[rastignac]

(02-20-2014 03:15 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  

^
But on the other hand, we see live ammunition by the army, spelling the end for these protests.


So which way is this thing gonna go?

Yanukovich is pissing his pants.

[rastignac]

Yanukovich was a petty thug who like all Ukrainian politicians used his position to increase his and his families financial wealth. If he loses power, no tears here. That country has been going to hell since he took power in 2010. Before the US screwed up the world economy in 2008, it was even better.

Prediction: even the east will rejoice when he falls, after the last few days. Any bet takers here? A bottle of horilka at Kyjivka in Lviv in the Spring? I will help you get past the doorman. We can try our luck with those conservative Ukrainian catholic girls.

Seriously, rvf is the only place on line I have encountered non-Ukrainians with on the ground experience and thoughts about what has been going on. Bravo.

(Crimea is not included in my prediction/bet).

RE: Pussy. Yanukovich is not the source of Ukrainian women, their nature, their culture, their femininity. It will take two generations to corrupt them. It is your grandchildren's problem. I will leave it that.

[MichaelCorleone]

unconfirmed reports in the NYT today that the Ukrainian government has machine gunned the protestors killing 70 and injuring 500. Looks like things just got taken to another level if this is true.

http://mashable.com/2014/02/20/at-least-...e-in-kiev/

Look out for the government snipers? I wouldn't goto Ukraine right now if someone paid me.....

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/21/world/...raine.html

This is becoming another proxy war between East and West (ala Syria), with Russia staring down the West yet again.....After today...it looks like the government is going to CRUSH the protesters Soviet Style...Russia probably told him to quit playing and bring in the military and then it is Game Over for the protestors.

I don't see how Russia will let Ukraine leave its sphere of influence, heck, didn't they poison a Western leaning Ukrainian President a few years ago?

[jimukr104]

"Prediction: even the east will rejoice when he falls, after the last few days. Any bet takers here? A bottle of horilka at Kyjivka in Lviv in the Spring? I will help you get past the doorman. We can try our luck with those conservative Ukrainian catholic girls. "

no tears I AGREE...but this is only the beginning. But The East and West divide thing will come along every few years. They will hop back and forth between candidates.
Now that is of course NOT considering a country split. If opposition party comes into power be sure of the possibility that local governors in many Oblasts will not recognize thier power.As long as they keep their local power, Kiev will not be able to dictate to them.Even when yushenko was in power many pretty much ignored him.

We will see how many get killed tomorrow ((

[DaveR]

(02-20-2014 06:30 PM)dtf Wrote:  

So what would be the ideal outcome of this for us 'love tourists'?

From best to worst, IMO:

- 'protest' fizzles out, Party of Regions stays in control, but there will be a repeat in a few years. This is ideal because the country will continue to accumulate a massive amount of debt without any reforms. Meantime, the oligarchs would continue to pilfer anything of value, guaranteeing that the economic situation would not improve. Ukrainian language usage will not increase in Kiev.

- the three amigos take control of the government. I don't think this would last very long (last time they could only hold power for 3 years). Politically, the country would align itself with the EU. On the + side, Ukraine's economy would be, in a word, fucked. Prices will rise (it's an EU+IMF demand) and they will lose the Russian subsidies - cheap gas, the Sevastopol lease, and bond purchases.
Under this scenario, you can forget about doing business in Ukraine because there will be law changes to deal with every month. In 2006-8 it was a nightmare trying to achieve anything. The only thing the country had at that time was rampant inflation due to foreign investors piling into the property market.

- some Southern/Eastern regions break away or form a new state. This is the worst possible scenario because the balance of the elections in the rest of the country would be shifted strongly towards the three amigos. The remaining part of Ukraine would align itself towards Europe. Ukrainian would dominate in Kiev, due to the lower influence from the Russian-speaking regions. Girls will start to wear the same trash they wear in the rest of Central Europe... The only stores that will survive will be the same 20 that you see in every mall in Poland, CZ, Hungary, etc.

[jimukr104]

(02-20-2014 07:22 PM)DaveR Wrote:  

(02-20-2014 06:30 PM)dtf Wrote:  

So what would be the ideal outcome of this for us 'love tourists'?

From best to worst, IMO:

- 'protest' fizzles out, Party of Regions stays in control, but there will be a repeat in a few years. This is ideal because the country will continue to accumulate a massive amount of debt without any reforms. Meantime, the oligarchs would continue to pilfer anything of value, guaranteeing that the economic situation would not improve. Ukrainian language usage will not increase in Kiev.

- the three amigos take control of the government. I don't think this would last very long (last time they could only hold power for 3 years). Politically, the country would align itself with the EU. On the + side, Ukraine's economy would be, in a word, fucked. Prices will rise (it's an EU+IMF demand) and they will lose the Russian subsidies - cheap gas, the Sevastopol lease, and bond purchases.
Under this scenario, you can forget about doing business in Ukraine because there will be law changes to deal with every month. In 2006-8 it was a nightmare trying to achieve anything. The only thing the country had at that time was rampant inflation due to foreign investors piling into the property market.

- some Southern/Eastern regions break away or form a new state. This is the worst possible scenario because the balance of the elections in the rest of the country would be shifted strongly towards the three amigos. The remaining part of Ukraine would align itself towards Europe. Ukrainian would dominate in Kiev, due to the lower influence from the Russian-speaking regions. Girls will start to wear the same trash they wear in the rest of Central Europe... The only stores that will survive will be the same 20 that you see in every mall in Poland, CZ, Hungary, etc.

If I MAY?
"the three amigos take control of the government. I don't think this would last very long (last time they could only hold power for 3 years). Politically, the country would align itself with the EU. On the + side, Ukraine's economy would be, in a word, fucked. Prices will rise (it's an EU+IMF demand) and they will lose the Russian subsidies - cheap gas, the Sevastopol lease, and bond purchases."

You mention Sevastopol.... the contract is still good for another 30 years so don't expect the Russians to pick up and leave. You try moving a 10k lb bear!

btw:Klitchko is an idiot..its his brother who is the smart one lol.

[Courage Reborn]

It seems the president is stalling talks to bring in more military forces.

If tanks start rolling down Kreshatik ulitsa, this protest thing is over.

The protesters have the numbers, and determination. For the president (oligarchs) to hang on to power, they will have to authorize a massacre. And to do that, they need someone to blame.

It remains to be seen if the increased international pressure will be a factor here, or not.

[DaveR]

For those who speak Russian: http://news.bigmir.net/ukraine/794874-Ak...n-ES--YGO-

For those who don't: The "peaceful protestors" thought the French/German bodyguards were hired thugs, then beat and kidnapped them and smashed up a few cars. The three amigos have been asked to get them released.

This might finally give the eurofags some perspective on what's actually going on.

[dtf]

(02-20-2014 07:22 PM)DaveR Wrote:  

(02-20-2014 06:30 PM)dtf Wrote:  

So what would be the ideal outcome of this for us 'love tourists'?

From best to worst, IMO:

- 'protest' fizzles out, Party of Regions stays in control, but there will be a repeat in a few years. This is ideal because the country will continue to accumulate a massive amount of debt without any reforms. Meantime, the oligarchs would continue to pilfer anything of value, guaranteeing that the economic situation would not improve. Ukrainian language usage will not increase in Kiev.

- the three amigos take control of the government. I don't think this would last very long (last time they could only hold power for 3 years). Politically, the country would align itself with the EU. On the + side, Ukraine's economy would be, in a word, fucked. Prices will rise (it's an EU+IMF demand) and they will lose the Russian subsidies - cheap gas, the Sevastopol lease, and bond purchases.
Under this scenario, you can forget about doing business in Ukraine because there will be law changes to deal with every month. In 2006-8 it was a nightmare trying to achieve anything. The only thing the country had at that time was rampant inflation due to foreign investors piling into the property market.

- some Southern/Eastern regions break away or form a new state. This is the worst possible scenario because the balance of the elections in the rest of the country would be shifted strongly towards the three amigos. The remaining part of Ukraine would align itself towards Europe. Ukrainian would dominate in Kiev, due to the lower influence from the Russian-speaking regions. Girls will start to wear the same trash they wear in the rest of Central Europe... The only stores that will survive will be the same 20 that you see in every mall in Poland, CZ, Hungary, etc.

Thank you for the explanation. I'm not llking 2 & 3. Btw, who are the three amigos? Haven't heard of them in the news.

[DaveR]

(02-20-2014 07:50 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

You mention Sevastopol.... the contract is still good for another 30 years so don't expect the Russians to pick up and leave. You try moving a 10k lb bear!

Yeah, but they weren't paying for it before 2010. The lease has a lot of conditions in it that require free access, no inspections, etc. which Svoboda and Fatherland are completely opposed to. It's listed on Svoboda's site as one of their main demands.

[DaveR]

(02-20-2014 08:01 PM)dtf Wrote:  

Thank you for the explanation. I'm not llking 2 & 3. Btw, who are the three amigos? Haven't heard of them in the news.

Yatseniuk, Klitschko, Tyagnybok.. the three opposition leaders. I write "three amigos" because it's quicker.

[jimukr104]

(02-20-2014 08:05 PM)DaveR Wrote:  

(02-20-2014 07:50 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

You mention Sevastopol.... the contract is still good for another 30 years so don't expect the Russians to pick up and leave. You try moving a 10k lb bear!

Yeah, but they weren't paying for it before 2010. The lease has a lot of conditions in it that require free access, no inspections, etc. which Svoboda and Fatherland are completely opposed to. It's listed on Svoboda's site as one of their main demands.

yes but Svoboda demands will start a civil war since half of them are russophobic and is against the wishes of the 50% who live in the south and east.
The contract was made..the Russians really have the high ground here. Again will the opposition leaders go to war with Moscow? Who will fight.
They will probably even bring up clauses about no foreign military bases listed in the constitution(that would include Nato as well).but Moscow has the strings here, plus they can probably get Crimea to leave Ukraine. Only the 200k tatars have a problem with that.

[Courage Reborn]

What really sucks is to be a business owner or employee in and around the city center right now.

I talked to one of my Kiev girls. They closed the subway system. Lots of employees had to walk home, hours to the outer stations. There are rumors of a government insinuated communications blackout. Fixing to cut off all cell and internet services, to make it harder for the organizers to organize.

On one hand this is bad for guys like us. I want to go back, but even I'm not that adventurous to wander into gunfire. If they declare a police state/state of emergency, how long it will be before you can walk down Shevchenko without it looking like a scene out of Apocalypse Now? Or at least without worry of taking a sniper round to the head?

I wonder if RvF has any lurkers with boots on the ground reading this thread.

The hotties won't be venturing outdoors for a while, but the fear these women are experiencing could make pickings VERY strong for the future. Especially for a westerner coming from a relatively "safe" haven like the UK or US.

[Icarus]

(02-20-2014 08:17 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  

The fear these women are experiencing could make pickings VERY strong for the furture. Especially for a westerner coming from a relatively "safe" haven like the UK or US.

Impending Civil War Game FTW!!!

[jimukr104]

(02-20-2014 08:17 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  

What really sucks is to be a business owner or employee in and around the city center right now.

I talked to one of my Kiev girls. They closed the subway system. Lots of employees had to walk home, hours to the outer stations. There are rumors of a government insinuated communications blackout. Fixing to cut off all cell and internet services, to make it harder for the organizers to organize.

This really sucks, because I want to go back. If they declare a police state/state of emergency, how long it will be before you can walk down Shevchenko without it looking like a scene out of Apocalypse Now? Or at least without worry of taking a sniper round to the head?

I wonder if RvF has any lurkers with boots on the ground reading this thread.

The fear these women are experiencing could make pickings VERY strong for the furture. Especially for a westerner coming from a relatively "safe" haven like the UK or US.

If the 3 amigos win..it will be the opposite. I saw how foreign phobic they were in the East after the 2004 revolution. American peace corps even got beat up in Donetsk.Also some guys in a club.

If what you are saying about a communication block out is true..then I suspect another push is coming?? could it be?
I have heard reports of full trains and planes leaving the city..but I guess it could just be a VERY long weekend getaway.

[Roosh]

(02-20-2014 07:58 PM)DaveR Wrote:  

For those who speak Russian: http://news.bigmir.net/ukraine/794874-Ak...n-ES--YGO-

For those who don't: The "peaceful protestors" thought the French/German bodyguards were hired thugs, then beat and kidnapped them and smashed up a few cars. The three amigos have been asked to get them released.

This might finally give the eurofags some perspective on what's actually going on.

The irony is that a lot of the violent protesters are neo-nazis, which Brussels is indirectly supporting. They are turning a blind eye to their violence so they can colonize the country, thinking that once their man is in power, they can dump the thugs.

[jimukr104]

(02-20-2014 08:23 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

(02-20-2014 07:58 PM)DaveR Wrote:  

For those who speak Russian: http://news.bigmir.net/ukraine/794874-Ak...n-ES--YGO-

For those who don't: The "peaceful protestors" thought the French/German bodyguards were hired thugs, then beat and kidnapped them and smashed up a few cars. The three amigos have been asked to get them released.

This might finally give the eurofags some perspective on what's actually going on.

The irony is that a lot of the violent protesters are neo-nazis, which Brussels is indirectly supporting. They are using turning a blind eye to their violence so they can colonize the country, thinking that once their man is in power, they can dump the thugs.

Don't worry there is stil a long way to go.
If they get Yanuk out and have new elections...do you realize that those 3 clowns individually haven't enough votes based on polls to take Yanuk. Yanuk can run and still beat them. The communist party or whoever runs for east and south can still beat the Western Capitalist Nazi's. They all are so greedy for power that the more opposition leaders who run the less % any of them will get.

[JohnKreese]

(02-20-2014 08:20 PM)Icarus Wrote:  

(02-20-2014 08:17 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  

The fear these women are experiencing could make pickings VERY strong for the furture. Especially for a westerner coming from a relatively "safe" haven like the UK or US.

Impending Civil War Game FTW!!!

"Oh, you want to know whats cool about my country? Well, we have a pretty cool hip-hop scene, California driver's licenses, and we aren't currently at (declared) war with ourself!"

[DaveR]

(02-20-2014 08:12 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

yes but Svoboda demands will start a civil war since half of them are russophobic and is against the wishes of the 50% who live in the south and east.
The contract was made..the Russians really have the high ground here. Again will the opposition leaders go to war with Moscow? Who will fight.
They will probably even bring up clauses about no foreign military bases listed in the constitution(that would include Nato as well).but Moscow has the strings here, plus they can probably get Crimea to leave Ukraine. Only the 200k tatars have a problem with that.

I agree, but I think Svoboda and Fatherland will get into a situation where they're breaking conditions of the lease or stealing gas and Russia will withhold payments for it. One way or another, Russia will find a way to stop paying if the EU Association Agreement is entered into.

The beatings have already begun in Simferopol... http://24tv.ua/home/showSingleNews.do?v_...72&lang=ru

[Roosh]

Ukrainian army has only 700 troops fit for combat.

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/915df8b8-...z2tuy8UIE9

[Blunt]

It is funny how quickly they forgot about Tymoshenko. None of them want to see her released as she would be more popular at least individually than any one of them and their egos have expanded too much from all the Western attention. Klitschko especially is keen to bow down to his Kraut masters.

If things got worse for Yanukovich, I would sign the pardon for her as a going away present for the amigos and then depart to Moscow or Belarus. Of course it would be necessary to insert a clause requiring admission of guilt to accept the pardon. Then the coalition can have a thieving oligarch and a neo-nazi.

[Roosh]

Incredible female to male ratio at Lviv protest:

[TripleG]

(02-20-2014 08:33 PM)DaveR Wrote:  

(02-20-2014 08:12 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

yes but Svoboda demands will start a civil war since half of them are russophobic and is against the wishes of the 50% who live in the south and east.
The contract was made..the Russians really have the high ground here. Again will the opposition leaders go to war with Moscow? Who will fight.
They will probably even bring up clauses about no foreign military bases listed in the constitution(that would include Nato as well).but Moscow has the strings here, plus they can probably get Crimea to leave Ukraine. Only the 200k tatars have a problem with that.

I agree, but I think Svoboda and Fatherland will get into a situation where they're breaking conditions of the lease or stealing gas and Russia will withhold payments for it. One way or another, Russia will find a way to stop paying if the EU Association Agreement is entered into.

The beatings have already begun in Simferopol... [url]http://24tv.ua/home/showSingleNews.do?v_...72&lang=ru[/url]

Hm...An American caught with a bunch of friends in Simferopol and beaten for thinking EU thoughts?
I'm sure the press is lying, he was probably assaulted for sargin' & aggressive caveman game with members of Rooshv forums on Lenin Blvd.


P.S. I've been to Simferopol before, a highly underrated city for gaming with some Tatar stunner's to be found on the streets.

[OMYG]

^^^^Can easily KO 100 approaches in 1 hour. How's that for The Roosh Program.

[DirectDanger]