[Switch]

What are your guys thoughts on this? I think this makes sense. You don't immediately jump into the deep end when learning to swim... You don't go straight to the MLB from little league... Is it any different in game? I mean, isn't it more natural to bang some 4's and 5's before you have the skill / confidence to upgrade and start banging 6's, 7's, 8's, 9's, and tens?

[eradicator]

no. how can you even get hard for an ugly woman?

[RawGod]

Meeting women isn't like preparing to climb Everest. This is not Sparta. Just mingle and assume that you have some value. Yes you will indeed find it harder to have sex with the most sought after women if you are an average kind of guy. But there's no reason not to chase the hottest ones, it's fun and good practice. And a lot of the hotter ones are nicer people, too, because they have more confidence.

[Switch]

I guess clunker might not be the right word, I'm talking about girls who just barely pass the boner test here, not hideous fatties.

[icefire57]

I tried/banged some "clunkers". If you cant get hard, you only bruise your ego, and the chick's ego as well. And if you can, well, it doesn't really make you feel that much better afterwards. I think I've learned my lesson of just avoiding chicks that don't pass the immediate boner test now. It just becomes a headache later on down the road for me.

But if you're just starting out or in a SERIOUS slump, I don't see how it would hurt to get some reps in with the clunkers.

[WestIndianArchie]

(03-22-2014 12:59 AM)Switch Wrote:  

What are your guys thoughts on this? I think this makes sense. You don't immediately jump into the deep end when learning to swim... You don't go straight to the MLB from little league... Is it any different in game? I mean, isn't it more natural to bang some 4's and 5's before you have the skill / confidence to upgrade and start banging 6's, 7's, 8's, 9's, and tens?

Just because you think a woman is not as attractive as some won't necessarily make it any easier to get her into bed.

Normally from here we'd go into a discussion about
- the number system
- subjective notions of attractiveness
- is there such thing as an objective 10
- how much does environment and culture play a part in that #
- what if she doesn't know she's a 10
- my idea that the number system represents fear on your part

^There are hundreds if not thousands of unsaid premises and questions never asked or answered.

But the much bigger idea here is

You can't really judge how easy it is to fuck a chick based on her "#".

Now i'm not saying you can't get any clues on her "DTF" level based on a visual observation - what i'm saying is

"where she falls on the 1-10 scale says nothing about getting her into the sack."

This 5-6 might be tough as hell to fuck.



She might be very prim and proper, a prude. She could be a born again christian. Maybe she used to take a lot of dick, but started to feel used, and now wants guys to work for it.

This 8-9 might just lay it out there for you.


She could be a rich girl who doesn't believe sex has consequences. She could be a glammed up hippied that believes in free love. Maybe she's so "intimidating" that the kind of guy that she likes, doesn't end up talking to her.

You really don't know based on looking at her.

Your best heuristic for ease of fucking isn't her #, but her behavior.

What she wears, how she wears it, how comfortable she looks, how she interacts with other guys is a start, but you really have no idea what she's like until you talk to her and get her to show her personality to you.

WIA

[VincentVinturi]

Heed your boner and embrace the law of uncertainty.

There's absolutely no way to predict which girl will be easy to bang and which will give you 3 hours worth of LMR or nothing at all.

But I know this much, if your boner is throbbing for her, that makes her potential decision in your favor way easier.

A guy can take being rejected; he's a guy. But if a girl sees that you aren't really into her and are just using her for ego validation and "practice", she'll protect her dignity by keeping the cookies out of reach.

Conversely, if you're rock hard for a chick, no matter what she looks like to the rest of the world, fucking go for it. Like Samseau said, nobody's gonna jerk you off when you go home alone because you were too scared of what people think to be boner-prudent.

Finally---and this is the weirdest part---your boner will fuck with your head. When you get rock hard for a chubby chick and present a wet macaroni for a legit hottie, you'll think "what the fu...?"

It's not necessarily common but it happens from time to time. That's just the way it goes... Don't let your ego tell you that you're "dumpster diving". Your boner is smarter. </rant>

BTW, Nice pics WIA. I just started re-watching Mad Men. Falling in love all over again. :-)

January Jones....

[Vaun]

(03-22-2014 11:13 AM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

Normally from here we'd go into a discussion about
- the number system
- subjective notions of attractiveness
- is there such thing as an objective 10
- how much does environment and culture play a part in that #
- what if she doesn't know she's a 10
- my idea that the number system represents fear on your part

[WestIndianArchie]

(03-22-2014 12:02 PM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  

But I know this much, if your boner is throbbing for her, that makes her potential decision in your favor way easier.

...

Finally---and this is the weirdest part---your boner will fuck with your head. When you get rock hard for a chubby chick and present a wet macaroni for a legit hottie, you'll think "what the fu...?"

I just started re-watching Mad Men. Falling in love all over again. :-)

January Jones....

This!

A guy goes out, sees some 8's, but some how the 6 captures his attention.

It might be blasphemy to say this, but sometimes a man can be attracted to more than just a girl's physical appearance, more than just the lure of easy sex.

OH NOEZ, GIRL GAME...

WIA

[berserk]

I disagree on this because I've had times with low confidence in the past where I'd deliberately seek out less attractive women for the 'easy' notch, but the truth for me was that ease and hotness definitely wasn't on a linear rational scale. A 5 isn't significantly easier to get than a 7, simply because if you can easily get the 5, then you could probably also get the 7. Isn't that also what the alpha-beta is about? You're either attractive to most women, or you're attractive to no women. What might cause the confusion for myself is that the less hot girl would probably just show her attraction much more obviously and because I had low confidence at the time, I'd need that reassurance to push forward.

I've actually been in this exact situation a couple of times, where I had interest going from two girls in one night, but I put effort into the less hot, because I thought it would be easier, but it wasn't easier at all to actually lay her.

[travolta]

I definitely recommend this, especially if you're not getting laid. Last year I banged a bunch of ugly chicks, but now the girls I'm banging are getting progressively hotter. Banging ugly chicks sucked, but it built up my confidence and my skills in bed. I wouldn't suggest banging ugly girls in the long term, but it's definitely a great way to start seeing some success.

[AneroidOcean]

(03-22-2014 12:59 AM)Switch Wrote:  

What are your guys thoughts on this? I think this makes sense. You don't immediately jump into the deep end when learning to swim... You don't go straight to the MLB from little league... Is it any different in game? I mean, isn't it more natural to bang some 4's and 5's before you have the skill / confidence to upgrade and start banging 6's, 7's, 8's, 9's, and tens?

Interesting analogy, without you even having meant it:

Clunker - Nowhere near as appealing, cheap to buy, but VERY expensive to maintain (relative to the value of the car).

Ferrari - Even if you're not the first owner, if it's been maintained well and there's not a ton of miles on the clock you can get a huge amount of enjoyment out of it and it will maintain it's value to you. The maintenance is high, but not incredibly high relative to it's value.

Not a great direct analogy to women, but funny for the above reasons.

I'd say I'm not going to knock a guy who goes for a girl less attractive than his dream girl in order to start somewhere and build up his skills, but if he's not regularly moving towards his dream girl he's not doing it right. However, if he's going after girls that barely pass his boner test when he's drunk then he's really kind of letting himself down.

You should feel GOOD after getting a number or a makeout or sex, not revolted the next day or next week when you think back on it. At worst you should feel neutral after it.

[The Beast1]

Meh I started with 5s and 6s. I've hit upwards towards 8 or 9s. Lately post college it fell back to 6. Gotta get the bankroll and other life things set up.

[soup]

You get good at what you practice. If you practice with 5s you'll probably get good at 5s.

If you practice on 8s, you'll probably get good at eights.

[MY DETROIT PLAYAS]

Slippery slope...another potential issue is that it may become so EASY to hit in the "minor leagues" that you no longer desire to "move up" to the majors or you become lazy and fail to develop into a 5-tool player with versatile game.

Just to borrow your baseball analogy

[Switch]

So a question for the more experienced guys out there with 50+ notches: what path did you take? Not what path would you recommend, but rather what did you actually do? What was the average level of your first 5 bangs versus your most recent 5? As you get better with lower level chicks won't that skill transfer at least a little to higher level ones?

[Switch]

(03-24-2014 02:17 PM)soup Wrote:  

You get good at what you practice. If you practice with 5s you'll probably get good at 5s.

If you practice on 8s, you'll probably get good at eights.

But won't the skill be transferable? The guys above are saying that just because a girl is a 5 doesn't necessarily mean she will be easier than a 9. So wouldn't that mean that girls are all of the same general difficulty (not on an individual basis, of course). So if that were true, wouldn't it make sense to work your way up as a means of building confidence and practicing. There are a whole lot more 5's and 6's who barely pass the boner test than there are 7-9 chicks.

[soup]

Some things are transferable and others aren't. You can't neg a 5 the same when you might neg an 8 because 5s don't need to be knocked down ego wise.

And you can't run comfort that you'd use on that 5 on the 8 because every guy in the world is probably already kissing the 8s ass in attempt to fuck her and she knows it.

[funkyzeit]

I was terrified how cold I was when a fugly chick was lying naked in front of me. Not a single twitch in my dick, nothing. If she is a butterface, bend her over and it's good, if she is fat, not gonna happen. Chubby, yes, why not but with some additional effort for me to become horny.

I do agree that you have to have some 5s available any time for a quick fuck. You need them to avoid dry spells, you need them to fuck away the sadness of breakup with an 8+/10, you need them to stay aloof and outcome independent. Hotties will sense that you have someone else to fuck and they will love you for it.

[bodmon]

if you're an inexperienced guy who has aspirations to become a cold approach player, then yes I do believe that your first 5 to 10 notches should be obtained without regard to quality. at this point your job is to get the utmost basics (learning how to talk to girls, how to do dates properly, how to pull, how to have sex, etc.) down as soon as possible. for a guy just starting out, just about anything, from any girl, fat or homely, is a learning experience. after you've acquired the basics, you can and should proceed to be choosy.

[Mage]

No! You should only ever game girls you would not be ashamed from only.

6es and 7ns are easier then 5es and below because of insecurity.

Game is not that hard that you should practice on uglies.

It makes sense to practice on 6es and 7ens before going for 8ts and 9ies trough, but touching a 5 and below is bad for your self esteem, and it is actually unethical to validate uglies.

[kosko]

You need practice. I've become too subjective with my boner and with a outright refusal to fuck fatties I'm not getting enough play to keep good practice going. Pulling once a month ain't enough for me. I need to get to the level where I can get it in once a week. My bed skills stay stagnant because I can't get those reps in, so, able to downgrade in quality would help me, but I'm way past that, my dick just isn't up (haha) for it.

You gotta get the reps in. The only downside is this becomes harder as you get older because you automatically become more subjective. If your young though... Burn through pussy wherever you can find it. Get the practice in so when you become more subjective in quality with time/practice with game you can break those 9s in half.

If your HS or college age. Fuck anything. Back In the day a Sears catalogue would get me raging. He'll not even the catalogue but the wrapping in came that said "Sears catalogue" inside because I knew tiites where in there. Like a breeze would get me hard growing up so the subjective style of your boner dosnt really know much. It just wants action.

I agree though that some dudes get lazy. But I feel those dudes ain't about game or self-development. If you have hand in hand a commitment to making yourself better then it becomes easy to grow board of pussy that is wack and you naturally want better things.

[LaserBear]

It's not humping a clunker, its humping a clunker relative to your goals.

My first was an 8 (on a 10 scale), but I dated her for two years... after that disaster I proceeded to fuck a few of what I would consider 2's on the Tucker Max 5 star scale (which we will use from here out). I had no game but it was an important lesson




The lesson being, other vaginas existed. Would I fuck any of them again? probably number 3... she got hot when she hit college. But in general no. Since then, my standards have consistently increased, leading to a funny effect on my list where every year the girls are hotter (if I look back), but I always feel the exact same distaste and disregard for them.

If you are just starting do not feel bad for hitting some clunkers. A few 2 stars you can get your sex game down on will pay dividends later when you're the first guy to make that sweet little 5 star cum.

After a small introductory pussy period though, you must up your goals.
If you aren't moving forwards you're standing still, and staying in one place is for dead people.

This is where the concept of Relative Clunkers™ comes in.

I'm a strong advocate of keeping a couple relative clunkers in you harem for ease of control. If you're actively pursuing only 4 or 5 stars, keep a couple 3s or 3.5s you can utterly manipulate at any times.

Scale up or down as necessary, for where your current target in your mind is.

Whatever girl(s) you have locked down in your harem, you should be actively pursuing ones AT LEAST a star higher than. (or whatever increment system you're using at the moment) Don't turn down a new prospect of the same level if it is presented, but only actively hunt that step up.

This guarantees progress and an ever improving harem... which in the end, isn't that what everyone wants?

If you're just starting out do not feel bad swinging at every pitch thrown. Before you can improve your harem... you gotta have one.
And don't feel bad for starting a harem with that 2 star, cause she doesn't make you any less valuable... You have a penis, not a vagina. More use just makes it more experienced, a traveler of the world. Respectable for all it's seen and more skillful as a result of these sights.

So if you're just starting establish at whatever minimal level you are comfy with, then immediately begin improving, and don't stop. Coffins are comfy, feeling comfortable where you're at is not your friend. It's just the death of game.


BUT DONT FEEL BAD SWINGING AT EVERY 5 STAR EITHER. A lucky home run can set you up a harem on a level you didn't think possible at the time. Just watch out for one-itis when it happens. You did it once, that doesn't mean you got lucky... it means you can do it again.

[Switch]

(03-27-2014 11:33 AM)LaserBear Wrote:  

It's not humping a clunker, its humping a clunker relative to your goals.

My first was an 8 (on a 10 scale), but I dated her for two years... after that disaster I proceeded to fuck a few of what I would consider 2's on the Tucker Max 5 star scale (which we will use from here out). I had no game but it was an important lesson




The lesson being, other vaginas existed. Would I fuck any of them again? probably number 3... she got hot when she hit college. But in general no. Since then, my standards have consistently increased, leading to a funny effect on my list where every year the girls are hotter (if I look back), but I always feel the exact same distaste and disregard for them.

If you are just starting do not feel bad for hitting some clunkers. A few 2 stars you can get your sex game down on will pay dividends later when you're the first guy to make that sweet little 5 star cum.

After a small introductory pussy period though, you must up your goals.
If you aren't moving forwards you're standing still, and staying in one place is for dead people.

This is where the concept of Relative Clunkers™ comes in.

I'm a strong advocate of keeping a couple relative clunkers in you harem for ease of control. If you're actively pursuing only 4 or 5 stars, keep a couple 3s or 3.5s you can utterly manipulate at any times.

Scale up or down as necessary, for where your current target in your mind is.

Whatever girl(s) you have locked down in your harem, you should be actively pursuing ones AT LEAST a star higher than. (or whatever increment system you're using at the moment) Don't turn down a new prospect of the same level if it is presented, but only actively hunt that step up.

This guarantees progress and an ever improving harem... which in the end, isn't that what everyone wants?

If you're just starting out do not feel bad swinging at every pitch thrown. Before you can improve your harem... you gotta have one.
And don't feel bad for starting a harem with that 2 star, cause she doesn't make you any less valuable... You have a penis, not a vagina. More use just makes it more experienced, a traveler of the world. Respectable for all it's seen and more skillful as a result of these sights.

So if you're just starting establish at whatever minimal level you are comfy with, then immediately begin improving, and don't stop. Coffins are comfy, feeling comfortable where you're at is not your friend. It's just the death of game.


BUT DONT FEEL BAD SWINGING AT EVERY 5 STAR EITHER. A lucky home run can set you up a harem on a level you didn't think possible at the time. Just watch out for one-itis when it happens. You did it once, that doesn't mean you got lucky... it means you can do it again.

This makes a lot of sense. I don't see myself going below the 3 on this scale, and definitely ever ever below 2.5. I think consistently trying to upgrade is the key to getting with hotter and hotter girls.

[Travesty]

As a beginner if you have struggled with women or getting attractive girlfriends I wouldn't think about this.

Your goal should be 30 approaches a week anyway you can get them.

Bang any girl that passes the boner rest until you get 10 notches.

I strongly feel you need to get your strong baseline down.

Once your baseline of bangs and many approaches are down then focus more on quality.

I agree with a past poster get one or two 6's on rotation that is a guaranteed lay. Focus on hot chicks and don't waste time on new 6's if you really want to improve your game.