[JimNortonFan]

http://www.slate.com/articles/double_x/d...r_all.html


One commenter said a guy with multiple wives won't get hired because of the health costs.

A reply to that comment shoots it down, saying we're moving to universal health care.

So, the Beta male pays taxes to support the health care of the alpha male's multiple wives.

When will the Betas have had enough and just drop out of a system that does nothing for them wile demanding more and more of them all the time?

[2Wycked]

Isn't something like 80% of our genetic DNA descended from women - i.e. every woman has reproduced but only a handful of men have?

Seems like this woman is just wanting to go back to the Stone Age.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

Is there any DNA that isn't genetic?

[JimNortonFan]

There's nuclear DNA and mitochondrial DNA. (If you're a bio person and I got the terminology wrong and you're going to correct me now go ahead and correct the terminology. I studied a harder field than bio and it's beneath me to learn terminology I'm too lazy to Google).

The nuclear DNA is 50:50 from mom and dad. The mitochondrial is from the mom.

I don't know of any studies that show how many men and how many women we are from.

ROK has an article saying that monogamy developed in ice age Europe, when things were tough. The increased productivity of Beta males led to civilization.

Now that we're so affluent, women want to go back to polygamy and exercise their preference for part of an alpha over all of a beta.

Harem, rotation, that's PUA lingo for the state of affairs that existed before monogamy.

Look at elephant seals. 10% of the males sire about 100% of the offspring. That's because fish are plentiful and the male is not needed to feed the young.

There's a species of woodpecker (or some other bird) that eats acorns. Problem is, acorns are low in nutrition. So, that species does polyandry. Two males help feed the young of one female. Tougher times = more need for men.

[scorpion]

She's right in the sense that if gay marriage is allowed, there's no justifiable rationale for prohibiting polygamy. The argument for gay rights has always been one of self-determination; that as long as gays were not hurting anyone they should be able to do what they want. Polygamists can make the same argument. They are simply adults entering into a consensual relationship. In a "tolerant" society, we should respect their choice.

Pretty soon the term "marriage" will be completely meaningless, and could conceivably refer to any group of adults in a recognized legal relationship. With no established foundation for marriage, there can be no foundation for the family structure. And then what is left but the state? That is why progressives are so keen on destroying traditional marriage: by doing so, they also destroy the traditional family, which increases the power of the state commensurately.

But these fools don't realize that they are attacking the very basis of society itself. Almost every societal ill we are experiencing in the modern age can be traced to the destruction of the nuclear family by feminism and other progressive programs. Obesity, delinquency, failing schools, disintegrating communities, consumerism, widespread apathy, etc... All of these problems are triggered or greatly exacerbated by the absence of strong family structures.

Society is crumbling, and they seek to double down on their destructive and delusional ideology. But they are only hastening their own demise. When this perverse and unsustainable society they've created (corrupted, more accurately) goes tits up, it will be men (like always) who rebuild it. And I expect by then that the damage wrought by feminism and progressivism will be widely understood, and those ideologies will gain no purchase in the minds of men for generations thereafter.

[Firestorm]

(04-18-2013 03:17 PM)2Wycked Wrote:  

Isn't something like 80% of our genetic DNA descended from women - i.e. every woman has reproduced but only a handful of men have?

Seems like this woman is just wanting to go back to the Stone Age.

Do you have a source for this?

[JimNortonFan]

The 45% of the population (beta males) that has historically been the most productive has been disenfranchised.

They are expected to work, borrow, pay interest, and pay taxes for a system that offers them nothing.

And don't tell me Game is the solution. Game only changes who's in the top 10% of men.

More Game is like better bass fishing techniques.

At first the senko or swimbait kills it. Then every bubba buys those and it's back to the top 10-20% of bass anglers catching 80% of the bass.

How does a system operate with 45% of the people viewed as worthless by the people who run things?

Terrorism, school stabbings in China, workplace violence in the US, it's all the same problem.

[Firestorm]

I noticed when I lived in London that that black men have children with multiple women. In essence they are operating some sort of polygamy, they call themselves baby fathers.

I find the idea of the plentiful supply therefore polygamy; in the UK if a woman gets pregnant she instantly gets support from the state and this support can be greater than a proffesional job can pay. Therefore the women aren't looking for intelligent and successful but instead just someone they find attractive.

I think this is a contributory factor to the London riots: young poor black men stealing and being violent because a minority of the men take many of the women (atleast in the underclass).

[Firestorm]

(04-18-2013 07:02 PM)JimNortonFan Wrote:  

The 45% of the population (beta males) that has historically been the most productive has been disenfranchised.

They are expected to work, borrow, pay interest, and pay taxes for a system that offers them nothing.

And don't tell me Game is the solution. Game only changes who's in the top 10% of men.

More Game is like better bass fishing techniques.

At first the senko or swimbait kills it. Then every bubba buys those and it's back to the top 10-20% of bass anglers catching 80% of the bass.

How does a system operate with 45% of the people viewed as worthless by the people who run things?

Terrorism, school stabbings in China, workplace violence in the US, it's all the same problem.

I agree, why would men go to work and deal with stress producing things when they will never get a woman. The real kick in the teeth is that these men go to work and pay taxes to support the children of men who have taken their women.

Part of the reason why I hate the welfare state.

[A War You Cannot Win]

I dream of the day the Welfare state collapses. When the disenfranchised beta males rise up and overthrow the cruel fiat masters. Revolution is hilarious.

[A War You Cannot Win]

(04-18-2013 07:07 PM)Firestorm Wrote:  

I noticed when I lived in London that that black men have children with multiple women. In essence they are operating some sort of polygamy, they call themselves baby fathers.

I find the idea of the plentiful supply therefore polygamy; in the UK if a woman gets pregnant she instantly gets support from the state and this support can be greater than a proffesional job can pay. Therefore the women aren't looking for intelligent and successful but instead just someone they find attractive.

I think this is a contributory factor to the London riots: young poor black men stealing and being violent because a minority of the men take many of the women (atleast in the underclass).

'Baby Fathers'? Looks like we found a bountiful specimen group for a quasi legal government funded venture into forced chemical sterilization.

[Tex Pro]

The one bright spot to this whole debate is that if men continue to drop out of the workforce and "enjoy the decline," then it will be single, career-focused women who will end up supporting underclass women who have several babies out of wedlock and live off of welfare. Win win, I say. Women wanted the welfare state, and now they can pay for it.

So, yeah, enjoy the decline...and head overseas often. Let the rats still stuck in the Matrix fight for the scraps on this sinking ship called the USA.

[A War You Cannot Win]

In the military/tactical community they say there's 3 types of people:

Sheep

Wolves

Sheep Dogs.

I started off as a sheep, found my masculinity and became a sheep dog only to find myself marginalized, betrayed, discarded, and embittered by the people and structure I swore to protect.

Now I'm a wolf, and I've never had so much fun
before in my life. It's a wolf's world we live in preying on the sheep and lesser wolves (we all know who they are) has never been easier or more beneficial.

Here's the essay exploring the trifecta, I recommend it for the redpill community

http://www.gleamingedge.com/mirrors/onsh...pdogs.html

[Excelsior]

(04-18-2013 07:07 PM)Firestorm Wrote:  

I noticed when I lived in London that that black men have children with multiple women. In essence they are operating some sort of polygamy, they call themselves baby fathers.

This is also true in urban America. There are a few select men who are able to father children with several, if not dozens of women, and thus contribute disporpotionately to the creation of the next generation.

Examples:

This guy has 6 offspring by 3-4 women, and managed to create a blood feud by impregnating two of them at the same time.

This one has 30 kids at the age of 30 with over a dozen women.

Examples like this really aren't that uncommon. Women in these communities gravitate to just a handful of men who, for whatever reason, have some status (athletes, entertainers, dealers, or just naturally cool dudes who stand out from the rest) and work to get pregnant by them. It is normal to see these kinds of dudes with 3-5 kids by 2 or more women. De-facto polygamy.

Quote:

I think this is a contributory factor to the London riots: young poor black men stealing and being violent because a minority of the men take many of the women (atleast in the underclass).

Keep in mind that in England this mentality also exists among white chavs and some non-black minorities where illegitimacy is common.

[A War You Cannot Win]

Athlone, I enjoy reading your posts but most of the time they really shatter my rainbow and depress the fuck out of me.

[Kabal]

(04-18-2013 07:00 PM)Firestorm Wrote:  

(04-18-2013 03:17 PM)2Wycked Wrote:  

Isn't something like 80% of our genetic DNA descended from women - i.e. every woman has reproduced but only a handful of men have?

Seems like this woman is just wanting to go back to the Stone Age.

Do you have a source for this?

I have a different one (which I believe I've posted here before), but it conveys the same idea:

Quote:

...ρX/ρA reflects the female-to-male breeding ratio, β. We estimated β from ρX/ρA inferred from genomic diversity data and calibrated with recombination rates derived from pedigree data. For the HapMap populations, we obtained β of 1.4 in the Yoruba from West Africa, 1.3 in Europeans, and 1.1 in East Asian samples.

Two takeaways here:

1. Indeed, humans have been polygynous throughout history and prehistory, with more women than men contributing to future lineages (i.e., it's more winner-take-all on the male end.)

2. Unsurprisingly, populations with higher historical female-to-male breeding ratios are the populations that have lower rates of paternal investment today, and vice versa. Also unsurprisingly, low rates of paternal investment are associated with low socioeconomic productivity and high crime rates both across and within nations.

It is not so clear whether, or to what degree, low paternal investment across societies and within societies causes low productivity and high crime, or whether the traits that lead to low paternal investment and low productivity and high crime are just frequently concurrent. I suspect it's more of the latter than the former, as various studies have shown that parenting per se has little effect in long run child outcomes, compared to genetics and environment, in that order.

Either way, regardless of the nature of the causality, if you want a productive society with low crime, you want the dads outbreeding the cads and the women who prefer dads to outbreed the women who prefer cads.

I, for one, will continue cadding around while rooting for the dads to beat out the cads. Hypocritical? Nope, merely the prisoner's dilemma and the fallacy of composition.

[Excelsior]

(04-18-2013 09:20 PM)A War You Cannot Win Wrote:  

Athlone, I enjoy reading your posts but most of the time they really shatter my rainbow and depress the fuck out of me.

You're gonna be ok.

[BortimusPrime]

(04-18-2013 08:56 PM)A War You Cannot Win Wrote:  

In the military/tactical community they say there's 3 types of people:

Sheep

Wolves

Sheep Dogs.

I started off as a sheep, found my masculinity and became a sheep dog only to find myself marginalized, betrayed, discarded, and embittered by the people and structure I swore to protect.

Now I'm a wolf, and I've never had so much fun
before in my life. It's a wolf's world we live in preying on the sheep and lesser wolves (we all know who they are) has never been easier or more beneficial.

Here's the essay exploring the trifecta, I recommend it for the redpill community

http://www.gleamingedge.com/mirrors/onsh...pdogs.html

Isn't this the same thing as from Team America: World Police?

There's three types of people: dicks, pussies, and assholes. Pussies don't like dicks because they fuck pussies, but they also fuck assholes who want to shit all over everything.

Also there's a fourth element missing from that sheep/sheepdog/wolf trinity: the shepherd. Like the wolf the shepherd is an apex predator, but he's controlling everything. He steals the wool and milk from the sheep, chops their balls off, and serves their young in bite-sized chunks at Lebanese restaurants, while feeding the sheepdogs dog food. Both the sheep and the sheepdogs are exploited and preyed upon by the shepherd, but they never realize it.

[A War You Cannot Win]

Haha yup. Good catch.

[Firestorm]

(04-18-2013 09:10 PM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

(04-18-2013 07:07 PM)Firestorm Wrote:  

I noticed when I lived in London that that black men have children with multiple women. In essence they are operating some sort of polygamy, they call themselves baby fathers.

This is also true in urban America. There are a few select men who are able to father children with several, if not dozens of women, and thus contribute disporpotionately to the creation of the next generation.

Examples:

This guy has 6 offspring by 3-4 women, and managed to create a blood feud by impregnating two of them at the same time.

This one has 30 kids at the age of 30 with over a dozen women.

Examples like this really aren't that uncommon. Women in these communities gravitate to just a handful of men who, for whatever reason, have some status (athletes, entertainers, dealers, or just naturally cool dudes who stand out from the rest) and work to get pregnant by them. It is normal to see these kinds of dudes with 3-5 kids by 2 or more women. De-facto polygamy.

Quote:

I think this is a contributory factor to the London riots: young poor black men stealing and being violent because a minority of the men take many of the women (atleast in the underclass).

Keep in mind that in England this mentality also exists among white chavs and some non-black minorities where illegitimacy is common.

I haven't seen this in England. usually chavs will have one girl who may have their kid. However some black guys have numerous baby mums, but unlike the US a lot of the girls are white. I am sure some areas are going to be all black in the future because so many of the girls have black kids.

I live in a university town and there is a local population of chavvy people. I almost never see black men around this city (there are one or two), but I see a lot of white single mums with black kids....

[Firestorm]

(04-18-2013 09:47 PM)Kabal Wrote:  

(04-18-2013 07:00 PM)Firestorm Wrote:  

(04-18-2013 03:17 PM)2Wycked Wrote:  

Isn't something like 80% of our genetic DNA descended from women - i.e. every woman has reproduced but only a handful of men have?

Seems like this woman is just wanting to go back to the Stone Age.

Do you have a source for this?

I have a different one (which I believe I've posted here before), but it conveys the same idea:

Quote:

...ρX/ρA reflects the female-to-male breeding ratio, β. We estimated β from ρX/ρA inferred from genomic diversity data and calibrated with recombination rates derived from pedigree data. For the HapMap populations, we obtained β of 1.4 in the Yoruba from West Africa, 1.3 in Europeans, and 1.1 in East Asian samples.

Two takeaways here:

1. Indeed, humans have been polygynous throughout history and prehistory, with more women than men contributing to future lineages (i.e., it's more winner-take-all on the male end.)

2. Unsurprisingly, populations with higher historical female-to-male breeding ratios are the populations that have lower rates of paternal investment today, and vice versa. Also unsurprisingly, low rates of paternal investment are associated with low socioeconomic productivity and high crime rates both across and within nations.

It is not so clear whether, or to what degree, low paternal investment across societies and within societies causes low productivity and high crime, or whether the traits that lead to low paternal investment and low productivity and high crime are just frequently concurrent. I suspect it's more of the latter than the former, as various studies have shown that parenting per se has little effect in long run child outcomes, compared to genetics and environment, in that order.

Either way, regardless of the nature of the causality, if you want a productive society with low crime, you want the dads outbreeding the cads and the women who prefer dads to outbreed the women who prefer cads.

I, for one, will continue cadding around while rooting for the dads to beat out the cads. Hypocritical? Nope, merely the prisoner's dilemma and the fallacy of composition.

Interesting and unsurprising. Perhaps in this age we're moving away from monogamy to survival of the swaggest. ha.

Although one thing I don't understand is why men who can;t find a woman would just stay in the western world as a single man when they can go and get a mail order bride/meet a poor woman in another country.

I feel like I am learning a lot about sexual politics and the economics of breeding in this thread. I had never considered how a plentiful supply would lead to polygamy and the effect on overall productivity.

[Excelsior]

(04-19-2013 02:56 AM)Firestorm Wrote:  

I haven't seen this in England. usually chavs will have one girl who may have their kid. However some black guys have numerous baby mums, but unlike the US a lot of the girls are white. I am sure some areas are going to be all black in the future because so many of the girls have black kids.

I live in a university town and there is a local population of chavvy people. I almost never see black men around this city (there are one or two), but I see a lot of white single mums with black kids....

Fascinating. I've noted this before based on anecdotes (I am a British national and have been able to glean info from relatives there as well as from my own research). It seems that there is a much greater tolerance in the UK for the idea of a white woman dating, mating and procreating with a black male than there is in the USA. I know that the scenario you described (white women regularly having children by black men) is practically unheard of here, and high frowned upon. A white woman here can get shamed for merely being seen with a black male, so for many having a black child out of wedlock just-so is simply out of the question.

The difference can be seen with celebrities as well. It isn't terribly uncommon in England for a fairly popular, young, hot white female celebrity to attach herself to a black male, especially a footballer (ex: Scott Sinclair, Ashley Cole, Jermaine Defoe). You don't really see a similar trend in the USA (our footballer equivalents here being NFL and NBA players). Young, hot white female celebrities here pretty much stick to their own, a trend which I think represents the general attitude in the USA toward such relationships (which is not a positive one).

Kim Kardashian is really the one great exception to this rule.

[Firestorm]

(04-19-2013 03:34 PM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

(04-19-2013 02:56 AM)Firestorm Wrote:  

I haven't seen this in England. usually chavs will have one girl who may have their kid. However some black guys have numerous baby mums, but unlike the US a lot of the girls are white. I am sure some areas are going to be all black in the future because so many of the girls have black kids.

I live in a university town and there is a local population of chavvy people. I almost never see black men around this city (there are one or two), but I see a lot of white single mums with black kids....

Fascinating. I've noted this before based on anecdotes (I am a British national and have been able to glean info from relatives there as well as from my own research). It seems that there is a much greater tolerance in the UK for the idea of a white woman dating, mating and procreating with a black male than there is in the USA. I know that the scenario you described (white women regularly having children by black men) is practically unheard of here, and high frowned upon. A white woman here can get shamed for merely being seen with a black male, so for many having a black child out of wedlock just-so is simply out of the question.

The difference can be seen with celebrities as well. It isn't terribly uncommon in England for a fairly popular, young, hot white female celebrity to attach herself to a black male, especially a footballer (ex: Scott Sinclair, Ashley Cole, Jermaine Defoe). You don't really see a similar trend in the USA (our footballer equivalents here being NFL and NBA players). Young, hot white female celebrities here pretty much stick to their own, a trend which I think represents the general attitude in the USA toward such relationships (which is not a positive one).

Kim Kardashian is really the one great exception to this rule.

In the UK the left leaning media is pushing the black man-white woman relationship really hard. I have heard many white girls in the UK say that a child that is half black and half white are better looking than other kids. Even a girl I was nailing at one point (she was surprised I was annoyed, dumb bitch).
If you watched the Olympic opening ceremony the family they featured was a black man and white woman with their interracial child. Also their black love story (London olympic or Lagos olympics?).

I think women are just following the media they see. TV, films and music that promote black men as superior and white/black couples and so that's what they follow.

It's at the point where I rarely see a black man with a black woman (outside of people who just moved from Ghana). This is one reason why I am not so good with moving to a place like London and I feel sorry for all the white men who are gonna be put on the shelf because all their women are gone. Don't worry though the BBC and other liberal media won't give a shit about these people, they won't make tv shows about them and they will stay invisible or the butt of someones joke.

Not a problem for me so much, but I feel bad for these guys.

[speakeasy]

(04-19-2013 03:34 PM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

(04-19-2013 02:56 AM)Firestorm Wrote:  

I haven't seen this in England. usually chavs will have one girl who may have their kid. However some black guys have numerous baby mums, but unlike the US a lot of the girls are white. I am sure some areas are going to be all black in the future because so many of the girls have black kids.

I live in a university town and there is a local population of chavvy people. I almost never see black men around this city (there are one or two), but I see a lot of white single mums with black kids....

Fascinating. I've noted this before based on anecdotes (I am a British national and have been able to glean info from relatives there as well as from my own research). It seems that there is a much greater tolerance in the UK for the idea of a white woman dating, mating and procreating with a black male than there is in the USA. I know that the scenario you described (white women regularly having children by black men) is practically unheard of here, and high frowned upon. A white woman here can get shamed for merely being seen with a black male, so for many having a black child out of wedlock just-so is simply out of the question.

The difference can be seen with celebrities as well. It isn't terribly uncommon in England for a fairly popular, young, hot white female celebrity to attach herself to a black male, especially a footballer (ex: Scott Sinclair, Ashley Cole, Jermaine Defoe). You don't really see a similar trend in the USA (our footballer equivalents here being NFL and NBA players). Young, hot white female celebrities here pretty much stick to their own, a trend which I think represents the general attitude in the USA toward such relationships (which is not a positive one).

Kim Kardashian is really the one great exception to this rule.

Doesn't bother me a whole bunch as I don't place much value on American white women in the first place. I just find the sociological implications regarding interracial dating in America to be intriguing.

[TheRookie]

(04-19-2013 03:34 PM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

It seems that there is a much greater tolerance in the UK for the idea of a white woman dating, mating and procreating with a black male than there is in the USA. I know that the scenario you described (white women regularly having children by black men) is practically unheard of here, and high frowned upon. A white woman here can get shamed for merely being seen with a black male, so for many having a black child out of wedlock just-so is simply out of the question.

I call bullshit on this - there are definitely a lot of white baby mommas with black fathers in the USA amongst the lower classes. It is a middle class to upper middle class taboo but common among the white trash and I would expect the same is true in the UK.

At this point a lot of middle/upper middle class America would be okay with their daughters marrying a black man but they sure as shit aren't looking for an illegitimate child. White trash don't care though.

As this article points out there are no stats to back this up right now but I can speak anecdotally, and others seem to be saying the same thing on the internets.

http://community.babycenter.com/post/a30...ot_married

http://voices.yahoo.com/once-go-black-ne...tml?cat=25