[kolovrat]

Venezuela has something like the world's 5th highest homicide rate. Probably not the best place to learn prison reform from.

[thegmanifesto]

(04-15-2013 02:19 PM)Bad Hussar Wrote:  

I often hear the claim that a large % of the American prison population is in jail because of drug possession. I've always thought that couldn't be true, but I am open to points raised here. I have a couple of questions:

1) Joe Blow is out on the street smoking a joint. Police roll up, arrest him for possession. In the US legal system is it really possible for him to end up in jail merely for possessing of a quantity suitable for personal use?

Yes.

Quote:

2) If Joe Blow is really poor is it a lot more likely that mere possession of a small amount will result in a prison term?

Yes.

Quote:

3) What proportion of people in jail for drug related offences can reasonably be described as dealers, and what percentage can reasonably be described as users only?

No idea.

What is wrong with being a dealer?

[Bad Hussar]

(04-15-2013 10:20 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(04-15-2013 02:19 PM)Bad Hussar Wrote:  

I often hear the claim that a large % of the American prison population is in jail because of drug possession. I've always thought that couldn't be true, but I am open to points raised here. I have a couple of questions:

1) Joe Blow is out on the street smoking a joint. Police roll up, arrest him for possession. In the US legal system is it really possible for him to end up in jail merely for possessing of a quantity suitable for personal use?

Yes.

Quote:

2) If Joe Blow is really poor is it a lot more likely that mere possession of a small amount will result in a prison term?

Yes.

Quote:

3) What proportion of people in jail for drug related offences can reasonably be described as dealers, and what percentage can reasonably be described as users only?

No idea.

What is wrong with being a dealer?

Not really saying there is anything wrong. In an environment where drugs are illegal every user needs a dealer after all. Just trying to understand how the justice system works, and who ends up in prison.

I'm a (somewhat hypocritical) libertarian so am generally OK with drugs being legal, even most of the hardcore ones, with certain safeguards. But dealers are stepping on peoples toes. Even if those toes only belong to companies that supply the legal intoxicants. I have been told by people in the UK that at the height of ecstasy use in the UK (90's) it was having a material effect on alcohol consumption in the UK. i.e. It tanked. And everyone knows how the Brits love to drink.

Anyway, the fact that drugs are illegal gives dealers their opportunity, since formal businesses wont touch the stuff. At least not publicly. But with that opportunity comes risk - in the US of jail it seems. This situation sucks. In my opinion a non-violent drug offender, even if a dealer, doesn't belong in jail. But until libertarian types take control of the US (i.e. never) and institute a reasonable drugs policy it seems like it will continue on as is.

PS: I'm surprised that mere users end up in jail in the US. That sucks. Police and the justice system really should have better things to do than arrest, prosecute and jail someone who smokes a joint or takes an ecstasy tab. That's ridiculous.