[IshGibbor]

Last night I was flaked on by a girl that told me she wanted to hang out with me and hit a party. Despite calling her and letting her know I was leaving ASAP I got no call/text back. I know she got my calls and texts and still has yet to call me back with why she didn’t come out that night. Come to find out this morning she pokes me on Facebook, ugh..what the fuck man LOL. (I guess she just wanted an ego boost that night, seems the whole game is centered around women's ego gratification..a theory I am developing..more later).

I pretty much don’t give flakes a second chance, got a good amount of prospects in the pipeline at all times so I can send a ho packing easily BUT I am starting to wonder if I am being too harsh. Should I give flakes a second chance? Maybe they can hit me up and try and get me again?I really can’t make myself pursue a girl that has flaked on me though as of right now since I feel that comes off as a little try hard and I don’t want to reward flaking behavior (similar to when you punish the dog with negative reinforcement if they pee on the carpet, you give him or her a treat when they roll over on command).

What are your procedures with flakes?

[IshGibbor]

Alright, she Facebook messaged me saying she was sorry she didn't call but was so tired when she got home. My thing is she should have called me and said she was tired and was not coming out rather then not calling at all. I chastised her for not calling me but was empathetic and realized people make mistakes but she is to not do it again. I told her I'd see her around and left it at that.


I am putting this chick on the shelf. If she wants to make plans with me she can contact me and set something up. I'm moving onto other girls.

Ish

[hydrogonian]

Definitely don't be hard on girls that flake, especially if you haven't been with them in any real way.

Every guy seems to need to learn this through experience, though. I did. There's a lot of "don't put up with bullshit from women" info out there, which largely holds true for girlfriends and women that test you in person.

But it really doesn't hold true for women that you don't have under your thumb and who aren't in your presence (unless she is insulting you). Remember to treat women like 4 year old children when they fuck up. You could get mad, but whats the point? They won't know what they did wrong, or will practice willful ignorance about it, and will just get pissy if you make it a big deal. Talk to and treat them like them like they are your very young daughters. This helps keep the correct frame through a variety of situations.

Being hard on girls that flake = usually no possibility of sex because you will usually get blown off even worse from then on out.

being cool about it even if it was completely selfish = you can still set up a date, meaning that you can still get laid: which is the goal. Also, you passed a "shit test" of sorts in not getting mad, theoretically making the path to the bedroom a little easier. It can actually freak girls out. Usually their flaking makes sense to them, unfortunately, and your getting mad seems completely strange from their perspective.

Of course, all situations vary in the details. Do what you think feels right. But usually getting legitimately mad at women that you aren't yet sexually active with leads to no sex.

Hitting a party isn't too bad of a flake. Its not like she left you waiting at a restaurant for her. Then I'd blow her off, usually. I don't have time for women like that. In this case, just remain positive and present it like you had a great time at the party and that you didn't give her a second thought. If she senses any emotion about it at all, your probably done. If she senses that it didn't affect you, then she might still be interested. Its one of those situations that acts as a shit test, unfortunately.

If you get into a relationship, you can then try to practice a certain amount of behavior modification by getting somewhat strict with her. But not until then.

[wolf]

She didn't want to be put in an uncomfortable position. Her answering the phone and telling you she doesn't want to go would of sounded much worse. Usually guys try to force the woman to go out with them if they catch her on the phone and the guy starts being desperate over the phone because he has her on the line and she saying no. I've caught myself doing this several times, it's very needy behavior.

It is a shit test, but what I noticed is that girls that usually flake on the first date nothing comes good after that, unless of course she is very persistent in rescheduling the date to another day.

[IshGibbor]

Thanks for the replies guys. I will respond when I have more time.

Ish

[IshGibbor]

(01-31-2011 01:48 AM)hydrogonian Wrote:  

Definitely don't be hard on girls that flake, especially if you haven't been with them in any real way.

Every guy seems to need to learn this through experience, though. I did. There's a lot of "don't put up with bullshit from women" info out there, which largely holds true for girlfriends and women that test you in person.

But it really doesn't hold true for women that you don't have under your thumb and who aren't in your presence (unless she is insulting you). Remember to treat women like 4 year old children when they fuck up. You could get mad, but whats the point? They won't know what they did wrong, or will practice willful ignorance about it, and will just get pissy if you make it a big deal. Talk to and treat them like them like they are your very young daughters. This helps keep the correct frame through a variety of situations.

Being hard on girls that flake = usually no possibility of sex because you will usually get blown off even worse from then on out.

being cool about it even if it was completely selfish = you can still set up a date, meaning that you can still get laid: which is the goal. Also, you passed a "shit test" of sorts in not getting mad, theoretically making the path to the bedroom a little easier. It can actually freak girls out. Usually their flaking makes sense to them, unfortunately, and your getting mad seems completely strange from their perspective.

Of course, all situations vary in the details. Do what you think feels right. But usually getting legitimately mad at women that you aren't yet sexually active with leads to no sex.

Hitting a party isn't too bad of a flake. Its not like she left you waiting at a restaurant for her. Then I'd blow her off, usually. I don't have time for women like that. In this case, just remain positive and present it like you had a great time at the party and that you didn't give her a second thought. If she senses any emotion about it at all, your probably done. If she senses that it didn't affect you, then she might still be interested. Its one of those situations that acts as a shit test, unfortunately.

If you get into a relationship, you can then try to practice a certain amount of behavior modification by getting somewhat strict with her. But not until then.

Well, I did have an emotion about it but I gave her a reserved rebuke. Here is what I wrote her.

Quote:

Yeah, not the best thing in the world to not tell someone you are coming out after you say you would. I understand, as a veteran of nine hour shifts for two years, that walking in the door dead ass tired can suck the will to do anything out of you (hence my vodka and xbox nights). That said, I understand mistakes happen.

I'll see you next time.

Ish

I kinda come off as snide initially but did the best I could to empathize (my mind state was how would I tell a friend).

Very good advice here and it is going to help me deal with flakes as they come up. I usually don't get flaked on at all so this was quite a surprise. Oh well, put her on the shelf for a month and try and set something up later on. If I blew it then I'll chalk it up to experience and keep it moving.

Ish

[IshGibbor]

(01-31-2011 03:39 AM)wolf Wrote:  

She didn't want to be put in an uncomfortable position. Her answering the phone and telling you she doesn't want to go would of sounded much worse. Usually guys try to force the woman to go out with them if they catch her on the phone and the guy starts being desperate over the phone because he has her on the line and she saying no. I've caught myself doing this several times, it's very needy behavior.

It is a shit test, but what I noticed is that girls that usually flake on the first date nothing comes good after that, unless of course she is very persistent in rescheduling the date to another day.

Yeah, the girl comes off as very confident so I would be surprised if she was insecure to call me and let me know she wasn't showing up. I've hung out with her before and knew her for a while so definitely not first date type stuff.

Thanks for the reply bro.

Ish

[hydrogonian]

(01-31-2011 09:23 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I kinda come off as snide initially but did the best I could to empathize (my mind state was how would I tell a friend).

Very good advice here and it is going to help me deal with flakes as they come up. I usually don't get flaked on at all so this was quite a surprise. Oh well, put her on the shelf for a month and try and set something up later on. If I blew it then I'll chalk it up to experience and keep it moving.

Ish

I don't think that's bad. You let her off the hook, which is essentially the right move. I'd say your fine, and even managed to send an air of "I know what happened, don't let it happen again" while not coming off as angry. Nice.

I think your strategy for her in the future is good. That's what I would do.

[playa_with_a_passport]

(01-31-2011 09:23 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I kinda come off as snide initially but did the best I could to empathize (my mind state was how would I tell a friend).

Very good advice here and it is going to help me deal with flakes as they come up. I usually don't get flaked on at all so this was quite a surprise. Oh well, put her on the shelf for a month and try and set something up later on. If I blew it then I'll chalk it up to experience and keep it moving.

Ish

Just charge her to the Game Playa, She's Just Not That Into You. And that's perfectly fine, even Jordan in the top of his Game lost a few games here and there. The bottom line is that Girls don't flake on guys they really feeling.

So the answer to your original question is no, you aren't being too harsh in having a zero tolerance policy towards flaking. I operate in similar fashion to how Luminere does. I always assume a chick is going to flake. Thus, I always pick a spot that's close to the tilt in case they flake there's no major inconvenience to me. Also, I am always late on 'em hoes because I don't even bother to start getting ready until she text/calls that she's on her way to the meeting spot.

[IshGibbor]

(01-31-2011 11:00 AM)playa_with_a_passport Wrote:  

(01-31-2011 09:23 AM)IshGibbor Wrote:  

I kinda come off as snide initially but did the best I could to empathize (my mind state was how would I tell a friend).

Very good advice here and it is going to help me deal with flakes as they come up. I usually don't get flaked on at all so this was quite a surprise. Oh well, put her on the shelf for a month and try and set something up later on. If I blew it then I'll chalk it up to experience and keep it moving.

Ish

Just charge her to the Game Playa, She's Just Not That Into You. And that's perfectly fine, even Jordan in the top of his Game lost a few games here and there. The bottom line is that Girls don't flake on guys they really feeling.

So the answer to your original question is no, you aren't being too harsh in having a zero tolerance policy towards flaking. I operate in similar fashion to how Luminere does. I always assume a chick is going to flake. Thus, I always pick a spot that's close to the tilt in case they flake there's no major inconvenience to me. Also, I am always late on 'em hoes because I don't even bother to start getting ready until she text/calls that she's on her way to the meeting spot.

Agreed. I don't think she has written me off just yet but I am not looking for anything from her either. I like your last sentence about not getting ready until they say she is on the way. Girls flake, most of them it seems from what I hear. Fuck it, keep approaching and fill up the pipeline.

Ish

[BR88]

I always give a girl a 2nd chance, especially if I haven't fucked her yet and I really want to. Young girls are just naturally flakey, and it's something you have to deal with.

A month ago, I had plans to go out with a girl for drinks on a Wednesday night. It was going to be our first "date" after I had gotten her phone number. She texted and wanted to postpone to Friday, which I agreed to do (against my own rules). On Friday, she flaked. We were supposed to meet at 7pm, and I texted her at 5 saying "See you at 7 ", but she never responded and she didn't show up at the location.

So I basically wrote her off. But then 3 weeks later (a week ago), I texted her again with something like "Hey, we never got a chance to meet. Are you still up for it?" She responded with 3 texts saying she was sorry and she never got back to me because she was embarrassed, and that she was having a really bad day when she flaked. But we met this last Saturday for a lunch date and it went really well, and we're going to see each other again.

If I had stuck to the hard line, I never would have had a chance with this girl. But now I do.

[Urban Renaissance Man]

(02-01-2011 02:00 PM)BR88 Wrote:  

I always give a girl a 2nd chance, especially if I haven't fucked her yet and I really want to. Young girls are just naturally flakey, and it's something you have to deal with.

A month ago, I had plans to go out with a girl for drinks on a Wednesday night. It was going to be our first "date" after I had gotten her phone number. She texted and wanted to postpone to Friday, which I agreed to do (against my own rules). On Friday, she flaked. We were supposed to meet at 7pm, and I texted her at 5 saying "See you at 7 ", but she never responded and she didn't show up at the location.

So I basically wrote her off. But then 3 weeks later (a week ago), I texted her again with something like "Hey, we never got a chance to meet. Are you still up for it?" She responded with 3 texts saying she was sorry and she never got back to me because she was embarrassed, and that she was having a really bad day when she flaked. But we met this last Saturday for a lunch date and it went really well, and we're going to see each other again.

If I had stuck to the hard line, I never would have had a chance with this girl. But now I do.

That is an interesting turn of events BR88. I've actually had a couple of situations like that myself. There was a girl at work who flaked on me about going on a date. She called the day of and said some emergency had come up. However, she never tried to give me a make up date or anything like that. About 7 months later, I asked her out again. We went out, but it was a bad situation. She wasn't into me, and was acting like she only wanted to be friends. We carried on a friendship for about 3 months, and then I finally 'hit it'. Now, I've been 'hitting it' semi-regularly (when ever I'm in her town). My point is that had I just given up after the first flake or even the second, I would've never hit it. I have at least one other instance where a girl flaked on me or ignored my calls initially, after perservering I ended up hitting it anyway. HOWEVER, The price you pay in lack of esteem and in training yourself to accept poor behavior is simply too high just for some sex. Not only that, when you basically 'wait a girl out', even if you finally end up hitting it she still never really developes the respect for you that is needed to make this situation much fun! You might hit it occassionally, but it's always on her terms, when she wants it, where she wants it and might even cost you dinners, drinks, etc. to secure it! And if you're seeking a meaningful relationship from any of these girls you've allowed to constantly flake on you, forget it! They overwhelmingly will not develope the respect necessary to ever desire you as their true man! Take each situation individually, and decide if it's a legitimate cancellation or just a girl being flakey. (A girl cancelling a date because she's "too tired to go" is 100% unacceptable!) Once you determine that the girl IS being flakey, I can see you giving her one more chance to make up for it after you verbally explain you aren't accepting of that type of behavior. Maybe even making her cook for you on the make up date or something. If it continues even once more, politely kick her to curb!

[bigbootyluvr]

Disagree. Total deal breaker. Why accept her disrespect over you? Be even acknowledging her again you are setting a precedence that it is alright to discard you like a toy, and pick you up when she's ready to again.

Don't settle for that shit. I had one do that to me last week, I promptly went home and deleted her off my phone, messenger, and fb. Gone, done. I will literally never talk to her again.

If you let people waste your time and money, they will. A man should always keep his dignity in tact, even when the entire world is fucking with you. That means never taking any shit from anyone.

[tomtud]

Continuing on this theme..... I am contemplating about purposely flaking on a chick that flaked on me with a lousy excuse.... On one hand, I am thinking why even bother wasting my time and move forward.... let her make plans next time...

Purposely flaking on her.. will it make me more of a catch in her eyes by being aloof? I have to deprogram my way of thinking to go this way.... I dunno..... For example, invite her to a sporting event this upcoming wknd, and wait till the day of,,, she calls and you tell her ohhhhh something came up etc... give her the same excuse.... as stupid as it sounds, will it make her more into me? Maybe doing this I am too hard on a girl that flakes.....

[afronoob]

(02-15-2011 11:20 PM)tomtud Wrote:  

Continuing on this theme..... I am contemplating about purposely flaking on a chick that flaked on me with a lousy excuse.... On one hand, I am thinking why even bother wasting my time and move forward.... let her make plans next time...

Purposely flaking on her.. will it make me more of a catch in her eyes by being aloof? I have to deprogram my way of thinking to go this way.... I dunno..... For example, invite her to a sporting event this upcoming wknd, and wait till the day of,,, she calls and you tell her ohhhhh something came up etc... give her the same excuse.... as stupid as it sounds, will it make her more into me? Maybe doing this I am too hard on a girl that flakes.....

Quote:

I have at least one other instance where a girl flaked on me or ignored my calls initially, after perservering I ended up hitting it anyway. HOWEVER, The price you pay in lack of esteem and in training yourself to accept poor behavior is simply too high just for some sex. Not only that, when you basically 'wait a girl out', even if you finally end up hitting it she still never really developes the respect for you that is needed to make this situation much fun! You might hit it occassionally, but it's always on her terms, when she wants it, where she wants it and might even cost you dinners, drinks, etc. to secure it! And if you're seeking a meaningful relationship from any of these girls you've allowed to constantly flake on you, forget it! They overwhelmingly will not develope the respect necessary to ever desire you as their true man!

BR88,I learned that a while ago,luckily when still new to the game-don't compromise your dignity for the mere thought of pussy you haven't even had!!
Several times ,a bitch actually came round,btw.

[Moma]

(02-15-2011 11:20 PM)tomtud Wrote:  

Continuing on this theme..... I am contemplating about purposely flaking on a chick that flaked on me with a lousy excuse.... On one hand, I am thinking why even bother wasting my time and move forward.... let her make plans next time...

Purposely flaking on her.. will it make me more of a catch in her eyes by being aloof? I have to deprogram my way of thinking to go this way.... I dunno..... For example, invite her to a sporting event this upcoming wknd, and wait till the day of,,, she calls and you tell her ohhhhh something came up etc... give her the same excuse.... as stupid as it sounds, will it make her more into me? Maybe doing this I am too hard on a girl that flakes.....

I think you should try that. Weather is picking up in our city, we have no excuses now, let's fill the pipelines up

[Ausguy]

My reply "you play games, goodbye"

They usually end up sending a heap of messages saying sorry which I ignore.

If they piss me off, in about 2 weeks I would message them and ask how they are when they pop online (rare). When they ask me how I am, I would say "I meet this great girl last week." Keep it friendly and make out that you are having a great time and end it with "I hope you find someone special as well."

I learn't years ago, the number one way to get revenge on a woman is to let her know you are with another woman and that you are happy (icing on the cake). Even if she doesn't really care about you (that's why she flaked on us), she will desire what she can't get.

NEXT!!!

[hardman]

As hydrogonian put it, the trick is to

(1) call her out on it so she realizes you're not going to put up with it
(2) don't get mad
(3) give her a chance to redeem herself without making her feel uncomfortable

As I detailed in another posting, this can lead to great results.

[iknowexactly]

(01-31-2011 03:39 AM)wolf Wrote:  

... what I noticed is that girls that usually flake on the first date nothing comes good after that, unless of course she is very persistent in rescheduling the date to another day.

In any area of life ( work, arts endeavors, socializing) I don't think I have EVER had a person who missed a first meeting without polite notice work out as a collaborator of ANY KIND.
Even if they are well-intentioned, which they often are, they are just unrealistic and over scheduled, or really not that interested in what you represent, or so unstable from physical or mental illness they cannot benefit you.

People who miss first meetings without notice are so statistically likely to never be a benefit to me I pretty much consider them instant liabilities from then on.

Of course there are always exceptions but i don't have time to spend looking for the 1/1000 that are.

[Vincent Chase]

Flaking is usually just pure disrespect. I usually get a couple of flakes a week from online dating. To the point where I expect it and just double book them. On online dating my policy is one flake for a first date and she's out, I just go ghost on her.

The worst was a girl last week who stood me up (and this was after I agreed to meet her closer to hers last minute - that was a bad idea) I told her I just arrived at the station and she said "OK I'll be there in two minutes", then she sent me a text 5 minutes later saying "I'm terribly sorry, I just received a bad call, sorry". Would I really text a girl like that asking for a reschedule? Of course not, she doesn't value my time, she can genuinely go fuck herself.

I went ghost on that one, I usually at most write back "OK". If they want to reschedule they will ask, 90% of them don't. They flaked because they didn't want to go in the end and even if they did but couldn't make it you'll probably never see them anyway because they don't want to feel any guilt of going on a date with a guy they flaked on.

[rungoodinc]

Flaking is a part of the game. But three strikes and you're out.

[YossariansRight]

(05-11-2015 07:58 PM)rungoodinc Wrote:  

Flaking is a part of the game. But three strikes and you're out.

3 strikes? Really? I'm "1 and done".