rooshvforum.network is a fully functional forum: you can search, register, post new threads etc...
Old accounts are inaccessible: register a new one, or recover it when possible. x


The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America
#1

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS8Oc736xqtXtdGlWOgulL...mkrc7g7-92]

I am huge horror flick aficionado - the local Blockbuster has a massive horror section and I have seen them all. As such, I am a fan of the After Dark Horrorfest Series. It is a great collection of “8 Films To Die For” released every year. The Butterfly Effect: Revelations was released in 2009. It is a good film, but not great by any means. I will be using one scene in particular to highlight the lack of a childhood that narcissistic mothers deny their children.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRlrMGUaXTh-g9c02HpCBt...7akbns7R2P]

I will only briefly discuss the movie. Like all the Butterfly Effect movies, it involves time travel. A fairly annoying, passive aggressive white dude is the main character who uses his bathtub to travel back in time and catch killers. He goes back to moments before the crime and observes it happen, then comes back to the present and reports his findings to a police liaison. An interesting take, as he does nothing to change the arc of history. However, he screws up when he tries to go back in time to prevent the murder of his girlfriend – a woman he is still deeply enamored with. He tries to stop the murder, but it results in his girlfriend still dying and another girl dying.

His sister, who helps him time travel and keeps him grounded, is seriously angry with him. He vows to never try to go back and save his dead girlfriend. That didn’t last long, as he keeps going back time and again; each time coming back with more dead women. He also gets poorer and begins to lose his mind. After each time travel back, we find that a woman he fucked at the beginning turned up dead. His police liaison began to suspect he is the serial murderer. He gets arrested, but gets sprung out by his friend in the department when he correctly states the first thing his wife ever said to him – something only he and his wife know. He gets a good lead in the past and finds the abandoned factory where the serial killer is doing their work.

At this juncture, we find out that his sister is the serial killer. We then find out that the main character used this time traveling powers to go back and save his sister from being killed in a house fire. Without time traveling, this man’s sister would have died in her youth in a house fire. However, when he saved his sister, he came back and found out his long-time girlfriend has been killed. It had been his sister all along killing his dalliances because each one of those women he would have married. His sister was in love with him. She throws herself at him and the end and he obviously rejects. He manages to get away from her and time travels once more – to the house fire. He goes back to when he saved his sister and locks her in her room as she burns alive. She knows it’s him that is locking her in and she screams and cries why he doing this to her. He never responds and leaves once she succumbs to smoke inhalation.

This is the scene I wish to discuss. It is tough to watch, as it shows her childhood toys burning up, the bright, sunny wallpaper turning to ash; you see her name on the front door in a smoky haze. I think this analogous to growing up with a narcissistic mother. You don’t have a childhood in any appropriate sense; you are trapped, as a dependent, with somebody whose only concern is feeling superior to everybody – including you, a child.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTCQkdy5GZtsQ1pmSEQkpx...HOUZiadIGL]

The general definition of narcissism is somebody who seeks to live out grandiose fantasies of themselves in the world. They crave worship and exhibit a complete lack of empathy. They simply just believe themselves to be better than everybody else. Often, their fantasies do not match up to their reality and only a few do. Honestly, there is no greatness without narcissism. However, understand the real need for narcissistic supply – which is the incessant need to demonstrate superiority. They crave worship, but once they get your approval, you are dead to them. They only see people as objects to be used for their gain or tossed aside if they don’t advance their visions of themselves. They do this to cover up for horrible self-esteem. If their fantasies are not acted out, they may sink into narcissistic depression.

My mother was and is a textbook narcissist. My father is a classic codependent male. And so it went for my childhood. The only fond memories I have of my early childhood was with my father. We couldn’t have a positive relationship with her around, so the moments only came when it was just the two of us. She was a career-oriented feminist, so she worked many hours. I got to spend a lot of time with my father. We would go fishing, worked on cars together (Well, he let me pretend) and would go hiking at the local national park. One of my most cherished memories was when he built me a tree house. I remember when he came home from work and I jumped out, running towards him and giving him a big hug. Nobody had ever done something just for me. That was five years old. I think my mother sensed my father and I were getting too close and I was school age, so she decided to quit and become a housewife. Part of the reason she quit was she was no longer one of the only women at work – she loved the attention, good and bad, being one of the few females in her field. Without all that attention, she had little use for the job.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSBJTxLPZc1D7RV4QvQ5zw...Zjdg9IgIa8]

She also knew she could force my dad to work multiple jobs and provide for her and me. He began to work over 70 hours a week and it was often just my mother and I at home. I was chubby at the time, but lost a ton of weight and began to have awful nightmares where I would thrash about and cry in my sleep. I would often talk to myself in my sleep, acting out relationships I didn’t have in real life. My mother would never come to comfort me; she would just complain that I kept her up late at night the next morning at breakfast. When questioned by my teacher about my behavioral issues and immaturity, she put on a show about how it was really the fault of school system that overburdens kids and how she cries herself to sleep about my problems.

As I got older, I just stayed in my room. I learned that if I didn’t interact with her; I did not to get drained. I was a prolific reader, reading all sorts of books. I read “The Three Musketeers” in fifth grade and wrote a book report for a class. I was accused of plagiarism by the teacher as she claimed it could pass for a senior's report in high school. The teacher told me, personally, there was no way a kid or a male could write that well. She told me explicitly that she was going to give the book report award to a female because she is a girl and girls need to be praised. I told my mother who blithely remarked, without looking away from the TV, that my teacher was absolutely right – girls and women are the future.

It went on in this vein. My mother did seek to get my approval from time to time. There were bizarre displays of generosity, compassion and interest. She thought she could buy my approval. However, I was always waiting for the other shoe to drop because the honeymoon period always ended. She denied me the right to have a girlfriend, told me to get a job after high school graduation because I would not be able to cut it at the collegiate level. She was extremely offended by my intelligence and vociferous appetite for the accumulation of knowledge and betterment of my mind. She was smart, but not too bright. She stopped buying me books once she realized I was smarter than her. I knew that the way forward for me was cashing in on my mind.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTeTm3-M4XPOv4Q1Vye5gj...fQpHeUGlYQ]

The last point about my mother before I step my approaches to personal therapy is her reaction to finding out I was watching pornography. I have never seen her that mad. She got in my face, grabbed me by the neck and told me if she ever caught me objectifying women again she would kick me out of the house. She screamed, ranted and subjected me to vicious thrashings with a copy of TIME over the course of around 20 minutes. She grounded me for the rest of the summer and made me fill an entire notebook with the unforgettable phrase, “I will never judge a woman’s value by her looks. I will respect women. I will never watch pornography again.” Before my self-improvement, I was the literal embodiment of the nice guy. As much as I fit the role, there was something off. I was willing to rebel, especially once I was independently set up. I refused to kowtow to her bullshit and given the fact she is now older, her negative energy has tailed off. Thankfully for my psyche, she doesn’t drain me much anymore.

When I enrolled in graduate school, I survived the first year with good grades. However, when all of my friends from undergraduate graduated and scattered across the country, I lost my support network. I was friends with people in law school, but I was not really established. My mother didn’t really want to talk to me because she was still smarting I got into a top law school and she knew I would have a better life than her. Of course, she would boast and brag to others about me but never congratulated me for my accomplishments. A perfect storm developed when I found Roissy’s website the night before second year started. My entire worldview was shattered. I didn’t leave my apartment for a week. I ate only a bit and burned through the two handles of Jack Daniels I had in my mini-refrigerator. I got a call from the Dean who enquired as to why I haven’t been to class yet – your classmates are worried about you. I told her I was in a terrible place and didn’t know what to do. She told me to meet her at the free counseling services for students on campus and we would talk. The next day, I went to the service and had an initial interview. I knew serious things were already going on, but the counselor applied for special waiver for continuous counseling, as there is a general limit on the number of sessions you can have. I got the waiver and underwent counseling.

I made a comment here once about how therapy is bullshit. It was inartful, as I really meant that therapists don’t understand the sexual marketplace. I was assigned a gorgeous woman as my counselor, so it was cool (for the beta at the time) to have to make solid eye contact with a hot woman, especially one who displayed amazing amounts of compassion and insight. The process was slow at first and I resisted my impulse to dominate the sessions with rants about ideology (a prelude to my personality disorder). I will eventually discuss techniques for shoring up and solidifying inner game, but understand I was with her several months and left a much better man. I could never convince her that men have a more difficult getting laid than women. Some battles just aren’t worth fighting.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQgAiaUdTbuI0zyTW2ktdt...FpfIeNXH7w]

Let’s frame my experiences through Dr. Robert Glover’s book “No More Mister Nice Guy.” I mentioned this book once before in my Fatso writeup, but now I want to discuss the second part of the book, where he discussed the symptoms of Nice Guys and how to work past those behaviors.

Understand, that many traits of the Nice Guy is little more than an attempt to cope with a female-dominated school system, feminism in general and the lack of fathers in the home. He also mentions women with serious personality disorders tend to produce some the worst Nice Guys. Let’s talk about some the traits with my experience in mind. The one that jumps of the page is seeking approval. Since I never had my needs met by my mother, I was in a constant state of seeking attention. This is what she wanted – she wanted my worship. Nice Guys think that if they do something right, they will get the approval they seek. This was my relationship with my mother. I learned to play the piano and she was happy for a time, until I got too good. So I stopped. I did good in school – but once I got smarter than her, approval stopped. I intentionally failed one class in high school, earning the dubious record of having all A+’s and one F. I got my mother’s attention, which I was subconsciously targeting. I learned she approved of me dressing well and taking care of myself, so I did it. My fashion game has been airtight since high school because of her.

This feeds into more behaviors Glover sets out. He notices many Nice Guys are too conscious of fashion and too interested in pop culture. They are superficial and scared of their sexuality. This is the next point that jumped out at me. Nice Guys are deathly afraid of their sexuality. He correctly identifies hyper-conservative Christians and feminists as instigators of this. Unable to reconcile male sexuality, they set out to shame the hell out of a man’s sexuality in the vain hope male sexuality will just go away. Nice Guys become very good at covert contracts. A covert contract is when somebody does something for somebody else and expects reciprocity. This develops out of a childhood were a man is subjected to over-the-top criticism for the slightest of mistakes. A parent’s anger should be rare and reserved for the most serious of occasions. I would get screamed at for spilling a glass of water. That is not an appropriate behavior.

Let’s step through positive ways to reinforce positive self esteem. Do note that I do not want anybody to become any sort of narcissist in response to their deficient childhood experience. Don’t look in the mirror repeatedly tell yourself you are awesome, great, etc. That is not healthy and won’t solve your problems. Also, if you have serious problems like me, there is little chance you will fix them on your own. Seek out professional help. If you are in college, check out counseling services. If you are not, I am sorry; you are in a tough spot. It can be expensive to get professional help. I was privileged because I never paid a dime for my therapy. Okay, going forward, the first thing is to admit you have a self-esteem issue. Then, you have to start treating yourself better. That means no cigarettes, too much booze, and no serious drug use. Start working out, eating healthy and get appropriate levels of sleep. Find a hobby that you enjoy and do it. Seriously, that is an important. Never let anybody tell you what you love is worthless. I love the NFL and fantasy football – some people say watching sports is pointless or beta. I don’t care. I love it and it makes me happy. That is what matters.

These tips are very important, as a primary cause of alcoholism, addiction to fast food and lack of exercise is a lack of real self-esteem. If you have low self-esteem, just deciding to do these positive things can really bolster your self-esteem. However, this is just the beginning. There is much more work to be done.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR09Os8TcSLFdQ8xsIc3yA...p8QoOMlql9]

First, is making these behaviors habits. It takes a long time to convince yourself you have real value if you were taught you are worthless. Seriously, it may and probably will take years. Stick with it – with real resources like this forum, you can get there and do it. The next step is eliminating bad thoughts. Nice Guys are shame-based – when they do something wrong, instead of realizing that it was just one bad act, they react as if they are completely bad. These sorts of thoughts course through their heads when they mess up, disappoint somebody or just fuck shit up. You have to eliminate these thoughts. The first step I used was just writing down what you are good at. Every day, just sit down and be honest about your positive traits. Build on it and every day write down something positive you did today. That is important because it will spur you to be proactive. Once you do that for awhile, give yourself some constructive criticism. Just like the approach on this forum, keep the kid gloves on while giving yourself some tough love. Don’t attack your whole person, focus purely on what you did wrong. Don’t make any statements about how you suck, how you will never be good with women or how you aren’t worth love.

Also, when you brush your teeth in the morning, tell yourself something like, “There is nothing I can’t handle,” “I am worthy of love and acceptance,” or T AKA Ricky Raw’s quote I love, “I am perfect the way I am but there is always room for improvement.” Do this every day – this is important. You need to make this a habit of you being honest about who you are and being honest about self improvement.

Dr. Glover presents two great experiments. One is do something that is against your self-image so you can realize how people rarely judge you for it. For example, if you pride yourself on cleaning your nails, don’t do it for a week and see if anybody notices. If you pride yourself on a clean car, let it naturally get dirty and see if anybody comments. He states that almost always nobody judges. He then further suggests you can ask people after the week is over if they noticed the change. For the clean car one, most people will respond they assumed you were too busy to clean your car or they confess they didn’t even notice. The second experiment is to put yourself first for a week. No matter what you do, you put yourself first. He relays the story of a man who wanted to work out, but his wife wouldn’t let him. Glover advised him to tell her firmly but gently tell her he understands her concerns about childcare and work, but he is going to work out because he wants to. She was angry at first, but then she decided to start working out herself, commending him for being proactive about his health. Game recognized?

Another important point is to face your fears. You have to be honest about your feelings. This can be a difficult one. You have to come clean about your fears, your anger and your complexes. If you don’t have access to a shrink, you will need to consume a lot of literature about personal psychology. I recommend the book I am citing, reading books like “Women Can’t Hear What Men Don’t Say” by Dr. Warren Farrell. Go over to The Last Psychiatrist, read his archives on narcissism. Read http://www.therawness.com. Read the big three R’s – Roosh, Rational Male and Roissy (read the archives of Roissy because whomever is running it now is a race troll). Keep a personal journal and detail your progress – on everything. Decide to lift? Write down everything you do and so you can document your progress. Few things bolster self-esteem like seeing your progress, overcoming obstacles and general self-betterment. As for your self esteem progress, document your thoughts and feelings as you feel them. You have to be brutally honest otherwise you will sell yourself short.

If you have a shrink, be honest about everything. If you feel the need to cry, do it. You need to come to grips with the fact you weren’t allowed the childhood every child deserves. You have to act your emotions as you feel them. You weren’t allowed to as a kid; you have to deal with this as an adult. Glover asserts, and I agree, expression of feelings helps you reclaim personal power. Since you weren’t allowed to as a kid, it becomes a way for you to reclaim ownership of your psychology. Once again, if anybody judges you, tell them 2Wycked said to go get cunt-punted. When you express your feelings, don’t blame others. Instead of saying “You are making me angry” say “I am feeling angry right now.” The general rule is to use the word “I.” “I am feeling helpless right now,” or “I am upset with your behaviors.”

Next is becoming honest about who you are – or developing integrity. You have to bring the reality of your life into your consciousness. You have to tell the truth not just to yourself, but to others. Let’s say you have some bizarre habit. Be honest about it. If people judge you for it, learn to cope with their disapproval. It is tough, but over time, you will become comfortable with it. Once again, this is tough as requires you to divest yourself of years and years of bad conditioning. In my life, it is tough to accept criticism without feeling shameful about it. I realized how much farther I am along in life when posting on this forum. Any criticism I have received I considered and moved on. That is psychologically healthy. Think about for five minutes – is it based in reality? If not, then ignore it. If it is, what should I do about it? It is about becoming real with yourself and the world around you. Tough stuff.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT0xwemfUm0M1ZfIUf2UnE...hSxrU4_eLQ]

Let me end with a discussion about the destruction of America. While moral Puritanism seemed to be America’s original sin, it is narcissism that will be its final sin. The lack of empathy, the outsized visions of themselves and the general lack of understanding of the world around is what will destroy America. The latter part is what I will focus on. The forum rightfully criticizes all manner of feminists for not believing in reality. They deny hypergamy, biological beauty standards and support movements like fat acceptance. They live in an alternate reality in which women don’t have any bad impulses and purely are good actors. The self-worship is really glaring when women do anything positive. Electing a female Senator? She will undoubtedly change the world for the better. Just wait for the first female President. The self-worship will reach stratospheric levels. Every woman will think she played a part in her election. The collective hamsterbation will probably alter the basics of physics. However, part of this is bad psychology.

Civilizations will always rise and fall. They will always consume themselves. However, the United States had a unique avenue to achieve a level of human civilizational transcendence that no other human civilization has had access to. Control of the continent, no local adversaries and the world engine of economic growth and scientific growth. However, feminism, fiat money and inability to reconcile collective psychological issues will damn this country. When the betas males of a society do little to nothing to advance a society, it will fail. Those betas need wives who will inspire them to work hard and achieve great things. Society loses when betas spend all day jacking off to lesbian porn and smoking weed. Society loses when women take jobs that should have gone a decent beta male, who would have supported a wife and kids.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQaS4spGnIhosJafk7YQU_...XdJDp_pEyo]

I recall an episode of the X-Files, when the leader of The Lone Gunmen talks about a dream he has. It is an America where Kennedy was never assassinated. America never deals with Watergate and is still in the idyllic social structure of the 1950’s – American’s never became cynical about politics. Flawed and unrealistic to be sure, but bear with me. He goes to his nice home behind the white picket fence, goes into his backyard and hugs his skinny, good-looking wife. He turns to his kids, hugs them and begins to play with them. The grass is lush, the house is beautiful and camera pans out and we see other families just like this. It is a social paradise, the sort of society that is either on top or on the upswing. However, as he admits, it is just a dream because reality is far grimmer. Which is the story of America; so much potential, its greatness was there for a while, but the underlying psychology manifested itself. The same impulse that led to America’s greatness will also lead to its downfall. The double-edged sword of narcissism. The impulse that led to its ascension recedes into self-indulgent worship. Like a general narcissist, once they get your approval, the show is over. Once America overtook the world, they set the terms of their decline. My generation is the most entitled, bitchy and vastly overrates their abilities. The older generation frequently comments on this - they are right. However, they made us. I have no solutions to offer. Just a lament for the once great nation.

Understand that the scene in Butterfly Effect 3 summed up the life of being born to a narcissist – a burning hell of pain, sorrow and bullshit. Narcissists are some the worst people around – while official statistics pin that around only one to two percent of people have the disorder (I am the 1%!) – narcissism is a general social problem. Do realize there are resources that can help you work through your problems. It is most likely the most difficult thing you will do in your life – but it is absolutely worth it. Also, understand that narcissism will destroy the US – or maybe it already has.

Today, I woke up, got the mail and cooked some eggs for breakfast. I opened my window to a beautiful day in the Midwest - the local birds were chirped a beautiful song. I used to be bothered by so many of these latent issues, but it is too beautiful of a day to get depressed. Today, I worked out, ate well and enjoyed watching the NBA games. I hooked up with some cute goth-ish chick. I came back to this piece I had 95% completed and finished it. I am currently enjoying a strong Jack and Coke. I couldn’t be happier – it took so much work to get here, but I wouldn’t trade it for the world.

Quote:Old Chinese Man Wrote:  
why you wonder how many man another man bang? why you care who bang who mr high school drama man
Reply
#2

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

I am proud to be the first to like this post.

Not everyone has access to the therapy you did.

I go cut off after 10 sessions in grad school.

It took me more than 10 years after that to figure things out.

Now I know why I love your posts so much.

Our life stories are like an experiment in twins, you had basically my upbringing except you don't mention any brutal physical abuse and my father was less attentive.

It seems like you got your act together 10-15 years younger than I did. Congrats.

Anyway, it's good to know there's someone else out there who's overcome a narcissistic mother.

Thanks for posting this stuff, hopefully it can help others.

Guys, do good work and good works, lend a Beta a hand up, not a handout. Know that like Richard Dawkins says you are an unlikely event and that no matter who has tried to keep you down you can have a life.

I'm rambling now, but this post has really affected me.
Reply
#3

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

JonNortanFan:

I wish it would work

Quote:Old Chinese Man Wrote:  
why you wonder how many man another man bang? why you care who bang who mr high school drama man
Reply
#4

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

Great writing.

Your feminist mother's reaction to your viewing porn was almost exactly my Catholic grandmother's reaction when she caught my uncle with a Playboy. As much as feminists criticize the church, their anti-sex ideas, constant shaming of men, and anti-biological ideas (i.e. what's natural is "immoral") mirror a lot of what it taught.
Reply
#5

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

I haven't posted in a while, but these posts by 2Wycked are great and needed more than just a like.

Why do the heathen rage and the people imagine a vain thing? Psalm 2:1 KJV
Reply
#6

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

Yeah, I was going to go silent this next month on the forum..

However, I needed to talk to RoK members about things.

But, I came back to this thread as an inspiration.

Quote:Old Chinese Man Wrote:  
why you wonder how many man another man bang? why you care who bang who mr high school drama man
Reply
#7

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

I came across this again, and am bumping it up because I think it is so valuable. I had a mother who was not a narcissist, but battling constant depression and was very cranky and irritable. What I learned to do was always try and do little things to please her so she wouldn't be randomly angry at me for some minor slip up. It did not help me in the long run.
Reply
#8

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

Thanks for bumping this thread up, man.

This was a very good read.
Reply
#9

The Butterfly Effect 3, Narcissistic Mothers And The Decline Of America

Your little tidbit about your mother going crazy with porn makes me think that more and more feminism is just becoming an acceptable, mainstream substitute for religion because that's exactly the reaction a religious zealot would do if they found their kid reading text of a different doctrine or doing something in their eyes is unacceptable.

To read your story though makes me all the more grateful of having a competent father figure and I'm not stuck with my mother in the custody battles.
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)