[2Wycked]

The current conceptualization of man caves is new, but the idea of a space for a man, apart from his wife, is nothing new. The current zeitgeist around man-caves is predictably bound up in feminism & the misreadings of masculinity.

In order to understand the phenomenon of man caves, individual relationships between men & women must be considered, as well as the mainstream take of man caves.

From an individual level, much of the female consternation over man caves stems from a lack of self-love or self-hatred. When a woman cavorts with alphas, she gets her insecurity feed by alpha’s indifference to her. The fact women know better than to seek a relationship reflects her valuation of herself while also promoting her own narcissism. She can dream endlessly of a lavish wedding, domestic bliss or just getting the relationship made Facebook official. The distance alphas usually take with women allows him to engage women on his terms while also affording women space to engage in narcissistic dreaming.

However, the fairytale dreamland always ends, as father time always sags her tits, ages her face & hardens her body. Then the next key step in a woman’s life happens – she “realizes” she deserves love. You see? That was holding her back the whole time – her inability to appreciate love coming her way. Wait, that sounds like women may be onto something?

Wrong. It is cliché, naïve-gazing explanation women use to explain when they are settling for a beta. Sure, they found a guy who will commit & love her unconditionally – in a way she could never do for herself. You see, men who women settle for are tools, often for the supreme level of intense psychological pressure a woman feels when she realizes she isn’t even a drunk booty call at 3 AM from a lesser alpha.

So, the settlor & the beta exchange their one-sided vows and retreat into what will socially be portrayed as domestic bliss. However, behind the scenes, it is the woman calling all the shots. Of course, in order to slake her need to appear equal, she will ask for his approval, citing the need for compromise & negotiation in a healthy relationship.



A great example of this was when I lived with a guy who was engaged. We were setting up the apartment and she was there with her mom doing her utmost to have as much say in the layout. Both him & I agreed on an spread for the living room – the compromise for us was I got layout I wanted for the couches & chairs (as I am the only one going to be throwing parties) and I put my nice TV in the room I had wanted to keep in my bedroom. Fair right? Well, she sidles up and says the setup is nice. He senses she doesn’t like it and says her input is as valid as both of us. She suggested a ridiculous outlet that seemed, to me, to be discouraging parties. He agrees with her right away and ask my opinion. All I said is only the two of pay rent and we had an agreement. No more discussion.
Later, he gave me a bizarre lecture half-drunk about that exchange, in which he qualified himself to me, that relationships are “all about negotiations, 2Wycked.” “You have to keep your lady happy.” By pointedly making those comments, he knew he was the party out of power in the relationship and it wasn’t right nor pleasing for him. They are married with kids presently.

Her absolute insecurity manifested itself in a supreme need for control over a male. However, that will never result in a relationship in which a woman lusts after, loves or respects her man. The flip side is the beta. Relationships are always bidirectional, as such, betas have to be getting something from this. They do in the form of superficial female approval. Since they have never felt the passion of a woman for them, never experienced female approval rooted in an actual desire, care for or love of them. Illusory heterosexuality is a perfect fit for these women & betas.

The concept of a man cave is important with considering a man’s growth. Not every man stays locked in the blue-pill closet of betahood – sometimes they try to break free. Recall the movie American Beauty. In it, it shows a man trying to break free from his bondage in a female-centric relationship & society. He doesn’t succeed, and the movie would not have be a success if he had, but it reflects a bit on the man cave.
The man cave is little more than a fumbling attempt at a man to crave out an identity for himself – but still within the framework of a woman’s approval. Such is the arc of masculinity in America – a complete suborning to authority figures who often are women in a man’s life.

Before I consider an example of a married couple I know, consider the female rage over man caves. Consider these quotes:

Quote:

Besides, if I let FI have a man cave

Quote:

I do not believe in man cave= him and rest of house= me.

Quote:

HATE the idea of a man cave!!! I always have. In fact my FI hates the idea as well. If there is a man cave then where is the woman cave? The kitchen or laundry room? No thanks! My FI rarely watches sports (I think its something he gave up once he started dating me cause I could careless about sports)

Right here, we have a goldmine to examine. Lurking right beneath the surface is sexism/patriarchy. Accusations of sexism & misogyny by women are generally rooted in a woman's desire to obtain male worship - suborning him to her. Here, implicit suggestions of male privilege are there to reinforce her self-hatred - unable to come to grips with her self-hatred, she pretends everybody else hates: "OMG, even my husband hates women (me)".

Further, is the denial of female supremacy in these relationships. Like the example I provided above, women pretend to be fair & equitable, but their desire to dominate overrides the secondary issues of equality. The first quote expressly admits she is in firm control of the relationship and it probably doesn't occur to her or another other woman what she just confessed.

The idea of a woman cave is amusing. Consider this clip from Knocked Up!, which is about Paul Rudd's wife, thinking he is cheating on her (justifying her rageful, judgmental jealousy) she finds out he is just a part of a fantasy baseball draft.

She is obviously mind-sided psychologically and needs to create space for her to deal with the situation. She presents that fact she wants time for herself, but the movie opened with her at a club with Katherine Heigl knocking back alcohol. The issue here isn't that she doesn't get time alone from her husband & family, it is that she resents the obvious implication that she isn't a good person.

In her mind this is what happens: I am a good person. Good people treat their significant others fairly. I get time alone for personal pursuits. My husband does not think he gets enough time alone. Since he is not being treated fairly, I must not be a good person.

It isn't healthy psychology, but it is what she is thinking. Her tears while asking for time alone belies what she feels. Whether she actually is worried about being a good wife or just being seen as one is not easily determinable, as this exchange occurs in public. She also reveals her sexual frustration as her plea for seeing Spiderman isn't about her wanting to see it by herself, but her wanting her husband to take the initiative and take her to see movie - lead her and not ask for her permission to be a man.

I have a good friend who has married into betahood. I have seen her internal conflicts as she clearly suggests the idea he needs to take more initiative in the relationship, which is true. However, if he was to do that, it has to be 100% his choice and must be behind it 100%. That isn't the only issue, as she has strong control issues.

He once, at a party, relayed his desire to have a room in their new house just for his music equipment. While talking about this, his eyes light up and he was clearly highly interested in this endeavor. His ideas sounded pretty cool, even though I am not a music guy at all. He had clearly spent much time thinking about it and planning. For one brief & telling moment, his wife angrily interjects that the room better have a wine rack in it. A random comment that she quickly papered over, saying every room needs a little feminine flair.

To me, it confirmed what I already knew - it was a compensatory narcissist/codependent relationship sexually. Still, we see the clear psychological tear the woman has - she wants a man to take control, but in the absence of that, she will take complete, domineering control.

Consider this quote by the Joker in the Dark Knight.

In the absence of alpha male behaviors, women will assert control over the relationship that reflect a supreme level of self-absorption.

The man cave, as aforementioned, is a feeble, female-centric way of asserting control over their masculinity. However, as we often see, it becomes a puerile & childish expression of manhood. It reflects the man-boy phenomenon that has been a multiplicity of forces intended to pin men down so women can feel superior to those men. Of course, we can't talk about modern masculinity without considering feminism.

Let's consider a male feminist critique of this "man-boy" issue.

Here's a picture of the faggot in all his fucking glory:


You know, I am pretty sure I have been even-handed in my analysis of pieces like this, but for a change of pace, I will just go in on this piece of shit.

First, let’s talk about race. This assclown needless injects race into the discussion because this fag knows if he didn’t use the specter of white privilege his argument would be just an attack on all men. He ignores black men, but I am sure his dipshit ass thinks that if white people start to think about white privilege some more & some technocrats in DC get the public policy right, then black people will start behaving in ways socially approved by middle-class feminists such as him. He talks repeatedly about gender being a performance, which I have already ethered as a bunch of bullshit, yet this fucking genius still keeps coughing up long since discredited analysis. Instead of going in on why men feel so disaffected – by actually considering what men are feeling – he just doubles down on white & male privilege so this omega can get is daily dose of female approval through self-abnegation. This dickwipe talks about progressives developing new modes of masculinity for men to be presented. Fuck! He admits masculinity is determined by authority figures, but does NOTHING to connect the fucking dots that such approaches to masculinity are the problem in the first place! This sort of man is beyond dangerous, as he sees oppression of men via heavy-handed control as desirable.

Ugh, donchafucking know privileged men know who good you have it? No, the privileged can never see it. All of this is the name of advancing women & equality. What – those two concepts are not the same! Another misogynistic shitlord. BORRRINGGG!!!



To men like the aforementioned person, giving men free reign to self-actualize or at least just get some room think for themselves is dangerous. The usual talk is about rape, violence & staggering levels of male privilege that prevent men from seeing women are people.

The argument would be why do men need a man cave? They already own the home, the workplace & the social sphere. The trouble with that argument is it is 100% false. Alphas rule the world, with women in second-command, with the rest of men tagging along.

Women need to socially pretend they married an alpha, so they will dress him up as need be to pretend they aren't settling. So, socially, they impute alpha qualities onto him. This results in him being falsely characterized as being in control, indifferent & demanding. The classic case of misogynistic machismo as interpreted by many.

On the other hand, women need to be in complete control of their man, so, in private, she will exert great levels of control over her beta. The man cave isn't just representative of her own low self-esteem, but also her inability to control her man completely. Recall my friend who couldn't even have a room in the house without a wine rack. That is her asserting dominance over the entire domestic sphere.

Betas get trapped between public & private spheres where they realize they are treated very differently. The man cave is their way of carving out a space that is for them, by them - but still within the framework of the existing relationship. Instead of thinking outside the box & questioning themselves & the nature of the relationship, they get as close to the edge the box without having to leave its sanctity.

Relationships that involve man caves are stable. So long as they abide within the roles established, it will last. A woman criticizing her husband for a man cave won't end the relationship at all - she will frame as his immaturity and in that characterization she gets to feel superior to him, so the relationship endures because her insecurity is slaked.

Man caves are all about women's desire to dominate betas in the way alphas dominate women. Unlike alpha power - which is usually exercised through indifference - female power over betas is intentional. It is somewhat based out of female desire to be alphas, but is primarily based out of their severe insecurity. The more insecure she is, the worse she will treat her beta husband. Part of this phenomenon is based out untoward approaches to masculinity our society takes. Also part of this is the supreme level of social attacks feminists make of men. Of course, it is couched in bettering men, but a breakdown of the psychology of that is a writeup for another day.

[Generation21stCentury]

(07-07-2013 02:00 AM)2Wycked Wrote:  

Betas get trapped between public & private spheres where they realize they are treated very differently. The man cave is their way of carving out a space that is for them, by them - but still within the framework of the existing relationship. Instead of thinking outside the box & questioning themselves & the nature of the relationship, they get as close to the edge the box without having to leave its sanctity.

This.

Relevant: http://therationalmale.com/2012/12/03/th...he-garage/

[Gmac]

Dupe.

[2Wycked]

@Generation21stCentury:

That is an interesting link. He is right the man cave is playing to a woman's frame.

I wish I considered Rollo's approach when writing my thread.

Have to include his view when I eventually trim this down & port it to RoK.

[Gmac]

(07-07-2013 06:24 PM)2Wycked Wrote:  

@Generation21stCentury:

That is an interesting link. He is right the man cave is playing to a woman's frame.

I wish I considered Rollo's approach when writing my thread.

Have to include his view when I eventually trim this down & port it to RoK.

With that line of thinking... Man house > Man Cave. Woman might get a say, but man controls the ins and outs.

Reminds me of my girl. "I like your mancessories."

Me: "Gay"