundreds of women?

Try finding some pics of him online with girls. You won't find many, even though he was supposedly with 100s.

He got crucified on the Opie & Anthony show for being a liar.

Read Ryan Holiday's book, he goes on and on about how they created his image. Tucker is just a smart businessman, but he is a huckster. Cool stories, but its pretty obvious thats what they are, when his marketing guru openly brags about all of the fake stunts they pulled off and image they created.

[MikeCF]

Tucker Max can't even "hold frame" in an interview with women.

Fast forward to 2:35. This is the man who slept with 100s of women?

[MikeCF]

(07-15-2014 09:18 PM)Vaun Wrote:  

Read Ryan Holiday's book, he goes on and on about how they created his image. Tucker is just a smart businessman, but he is a huckster. Cool stories, but its pretty obvious thats what they are, when his marketing guru openly brags about all of the fake stunts they pulled off and image they created.

Yep. You can tell in this thread who has read Ryan Holiday's book and who hasn't.

Like I said, this is separating the men from the boys.

It'll be interesting to see how this shakes out.

[Abe Lincoln]

(07-15-2014 04:26 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

(07-15-2014 04:21 PM)JJ Roberts Wrote:  

So Sex 3.0 does not and will not have anything to do with the PUA industry either.

How many people did you pay on Fiverr to write reviews for your books?

You have no organic following that I can see and you seem to be following the same business plan that Tucker is following.

Good spidey sense MikeCF. This guy is a total fraud. JJ Roberts (i.e. Lumerie before he got clowned by Moma) also writes his own fake reviews on Amazon. You be the judge:

Fake Review
Another Fake Review
Fake
Another Fake!
Faker
Authentic JJ Roberts Fake
Another Fake
Another Fake Review? Shocking!
Amazing Book .. Says Fraud Roberts!
Lumerie is a Tool and a Fraud

Notice how all of the glowing reviews above sound exactly the same? And how each entralled reviewer reviewed .. Lumerie's books and almost nothing else! Seriously this clown makes up fake names, fake cities where the reviewer is supposedly from and then likes his own reviews. Fraud pure and simple.

And this twit has the balls to say:

MikeCF Wrote:

How many people did you pay on Fiverr to write reviews for your books?

None.

I[f] you read the book you would know that.

For reference, here are a couple real reviews ...

Keepin it Real
Mmm Hmmm
Oh snap

If you change your forum name after getting punked .. and still proceed to hawk your craptastic "book" in your sig line, at least have the common decency let the marketplace decide the merit of your work. This place is the real deal and imo fraudulent dishonest hucksters should be shown the door. We cannot let this place rot from within because every dishonest tom dick and larry thinks he can exploit the forum's popularity to make a buck.

I'm Honest Abe and I cannot tell a lie

[Santoro]

Holy shit. I only saw MG when it had just the landing page.

Went there to poke around and decide for myself. The full blown version is a disgrace

In the 'go deeper' section, the 'improve yourself' page still has the notes from the marketing team. They must have forgotten to update it or something...

Mike, you are right. They are rushing.

[MikeCF]

(07-15-2014 09:28 PM)Abe Lincoln Wrote:  

Good spidey sense MikeCF. This guy is a total fraud. JJ Roberts (i.e. Lumerie before he got clowned by Moma) also writes his own fake reviews on Amazon. You be the judge:

People either forget or perhaps don't know that I'm a licensed attorney who spent years defending accused criminals.

I can spot these guys a mile away.

Speaking of which, you wouldn't believe what I'm currently sitting on.

Tucker is in my sights. If this supposed ally of mine doesn't speak out (unprompted by me), then expect the biggest scandal that has ever rocked this side of the Internet.

Like I said, I am watching this closely.

Anyone who does not fight by my side on this is my enemy, and I will proceed accordingly.

[MikeCF]

(07-15-2014 09:28 PM)Santoro Wrote:  

Holy shit. I only saw MG when it had just the landing page.

Great find!

The "hive mind" on this is going to be too much for Tucker Max and his fancy, six-figure marketing team.

We (or some us anyway) are like the 300. We will destroy them one by one.

[Vaun]

Tuckers hired marketing guru, Ryan Holiday, recently posted this image during July 4th. He's the head of marketing for American Apparel;



Then when there was an outcry of pissed off Americans, he issued this limp wristed weak ass manipulative apology;



The idiots that shop at American Apparel for the poor fitting, over priced clothing probably believed this "apology". Its pretty obvious what it was. I saw the explosion happen live on TV after my 3rd grade class sent letters to the teacher on the flight.

These are the same tactics that were used to promote Tucker Max, from the same minds that created him in the public realm.

In reality he probably didnt make a lot of money from his books, maybe a few million tops. But the fact that people believe this imagery is hilarious.

[Fortis]

Watching Tucker get henpecked on Tv makes me chuckle.

[Vitriol]

Apparently, if you read the shit Tucker Max wrote, he was able to get blasted on a Tuesday night and end up waking up next to a girl who was a runner up for Miss America.

Somehow, none of us on this forum have ever been able to pull anything like that off... I wonder why...

[Tuthmosis]

(07-15-2014 08:58 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

This one is most likely fake: http://www.amazon.com/gp/cdp/member-revi...KGX33ZK23/
Based on the reviewer.

Maybe you didn't pay for a fake review, but you got fake reviewers reviewing your book.

It's very strange that the above (seemingly) fake review uses the term "unfenced relationships"--an unusual phrasing I've never encountered elsewhere--but is directly associated with JJ Roberts/Lumiere around the Internet. He's also really the only guy on the forum who repeatedly uses that string of words.

This all might be easily explained, but I recommend he pursue whoever's tainting his legitimate Amazon's reviews with these obvious forgeries or attempts to discredit him.

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-7931-p...#pid115065
http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-15535-...#pid260801
http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-36468-...#pid736854

[JJ Roberts]

(07-15-2014 09:43 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  

It's very strange that the above (seemingly) fake review uses the term "unfenced relationships"--an unusual phrasing I've never encountered elsewhere

Tuth, I invented the term "unfenced relationships".

The only people who use it are people who have read the book or who know me personally.

I would be surprised to see a review of the book or a podcast interview with me that did not use the term. In fact if the term was not used in a review it would be suspicious.

[Matt Forney]

Tucker has lost. I predict the Mating Grounds will go belly up in six months. Even if they can somehow shake off the bad Google juju that MikeCF has given them, Tucker will have to burn through thousands of dollars in SEO maneuvering to do so. How can he possibly be drawing a profit from the site?

As for everyone who moved to kiss Tucker's ass when he announced his little ripoff site, shame on you. I get it: you want to defend a guy you once thought was cool. I liked his book too. But that was a DECADE ago. What has he done since then to deserve your respect? He released a movie that bombed and blamed everyone but himself, killed a popular forum solely to assuage his ego, released two crappy sequels to his one good book, then narcissistically disavowed everything he ever wrote in a last desperate attempt to stay in the spotlight. Now he's not only robbing you blind, he's spitting in your face while he does it.

Your childhood hero is dead. Tucker has exhausted every bit of goodwill he was entitled to. Time for you to grow up.

And to all the bloggers who thought sucking up to Tucker would help you, has he even linked to a SINGLE ONE of your sites? Thanked you for your efforts? Even acknowledged that you exist? Thought so.

At least Judas actually got paid for his betrayal.

[Quintus Curtius]

^^^^

Scorching, and irrefutable. The manosphere's Zola hath spoken.

[AnonymousBosch]

I'm guessing I'm the one guy who doesn't know who Tucker Max is.

[MikeCF]

JJ Roberts, is this post about you?

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-28071-...#pid533893

Quote:

Well tonight was interesting, it would have been a lot better if 20nation and THC had joined me, but those guys decided to take it easy, which I can understand as they're traveling long term and can't come out every night, which I'm doing. I did however meet the biggest dickhead from RVF I've met so far tonight, you know who you are, under normal circumstances I wouldn't call you out bro, but you were such an ignorant cunt tonight that I have to do this.

I've met a lot of RVF members during my travels, 90% of which have been cool, surely some of the most highly repped members here will vouch for me, I don't make this statement lightley but you're a fucking goof, I tried to engage you in positive conversation but your arrogant ass wouldn't have it. Finally I called you out, outside of the night club that wouldn't let you in because you refused to take off your stupid hat, I told you straight up man-to-man that you have a negative attitude and you were acting like a fucking prick. What did you do at that point? You walked away from me like the little bitch that you are!

Have fun on your upcoming trip to Jamaica and Cuba, I could have given you some solid intel on the former if you hadn't been such an insufferable wanker.

I may elaborate on this later but its after 2, I' drunk and I have an early bus to catch, come at me brah!

Peace, Scotian.

[Samseau]

[Matt Forney]

As for everyone who's arguing "hurr durr Tucker Max is rich and famous why would he care about the manosphere," this is for you.

Tucker Max isn't rich. While he made a fair chunk of change off his first book, it's absolutely DWARFED by the $10 million or so he lost when the I Hope They Served Beer in Hell movie bombed. I'm on my phone and can't provide stats right now, but that film only made about 300 grand at the box office and was barely noticed when it was released on DVD. The movie's failure was so stark it hastened the collapse of Tucker's company Rudius Media, which was already losing money. Tucker himself has admitted to all this.

Both of Tucker's follow-up books, Assholes Finish First and Hilarity Ensues, sold basically nothing. And don't forget how he killed his own forum, which was one of the biggest reasons for his popularity. This is all independently verifiable, look it up.

People also forget how Tucker's rich parents (his dad owns a major restaurant chain in south Florida if I recall correctly) enabled his antics by bailing him out when he got in over his head. You try getting repeatedly arrested without your rich daddy to pay your legal bills and see how far you get in life.

Basically, stealing other people's work is all Tucker has left. He can't go back to writing about picking up sluts now that he's supposedly turned over a new leaf (plus a guy in his late thirties writing about frat boy antics would just be sad). He basically told his fans to go fuck themselves when he killed his forum, so he can't rely on then either. I'm guessing the Mating Grounds came about because Daddy Max was sick of subsidizing his deadbeat son and told him to get a real job.

You've all been had.

[Abe Lincoln]

(07-15-2014 11:55 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

JJ Roberts, is this post about you?

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-28071-...#pid533893

Quote:

Well tonight was interesting, it would have been a lot better if 20nation and THC had joined me, but those guys decided to take it easy, which I can understand as they're traveling long term and can't come out every night, which I'm doing. I did however meet the biggest dickhead from RVF I've met so far tonight, you know who you are, under normal circumstances I wouldn't call you out bro, but you were such an ignorant cunt tonight that I have to do this.

I've met a lot of RVF members during my travels, 90% of which have been cool, surely some of the most highly repped members here will vouch for me, I don't make this statement lightley but you're a fucking goof, I tried to engage you in positive conversation but your arrogant ass wouldn't have it. Finally I called you out, outside of the night club that wouldn't let you in because you refused to take off your stupid hat, I told you straight up man-to-man that you have a negative attitude and you were acting like a fucking prick. What did you do at that point? You walked away from me like the little bitch that you are!

Have fun on your upcoming trip to Jamaica and Cuba, I could have given you some solid intel on the former if you hadn't been such an insufferable wanker.

I may elaborate on this later but its after 2, I' drunk and I have an early bus to catch, come at me brah!

Peace, Scotian.

Bingo. Damn MikeCF you on a roll! This is the very guy. Brown leather cowboy hat worn everywhere. You could search far and wide and not find a less likeable dude.

What about the fake reivews though. I don't know why I should care but it chaps my hyde. All of these "people" Lumerie made up only reviewed one book -- "Sex3.0" -- and wrote paragraph after paragraph extolling its virtues. How stupid does he think we are? Every glowing review, 7 out of 7 found this review helpful, 3 out of 3, etc. etc. Yet the negative ones, 0 out of 4, 1 out of four, etc. Why could this be? Hmmmm ..

The titles of these reviews tell you all you need to know

Astonishing in its clarity, brevity and vision; A superbly crafted book; A philosophical essay of sheer clarity; A guidebook to a new paradigm; A Key To Unlock The Relationship Matrix; Be true to yourself and find freedom; A clear, rational framework of the natural evolution of relationships; A miraculous work. Confirms what I've been suspecting for years ....



I actually have more respect for Tucker stealing peoples stuff than some cream puff making up fake people to fakely praise something that he's selling.

Lumerie should come out and explain how it is these "reviewers" only reviewed one book ever. And why does each review sound exactly the same? And how is it that there are completely separate, different reviews, by the same reviewer, right next to eachother, for the same book -- one review for the paperback and one for the kindle? That makes NO sense. Another "person" writes a 1,000 word essay going through every detail of your amazing book .. and posts no other reviews at all??

C'mon. You are shameless! You are the very definition of a scam artist. Come out and admit you personally wrote all those reviews and that you are a totally unscrupulous and dishonest person.

Sorry for the rant guys but scam artists need to be called out.

[worldwidetraveler]

(07-16-2014 02:05 AM)Abe Lincoln Wrote:  

Sorry for the rant guys but scam artists need to be called out.

9 posts since January 2013 with two of them being on this thread calling out another member.

It seems you don't have a lot to offer besides calling out scam artists.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(07-15-2014 09:18 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

Tucker Max can't even "hold frame" in an interview with women.

Fast forward to 2:35. This is the man who slept with 100s of women?

Nice vid and @Matt F - good info out there. Investing in a crappy movie 10 mio$ while being barely into double-digit-millionaire or even single-digit-millionaire status is just nuts. Actually even investing in a good movie is risky as hell.

At least he will likely inherit his father's chain or can go back and try this career move:

As far as the TV interview is concerned - he wasn't really destroyed. His debate was severely lacking. He was lacking good ammo by attacking feminism, loose morals of girls as the gatekeepers of sex, the reality of college where 80% of girls chase the top 10% of guys while ignoring roughly 60% completely. There are guys there who have asses lined up back to back while almost 50% are completely celibate. Those girls want relationships with the top 5% of guys while ignoring the lower 80%. So what should the top dogs do? Say no to the platoons of sluts throwing themselves at them?

THOSE TV BITCHES WOULD HAVE BEEN DESTROYED by most of the manosphere bloggers here. They would be going off-screen with their ears bleeding. Instead Tucker just laughed, was nervous and did not attack the feminine imperative.

Tucker admitted that he sees himself as a feminist. He never advanced his Game beyond the college level - as most naturals do - they usually get stuck in some behavior pattern if they don't go out often later on. You also have to realize that good-looking tall Naturals don't need much Game - not being too Beta and not fucking it up is enough.

Either way - nice stuff here further destroying the guy trying to build a fake-manosphere-blog. BTW - that Apparel social media error shows that some corporations might even outsource their business to India - cheap online marketing, cheap and numerous online reviews etc. - fucking idiots.

[ElBorrachoInfamoso]

tucker can eat a bag of dicks. He was writing cool shit ten years ago. Shit that it turns out was mostly made up. Now in mating grounds he has created the manosphere's gay cousin. No thanks, no thanks at all.

[runsonmagic]

So I've gotta admit - I was wrong about Mating Grounds.

When it first came out, I wished Tucker well - I figured, the more people helping young men the better. When Tucker said his work was going to be different and he and Geoffry were doing original research I took that statement at face value.

Then they started posting, and I saw phrases like "attraction is not a choice." That's not even ripping off the manosphere, that's ripping off 90s internet marketing pickup products. If Tucker was cribbing material from Rational Male or Heartsie he might actually have a good site, but so far what I've seen is basic evolutionary psych material that manosphere writers have explored in greater depth, and blue pill advice repacked as science.

The podcast was the final push for me. I listened to the episode "what women want." After the terrible female voiced intro, they started talking. Basically everything Geoffry said had me shaking my head. It was the kind of blue pill advice that leaves men frustrated and angry. Geoffry actually listed "kindness" as one of the things women are most attracted to. This is how nice guys are born. Tucker had some intelligent points, but they weren't original points. I could have told you most of them after reading Steven Pinker's work in the 90s. And he never called his co-host on the bullshit he was saying - which seems to be the sites greater problem - lack of teeth. The site basically repeats blue pill tropes with "because science" tacked on at the end.

I think I didn't initially agree with the idea Tucker was stealing from the manosphere because his site looked nothing like a manosphere site. If it did, it might actually be good. He only borrows the safe parts from manosphere writers - D&P's work on testosterone, a little evo pscyh from heartsie and Rational Male, while ignoring all their respective views on dominance, dark triad traits, and the feminine imperative.

Plus, the conclusions are self serving. Tucker said during the podcast, women prefer men with "crossfit bodies" to men who are super bulky and ripped. Okay guy-who-men-his-girlfriend at crossfit.

It's unfortunate, because Tucker has a platform from which he could help a lot of men. I found his books funny, and his early forum was close to this one in many ways. If he'd been brave enough to talk about how his earlier dark triad traits and narcissism contributed to his success with women, or comment on the work earlier manosphere writers had already done, he could have had one of the best podcasts and sites on the net. By playing it safe he's squandered an opportunity.

I don't get any pleasure in hating on him, because I'd truly much rather see him succeed and make a great site that helps men, then see the mediocre and derivative work he's produced. But it is what it is, and it just means the rest of us will have to write the truths others won't.

[Roosh]

7 day ban for Abe Lincoln. Newbies are not allowed to spit drama/hate.